HAARP Is Out Of Control, You be the judge!!!

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by Donny 4 million

 

I was hoping that people would have read the full article linked, but it seems my hopes were not met:

The United States Navy utilized extremely low frequencies (ELFs) as radio band and radio communications.

The USN uses ELF as radio band communications.

IF anyone had bothered to read more, then they would have learned that ELF is involved in submarine communications. Water is quite the barrier to normal RF in higher frequencies.

Oh...and piggy-backing on HF? I don't even know where to begin withthat one!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Speaking of HF, that is really what HAARP is about. Why won't people read the truth, instead of believing in pseudo-science claptrap?
www.haarp.alaska.edu...

ALSO, from the same source ATS member Donny 4 million provided (Wiki):

Exposure


In electromagnetic therapy and electromagnetic radiation and health research, electromagnetic spectrum frequencies between 0 and 100 hertz are considered extremely-low-frequency fields.

The section from that entire Wiki article is quick-linked here.


Now, I still think you are wrong, and Phage is correct.



[edit on 14 March 2010 by weedwhacker]

Weedy, you always take the long winded way to explain not much.
It is quite simple as stated in the wiki link.
Radio starts 30 KHz It it used for air transmission did you see that? oh well.

Modulation is how you impress Audio and ELF on a HF carrier frequency.
That is how you transmit useful infomation.
With out that HF is just a simple ordinary frequency.
That's how HAARP was used to communicate with subs and explore for oil.
Ask Phage ,he posts about that all the time,

haarp is probably what's gonna save us all from being nuked by iran, dont complain!!

A vast area of Chile, including the capital city of Santiago, was plunged into darkness Sunday by a massive blackout, the National Emergency Office said. The area affected covered a 1243 miles stretch affecting about 80 per cent of Chile's population of 17 million people, officials told AFP. The blackout was caused by problems with a 500KW transformer - a device that transfers electrical energy from one circuit to another - Chile's Interior Minister Rodrigo Hinzpeter said, according to Reuters. The electricity problems were not believed to be directly related to the massive earthquake that struck on February 27, the minister said, but there would be an investigation to confirm this.

www.foxnews.com...

reply to post by Phage


Good morning Phage, How's the coffee?
Does this mean you have reversed your position that HAARP cannot transmit electromagnetic waves and reflect them from the ionosphere?
Also please explain how the ionosphere can transmit anything???


You said this.
"I have watched the "documentary". It is full of the same speculation, misunderstanding, ignorance and fear, beginning with connecting Tesla to HAARP. Tesla denied the existence of the very thing HAARP was created to study, the ionosphere (which was called the "Heaviside layer" in those days). His thoughts about it also demonstrate his lack of understanding about the nature of electromagnetic radiation and how the ionosphere can reflect and/or transmit it."

I hope you are satisfied the way weedy has been fielding my post to you.

Originally posted by jumpingbeanz
haarp is probably what's gonna save us all from being nuked by iran, dont complain!!

Who is complaining? Not me.
I always thought this a good idea. How would that work?

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by drew hempel

 

HAARP does not transmit ELF frequencies but it is conducting research into the use of HF ionospheric heaters to produce ELF radiation in the ionosphere itself. One reason for research into this is precisely in order to avoid the use of large, ground based installations such as the one you protested against.

The level of ELF radiation produced by HAARP is extremely low, much lower than that which is produced naturally. It is also produced more than 100 miles above Gakona. Any ELF radiation reaching the surface is of much lower intensity than the ELF radiation produced by household appliances and wiring.

[edit on 3/15/2010 by Phage]

Hey Phage,
I am on my second cup,

This is very confusing.
Are you saying HAARP cannot transmit ELF or does not?
There is a big difference.
How does a HAARP HF heater create ELF in the ionosphere?

How do you quantify the amount of ELF power that can be reflected back to earth? And where?

Thanks in advance

reply to post by Donny 4 million



www.chemtrails911.com...

One of the difficulties posed when broadcasting in the ELF frequency range is antenna size. This is because the antenna must be at least a substantial fraction of the size (in at least one dimension) of the wavelength of the frequency of the EM waves. Simply put, a 1 Hz (cycle per second) signal would have a wavelength equal to the distance EM waves travel through your chosen medium in 1 second. For ELF, this is very slightly slower than the speed of light in a vacuum. As used in military applications, the wavelength is ~299,792 km(~187,370 mi) per second divided by 50–85 Hz, which equals around 3,450 to 5,996 km (2,140 to 3,730 mi) long; by comparison, Earth's diameter varies from 12,715 km (7,901 mi), pole to pole to 12,756 km (7,926 mi), equatorial. Because of this huge size requirement and, to transmit internationally using ELF frequencies, the earth itself must be used as an antenna, with extremely long leads going into the ground. Various other means are taken to construct radio stations with substantially smaller sizes, such as electrical lengthening.

