Why are so many people calling contrails, Chemtrails?

reply to post by Zaphod58


They covertly spray chemicals into the air - under the banner of weapons testing / radar blocking / crop dusting

whatever guise they do it under - secretly spraying unknown crap over our bodies, land, schools, water supplies IS NOT ACCEPTABLE

The cause of deaths and illnesses come to light years later - as in the link to the BBC report posted earlier

How is this not chem spraying ? Why are people saying it does not happen even in light of factual evidence.

YES - it has happened before - people have good reason that it is still happening in some areas - evidence of serious illness etc

You cannot say for definite our air is safe - you do not have direct access to all Governmental / Military records !
Evidence shows us they have done if before - why is it so inconceivable that they would not do it again

Why do you still insist that anyone who voices concern about it is delusional.

reply to post by ChemBreather


Why can't you go get your own samples? You claim they fly over you all the time spraying, you even say people are getting sick, yourself included.

So whatcha gonna do? take photos and moan about it on the interwebs?

Or get out there and do something about it? The ball is well and truly in your court, like I said you're in the box seat to prove that these chemtrails are real!

Happy hunting!

Soil sample kit

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/ac3a3b6913e3.jpg[/atsimg]


Air sampling unit

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/ce239b1b5905.jpg[/atsimg]


So you got your samples, your evidence to prove once and for all that chemtrails exist!

Oh wait, you'll need a lab to test the samples, don't worry I got that covered too!



State by State list of soil labs
Air quality consultants


You don't have to thank me, honest.

[edit on 15-3-2009 by Chadwickus]

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by ChemBreather

 

You can't say with 100% certainty that it was from an aircraft. Barium and all the other metals in that sample are also released from factories into the air and ground water. The sample was taken from an air filter that sampled air for 8 hours a day for 28 days. All that proves is that the metals are in the air. It doesn't say anything about where they are from.

I cant say for sure that one test is taken from an aircraft, and you cant be sure it is not. But still there are still alot more of this 'reports' and I nor you can say they are all 'make up' reports. I find that too sinister to be a fact. Nice links up there, still another fact that high levels of barium (Ba) is harmfull, and when you look into the fact that more and more young healthy people gets Astma, it should rise your eye brows just a tad atleast..
This is in almost every part of the world, wich it is reportes of..

One of the interesting - at least to me - things about chemtrail conspiracies is the claim that it's a controlling mechanism, that some nefarious agency, a very large and organised one at that, is seeding the skies with poisons which are affecting the way we all think and behave.

If that's true and this dastardly plot has been going on for decades and it's just so effective, how do the pro-chemtrail theories manage to emerge in the first place? I'm not aware of these pro-chemtrail theorists living in bubbles and biosuits, apparently the live pretty much the same as everyone else.

Now if I was going to poison the skies with mind-controlling contaminants, I'd want my plan to actually work. I'd want it to work because, from a cost and organisational point of view, this project is massive. It must have cost billions to put in place and must have used countless man-hours to get it up and running and keep it up and running.

Yet it's not actually working - after all these years - because threads like this seem to be a fairly consistent, albeit stemming from a relatively vocal if small amount of proponents. Proponents who aren't controlled by the powers that be presumably.

So, what is different about these proponents, that they can see a 'truth' that others can't? Do they live in biosuits and bubbles (if they don't see the need to, then it's not much of a threat)? Do they believe themselves to be 'special' and immune to whatever is poisoning and controlling the rest of us?

Just how does this conspiracy work exactly?

Originally posted by Chadwickus
reply to post by ChemBreather

 

Why can't you go get your own samples? You claim they fly over you all the time spraying, you even say people are getting sick, yourself included.

So whatcha gonna do? take photos and moan about it on the interwebs?

Or get out there and do something about it? The ball is well and truly in your court, like I said you're in the box seat to prove that these chemtrails are real!

Happy hunting!

Soil sample kit

[edit on 15-3-2009 by Chadwickus]

Oh I thank you ! But this looks like alot of cash to collect things all ready collected.
Didnt you look at my photos and Vid clip ? take a looksie, and tell how that can accure .

reply to post by ChemBreather


So called "safe" factories are doing more harm than any claim of spraying from an aircraft. The levels of barium and other metals released from these plants is staggering if you ever look into it. I had a thread about coal plants and the amount of radiation that they release annually that shocked the hell out of me. The levels were staggering, and they were from "clean" plants. I'm a lot more worried about those factories and coal plants than I am about that plane flying over my head.

Reply to suziwong

Where have I said that chemtrail believers are delusional? I have said that chemtrails are bs, and believers are mistaken, but that's because of what I know about aviation, and the claims that are made. EVERY SINGLE time someone comes up with a sprayer plane, they have been badly mistaken. They have even resorted to cheap photoshopping to try to make them more sinister.

Yes, governments have sprayed things in the past, and it's POSSIBLE that they COULD be now, but I have yet to see ANYTHING that proves that there is a spraying program going on. I have seen a lot of people that don't know much about aviation pointing out things that are weird to them, but that's about it.

[edit on 3/15/2009 by Zaphod58]

reply to post by ChemBreather



Well sell your camera, because photos alone aren't going to prove anything, then use the money to get an air sample unit.

