The Ancients Series | Part I: Sumerians

reply to post by undo

I think I have seen this documentary before, at least I am aware of this flood theory. The flooding of the Black Sea is far from a global, biblical flood though. Personally I much prefer the theory that the biblical flood story (which was global) was linked to a comet. This is a Velikovsky perspective and one that I find explains this event in the simplest way.
Here are a few links.

The Deluge

Deluge and a Comet

Saturn and the Deluge

I could not find the source of the full description but these links and a few books I have read are likely the origin. The way I understanding the theory is that the flood was caused by one or more comets which deposited large amounts of water onto the Earth in a very short period of time (40 days maybe?). This water, which contained salt and other minerals, might have originated along with the comet(s) from another planet. Perhaps Uranus or Neptune but many myths attribute this event to Saturn and Jupiter.

I am beginning to think that perturbed orbits of Saturn and Jupiter caused mass ejections from Uranus (a comet that became a planet) and this is the source of our oceans.
There is a lot of material that describe this in more detail but I am summarizing it here.
The material that was ejected from Uranus came in close contact with Earth which appeared as a comet and this event was not only predictable but was also globally catastrophic.

This theory seems to predict that we can find mineral deposits, in areas like Salt Lake City, Utah and the Dead Sea in Israel, that were from this event, i.e. physical evidence. Water was not only dumped onto the Earth (Inundation) it also rained down (Deluge). Most importantly are the tidal effects that all of this water would have from such a large object (Venus?) so close to Earth. Imagine a several mile high tide and what it would do as the Earth continues to rotate. I think it would be safe to say that just about everything on Earth would be wiped clean.

[edit on 11/1/2009 by Devino]

reply to post by Devino


Hmmm... interesting post. If indeed it wasn't a global flood (which is my opinion), but only restricted to the wide Mesopotamian area then it would most likely be the result of a comet.

Now, i remember watching a documentary but i cannot remember the name for the life of me. You might know though, ill explain the theory. The theory stated that the flood came from the North after an impact from a crater. That would mean a massive comet would have had to have to struck somewhere around the Black sea, the impact would have had to have been massive if it swept all over Turkey and covered the greater Mesopotamian Empire. The theory held weight though, because they had some geological evidence of massive tidal impacts on the soil. I will try and find this documentary, but im having no luck so far.

If it was a comet, it does not rule out all God-like mythological attributes, as a comet and a massive flood would surely still be attributed to punishment from God.

Cheers.

They actually had come to find that their was a great flood in the middle eastern area... but there was NOT a flood worldwide. Its all very interesting tho. Like i've said in other posts, I used to be overly religious and challenge preachers to see if they knew their stuff.... when none did. I departed on my own path... so I can add some christian and anti christian bias to the flood

reply to post by serbsta


I think the theory for a flood due to a celestial impact can be found in the work of Scott Creighton or Graham Hancock. I remember Scott posting a link about this theory although I can't remember whose theory it was nor where the link is. I wasn't too excited about it though, to me it didn't sound quite right.

The theory I was referring to is not from an impact. It is a close fly by of a very large comet, perhaps the size of Earth. What did fall to Earth from this comet was mostly liquid and gas from the comets atmosphere and tail.

Add: imagine passing through this comets tail that was composed of salt water and gasses, some of it poisonous, and the effects this would have on you and where you stand.

I think the Sumerian myths show a water bearing God that rains water (and some fishes) down upon the Earth (Enki). My guess is that there is a connection here. If there was an interaction between planets in this manner then there can be found physical evidence of such an event here on Earth. I believe that an event like this did happen and therefore I believe that the Earth is littered with geological evidence showing what happened.


[edit on 11/1/2009 by Devino]

Originally posted by Devino
reply to post by serbsta

 

The theory I was referring to is not from an impact. It is a close fly by of a very large comet, perhaps the size of Earth.

I believe that an event like this did happen and therefore I believe that the Earth is littered with geological evidence showing what happened.


[edit on 11/1/2009 by Devino]

I don't think I've come across news of such evidence being found yet. Nothing of that scale... you would think the evidence would be obvious and in plain sight?

What about our very own moon as evidence of this?

