64 Years ago, Yesterday... (Warning some graphic material)

What happened 64 years ago yesterday ATS???
You forget?
No, don't go running to Google Search, I’ll tell you.

The US Bombing of Hiroshima.

I was surprised when I arrived on ATS this morning and didn't find any new threads concerning Hiroshima.
Why?
Because:

64 years ago yesterday the USA used a weapon of mass destruction on Hiroshima Japan. Three days later on the 9th the USA again bombed the East (Nagasaki), in total killing over 250 thousand innocent men, women and children.
The USA would go down in history as the first ‘modern’ nation on earth to do so.
64 years later, we’ve forgotten.
Almost

I began looking around on MSM wondering about coverage there.
I found an article on CNN, but it had Obama in the heading.

The USA military destroys over a quarter of a million innocent lives but the article has to have Obama in the heading to get any attention.

Hiroshima mayor backs Obama on nukes ban

About 50,000 people attended the ceremony, including officials and visitors from countries around the world, though the United States did not have an official representative at the ceremony.

Hiroshima was instantly flattened and an estimated 140,000 people were killed or died within months when the American B-29 bomber Enola Gay dropped its deadly payload in the waning days of World War II.
Three days after the attack on Hiroshima, the U.S. dropped another atomic bomb on the city of Nagasaki, killing about 80,000 people. Japan surrendered on Aug. 15, ending World War II. A total of about 260,000 victims of the attack are officially recognized by the government, including those that have died of related injuries or sickness in the decades since.

Stepping away from MSM I began checking *other* sites, which of course didn’t disappoint.

Information Clearing House has three good articles: Hiroshima Day, The Great Hiroshima Cover-up, and a Poll that states only 22 percent of the polled thinks the bombing of Hiroshima by the USA was wrong.


Fark remembered Hiroshima! Hiroshima mayor calls for abolishing nuke weapons

Hiroshima's mayor urged global leaders on Thursday to back President Obama's call to abolish nuclear weapons as Japan marked the 64th anniversary of the world's first atomic bomb attack.
In April, Obama said that the United States — the only nation that has deployed atomic bombs in combat — has a "moral responsibility" to act and declared his goal to rid the world of the weapons.

Oh look, there’s that Obama guy again, but what do you expect - it‘s a Google article.

About 50,000 attended the ceremony, including officials and visitors from countries around the world, though the United States did not have an official representative at the ceremony.

American’s didn’t even send a representative to the memorial!



But back to MSM, ATS and Hiroshima.
Does it bother me the MSM didn't cover this more, yesterday, and without Obama references?
Yes.
Maybe they’re waiting to wrap it all up nice and tidy on the 9th?
We’ll see.

Oh yeah, the 9th? That’s when the USA dropped a second bomb on Nagasaki.

Just in case you forgot...

Warning: The following photos may upset you Warning


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/37f5c884df1f.jpg[/atsimg]


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/50c82eb5c373.jpg[/atsimg]

The American occupation forces imposed strict censorship on Japan, prohibiting anything "that might, directly or by inference, disturb public tranquility" and used it to prohibit all pictures of the bombed cities. The pictures remained classified ‘top secret’ for many years. Some of the images have been published later by different means, but it’s not usual to see them all together. This is the horror they didn’t want us to see, and that we must NEVER forget.

Here’s a link to the photos the USA didn’t want people to see.
www.neatorama.com... (WARNING!)

And as I have a real aversion to anything that might be considered sensationalism that does not add a ray of hope I’ll post a small montage of some the incredibly courageous and beautiful Hiroshima today.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/8cda66aaf86b.jpg[/atsimg]

Don’t forget. Never forget.


Similar threads on this issue here on ATS.

I really encourage anyone who reads this thread to go to the above link

An absolutely stunning read, and see - truly one of the best threads I’ve seen on ATS.

peace

[edit on 7-8-2009 by silo13]

I dont want to take away from the meaning of the article, ... but whats the significance of the 64 year anniversary ??? next year it will be 65 years, ... should we observe it as a holiday or something ??

