Did no one really get what Jones was trying to do?

Thats the exact same thing my buddy nicolaus said when he asked me to write the protocols of a meeting of some rabbis in paris. Just to open some eyes. Sure, the meeting never took place, but it could have! And lots of good came from me writing that little piece of fiction!
But when another buddy of mine in south america started killing people to solve the case in his true crime TV show i told him that he had to be more careful with that! I told him that people will be too naive to see that all he did was trying to make them happy!
I heard rumors about CNN paying the guy with the AR15. Don't know if its true but if they did it to push their agenda, they have an end, that they want to achieve, and the end justifies the means, right? right?

Edit to add one more example:
It's all true! 911 was an inside job. Bush personally trained on that remote control for months and laughed in glee when he managed to hit the pentagon! But all he wanted to do is bring democracy to Iraq! Really, what are 3000 people dead compared to millions of iraquis living in freedom? I mean, sure... he "made the news instead of reporting them" but: Free Iraquis, free oil, lots of money for halliburton, whats not to like there?

[edit on 9-9-2009 by debunky]

reply to post by debunky


Reply to your edit:

Does it not then smack of both irony and karma that the same tactics be used on "them" that they used on us?

reply to post by A Fortiori


No karma involved.
If you don't object to deception used to achieve a goal, you can not object to Bushs justifications for attacking iraq. (doesnt even have to include 911, WMD suffice)

reply to post by jprophet420


So calling everyone a liar makes the topic of this thread seem more relevant? The topic is that nobody got what Jones was trying to do.

And, yes, I do get what he was trying to do, but he failed miserably with what he did.

If you want to create a video and hype up the BIGGEST story of the last 14 years, then so be it. If Charlie Sheen wants to write a script of what could be, so be it. But what Jones did was tell people in his video that he would release pieces of what the story would be about that morning before his show. It turns out that what was released was the Charlie Sheen "interview" and it was presented as if it happened.

When the comments started challenging the authenticity of this story, they were immediately erased. In conspiracy circles, we call this a coverup. Then, 90 minutes later a disclaimer was added stating that this interview hadn't taken place...yet. Even this is slightly deceitful as it could imply that there will be an interview in the future and not that this is just wishful thinking or an attempt to garner an interview.

I posted the definition of a hoax in another thread. It fits nicely with what Jones did. Here is the definition: An act intended to deceive or trick.

If you think that he did not intend to do this, then we will have to agree to disagree.

But please don't try to justify the actions of someone as high-profile as Alex Jones by saying that we all lie so that makes what he did o.k.

To quote from the Spiderman movie, "With great power comes great responsibility."

Jones does have a lot of influential power in many conspiracy and truth-seeking circles. That's why many of us just can't understand why he would risk damaging his credibility and that of the community with this irresponsible stunt. This isn't the biggest story of the last 14 years and will be off the radar in no time. It's sad to think that this was a feeble attempt to drive up revenue for a short time and/or create a viral video for means of pushing his latest DVD.

LMAO.

I could care less about Alex Jones little stunt. Whether you support it or not ... there remains one undeniable FACT:

It worked because you're STILL talking about it. Mission accomplished.

reply to post by debunky


Or maybe I objected to Bush using that approach to murder people, and feel that Charlie Sheen's approach is karma because he's using it to save people.

I don't live in a black and white world. There are shades of gray and then there's technicolor.

There is a Jewish Rabbinic responsa that answers what constitutes a lie. They responded with:

Would you tell a bride she is ugly on her wedding day?

Charlie Sheen didn't lie in order to hurt anyone. He basically told the bride that she looked lovely.


[edit on 9-9-2009 by A Fortiori]

reply to post by Frankidealist35


WRONG!

The article specifically says "I recently had the pleasure of sitting down with our 44th President of the United States of America, Barack Hussein Obama".

That was a complete lie.

The line at the bottom stating that it has not actually happened yet was not added until hours after the original story was posted, making the story a complete lie.

reply to post by dalepmay


Or it really could have been an error as they were trying to post early enough to make EST...

When I rush I do stupid things.

EDIT: For example, I just went back and corrected "like" to "lie" in the above post. And I just edited this post. Check out how many posts have "edit" in them before you declare disbelief.

Also...how far did they get in War of the Worlds before they told people it was a fabricated story and not a real attack, and this was an age where people couldn't jump on the internet to verify that no one was attacking.

[edit on 9-9-2009 by A Fortiori]

Originally posted by symmetricAvenger
reply to post by A Fortiori

 

sorry

he lied to get attention..

HOAX

+1
Case closed.

Wow!!!

SOme people just don't have a grip on reality...

Your doctor lies to you.
The car dealer lies to you.
The stockbroker lies to you.
The church lies to you.
The government lies to you.
Your wife and kids lie to you.
Your mother and father lied to you.
Your schoolteacher lied to you.
The history books lie to you.
The police lie to you.
The President(s) lie to you.

