64 Years ago, Yesterday... (Warning some graphic material)

Better the school bully then the resident psycopath

reply to post by MADCZAR

If you beleive what you were taught in school about history ur definately going down the wrong path. Anglo history has been changed to make Anglos look dominate over other cultures. English scholars created a Indo European culture so they didnt have to admit are language comes from sanskrit. History should constantly be revised when flaws are found in acepted knowledge.

I was taught in history class that the Japanese invaded Manchuria in 1931.
en.wikipedia.org...
www.thenagain.info...

I was taught that the Japanese invaded China in 1937.
library.thinkquest.org...

I was taught that the Japanese attacked Nanking in China in 1937, and tortured, raped and massacred hundreds of thousands of people.
en.wikipedia.org...
www.centurychina.com...

I was taught that the Japanese invaded South East Asia in 1941, not to mention Pearl Harbor.
www.fsmitha.com...

History is history, you cannot avoid facts. The Japanese had been preparing for a fight and they got one. Fortunately they lost. USA drops two Atomic bombs, end of War.

better the school bully then the reisdent pyscopath

reply to post by fooffstarr

What I find ironic and saddening is that 64 years on, the US, the only country ever to use a nuclear weapon in an act of war, is the one trying to police the world on who can and can't make them. That's like making the school bully the hall monitor.

You can find it ironic and saddening, that is your opinion. The USA, the only country to use the bomb. The only country to possess such a bomb, used it to end WW2. The USA has not used one since then. The USA knows the destructive power of the bomb, and strives to prevent the proliferation of more such bombs. If the "School Bully" is keeping the peace, what seems to be the problem. If the USA and its allies didn't do this, who would?

Nuclear Weapons are the worst inventions ever to be invented.

They are wrong. They are wrong according to me, the Earth Charter, and really anyone with half a brain.

So. That's all I have to say on this topic. What America did was wrong.

I didnt mean to make it a personal attack. My point is we never really know the truth just what other people have seen. All the history books will say Osama was responcible for the twin towers does that make it true.
U obviously are very educated and I dont want to pick a fight. U should look into oral histories of the world mostly ancient history it very interesting how different it is from written history. That is the reason the Kabbalah was made as an oral secret. The books are all BS. And I agree with you on how horrible the Japanese were against the Chinese.

While I wish Nukes never existed they do. So stop being a child and be happy we have them. Secondly if Nukes were not invented we would all probally be at war. The human species has been fighting tribal wars since its inception. The cro mags killed the neanderthals and thats how the Japanes viewed the rest of the world and still do. Look at what it takes to become a Japanes citizen.

reply to post by ravenshadow13

So. That's all I have to say on this topic. What America did was wrong.

By dropping the Atomic Bombs on Japan, it is estimated that at least 4 million lives were saved. If you do not understand that saving lives is a good thing, you are entitled to your opinion. Some country was going to invent the Bomb, I just thank God it was the United States.

www.freerepublic.com...

If the Japanese had not been forced to surrender by the atomic bombs, a conventional invasion might have incurred a similar casualty ratio as Okinawa had. That would be roughly 35 million lives lost, half of those being Japanese civilians forced or propagandized into fighting to the death.

scottthong.wordpress.com...

Originally posted by IntastellaBurst
I think the sad thing is .... Japan had already surrendered before the bombs were dropped. ... but the US wanted revenge for Pearl Harbour, ... as well as being able to test the new weapon on a population.

[edit on 7-8-2009 by IntastellaBurst]

It's so true what you said.

That's exactly what's being discussed by Ralph Epperson on this week's Veritas Show



Here's a preview I found:



And here's the Hilo Tribue newspaper dated November 30, 1941 in which the headline reads: JAPAN MAY SRIKE OVER WEEKEND

Here's an image of the newspaper:


So, if the Hilo Tribune knew and reported about this, what are the chances that President Roosevelt knew too? You decide.

I disagree, however, in your statement about the US wanting revenge from Pearl Harbor (four years before). What the US really wanted was to test the new weapons, and they did.

Cheers!

[edit on 7-8-2009 by Exopolitico]

In my opinion, there was no way around it. If we had not dropped the bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, there would have been alot more bloodshed. Take for example the Japanese on the Aluetian Islands, U.S. Territory. The Japanese expansion had no boundaries. What I'm saying is that, if we did'nt drop them, we would have been in a prolonged war on Japans mainland, that would have caused hundred of thousands if not millions of casualties.

reply to post by Brother Stormhammer


I understand where you are coming from...but who really knows anything?

History really depends on which history book you are reading. People read things, and then they believe them. A dangerous practice. People cite sources of history as if they are 100% fact.

You could argue that the atom bombs ended the war and saved lives. You could also argue that it was the Soviets that ended the war and saved lives. It really depends on your source of information. And the most popular version of history doesn't make it the right version of history.

Nobody can say that dropping the atom bomb saved millions of lives. First, because we aren't sure that is what stopped the war. Second, because we don't know what would have happened. Humans are horrible at predicting much of anything. (Plus there are many propaganda campaigns. I've read that inflating the estimates of deaths in a sustained war was one of them...but who knows)

I am personally against nationalism and patriotism. I believe people being too proud of their nations, religion, etc. is what causes wars, arguments, etc. and causes us to repeat history. It also allows the governments of those nations to get away with more. Nowadays it is pro-American vs. anti-American. If there was no American to begin with there wouldn't be this problem.

Just look at this thread...pro-Americans vs. anti-Americans.

Like John Lennon's song, Imagine...