So here is my question. Am I to understand that all of the lines in the sky are chem trails? Or just some of them? Is it every plane out there or just a couple? Do they spray over populated areas only or rural areas as well? Doctor Doom and a few others have stated this theory but left out a good bit of detail. Please enlighten the rest of us as to what exactly the conspiracy is.

My other question is are cars spreading chem trails too? I have noticed on certain days when the outside temperature and humidity are just right, my car and others spread these "chem trails". And Power plants that burn coal seem to have the same issue. Is it possible that not everything in life is a government conspiracy? After all there are plenty of real conspiracies out there.

reply to post by Mason mike


Good question!

Did you know ships create contrails too?

This article HERE is a good resource for contrails and also has a chapter on ship trials as well. It starts at page 68

reply to post by Mason mike


Excellent comments there

As I've said before, if what we're seeing are chemtrails then where are the normal contrails? Or are chemtrails laid to hide the fact that commercial aircraft no longer produce normal contrails? Maybe that's why they look and act identically to normal contrails? It really is as daft as that .....

Originally posted by Exuberant1

Only one of the members claiming to be a Meteorologist/pilot/contrail expert had managed to produce credentials of any sort.

Well I'm not exactly anonymous

Originally posted by suziwong

What about the confirmed covert weapons testing chem spraying in the UK - what is your take on that

It has no more relevance to chemtrails than the use of mustard gas in WWI. Why do you think it's relevent?


If there is any relevance it demonstrates that were chemical spraying occuring today we'd not see or be aware of it

reply to post by Exuberant1


Irrelevant?

Rubbish.

So its ok for one side to mock, claim that people are paid disinformation agents and liars, and that they have no credentials to back up their argument, and at the same time the ones making those claims provide nothing at all?

You can't have it both ways. Trying to do so is hypocrisy.

You asked for credentials? ok here you go. I have edited my ID card in the photo only to protect my anonymity as I would like to keep my job and somewhat privacy.

Its from Environment Canada if its too blurry to read.



Its a little blurry I know, my camera sucks but Oz can verify the validity as we know each other outside of ATS

so now that I have shown you my credentials are you going to show me yours? I think that would only be fair.

Maybe they are chemtrails, after all no one saw low flying planes when the USDA poisoned birds in New Jersey. We never learn about it until after the fact. Maybe they are spraying for west Nile next. To me it looks more like a chemtrail, rather than a contrail. I don’t mean to change the subject to 911 conspiracy but if ,in fact they are contrails satellite photos showed where contrails were occurring and mostly absent over the U.S. between Sept 11 through the 14th, but still occurring in Canada, Mexico and somewhere else.. yet the air temperature increase associated with contrails increased during the same period. Another idea is at what altitude the planes in your video were flying. Not enough info to form a conclusion.

reply to post by wonderworld


You do realize that the ONLY planes flying over the United States on 9/11-9/13 were military right? All civilian flights were grounded beginning the morning of September 11th until September 13th. On 9/14 civil aviation flights under IFR rules were allowed to resume, and on 9/19 VFR flights were allowed again. That's why there were no contrails over the US on those days. Only fighters, AWACS and tankers were flying.

reply to post by wonderworld

Contrails do not form with a temperature increase. They are caused by cold, moist air at the altitudes at which the aircraft are flying.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Sept. 11 through 14, 2001, had the biggest higher elevation temperature range change of any three-day period in the past 30 years, caused by contrails even though there were no commercial flights during this time. All Military jet exhausts do not create contrails depending on their altitude, cloud cover and local temperature. Those three days in Sept. were unusually dry, which would account for an absence of natural cloud cover and a greater temperature range. Cloud cover on Sept. 11 was mild, but that cloud cover and humidity increased on the 12 and 13th. Contrails do indeed have an effect of weather temps. Ive read here at ATS some believe they can change or manipulate weather patterns. I’m not sold on that. Now I’m jumping all over the place sorry. I’m not a pro by any means on plane trails but it’s always good to watch for something abnormal in the pattern. It still looks like a chemtrail. Maybe that is why so many refer to it as such?

reply to post by wonderworld


September 11-14 were the best days for scientists to get a true idea of just how contrails affect the weather. The average day over the US has up to 5-6000 flights in 24 hours. Those days with only military flights gave them a chance to finally see just HOW contrails change things. There was never a chance to really get a good dataset because there was nowhere that had a mass grounding like this.

reply to post by wonderworld

Don't you have it backward? It was the lack of contrails that is thought to have caused a temperature increase. The effect of contrails on weather and climate is a topic of a lot of study but it has nothing to do with "chemtrails".

Because persisting contrails can reduce the transfer of both incoming solar and outgoing infrared radiation4, 5 and so reduce the daily temperature range, we attribute at least a portion of this anomaly to the absence of contrails over this period.

www.nature.com...

reply to post by Zaphod58


Thank you for Simplifying that for me. That is totally logical. Why is your mood cranky? Some of these discussions get intense! I get a kick out of simply reading these posts. Most come up with interesting subjects. We will never know if those are contrails VS chemtrails I suppose. That's the fun part leaving it to your imagination.