Egypt did not get their name from someone named Egyptus;The civilization derived that later in time to fit it to their own culture.
Aegypt/Egypt--->"Aegis (Protection) of Ptah" (Peteh/Petoh)(Hotep backwards)
Aegis="guidance, protection"
Ptah= creator deity of the egyptians
Mizraim/Mizrayim/Musri/Meluhha were inhabitants of the land of the Nile River


[edit on 2-11-2009 by problemsolvr]

[edit on 2-11-2009 by problemsolvr]

Originally posted by undo

Thought I should reply to this post to show the relation of words with different languages

Undo wrote: i've been studying this topic for awhile. thought you might like this little etymology

YMN
AMUN
AMEN
AMON
MONTU
MENTU
ENTU
ENU
EN
ANU
AN

YMN -YEMEN
AMUN - MUNDO ("World" in Spanish)
AMEN - MENES/MINOS (1st Egyptian Dynasty ~3100 B.C.)
AMON - AMOON/MONA/MOON
MONTU - MONT (French for MOUNTAIN) MOUNT-AIN/Mount Ayin/Mount-N =ain (N in English)
ayin;(16th letter of Hebrew alphabet); (silent)
MENTU - GOVERN-MENT/MOUNT
ENTU
ENU
EN - EN-KI,EN-LIL,EN-LIGHT-EN,EN-TER,
ANU
AN

[edit on 2-11-2009 by problemsolvr]

[edit on 2-11-2009 by problemsolvr]

reply to post by undo


Most really do not know where the word IRAQ came from to name the country that is in Mesopotamia;

My theory is after reading texts, researching 100's of sources:

Sumerians changed the way they wrote from left to right to right to left,

Arabic is written from right to left. I theorized that after civilization changes with Arabs being more prevalent that they misread the older names of the land of E-KUR

Originally posted by problemsolvr
Egypt did not get their name from someone named Egyptus;The civilization derived that later in time to fit it to their own culture.
Aegypt/Egypt--->"Aegis (Protection) of Ptah" (Peteh/Petoh)(Hotep backwards)
Aegis="guidance, protection"
Ptah= creator deity of the egyptians
Mizraim/Mizrayim/Musri/Meluhha were inhabitants of the land of the Nile River

[edit on 2-11-2009 by problemsolvr]

We've already established the fact that the name example for Egypt i used in the OP is not factual, it is a Mormon perspective and was simply used to offer a somewhat logical example, nothing more.

But yes, you're post is correct. Aegis and Ptah we're the original words used in the makeup of Egypt.

Originally posted by problemsolvr
reply to post by undo

 

I also started thinking that the Qur'an/Kur'an (Their is a gutteral stop noted by the ', according to experts) is related to the KUR=Pyramid/ZigKURat theory. It is interesting to note that the later Arabics used to words that were used much in Sumerian times KUR AN KUR= Pyramid/Mountain/Zikurat of AN-u (AN/ANU/ANU-NA-KI)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kur

This is pretty interesting.

IRAQ could be from the Arabic araqa which means something along the lines of 'well watered'. Although I think it is from the Sumerian Uruk (is this the Biblical Erech?)[which is from the Sumerian uru meaning 'city'].

Edit: However, what you were saying about Qur'an is very interesting. It's associations with Pyramids (KUR) etc. leave for a lot of speculation.



[edit on 2/11/2009 by serbsta]

Originally posted by serbsta
I don't think I've come across news of such evidence being found yet. Nothing of that scale... you would think the evidence would be obvious and in plain sight?

What about our very own moon as evidence of this?

The evidence is in plain sight but the link has not been made yet.

Salt Lakes and Salt flats-Wiki

A salt lake or saline lake is a landlocked body of water which has a concentration of salts (mostly sodium chloride) and other minerals significantly higher than most lakes...
In order, the three largest salt lakes in the world are the Caspian Sea, Aral Sea, and Lake Balkhash. The largest salt lake in the Western Hemisphere, the Great Salt Lake, is the fourth largest salt lake in the world.

Some of the evidence are these salt lakes and flats. Where is the source of their salt and minerals? I have a difficult time believing that is is from rain water running down the area's mountains.