[edit on 7-8-2009 by Nickmare]

Originally posted by jammer2012
In my opinion, there was no way around it. If we had not dropped the bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, there would have been alot more bloodshed. Take for example the Japanese on the Aluetian Islands, U.S. Territory. The Japanese expansion had no boundaries. What I'm saying is that, if we did'nt drop them, we would have been in a prolonged war on Japans mainland, that would have caused hundred of thousands if not millions of casualties.

What you are saying would be true if Japan hadn't been trying to surrender for weeks. No invasion and more death and carnage was necessary. The bombs were dropped because we wanted to test them for the first time and send a clear message to any other country. It was a simple equation.

Cheers.

reply to post by Exopolitico


The First Atomic Bomb Blast, July 16, 1945

The events that took place in a remote area of New Mexico during the predawn hours of July 16, 1945 forever changed the world. In the early morning darkness the incredible destructive powers of the atom were first unleashed and what had been merely theoretical became reality.

Hiroshima (August 6, 1945)

In the early morning hours of August 6, 1945, a B-29 bomber named Enola Gay took off from the island of Tinian and headed north by northwest toward Japan.

Originally posted by IntastellaBurst

I think the sad thing is .... Japan had already surrendered before the bombs were dropped. ... but the US wanted revenge for Pearl Harbour, ... as well as being able to test the new weapon on a population.

Japan had not surrendered. After the first bomb, their response was misunderstood because they did not say "we surender" but used a different word. They got #2 and were asked again. This time they said "surrender." War over.

reply to post by IntastellaBurst


I don't remember them surrendering before the bombs fell.

Point is war sucks. War is evil. America looked after its own. To them , American lives were more important than Japanese ones. Too bad, but in war that's the evil fact.

reply to post by Exopolitico


Well, to be honest, I do not know too much about the Japanese trying to surrender weeks before we dropped the bombs. From the history I know, that was never the case. It took the second bomb to get them to surrender.

Originally posted by IntastellaBurst

I dont want to take away from the meaning of the article, ... but whats the significance of the 64 year anniversary ??? next year it will be 65 years, ... should we observe it as a holiday or something ??

I think the sad thing is .... Japan had already surrendered before the bombs were dropped. ... but the US wanted revenge for Pearl Harbour, ... as well as being able to test the new weapon on a population.

[edit on 7-8-2009 by IntastellaBurst]

Please don't spread bull#.

en.wikipedia.org...

The atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were nuclear attacks near the end of World War II against the Empire of Japan by the United States at the executive order of U.S. President Harry S. Truman on August 6 and August 9, 1945, respectively. After six months of intense fire-bombing of 67 other Japanese cities, followed by an ultimatum which was ignored by the Shōwa regime, the nuclear weapon "Little Boy" was dropped on the city of Hiroshima on Monday,[1] August 6, 1945, [2] followed on August 9 by the detonation of the "Fat Man" nuclear bomb over Nagasaki.

They did not surrender until the 12th of August:

On August 12, the Emperor informed the imperial family of his decision to surrender.

Originally posted by ravenshadow13
Nuclear Weapons are the worst inventions ever to be invented.

They are wrong. They are wrong according to me, the Earth Charter, and really anyone with half a brain.

So. That's all I have to say on this topic. What America did was wrong.

Nuclear is the future. We need nuclear energy.

Religion killed more people, and you know what? It's only going to get more dangerous.

reply to post by silo13


A very important thread and IMO proof that those in power will always be willing to kill innocent civilians and have NO discretion whatsoever when it comes to to slaughtering them.

The ethnocentric jingoistic imperialist attitude of the USA in regards to the dropping of these bombs has always disgusted me even when we were learning about it in civics class they would portray it as necessary or would scoff at the fact the Japanese shouldn't have messed with us

It really is infuriating that today's media circus can't scrounge up at least a few minutes of time to talk about the bombings...

When people act incredulous at the idea that 911 might have been an inside job because they believe the people in power wouldn't slaughter thousands of innocents I like to remind them of what happened in Japan and that the Elite really don't care whether innocents die in the thousands or in the millions, they don't care.

The more I look at American history the less inclined I am to be proud to be an American.

reply to post by Exopolitico

I think the sad thing is .... Japan had already surrendered before the bombs were dropped. ... but the US wanted revenge for Pearl Harbour, ... as well as being able to test the new weapon on a population.

It is not true what was said.

The events that led to Japan's Aug. 15 surrender occurred a few days earlier, when U.S. planes dropped an atomic bomb on Hiroshima on Aug. 6 and on Nagasaki on Aug. 9, taking nearly 200,000 lives.

www.cjonline.com...

The surrender of Japan in August 1945 brought World War II to a close. By August 1945, the Imperial Japanese Navy effectively ceased to exist, and an Allied invasion of Japan was imminent. While publicly stating their intent to fight on to the bitter end, Japan's leaders at the Supreme War Council (the "Big Six") were privately making entreaties to the Soviet Union to mediate peace on terms favorable to the Japanese. The Soviets, meanwhile, were preparing to attack the Japanese, in fulfillment of their promise to the Americans and the British made at the Yalta Conference. On August 6 and 9, the Americans dropped atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, respectively. Also on August 9, the Soviet Union launched a surprise invasion of the Japanese colony in Manchuria (Manchukuo), in violation of the Soviet–Japanese Neutrality Pact. These twin shocks caused Emperor Hirohito to intervene and order the Big Six to accept the terms the Allies had set down for ending the war in the Potsdam Declaration. After several more days of behind-the-scenes negotiations and a failed coup d'état, Hirohito gave a recorded radio address to the nation on August 15. In the radio address, called the Gyokuon-hōsō (Jewel Voice Broadcast), he read the Imperial Rescript on surrender, announcing to the Japanese populace the surrender of Japan.

en.wikipedia.org...