Paul ~ Inventing a new saviour

Interesting side note:

So many of you claim to that your belief is the broad path. If few be that find it and follow it, how is it that thus far, few have been on this thread to support badmedia and myself.. are you *sure* that you are on the narrow path that few will find? Doesn't look like it from where I am viewing.

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by justamomma

 

Yeshua(Jesus) DID NOT change the Law or modify it, He FULFILLED IT!
BTW, everyone, I didn't put those 'smilies' in my post!

He fulfilled it for whom though? You? that is not something that you can find the basis for in the Tanakh.

Ezek 18:20-28
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.


So, can we admit that your belief is not based on what you refer to as the OLD testamant.. more appropriately known as the Tanakh?

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by justamomma

 

Yes, FALSE PASTORS who eat up the flock and scatter the sheep are to be condemned!
The TRUE shepherds or pastors are not.

Who are the true pastors then Clearskies? Which ONE of the MANY theories that are based on Paul's confusing teachings is the RIGHT one?

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by justamomma

 

Yeshua(Jesus) DID NOT change the Law or modify it, He FULFILLED IT!
BTW, everyone, I didn't put those 'smilies' in my post!

He fulfilled it for whom though? You? that is not something that you can find the basis for in the Tanakh.

Ezek 18:20-28
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.


So, can we admit that your belief is not based on what you refer to as the OLD testamant.. more appropriately known as the Tanakh?

For ALL who needed to go to the High Priest and have sacrifices of bulls and rams and doves for their sins!
For example;

Num 7:83 And for a sacrifice of peace offerings, two oxen, five rams, five he goats, five lambs of the first year: this [was] the offering of Ahira the son of Enan.
Num 7:87 All the oxen for the burnt offering [were] twelve bullocks, the rams twelve, the lambs of the first year twelve, with their meat offering: and the kids of the goats for sin offering twelve.
Num 7:88 And all the oxen for the sacrifice of the peace offerings [were] twenty and four bullocks, the rams sixty, the he goats sixty, the lambs of the first year sixty. This [was] the dedication of the altar, after that it was anointed.
Num 23:1 And Balaam said unto Balak, Build me here seven altars, and prepare me here seven oxen and seven rams.
Num 23:29 And Balaam said unto Balak, Build me here seven altars, and prepare me here seven bullocks and seven rams.

Every year.

[edit on 21-1-2009 by Clearskies]

reply to post by Clearskies


Hmmm... so again, I ask.. where is it stated in the Laws of G.d that a human being on the list of appropriate sacrifices.

Give me a few minutes and I will repost my post that shows you what the Tanakh teaches as far as appropriate sacrifices. The sacrifices *were* a picture.. but there is only one practice that would equate to Jesus and Isaiah clearly makes it known that the picture was referring to a people and not ONE man!



[edit on 21-1-2009 by justamomma]

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by justamomma

 

Yes, FALSE PASTORS who eat up the flock and scatter the sheep are to be condemned!
The TRUE shepherds or pastors are not.

Who are the true pastors then Clearskies? Which ONE of the MANY theories that are based on Paul's confusing teachings is the RIGHT one?

Hebrew for that definition. Pastors;
[ex1) to pasture, tend, graze, feed
a) (Qal)
1) to tend, pasture
a) to shepherd
b) of ruler, teacher (fig)
c) of people as flock (fig)
d) shepherd, herdsman (subst)
2) to feed, graze
a) of cows, sheep etc (literal)
b) of idolater, Israel as flock (fig)
b) (Hiphil) shepherd, shepherdess
2) to associate with, be a friend of (meaning probable)
a) (Qal) to associate with
b) (Hithpael) to be companions
3) (Piel) to be a special friend

Here are some qualifications for an 'evil pastor';

Jer 23:10 For the land is full of adulterers; for because of swearing the land mourneth; the pleasant places of the wilderness are dried up, and their course is evil, and their force [is] not right.


Jer 23:11 For both prophet and priest are profane; yea, in my house have I found their wickedness, saith the LORD.


Jer 23:12 Wherefore their way shall be unto them as slippery [ways] in the darkness: they shall be driven on, and fall therein: for I will bring evil upon them, [even] the year of their visitation, saith the LORD.


Jer 23:13 And I have seen folly in the prophets of Samaria; they prophesied in Baal, and caused my people Israel to err.


