Why are babies sinners?

It is because of where they come out from, its filthy I tell ya. And they like breasts a lot. I have also seen some projectile vomit just like in the Exorcist.

And they have little hands, heads and beady eyes. That follow you around the room.

Its just not natural.

[edit on 11/19/09 by thedeadtruth]

If Adam and Eve were the first people and they had kids... Who did those kids mate with to create more people? THATS RIGHT. Incest. Your all the bastard children of incest... Sinners.

In my opinion the bible is just a book of stories about people who didn't exist. And someday i hope the world will rise above it. And i firmly believe that the only thing stopping world peace is religion.

reply to post by WolfKing


So far the ONLY person (so far in this thread) that actually has a clue!! I will keep reading and then leave my post

OK how do i start so that this can be understood by those the church, hundreds of years ago, was targeting - illiterates etc LOL

OK first there is no original sin
second: babies don't go to hell - why?
third: there is NO hell
forth: God has mercy and wouldn't put you and your family in a place where you could see a family member suffering in hell.

The bible was written when the majority of the worlds population was illiterate and was used to scare people into being "good" and NOT sinning.

Like Hell being filled with fire and brimstone - it is what they, then, understood because THAT is what was used when cremating the dead and that is what these people understood.

Take the bible for whatever you feel it is and make it personal. I think it kind of takes us back to "the dark ages" where ignorance reigns and illiteracy is rife - considering some of what I have read.

The bible is NOT literal for the most part! ADAM and EVE were NOT Adam and Eve but MAN and WOMAN and really was a "story" to help illiterates understand the concept of "the beginning" because they knew nothing of evolution in those days.

Also the world etc was not made in 7 days - it was the church's way to tell a "confusing" story, made simple, to illiterates. For example it does not say, in Genesis, each day was 24 hours...

Now perhaps this was an "AH HAAAA" moment for some? LOL

No i am not going to prove anything - just read it again and again and again till you get what I am saying...

Imagine if the bible was written now how it would read!!

"in 563million years Plane X was created..." LMAO
"Then Fred and Jane Smith were sent on holiday to Area 51 and the "Guard" said don't go into that room - then they DID!! They were thrown out because they learned the truth..." "Then they sat on the pavement eating an apple wondering if they should do it right there...

OH MAN that would be good!!!

[edit on 1/3/2010 by shearder]

All of us are born into sin - a baby is not accountable for his/her sins because they are too young to have any sins.

When that baby gets to an age of accountability, which would vary with each child/pre teen//adult, then they are subject to judgement.

God doesn't send babies to hell - good grief, people!

And for those that say there isn't a hell - the only hope you have on that one.....is to hope that you are right, and billions of others are wrong.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
God doesn't send babies to hell - good grief, people!

And for those that say there isn't a hell - the only hope you have on that one.....is to hope that you are right, and billions of others are wrong.

Well, again, no one can prove it either way so all we have to believe in is that God has mercy hence what you said with "faith" 'God doesn't send babies to hell'

If you want to read what the Bible, and Jesus, has to say about hell, click HERE

A man is on the beach when the tsunami sirens start blaring. Hundreds of people start running off the shore, past the man, who remains standing by the water.

A small boy runs by, slowing down long enough to ask the man why he's not running. The man tells the boy, "Oh, I don't believe in tsunamis.". The small boy continues running to higher ground.

In a few minutes, the tsunami makes landfall, washing the man out to sea.

reply to post by shearder


I have a friend who thinks on the same lines as you appear to - when asked if she has received salvation, or been baptized, she says "I don't need all that". I asked her why.

Her response - "John 3:16".

I said "Ok, that's a sign that people hold up at football games, but what about your salvation?".

Again, she says "All I need to know is John 3:16".

========================================================
Sadly, her, and millions more just like her, have bought into the "new age" Christianity. The one that is now telling people to just believe - you don't have to fast, or pray, or repent - just believe, and you'll go to Heaven.

It's this mentality that is going to be the downfall of most of us. The Bible makes it clear that there will be far more not going to Heaven, that will be going.

God didn't give us the Bible for us to just pick out one or two verses, that sounded all good and simple, and use them as justification for not reading/following the rest of His laws and guidelines.

I.e. the wide gate vs the narrow gate. More people will be going the way of the wide gate (hell) than the narrow one (Heaven).

The Bible speaks in great detail, graphic detail, about hell :

WHAT JESUS CHRIST SAYS ABOUT HELL!