Other evidence are geological formations called Carolina Bays that have been found on the East Coast of North America, New Mexico, South America and Africa. In these areas there are also odd formations called concretions, Fulgurites and Blueberries (like the Martian blueberries) or otherwise called Moqui Marbles. All of these I believe are due to electrical interactions with a celestial body but that is yet another subject.

Also linked to these areas are strange craters from small impacts and volcanoes possibly due to tidal effects from a large object. Categorizing all of this stuff in such a format would be a huge endeavor.

In North America and parts of Europe there are micro carbon and iron spheroids and nano-diamonds yet no impact sight has been found nor is there evidence of an impact. This particular event is directly linked to the Clovis Event or the Younger Dryas period and Black mat layer.

My point is that there is evidence everywhere, the problem is that we do not know what to look for. I underlined the key words to search for as there is a myriad of information on all of this stuff and no sound conclusion as to what happened or how.
Much of this stuff is linked to the Maya and Hopi myths and probably better discussed in that thread.

In a previous post I mentioned the flood was partially due to tidal effects, let me clarify that. Think of how our Moon effect our oceans now, tides ranging from several feet to dozens of feet from the Moons gravity. If a large object came in close to Earth (Earth size and within one lunar distance) the tidal effects on the oceans would be much greater. We could see tides of several miles high. Now imagine the Earth as it rotates under this massive tidal surge.

As for the Moon, well you ever hear about Earth's 360 day year? 12 Lunar months of 30 days each. This was the length of calendars found all over the world. Then after a great cataclysmic event a little over 5 days was added. The length of the Lunar months, number of days per year and Earth's seasons were changing rapidly over time and this was recorded by civilizations from all over the globe.
Change in our Calendar-extracts from "Worlds in Collision"

Sorry for the lack of source links, I am going mostly off of memory. I could post some links but some of my old links are no longer good so I would end up simply doing a search anyway. There is a lot more evidence from the Moon, Earth and our neighboring planets.

Originally posted by Devino

Originally posted by serbsta
I don't think I've come across news of such evidence being found yet. Nothing of that scale... you would think the evidence would be obvious and in plain sight?

What about our very own moon as evidence of this?

The evidence is in plain sight but the link has not been made yet.

Salt Lakes and Salt flats-Wiki

A salt lake or saline lake is a landlocked body of water which has a concentration of salts (mostly sodium chloride) and other minerals significantly higher than most lakes...
In order, the three largest salt lakes in the world are the Caspian Sea, Aral Sea, and Lake Balkhash. The largest salt lake in the Western Hemisphere, the Great Salt Lake, is the fourth largest salt lake in the world.

Some of the evidence are these salt lakes and flats. Where is the source of their salt and minerals? I have a difficult time believing that is is from rain water running down the area's mountains.

Well if these salt lakes aren't the result of river's coming in from the mountains, evaporating, and leaving the salt behind in a process that's been going on for millenia, then it could only be one thing.

Could it be that these areas used to be where large oceans used to exist, maybe even heavily salinized?

I'm not trying to disprove you're more 'cosmic' theory, but i'm trying to give these a more terrestrial explanation.

Originally posted by Devino

In North America and parts of Europe there are micro carbon and iron spheroids and nano-diamonds yet no impact sight has been found nor is there evidence of an impact. This particular event is directly linked to the Clovis Event or the Younger Dryas period and Black mat layer.

Yes i've read about this and i'll agree with you on this one. It is strange.

Originally posted by Devino
As for the Moon, well you ever hear about Earth's 360 day year? 12 Lunar months of 30 days each. This was the length of calendars found all over the world. Then after a great cataclysmic event a little over 5 days was added. The length of the Lunar months, number of days per year and Earth's seasons were changing rapidly over time and this was recorded by civilizations from all over the globe.
Change in our Calendar-extracts from "Worlds in Collision"

I've only vaguely come across this, but i will have a read of the link and will offer my thoughts at a later time.

Cheers.

reply to post by Devino


well i think the water gate is a gated worm hole IN the water, or in some cases, looks like it's in water (event horizon looks like water), but that's a different topic.

i have a thread here about that. it's 2 years old by now, called stargates are real.

reply to post by serbsta


i have to give credit for the enmerkar-nimrod-narmer-osiris connection to DAVID ROHL, an egyptologist who is really interesting. he created what he calls THE NEW CHRONOLOGY. (the ancient world is dated currently, by the egyptian pharaonic line). here's a couple videos about rohl's take on egypt



also, i did an interview with the author (peter goodgame) of THE GIZA DISCOVERY, where i found the data originally, which was my favorite interview.
WARNING: THIS IS MOSTLY ABOUT BIBLE PROPHECY. you can hear it here:
thestargates.com...