The US maintained two sites, in the Chequamegon-Nicolet National Forest, Wisconsin and the Escanaba River State Forest, Michigan (originally named Project Sanguine, then downsized and rechristened Project ELF prior to construction), until they were dismantled, beginning in late September 2004. Both sites used long power lines, so-called ground dipoles, as leads. These leads were in multiple strands ranging from 22.5 to 45 kilometres (14.0 to 28.0 mi) long. Because of the inefficiency of this method, considerable amounts of electrical power were required to operate the system.

[edit on 15-3-2010 by jumpingbeanz]

[edit on 15-3-2010 by jumpingbeanz]

The military's own Executive Summary of the HAARP program clearly states their reliance on ELF waves. Instead of transmitting these waves from ground based transmitters, HAARP created these waves through the use of "pulse" transmissions of their HF energy beams. Or, to put it another way, HAARP duplicated the ELF signals by turning their signal on and off at rates (30 to 3000 cycles per second) within the ELF range. The result was that ELF radiation could be directed to a specific area on the surface of the planet, at will.

Originally posted by jumpingbeanz
The military's own Executive Summary of the HAARP program clearly states their reliance on ELF waves. Instead of transmitting these waves from ground based transmitters, HAARP created these waves through the use of "pulse" transmissions of their HF energy beams. Or, to put it another way, HAARP duplicated the ELF signals by turning their signal on and off at rates (30 to 3000 cycles per second) within the ELF range. The result was that ELF radiation could be directed to a specific area on the surface of the planet, at will.

Sort of like FM eh!
Frequency Modulation

Originally posted by jumpingbeanz
haarp is probably what's gonna save us all from being nuked by iran, dont complain!!

I highly doubt that. We're in more danger of being Nuked by Russia who has already enriched all of their Uranium than Iran who is just now learning.

But hey, your opinion is as good as mine.

Originally posted by jumpingbeanz
The military's own Executive Summary of the HAARP program clearly states their reliance on ELF waves. Instead of transmitting these waves from ground based transmitters, HAARP created these waves through the use of "pulse" transmissions of their HF energy beams. Or, to put it another way, HAARP duplicated the ELF signals by turning their signal on and off at rates (30 to 3000 cycles per second) within the ELF range. The result was that ELF radiation could be directed to a specific area on the surface of the planet, at will.

Nicely done. Great post with great info. Thank you for contributing!!!

reply to post by Blazer


Thanks for posting the information Blazer. It definitely gives me something to speculate on.

Originally posted by davesidious


There is no way HAARP can change the weather and cause earthquakes. It would involve the entire laws of physics being rewritten. Notice it's never scientists who claim HAARP can do these things, just internet "enthusiasts".


No, the OP is full of baseless conjecture. HAARP is very safe, as it can only affect the Earth a tiny, insignificant amount when compared to the Sun, which does what HAARP does, but 24/7, with infinitely greater power, across half of the world.


It's not fire. It's not dangerous. You are getting scared by internet hearsay.

No.

The "ground" applications describes using HAARP to make a part of the ionosphere reflective to radio waves capable of penetrating the ground ("ground-penetrating RADAR"). RADAR sets then bounce their EM radiation off that patch and on to the ground in a desired location. The amount of energy in the RADAR is miniscule, and as capable of causing earthquakes as earthworms.


Tesla and Westinghouse have nothing to do with it. All it does is simply heat part of the ionosphere, changing its ability to reflect and bounce electromagnetic radiation around.

My god.....it sounds like someone on this website understands science....

well done Dave.

Originally posted by wtfhuh

I am under a different impression.

I think you mean you are delusional. The scientific data on haarp is for the most part out there if you actually take the time and do the research. I mean current and archived.


Nothing worse then people spouting off idiocy when they don't do basic research.


Patents and opinion are not facts.

Um no...I think I meant to say that I was under a different impression. Thanks for contributing to this thread.

reply to post by jumpingbeanz

The ELF radiation produced by HAARP in the ionosphere is not very directional. It propagates outward, horizontally and vertically from its area of origin over Gakona, generally following Earth's magnetic lines of force. It cannot be directed to a specific point.
wwwppd.nrl.navy.mil...