I think the sad thing is .... Japan had already surrendered before the bombs were dropped. ... but the US wanted revenge for Pearl Harbour, ... as well as being able to test the new weapon on a population.

[edit on 7-8-2009 by IntastellaBurst]

Starred and Flagged.

There is a lot of talk lately about Nuking Iran. When when that happens the Weapon will have as it's trigger, a bomb more powerful than the ones that destroyed those Japanese cities. That's just the trigger.


Pick your City:

The Bush administration has built a new generation of nuclear weapons that we call ‘usable’ nukes, and they have a nuclear ‘posture’ now, which permits the use of nuclear weapons in a non-nuclear environment if the Commander in Chief deems U.S forces to be at significant risk. If we start bombing Iran (I tell you now it’s not going to work).

My concern is that we will use nuclear weapons to break the backbone of Iranian resistance and it may not work, but what it will do is this: It will unleash the nuclear genie. So to all those Americans out there tonight who are saying, you know what, taking on Iran is a good thing… . And if we use nuclear weapons, the genie ain’t going back in the bottle until an American city is taken out by an Islamic weapon in retaliation. So tell me, you want to go to war against Iran, pick your city. Pick your city. Tell me which one you want gone. Seattle? L.A.? Boston? New York? Miami? Pick one! Because at least one’s going. And that’s something we should all think about before marching down this path of insanity

[edit on 7-8-2009 by Exuberant1]

I agree that its sad people forgot and little is said about it being the 64th anniversary of the bombing although once something passes more then ten years people generally don't talk about it unless it a 5 year mark.

I don't agree with "250 thousand innocent men, women and children.".

It was war and they were killing innocent men and children also, why does it make the US monsters because they won the war? You win a war but blowing up the other person or disabling their ability to continue to fight.

I don't really know where people got this idea that in war people shouldn't die unless they are in uniform but it doesn't happen that way. War is sick and twisted and causes pain and suffering but it's also about domination and each side doing just about anything they can to win over the other at any cost. In this case we had the bomb before they did so we won.

We didn't win because they were more merciful and caring. If given the chance they would have wiped the west coast off the map and we would have been the ones in their position.

Talk about the remembering for the loss of life but don't look to gain much support for your effort with a post like that. War sucks but its reality.

reply to post by silo13




Just thought I'd drop this video off.

Well not drop but post, drop may be a bad word in this thread. PC

reply to post by IntastellaBurst

... but whats the significance of the 64 year anniversary

My reasons are stated in the article.

In a nutshell - what significance does the anniversary have?

That is happened at all - as I agree we couldn't wait to *test* the bomb and Japan paid the price.

peace

reply to post by whoshotJR

Talk about the remembering for the loss of life but don't look to gain much support for your effort with a post like that. War sucks but its reality.

I’m not looking for support.

Who needs support when I know what is right and what is wrong and FACTS support:
Japan was beaten.
They were through.

All it takes is a little looking around and you'll find out the truth.

The bomb did not have to obliterate over 250 thousand INNOCENTS to bring a war, that was already OVER to a close.

Not you, or anyone has the right, in the name of *war* to rename a child anything other than innocent. No one has that right. If anything it’s just a sick attempt at justifying the atrocities perpetrated by war.

And please, best intentions or not, don’t tell me what to write about or not write about on ATS.

peace


[edit on 7-8-2009 by silo13]

Originally posted by silo13
That is happened at all - as I agree we couldn't wait to *test* the bomb and Japan paid the price.

peace

The First Atomic Bomb Blast, July 16, 1945

The events that took place in a remote area of New Mexico during the predawn hours of July 16, 1945 forever changed the world. In the early morning darkness the incredible destructive powers of the atom were first unleashed and what had been merely theoretical became reality.