[edit on 2-11-2009 by undo]

reply to post by undo



Hmm... interesting.

What are you're thoughts on the water shaft of Osiris though. Does it have any significant connections with the abzu and Osiris in mythology?

reply to post by serbsta


it could! i have no idea. like, i theorized that nimrod brought the dur.anki gate from nibru to abydos, and put it in the osirieon. then he drowned, was resusicated, entered the gate (the portal of the lords of eternity mentioned in the shabaka stone text) and now he's.......i dunno, what he's doing but sounds odd whatever it is. anyway, i also theorized that there was a pyramid or ziggurat construct on top of the osirieon, and after his death, it was deconstructed and the stones used to build the 14 obelisks that were erected along the nile, commemorating his "dismemberment" by Set, and that he wasn't really chopped up into 14 pieces, it's a cover story for the deconstruction of the building that was at one time on top of the osirieon. the osirieon was an abzu chamber in which the portal of the lords of eternity existed.

seti the first, found it many many years later, during excavations for his own temple at abydos, after which he had the book of gates penned, for the very first time. the entire text of the book of gates is engraved into his alabaster sarcophagus. i don't think he knew what to do with it, though. the osirieon chamber and its contents, stayed buried there for a very long time. it wasn't found again till like 1900 AD



[edit on 2-11-2009 by undo]

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by serbsta

 

seti the first, found it many many years later, during excavations for his own temple at abydos, after which he had the book of gates penned, for the very first time. the entire text of the book of gates is engraved into his alabaster sarcophagus. i don't think he knew what to do with it, though.


[edit on 2-11-2009 by undo]

Ok, does that explain why Seti built his temple in front of the Osirieon? Did he know of it's significance or did he only assume?

Please expand on the engravings and this 'book of gates', sounds interesting as i haven't heard about this yet.

Edit: Found something:

This temple was built as a symbol of Seti's closeness to Osiris and contains a sarcophagus, though Seti was not buried here. Seti's actual tomb is in the Valley of the Kings in Luxor. This was a fairly common practice among many of the pharaohs, having "public" tombs in one location, but actually being buried in another. The Osirieon is currently inaccessible because of the rising sand and the flooding that has occurred. Excavation has been done on the south side passage, which revealed texts from The Book of the Gates and The Book of What is in the Duat.

Some of these specifics are news to me though, and not you, so i apologize if im just posting things you already know about.

[edit on 2/11/2009 by serbsta]

reply to post by serbsta

I must admit that the Salt Lake theory for a cosmic origin is something that recently caught my attention and I feel it deserves more research. Deposits of salt in such large quantities above ground only happen in land locked areas where the water does not drain but instead evaporates off.

As far as I know all water run off from mountains due to rain or snow melt is fresh water containing no salt. There are some trace minerals especially in muddy glacial water (Glacial Milk) but it is not salty. If mountain water run off does contain salt then it should be present in the water and there should be deposits along the river banks and upper mountain lakes.

I am aware of the "terrestrial explanation" for these salt flats as this is what I was taught in school and it remains the explanation today. I don't know what to think of the ancient sea bed theory, I suppose it could have happened, but keep in mind it is quite possible that we do have witnesses to these events (global biblical flood myths). I remember reading a claim that the water that fell from the heavens causing the flood was salty.

reply to post by serbsta


book of gates
www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk...
the osirieon
www.phouka.com...

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Basic indeed.. I couldn't read past the first post me self, from an "academic" viewpoint, it is a butchery of history..

Now, now, be a good mason and show kindness and benevolence at all times.

I am unsure of why people have recently taken to.. I don't know.. trying to make ancient Gods into aliens or real Gods even.. Why can't a story, be a story?

The ancient-astronaut-theory arose out of the need to overcome religious-bias on the one side and anti-religious-bias n the other side to see events as they were actually reported.

[edit on 2-11-2009 by Skyfloating]