The ability of the heater to produce ELF radiation is highly dependent upon the amount of geomagnetic activity. Under normal conditions the strength varies between 1 and 10 picotesla. Under very active conditions levels of 70 picotesla have been observed. These readings were from the receivers closest to Gakona. The strength of the field drops off the further the receiver is from the site.
cires.colorado.edu...



For comparison the natural EMF of the Earth has a strength of about 55 picotesla near Gakona. In a typical office the strength of the ELF field produced by equipment can be in the range of 30 to 250 nanotesla (30,000 to 250,000 picotesla). The ELF produced by HAARP is insignificant except for possible use in communications.
www.buildingbiology.ca...



There is also evidence that the ELF radiation produced by this method is subject to "saturation". That is, there is a limit to how much radiated power can be produced, no matter how much HF power is applied. The reason for this is not clear and is being studied.
www.vlf.ece.ufl.edu...




[edit on 3/15/2010 by Phage]

reply to post by weedwhacker


If knowing HAARP's capabilities is simply pseudoscience, then the guy who invented HAARP must also be a pseudo-inventor. But yet, there HAARP stands in all of its glory in Alaska.

HAARP's inventor is one of HAARP's biggest whistle blowers and he also one of HAARP's greatest opponents. He was actually quite angry that the Airforce bought him out because he was aware of what they intended to use it for. They specifically used the word, "weapon." This went against the very things that Jim Phelps invented HAARP for in the first place.

Now, are you calling Jim Phelps, and his invention pseudoscience? Are you claiming to know more than they guy who brought HAARP into existence? If so, why don't you design something of this magnitude to prove Phelps wrong?

Jim Phelps against HAARP.
original PDF:
www.lightwatcher.com...

This is from a conspiracy site, but, it still has Phelps's information:
www.surfingtheapocalypse.net...

Here is a page that has multiple links of Phelp's work:
educate-yourself.org...

www.assatashakur.org...

www.rense.com...

www.pdfqueen.com...

www.chemtrailcentral.com...

relay4thetruth.blogspot.com...

forum.prisonplanet.com...





[edit on 15-3-2010 by EvolvedMinistry]

Originally posted by terran99

Originally posted by davesidious


There is no way HAARP can change the weather and cause earthquakes. It would involve the entire laws of physics being rewritten. Notice it's never scientists who claim HAARP can do these things, just internet "enthusiasts".


No, the OP is full of baseless conjecture. HAARP is very safe, as it can only affect the Earth a tiny, insignificant amount when compared to the Sun, which does what HAARP does, but 24/7, with infinitely greater power, across half of the world.


It's not fire. It's not dangerous. You are getting scared by internet hearsay.

No.

The "ground" applications describes using HAARP to make a part of the ionosphere reflective to radio waves capable of penetrating the ground ("ground-penetrating RADAR"). RADAR sets then bounce their EM radiation off that patch and on to the ground in a desired location. The amount of energy in the RADAR is miniscule, and as capable of causing earthquakes as earthworms.


Tesla and Westinghouse have nothing to do with it. All it does is simply heat part of the ionosphere, changing its ability to reflect and bounce electromagnetic radiation around.

My god.....it sounds like someone on this website understands science....

well done Dave.

Here's how well we understand the laws of physics:
refreshingnews9.blogspot.com... (OOPS)

Sorry bud, if this can happen in 2010, where we find out that the theory of relativity based on Physics isn't absolutely correct, then I doubt Davesidious, who is far from being an Einstein, knows that much about what is going on with HAARP.

Just an observation.

But hey, your opinion is the one that matters here.


[edit on 15-3-2010 by EvolvedMinistry]

Originally posted by drew hempel
reply to post by Phage

 

When considering HAARP let's consider Project ELF a forerunner, shut down in part due to the documented health risks:

www.serve.com...

Yeah I got arrested protested Project ELF -- no regrets.

[edit on 15-3-2010 by drew hempel]

Nice point. Thanks for posting to this thread.

Originally posted by jinx880101
reply to post by davesidious

 

Yes, we know. The design of the antennae in the heater is public knowledge, and the amount of power it consumes is also public knowledge. The physics is basic, and well understood. It's only a mystery to those ignorant of science. That video, featuring the inventor's son (even though Eastlund wasn't the inventor, but anyway) doesn't count for squat. Eastlund never even worked at HAARP, but don't let that stop the crazed theories flying around.

Too bad, so sad. This statement is funny.

Well Dave....you're right. Eastlund wasn't the inventor of HAARP. LOL. Good stuff.

His name was Jim Phelps, and the kid on the video was Jim Phelp's kid.

Wake up.

www.youtube.com...