Hiroshima (August 6, 1945)

In the early morning hours of August 6, 1945, a B-29 bomber named Enola Gay took off from the island of Tinian and headed north by northwest toward Japan.

reply to post by silo13


Boy, sure can tell you weren't around then. The Japanese refused to surrender. It was determined that up to 500,00 American soldiers would be killed or wounded in an invasion of Japan. We had already lost tens of thousands fighting in the European and Pacific theaters of war. That is not including those who were wounded. After the first bomb was dropped the Japanese still would not surrender. So, we dropped another. Being the first country in the world to possess such an awesome weapon, it was a difficult decision that President Truman had to make whether to use it or not. If you want to get into the innocent women and children issue, why not look at all the Korean, Chinese, Thai's and other South Eastern Asian women and children who were raped, tortured and worked to death by the invading Japanese? We used the Bomb, the Japanese finally gave up, war over.

Originally posted by silo13

The bomb did not have to obliterate over 250 thousand INNOCENTS to bring a war, that was already OVER to a close.

We were going to starve millions of Japanese to death before the invasion. This bomb saved their lives.

I still wish it had never been used. I used to have nightmares about it.

reply to post by Oatmeal


Great point.

The US was already destroying a city a day with conventional bombing. Actually the death toll from Hiroshima and Nagasaki came to around 200.000 combined. They were relatively small bombs compared to what the US/RUSSIA/China have now.

They weren't going to surrender.

Oatmeal and Exuberant

Japan was ready to call it quits anyway. More than 60 of its cities had been destroyed by conventional bombing, the home islands were being blockaded by the American Navy, and the Soviet Union entered the war by attacking Japanese troops in Manchuria.

American refusal to modify its "unconditional surrender" demand to allow the Japanese to keep their emperor needlessly prolonged Japan's resistance.

A demonstration explosion over Tokyo harbor would have convinced Japan's leaders to quit without killing many people.

Even if Hiroshima was necessary, the U.S. did not give enough time for word to filter out of its devastation before bombing Nagasaki.

The bomb was used partly to justify the $2 billion spent on its development.

The two cities were of limited military value. Civilians outnumbered troops in Hiroshima five or six to one.

Japanese lives were sacrificed simply for power politics between the U.S. and the Soviet Union.

Conventional firebombing would have caused as much significant damage without making the U.S. the first nation to use nuclear weapons.

peace

[edit on 7-8-2009 by silo13]

reply to post by silo13


Don't forget the "Unconditional Surrender" nonsense that was our policy at the time.

Japan refused to surrender unless they could have guarantees that the Emperor would not be punished for war crimes. America said "No. Unconditional surrender is all we'll accept".

....But guess what - We decided not to prosecute the Emperor afterall.

reply to post by silo13


When I was younger (15ish) I believed the US was justified in bombing Hiroshima.. However as wisdom grew with my age, i found that.. it is completely un-acceptable to EVER, and especially INTENTIONALLY bomb a civilian population.

Originally posted by silo13
American refusal to modify its "unconditional surrender" demand to allow the Japanese to keep their emperor needlessly prolonged Japan's resistance.

That had nothing to do with unconditional surrender.

The Emperor was perfectly safe. See here he is standing next to the defeated Japanese Emperor [atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/de765a18f68c.jpg[/atsimg]

[edit on 7-8-2009 by SLAYER69]

reply to post by SLAYER69


Heh,

We replaced their military dictatorship with our own.

reply to post by silo13

Japan was ready to call it quits anyway. More than 60 of its cities had been destroyed by conventional bombing, the home islands were being blockaded by the American Navy, and the Soviet Union entered the war by attacking Japanese troops in Manchuria.

The Japanese military was not ready to "call it quits", they were preparing to defend the home islands with everything they had. Manchuria was invaded by the Japanese in 1931.

A demonstration explosion over Tokyo harbor would have convinced Japan's leaders to quit without killing many people.

Unknown to the Japanese, we had only two bombs.

Even if Hiroshima was necessary, the U.S. did not give enough time for word to filter out of its devastation before bombing Nagasaki.

After the first bomb, the Japanese military surely knew about it!

The bomb was used partly to justify the $2 billion spent on its development.

The Bomb was used to save American lives that would be lost invading Japan.

The two cities were of limited military value. Civilians outnumbered troops in Hiroshima five or six to one.

The two cities bombed were on a list of possible target cities. Civilians out numbered troops in every Japanese city.

