The Sorcery Conspiracy

reply to post by Bigwhammy


BW I like you, I think your heart is in the right place, and I think you are genuinly concerned about your fellow man, but not everything has to do with the Bible. Who said the person I discribed was suffering from a mental illness? I do believe that in your Bible there is a passage that says not to judge until you've walked a mile in the other man's shoes. I think so anyway. lol I've spent the better part of the last 3 decades serving my fellow man in one form of another. I've seen more drama then I care to share, but what's perfectly clear to me is that all of us have the potential to be nutz, given the right circumstances at the right time we all will temporarily loose our minds.

Does Sorcery exist? Absolutely! In many forms it exists. Sorcery is nothng more then tricking the mind, and there is many forms of it. Everything from the mischevious imp playing jokes, to the evil demons who use it for posession. It comes in many forms and used for many reasons. Entertainment, control, manipulation, and even comfort as I've indicated before. Not all sorcery is bad, but used inappropriately it can be.
However, don't confuse Sorcery with magic or witchcraft, they are very different things. The content being too complex and drawn out for this post.

Does drug addiction exist? Yes of course! Anyone walking through this life has seen at least one case of drug addiction, it's a horrible thing to watch, and yes drugs are sometimes used inappropriately to perform Sorcery. I think all of us can give examples of how that works, but to say that drugs and Sorcery work hand in hand is to limit yourself to black and white thinking, and personally I think we should all strive to rise above that.

As for the comment that mental illeness is on the rise, well I don't think that's true personally. I think mental illness has always been around, but it's only been in recent history that we've come to understand it enough to put lables on it, and our treatment of it is archaic because we still have so much to learn. Untill then however, we have to use what is available to us.

Originally posted by enchantress62
reply to post by Bigwhammy

 

Does Sorcery exist? Absolutely! In many forms it exists. Sorcery is nothng more then tricking the mind, and there is many forms of it. Everything from the mischevious imp playing jokes, to the evil demons who use it for posession. It comes in many forms and used for many reasons. Entertainment, control, manipulation, and even comfort as I've indicated before. Not all sorcery is bad, but used inappropriately it can be.
However, don't confuse Sorcery with magic or witchcraft, they are very different things. The content being too complex and drawn out for this post.

Well I think we have identified Sorcery as being anything that manipulates the heart and mind for the benefit of the Sorcerer. Whether consciously or not Scientists , Doctors, Pharmacists, the Media , and Religion as well can do his.

Some people are unthinking in there Religious beliefs falling under the spell of a chraimatic leader - who is in fact a Sorcerer.

Jim Jones was a Sorcerer.

Binny Hinn is a Sorcerer.

reply to post by Bigwhammy


It really comes down to intent then. The use of Sorcery for self gain, or evil intent is where the trouble lies, and when drugs, herbs, or plants in general are used to assist that type of Sorcery, then as we've seen in our society, the consiquences can be catastrophic. But even out of that, good can arise as we have seen with the example of Hitler and the atrosities he inflicted on the Jewish ppl. Out of that horrific massacure came many of the modern treatments we use today. That works both ways though, out of a pure rightous intent can come great evil, just look at modern TV.

I have great respect for Jesus and his teachings. I think his message was pure and his intent was to teach ppl how to come together in harmony, but man has so distorted his teachings with their own interpretations that his messages often get lost in the fight.

looks like a conspiracy to me

No more drug talk in this thread

Myself and idle_rocker were warned by monitor Sauron for talking about the Sorcery of Doctors who over prescribe legal prescription drugs.

I had complained about the Jesus smokes pot type posts because they have nothing to do with the topic.

But Doctors as sorcerers using prescription drugs to enslave people and profit qualifies as sorcery to me...

I hope maybe we will get the warning lifted as it hardly seems fair.

So the main idea was the mistranslation of the greek word Pharmikia (drug use)
in our modern Bibles. And how the Bibles teaching on drug use is surpressed because of this bad translation.