Jer 23:14 I have seen also in the prophets of Jerusalem an horrible thing: they commit adultery, and walk in lies: they strengthen also the hands of evildoers, that none doth return from his wickedness: they are all of them unto me as Sodom, and the inhabitants thereof as Gomorrah.


A preacher who doesn't speak out against evil, who causes the congregation to go after adulterous worship of statues, , gods/goddesses, money, himself, etc.....
Jesus called the Temple in His day a den of thieves!
There are certainly churches like this.

But one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said to them, "You know nothing at all, nor do you take into account that it is expedient for you that one man die for the people, and that the whole nation not perish." John 11:49-50

In case anyone is interested in what the Jewish High Priest knew that the others did not know, check out this site:

www.hopeofisrael.net...

reply to post by justamomma


Please DO TELL how Isaac was not a man in the Tenach. ???

reply to post by justamomma


Here it is.. but you will have to excuse the mistakes I made in there as I was highly frustrated at that point at the twisting of the Word that was taking place.

It is not a sacrifice... and this is was what happened when G.d spread the blood line of David into the world gene pool. He knew this bloodline was special in that there would be those in whom He would be able to break of the lies and manipulation by allowing them to be debased.. and once that happened, He would be able to build them back up in His knowledge.

This is what Isaiah is speaking directly about. That bloodline.. the suffering servant and the collective messiah.. and this is the prophecy that is coming to pass even now.

It is more amazing than the deception that has been fed and eaten by the masses!! G.d does not break ONE Law.. not even the Law of nature to fulfill His prophecy! Wow! I just don't know how you all choose to eat the lie over the truth!



[edit on 21-1-2009 by justamomma]

reply to post by L.I.B.


Thanks!
Maybe this is more reliable that Tacitus' documents.

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by justamomma

 

Please DO TELL how Isaac was not a man in the Tenach. ???

Huh? explain yourself.. That was actually G.d's showing that he would never require a human sacrifice! How does this support your view that Jesus was a human sacrifice for your sin? Confused

[edit on 21-1-2009 by justamomma]

reply to post by justamomma


What is your 'Truth' you keep talking about?
Just loving everybody and being nice to unbelievers, because you can have that with no G-d.
Do you have to be of the tribe of Judah?

reply to post by justamomma

Why then does the Tenach say that G-d ASKED for Isaac as a sacrifice?

reply to post by Clearskies

Beautiful question! It was to show that all He would ever require was our obedience to His leading... and to show that He would never require the human sacrifice. It was His way of warning us of the lie that was to come.



[edit on 21-1-2009 by justamomma]

reply to post by justamomma


I don't think so.
The Ram caught in the bushes was a symbol for Jesus. G-d sent a sacrifice that He provided.

reply to post by Clearskies


No, you do not have to be of the line of Judah!! nor do you have to be of the house of Israel (the lost sheep). All you have to do is this:

Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.
The Lord GOD, which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him.
- Isaiah 56


It is more loving and more logical than what we were fed by Paul and the pastors of this nation. It has the very elements of truth in it! It is G.d's way.. human sacrifice is not G.d's way. He is loving.. not barabaric! I know this. I have seen and tasted this! It is the sweetest Love that I have known.

reply to post by justamomma


When is the Sabbath?
Saturday?

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by justamomma

 

I don't think so.
The Ram caught in the bushes was a symbol for Jesus. G-d sent a sacrifice that He provided.

No, that is the mark of paganism. G.d did not ever condone human sacrifice.. the ram being sent was His proof of that. Christianity requires human sacrifice.. how is G.d sending a ram in place of the human sacrifice a show that He would require human sacrifice after all? You miss the beauty and replace it for the ugliness.

Originally posted by justamomma
Interesting side note:

So many of you claim to that your belief is the broad path. If few be that find it and follow it, how is it that thus far, few have been on this thread to support badmedia and myself.. are you *sure* that you are on the narrow path that few will find? Doesn't look like it from where I am viewing.

Here's what it means. At any given moment in time, few will be on the path that leads back home. It is the "narrow" path because it is the path of the One, and not the path of the *many*. Few of the *many* find it because they want to bring the *many* with them. They cannot. Given enough time, all of the *many* will find the path of the One. This may take a million years. Does not matter. Salvation is for saving time. And, the Savior has all the time in the world.

Christ!

reply to post by Clearskies


I'm not saying that you don't know G-d, but there are scriptures about those who would break into heaven without proper means, only to be cast out again.