But AJ does it to bring a subject out into the open so we can find the truth and all you bluehairs go into a tizzy. I don't like him or even listen to him...you have an off button...use it...

What boring lives you must lead if this is all it takes to get your dander up..

get a life....

Originally posted by symmetricAvenger
reply to post by A Fortiori

 

sorry

he lied to get attention..

HOAX

hahahha ... as I said ... the brain is not something everyone is allowed to have ... and that is sad ...

if you really think that some random guy would interview obama about 911 ... man, and then get out with everything and permission to post online, well ... we live in different worlds

reply to post by A Fortiori


But the only way you can not object to what jones "tried to do" (your own words, implying that it was indeed not an accident) (and how could it be) is if you think the end is something that one should try to achieve.

And no matter what the goal, you will find good number of folks who don't think its noble, and must be achieved at all costs. History is full of examples of this, from the tiny (like this) to the undeniably huge (Burning down the Reichstag to get rid of communism).

Ergo: The end justifies the means can only be true if the end is something "good", and since "good" is highly subjective the ends *never* justifiy the means.

Edit to add: war of the worlds: In the announcement at the beginning, and in the end Orson wells stating "I hope you liked our little tale on this halloween evening" or something along those lines. But i don't think it's all fair to compare this to war of the worlds. Intention *does* enter the equation. The intent for Blair witch project was not to drive up tourism in rural America. Also War of the worlds has some literary merit (you can find it on youtube and you will see that it has lost nothing of it's spookiness in the last 70 years), while this is more comparable to the "Obama talks to alien" thread on this board.

[edit on 9-9-2009 by debunky]

reply to post by debunky


You are using extreme examples that, once again, involved injury and destruction. The next time your girlfriend, wife, or daughter asks you if she looks fat or could lose weight and she does then tell her the absolute truth and see what happens. If you're a girl, the next time your SO asks about "size", tell the truth.

There are levels of "ends justifies means" and hyperbolizing them is also a deception. You are being deceptive when you say that you don't know the difference between lying to save someone's life and lying to take it.

from infowars

from infowars

Separately, a few other blogs were up in arms about Sheen’s letter being a “hoax” because the disclaimer clarifying that the meeting with Obama was a stylized fictional account and not a real event did not get added to the bottom of the article until a little later due to technical snafus and a bombardment of traffic that shut down servers and locked out Infowars and Prison Planet webmasters. With the Infowars version having been copied across from Prison Planet, both original versions did not contain the disclaimer until the error was brought to our attention and promptly fixed as soon as we could gain access to servers that kept crashing, as many readers noted at the time. We added the disclaimer as soon as possible as well as other information that should have been included at the bottom of the original article regarding Sheen’s appearance on the show. We apologize for any confusion this may have caused and are trying to move our servers in house to prevent this routine occurrence from happening again.

reply to post by A Fortiori


And the difference here is that i don't think any lifes will be saved by this. See? We don't agree on the "goodness of the goal". You think "some people will look into 911 because of this. yay." I think "Some people might look into 911 because of this and will be decieved further (With shinier loose change for example) Oh no."

Originally posted by Frankidealist35
reply to post by symmetricAvenger

 

It wasn't a lie. It was a work of fiction.

It was a war of the worlds type of thing. Can't you guys see that?

Yeah--WOTW is a PERHAPS a good analogy/example,but do you remember what happened during/after the broadcast of WOTW?Danger,Danger.....

thats what I posted in the other thread to kind of proove that this all thing was a mistake ... follow my thinking

yes, some guy in the website made a mistake ... but really

THERE WAS 2 NEWS OR MORE ABOUT CHARLIE SHEEN

1 - 20 minutes with the president
2 - Charlie Sheen requests meeting with obama


Thats why, my brain, that I think its capable enough, thinks that the guy in the website, who manages it and posted the news, forgot to put the disclaimer ....

WHY would alex make some hoax news if the other news below was an request to meet the president

it Just doesnt make ANY sense ... really, I think I debunked your theory ...

reply to post by Faiol


Either way...I don't care. People are talking about it.

i think that alex sensationalizes all kinds of things for attention.

this was a fake story.

but if you didnt already know that charlie sheen WASNT actually interviewing the president, and if he did that they would actually let us see it all, well you arent the brightest bulb, now are you?

i mean seriously.

what it was, I believe, was an attempt to get obama to possibly see the interview, and since it assumes him as a role, he might be guided into saying what he is saying in the faux-interview. possible.

might open the eyes of those that absolutely dont believe if could happen, since they might have said the same things as he in the beginning.

i thought it was a positive push for reopening investigation in ALL peoples minds.

obviously it was fake. come on..

reply to post by mahtoosacks


Thank you. That is my point, exactly.