I have to go out for a while but when I get back I will post some different translations where the word sorcery is used to see if some convey the meaning better than others.

Originally posted by Bigwhammy

No more drug talk in this thread

Myself and idle_rocker were warned by monitor Sauron for talking about the Sorcery of Doctors who over prescribe legal prescription drugs.

I had complained about the Jesus smokes pot type posts because they have nothing to do with the topic.

But Doctors as sorcerers using prescription drugs to enslave people and profit qualifies as sorcery to me...

I hope maybe we will get the warning lifted as it hardly seems fair.

So the main idea was the mistranslation of the greek word Pharmikia (drug use)
in our modern Bibles. And how the Bibles teaching on drug use is surpressed because of this bad translation.

I have to go out for a while but when I get back I will post some different translations where the word sorcery is used to see if some convey the meaning better than others.

Well, I hesitate to post anything now and after this post, I probably will not. As most of you know, I am new to this site and I have tried to be nice to as many people as I can and loved being able to contribute.

There is nothing I nor Bigwhammy said that took the post off-topic. If the post for which I have been warned, was off topic, it should have been removed, as the other posters' responses were that were "removed for being off-topic". But we got warned instead with points taken away. I cannot understand that logic.

I am not here for points...I am here to learn and grow, which is what I think most of us are here for. It seems unjustly warranted to me since my post was about medically prescribed drugs and why they are needed more today than ever.

Thanks to everyone and have a nice evening.

reply to post by idle_rocker


Sauron gave you the points back rocker.


Thanks Sauron.

reply to post by Bigwhammy


It's not like ya'll were advocating doing drugs or anything. Quite the opposite!

Well, it was inequitable, but I'm over it. As a Christian I forgive myself for whatever it is I've done, and anyone else involved in anything, whatever it may have been, may be or may be in the future. And I'm back to being a big bad mama in my rocking chair, as BW calls me

So back on subject. BW did you come up with more sorcery info?

Ok to get back to the main topic:

Revelation 9
21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.


This verse is speaking of the world in the "end times". Revelation 9 is after plagues and all sorts of tribulation has gone down. so these sins listed in the verse are ingrained into people and they will not repent in spite of the tribulation which is occurring.

It is natural to ask whether these plagues (v. 20) are the three plagues of fire, smoke and sulfur under the sixth trumpet (v. 18) or the whole trumpet series up to this point. But the question is moot because the three plagues of verse 18 are the only ones in the entire series specifically designed to be lethal to human beings (see v. 15). More illuminating is John's characterization of the rest of mankind that did not repent (vv. 20-21). His own moral values come to expression in his list of their vices: worshiping demons, and idols of gold, silver, bronze, stone and wood--idols that cannot see or hear or walk (v. 20); also murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts (v. 21).

commentary



Ok I have substituted the original Greek word in italics.

And they did not repent of their murders or their pharmakeia or their sexual immorality or their thefts."

Here's the word in Greek : φαρμακεία

pharmakeia
Pronunciation: fär-mä-kā'-ä
Part of Speech:feminine noun
Outline of Biblical Usage
1) the use or the administering of drugs
2) poisoning
3) sorcery, magical arts, often found in connection with idolatry and fostered it
4) metaph. the deceptions and seductions of idolatry

Strongs Greek Lexicon

Strong's Greek lexicon is the gold standard for modern Bible scholarship. It has "drug use" for the number one definition of this term pharmakeia as

I have checked all these versions of the Bible...

(Rev.9:21,)

KJV 21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.

NIV 21Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts.

NAST and they did not repent of their murders nor of their sorceries nor of their immorality nor of their thefts.

The Message
20-21The remaining men and women who weren't killed by these weapons went on their merry way—didn't change their way of life, didn't quit worshiping demons, didn't quit centering their lives around lumps of gold and silver and brass, hunks of stone and wood that couldn't see or hear or move. There wasn't a sign of a change of heart. They plunged right on in their murderous, occult, promiscuous, and thieving ways.