"fire" Matt 7:19, 13:40, 25:41

"everlasting fire" Matt 18:8, 25:41

"eternal damnation" Mark 3:29

"hell fire" Matt 5:22, 18:9, Mark 9:47

"damnation" Matt 23:14, Mark 12:40, Luke 20:47

"damnation of hell" Matt 23:33

"resurrection of damnation" John 5:29

"furnace of fire" Matt 13:42, 50

"the fire that never shall be quenched" Mark 9:43, 45

"the fire is not quenched" Mark 9:44, 46, 48

"Where their worm dieth not" Mark 9:44, 46, 48

"wailing and gnashing of teeth" Matt 13:42, 50

"weeping and gnashing of teeth" Matt 8:12, 22:13, 25:30

"torments" Luke 16:23

"tormented in this flame" Luke 16:24

"place of torment" Luke 16:28

"outer darkness" Matt 8:12, 22:13

"everlasting punishment" Matt 25:46

While you may can say I personally can't prove there is a hell, or Heaven, there are people that claim they can - as they say they have been to both.

Up to you if you want to believe them or believe the non believers.

Source can be found Here

reply to post by nomorecruelty


Well not that it matters but I am Catholic and wil probably die Catholic but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure these things out as there is a LOT of literature which give good reason as to why I don't believe Hell exists.

With that in mind - it isn't why i believe there is no hell but just strengthens my stance.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
While you may can say I personally can't prove there is a hell, or Heaven, there are people that claim they can - as they say they have been to both.

Up to you if you want to believe them or believe the non believers.

Like i said, read the bible and make it personal - it will be different for all - as we see. However, keep in mind too that I said it was not meant for our level of intelligence in 2010 but for what it was back then. It was written by man to teach what they knew BUT NOT in the literal sense.

AH sorry nomorecruelty I didn't address your links - needless to say if someone has a serious fear about going to hell these links are just what they need LOL - a commercial site(s) that will sell them help hehehehe

Again, like i said, it's personal. I don't believe there is a "Hell" like we hear and read about. God has mercy. However I won't stop anyone believing there is.

Originally posted by kawacat
I just cannot understand how a newborn baby could be a sinner.

It seems to me that is very unfair - a baby is a pure clean soul, unblemished - so why are we told by the Bible (which I think was written by a lot of liars) and the churches (which I think are run by a lot of liars) that we are born in sin?

I think a baby starts out with a clean slate which is then blotted by a lot of other people first, and then by that person accordingly.

In other words, I think we are poisonous to our young people and also to ourselves.

Apparently we are all born into sin because Adam and Eve sinned. Because they were not supposed to question anything but they were supposed to dumbly obey.

This sounds very suspect to me.

Nice straw man argument.

Would you argue that a just and loving God would judge those who did not have the opportunity to have a relationship with Him in the same manner as those who had the opportunity to have a relationship with Him and chose not to?

Or are you crazy enough to assert that God is not just and loving?

Or are you trying to argue that God doesn't exist because He is not made in your image?

reply to post by kawacat


www.gotquestions.org...
"Adam and Eve were made in the image and likeness of God (Genesis 1:26-27; 9:6). However, we are also in the image and likeness of Adam (Genesis 5:3). When Adam fell into sin, the result was every one of his descendants also being “infected” with sin."

I suppose you could say it's like an inherited faulty gene or disease like diabetes, heart problems, etc. except 'sin' was inherited by every human because the sin was established before Adam and Eve had children. It would be interesting to know what would have happened if they had children first and then disobeyed God which led them into the act of sin. Adam and Eve were given the commandment not to eat of the tree of Good & Evil. As far as I can understand, this was to give them a choice...or in other words to have free will, otherwise they wouldn't understand right or wrong. This was all part of Gods plan so Jesus could be the sacrificial lamb to forgive our sinful nature.



[edit on 2-3-2010 by Lois]

reply to post by CharlesMartel


I have asked a simple question because I do not understand it.

I have asked why are babies sinners.

To which you have replied that it is a "Nice straw man " thing, then you have said do I think God would classify those who have not yet sinned with sinners, and then you have asked me whether I am upset because God was not made in my image.

To address your sarcastic reply:

1. Re the straw man - have a close look at yourself because your arguments are blown away in the wind.

2. That is the very question I am asking - why has God classified those who have not yet sinned as sinners? So you have said that babies are not sinners.

3. More facile sarcasm.

This is not helpful, nor is it smart or funny - it is pathetic.