Japanese lives were sacrificed simply for power politics between the U.S. and the Soviet Union.

Japanese lives were sacrificed to save American lives. We could have taken much longer to devastate their cities one by one with conventional bombing. There was no "cold war" with the Soviets at that time, they were our Allies.

Conventional firebombing would have caused as much significant damage without making the U.S. the first nation to use nuclear weapons.

Death is death, be it by firebombing or use of nuclear weapons. We had the weapon first. We decided that if we used it that American lives would be saved. Even if it saved the life of one bomber pilot, it was justified.

This was the worlds introduction to the Atomic Age. We have never used a Nuclear Weapon since. The ones we did use put an end to an aggressive war by an Imperial Power. Sorry, but somebody had to be first.

Peace

reply to post by Exuberant1

Don't forget the "Unconditional Surrender" nonsense that was our policy at the time. Japan refused to surrender unless they could have guarantees that the Emperor would not be punished for war crimes. America said "No. Unconditional surrender is all we'll accept". ....But guess what - We decided not to prosecute the Emperor afterall.

Japan started the war first by invading Manchuria in 1931. Then invading China in 1937. Invading Southeast Asia and bombing Pearl Harbor in 1941. Then they want us to give them "guarantees"?

The war effort in Korea and China included the mobilization of labor, in which the workers could be moved to various parts of the Japanese Empire, all to insure production for the war effort. Koreans worked in factories and mines in Manchuria, northern Korea and Japan. About 4,000,000 Koreans and Chinese (6) were displaced from their homes and shipped to these factories so that they would be productive in Japan's war efforts. The war mobilization scattered Koreans and Chinese, as manpower, all over East Asia, in an effort to maximize production for the mother country.

www.thenagain.info...

[edit on 7-8-2009 by Oatmeal]

reply to post by SLAYER69

www.doug-long.com...

On the evening of July 26, 1945 in San Francisco (which in Tokyo was the morning of July 27) a message from the Allies now commonly known as the Potsdam Proclamation was broadcast in Japanese. The broadcast was relayed to the Japanese government on the morning of the 27th (Pacific War Research Society, The Day Man Lost, pg. 211-212).

The proclamation demanded "the unconditional surrender of all the Japanese armed forces" (U.S. Dept. of State, Foreign Relations of the U.S., The Conference of Berlin (Potsdam), vol. 2, pg. 1474-1476). It made no mention of Japan's central surrender consideration: the retention of the Emperor's position (Butow, pg. 138-139). What made this crucial was that the Japanese believed their Emperor to be a god, the heart of the Japanese people and culture (Pacific War Research Society, Japan's Longest Day, pg. 20). The absence of any assurance regarding the Emperor's fate became Japan's chief objection to the Potsdam Proclamation (Pacific War Research Society, The Day Man Lost, pg. 212-214). In addition, the proclamation made statements that, to the Japanese, could appear threatening to the Emperor: "There must be eliminated for all time the authority and influence of those who have deceived and misled the people of Japan into embarking on world conquest" and "stern justice shall be meted out to all war criminals" (U.S. Dept. of State, Potsdam 2, pg. 1474-1476).

link

Slayer, I hate debating friends.
I respect you as a person, I respect your views.
We don’t have to agree.
So this is painful...


peace

reply to post by silo13


First, I totally agree with your questioning of the morality of the US using an atomic bomb on a large population center once military victory had been achieved. However, to my understanding every man, woman, and child in Japan was preparing to fight to the death rather than surrender. When some of the initial islands were taken on the southern tip of Japan hundreds of unarmed women and children chose to leap from cliffs into the sea rather than surrender.

Given that this "death is better than surrender" philosophy would have endured should the US have chosen mass invasion over nuclear bombing, the use of the bomb, though it killed 250,000 people, could have at the same time saved Japan's other 70 million residents.

Now in saying this, I have to admit that the accounts of suicidal Japanese civilians could have been nothing more than government propaganda. However, knowing the amount of resistance shown by the Japanese soldiers in places like Iwo Jima, I kind of doubt it.