Amplified Bible
21And they did not repent of their murders or their practice of magic (sorceries) or their sexual vice or their thefts.

New Living Translation
21 And they did not repent of their murders or their witchcraft or their sexual immorality or their thefts.

New Century Version
21 These people did not change their hearts and turn away from murder or evil magic, from their sexual sins or stealing.


21st Century KJV
21neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their
fornication, nor of their thefts.

Worldwide English New Testament
1And they did not stop their killing, or their witchcraft, or their wrong ways of
using sex, or their stealing.


They all seem to go with the sorcery magical arts definition. But with the way our society is today I just do not believe this is a realistic interpretation. Sure we have some people doing ritual magic etc. However drug usage is far far more common and ingrained in society. I believe my interpretation:

"Nor did they repent of their murders, their drug use, their sexual immorality or their thefts."

is much more indicative of modern life.










[edit on 3/6/2008 by Bigwhammy]

reply to post by Bigwhammy


That is so fascinating (if that's the proper word here) that all of those translations have 'witchcraft' or 'sorcery' where clearly the word there was meant to be some type of medicinal worship.

Maybe I've been wrong all these years with thinking that witchcraft and sorcery is Harry Potter type stuff, casting astrology charts, spells etc..

OR....Maybe that is exactly what Babyon is! She is an entire system filled with works of sorcery and witchcraft. Take a look at all things she's filled with when she falls (Rev 18) and especially verse 23-24.

reply to post by Elisha4Yah


I think the Harry Potter stuff is a smoke screen. The real deal is science and medicine getting out of control people seeking chemical solutions to their problems and turning away from the spirit.

Just think with the right cocktail of drugs you could induce heaven. Where people were high all the time... if they hot it right,there would be no nasty side effects, everyone would be ecstatic and have no need for God. These same drugs would also cut you off spiritually like the Rev 18:23 says...

Ok I found some corroborating evidence finally...

Sorcery was forbidden by the Law of Moses (Ex. 22:18; Deu. 18:10-11) as were all practices which involved communication with the dead such as conjuring spells (Deu. 18:11), consulting mediums (1S. 28:3-9), spiritism, or calling up the dead (really the demonic realm). This included all forms of magic (Ex. 22:18; Lev. 19:31; Lev. 20:6, 27; 2Chr. 33:6; Mal. 3:5). God condemned all of these practices and was indignant that men would “seek the dead on behalf of the living” (Isa. 8:19). Instead, they were to seek the living God.

Drugs are used in association with sorcery because they place the practitioner into an altered state of consciousness whereby he or she becomes more open to contact with the demonic realm. The following account of a shaman from the Yanomamo tribe illustrates the connection between drug use and the demonic realm—a connection well-known even among “primitive” peoples:

I recently interviewed a man who had spent most of his life communing with spirit entities. There is no doubt as to his “authenticity.” He was a shaman, a medicine man and chief of his Yanomamo tribe, which resides deep in the Amazonian rain forest of Venezuela. At odds with the lie promoted in anthropological circles that the lives of primitive tribes-people are pure, natural and Eden-like and therefore best kept from outside influence—Chief Shoefoot and his peoples violent, fear-filled existence is documented in a book titled The Spirit of the Rain Forest, written by Mark Ritchie . . .
As a young boy, Shoefoot was singled out as one sensitive to the spirit realm and subsequently initiated into the sorcerers world. Again, a shaman is one who, through knowledge and power obtained from the spirits, heals and guides his people. Although the initial process of enabling him to contact the spirits was brutal, involving days of food and water deprivation and having someone force hallucinogenic drugs into his system by blowing them up his nose, the spirits he met were at first benign and curiously captivating. . . . Shoefoot increased his drug intake in order to go deeper into the spirit world to find more trustworthy and benevolent spirits. That led to even more wicked spirits (Luke 11:26), greater frustration, and intense despair.

open companion bible

High on Mount Sinai

There is no prohibition against taking drugs in the Bible (however much the OP may insist there is). The reason, as I pointed out in an earlier post, is that drug use was widespread and socially accepted throughout the ancient Middle East, and that such drug use was especially popular amongst mystics and religious obsessives. The people who wrote the Bible took drugs. The prophets, as I said, were undoubtedly blitzed to the eyeballs.