Originally posted by calstorm

Originally posted by Dermo
reply to post by kawacat

 

Because a Naked Rib Woman ate an Apple given to her by a Snake.. Apparently.

This is why my Dads brother who died at birth never "Made it to heaven"..

That type of Religious nonsense is sick and twisted.

Yes you are right, those who believe that is what the bible teaches, well...
The bible clearly states the age of accountability, at what age that is, its hard to determine, but I believe it is when ones brain is considered fully developed. Children do not go to hell. Even children who do horrible things.

www.gotquestions.org...
"The age of accountability is a belief that God saves all those who die before reaching the ability to make a decision for or against Christ. Thirteen is the most common number given for the age of accountability, based on the Jewish custom that a child becomes an adult at the age of 13. However, the Bible gives no direct support to the age of 13 always being the age of accountability. It likely varies from child to child. A child has passed the age of accountability once he or she is capable of making a faith decision for or against Christ."

Accountability is not a certain age in particular_this is something God determines according to the individual. A person who has done many wrong things in his/her life can be forgiven by Christ...even in their last breath of life. He knows the heart of every human and "Ephesians 2:8–9 (NIV)
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast."

This does not mean 'good works' aren't important because God does recognize those who perform great deeds. What he's saying is that 'faith' in God , receiving his salvation/forgiveness is by his grace and not because a person has done so many great things. Boasting is not a humble attribute...good deeds should be done in secret or with as little as attention as possible to the one performing the deed. In my opinion, the purpose is so the person won't forget to give glory to God for enabling them to do this good deed.


[edit on 2-3-2010 by Lois]

I am still at a loss to know why we are all called sinners, and babies are born into sin, and that sin seems to be something that everyone in this world is born into.

This is one more strong reason why I refute the bible - it was written by many men, it is corrupt, it is not the true word of God.

To find the true word of God, listen to your heart.

reply to post by kawacat


Original sin just means imperfection. We're all imperfect. Sin doesn't mean evil. Evil is another thing. Sin=death means we're like biological machines. We're machines, but not perfect so we can break and wear out and stop working or even misbehave (malfunction) before we die.

Jesus supposedly had no sin. According to the Bible this imperfection stops us from defeating death. Jesus had no sin so he could come back from the dead supposedly. He somehow rebooted himself, but original sin somehow stops us from doing so.

The Bible tells us original sin is passed down through child birth. That means if the Bible is actually true (I'm not saying it is or isn't) it's probably in our DNA. The instructions that we're made out of. If the instructions have a flaw in them, then so will the machine that gets built from them.

But babies don't go to Hell when they die BTW. That's not what the Bible says. Jesus said to get into Heaven we will have to become like children actually. Maybe the Catholic church teaches that, but it's not supported by the Bible.

Nobody will be punished for original sin. The Bible says that one day Jesus or a Christ of some kind will return to raise the dead and give us new perfect bodies without these flaws. Whatever that means.

[edit on 2-3-2010 by tinfoilman]

Originally posted by tinfoilman
reply to post by kawacat

 

Original sin just means imperfection. We're all imperfect. Sin doesn't mean evil. Evil is another thing. Sin=death means we're like biological machines. We're machines, but not perfect so we can break and wear out and stop working or even misbehave (malfunction) before we die.


The Bible tells us original sin is passed down through child birth. That means if the Bible is actually true (I'm not saying it is or isn't) it's probably in our DNA. The instructions that we're made out of. If the instructions have a flaw in them, then so will the machine that gets built from them.

But babies don't go to Hell when they die BTW. That's not what the Bible says. Jesus said to get into Heaven we will have to become like children actually. Maybe the Catholic church teaches that, but it's not supported by the Bible.



[edit on 2-3-2010 by tinfoilman]

Matthew 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.

18:4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

....................................................................................................

Children generally have an abundance of 'faith' and are quick to believe something without proof. We have the Bible which explains the beginning of all creation and who is the master artist. Our 'faith' is being tested all throughout our lives and as humans we will at times question why bad things happen. Questioning God is not a bad thing because we strive to seek truth and understanding and our creator understands our quest to learn the mysteries in life. The point Christ is saying is to trust in him like children and their open trust.

Because in my opinion, re-incarnation most definitely exists.

It would have to in order for any soul growth and progression. It makes sense to me that you Reap what you Sow.

If I decided to use machete to cut off an innocent persons leg - and God has mercy on my soul -

He would simply send me back into this life with a debilitating disability in order to understand the suffering and grow from the experience. I have a chance now as a new born to grow and learn different emotions.