Benny Shanon, Professor of Cognitive Psychology at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, agrees with me.

According to Shanon, psychedelic drugs formed an integral part of the religious rites of Israelites in biblical times.

He says concoctions based on the bark of the acacia tree, frequently mentioned in the Old Testament, contain the same molecules found in plants from which the powerful Amazonian hallucinogenic brew ayahuasca is prepared.

"The thunder, lightning and blaring of a trumpet which the Book of Exodus says emanated from Mount Sinai could just have been the imaginings of a people in an altered state of awareness," writes Shanon. "In advanced forms of ayahuasca inebriation, the seeing of light is accompanied by profound religious and spiritual feelings."

Moses was probably also on mind-altering drugs when he saw the "burning bush", suggested Shanon.

[Mod Note]
Please stay on the topic of this thread "The Sorcery Conspiracy"



[edit on 7/3/2008 by Sauron]

reply to post by Astyanax


What topic are you discussing? This thread is the sorcery conspiracy.
We are discussing the translation of this verse.

Revelation 9
21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.

I don't understand the purpose of your post.


[edit on 3/7/2008 by Bigwhammy]

Now here is some wicked sorcery for you.

Rev9:21
These people did not change their hearts and turn away from murder or evil magic...

Animal-Human Hybrids Spark Controversy

Scientists have begun blurring the line between human and animal by producing chimeras—a hybrid creature that's part human, part animal.

Chinese scientists at the Shanghai Second Medical University in 2003 successfully fused human cells with rabbit eggs. The embryos were reportedly the first human-animal chimeras successfully created. They were allowed to develop for several days in a laboratory dish before the scientists destroyed the embryos to harvest their stem cells.

source


A chimera is a mixture of two or more species in one body. I can't wait until one of these grows up by accident and we have goat-boy running around chewing up the furniture.

[edit on 3/7/2008 by Bigwhammy]

We may already have grown chimeras.

A thing I was thinking about lately, chemtrails
are sorcery.
They are poison, and have some mind-altering capabilities.(according to what is in them!)
You know Rome, Italy had *certain drugs* in their air.
Some people don't believe they are real, but, I KNOW they are!
Why does the DIA on Colorado have frescos of stormtroopers with gas masks and dead bodies?

Originally posted by Bigwhammy
A chimera is a mixture of two or more species in one body. I can't wait until one of these grows up by accident and we have goat-boy running around chewing up the furniture.

[edit on 3/7/2008 by Bigwhammy]

I'm affraid that it was probably my post that got us all into trouble, and if it was then I appologize to all of you. I too received a warning and had my post taken down, which was a shock to me since I thought that all of us were following along the way the thread has been unfolding.

Anyway, back to Sorcery. BW good post, it was very informative. I didn't know that scientists were doing these experiments, but that's definitely an example of Sorcery. There are just some things that shouldn't be played around with.

reply to post by Clearskies


I guess Chentrails would be a form of sorcery. I haven't looked into it much. Have you heard of Morgellons disease. Some people think it comes from chemtrails, it is weird stuff. Fibers growing out of people and stuff.


[edit on 3/7/2008 by Bigwhammy]

reply to post by Bigwhammy


When I was young, I had asthma and I couldn't even go down a detergent aisle in the supermarket, because I would get an attack.
When I got older, synthetic fragrances would make me nauseous and give me a headache.
These chemtrails make my neck feel like the hangover from dropping *certain drugs*
and a headache. I've gotten over the nauseousness, I used to throw up.

I fully believe that when the antichrist comes, the planes will stop and people will feel delightful, without all the pollution!
Pscyops!
HERE




[edit on 7-3-2008 by Clearskies]