For all you who hate the USA

Neformore,
I would've given you a 'way above' but they've scrapped them.
You'll have to settle for this:

Originally posted by redseal
Not proud, but how many innocent did HITLER get?

Justifying genocide. Nice.

and I'm sure you already know that one of bush's ancestors financially supported the Nazis.

Thats like saying I'm responsible for slavery, What a stupid comment!!!

Stupid comment? I see.. someone disagrees and they get abused. You should work for your government! [boom boom]
You're right.. it would be like saying you're responsible for slavery.. providing you actually owned slaves. The bushes are a political family, Bush Senior put Saddam in power.. that family has been pulling strings for generations.. perhaps centuries. In reality that family has supported two facist regimes now.. though in all fairness I think they've only created one dictator; getting rid of Saddam wasn't atoning for sins of the father though.. they just couldn't control the monster they created so they decided to literally step in, kill it and and take it's place.

You just dont get it do you?

Yeah I get it.. it's obvious you buy the 'muslims are evil' bs propoganda that your government spoon feeds you.

What would you have us do? let the terrorist run free??

if you knew your facts you'd know the america CREATED many of the terrorists.*

Thats what they want!! as far as handling the problem, their hasnt been another attack on US soil since then,

Embassies don't count?

so I guess we have handled it!

I didn't know the war on Iraq had finnished and that they caught bin laden. When did this happen? You haven't handled anything.

Sorry, but we arent fighting this war just to keep you land safe,

My land? Yeah right. Bali isn't far from Australia and got bombed. All america has done has made westerners in other countries a target as well. Thanks very much for that.

its for us, and since 9/11 we havent had 1 singe attack here,

I remember anthrax attacks and snipers. Where was the US when the UK got bombed? They were bombed for being american allies so there have been attacks since then.

and yet the globe over has had bomb after bomb go off!!! Ya the USA has it wrong!

..and as well as putting Saddam in power.. the USA also trained [created]Osama bin laden.*

The USA is like a little delinquent who gets a kick out of lighting little fires in other peoples backyards and then expects to be treated as a hero for calling the fire brigade just as those houses burn to the ground.

..and it's created the problem by imposing extreamily racist international policies on other countries while underminding their culture and lifestyle.. as well as invading them and calling it 'self defence'.

Wow, I cant even say I'm supprised the race card got played here!!
When you dont have a valid argument just scream racisim!!

What race card? Racism can be disrespecting and insulting other cultures. The American government frequently does this.. it imposes it's will on other countries without a thought for the customs and traditions. Much like when you denograte the muslims here by insulting them for praying five times a day. Maybe you should think about that.

[edit on 12-5-2007 by riley]

Nice one Nef I take it Red is reading up on history as he's been quite for a bit. I can only assume he was on a trolling exercise as it is totally illogical to ask people a question but do not engage them in logical discourse but use the I can shout louder than you trick.

One hopes that such a person does not represent all his fellow Americans.

Originally posted by riley
Neformore,
I would've given you a 'way above' but they've scrapped them.
You'll have to settle for this:

Originally posted by redseal
Not proud, but how many innocent did HITLER get?

Justifying genocide. Nice.

and I'm sure you already know that one of bush's ancestors financially supported the Nazis.

Thats like saying I'm responsible for slavery, What a stupid comment!!!

Stupid comment? I see.. someone disagrees and they get abused. You should work for your government! [boom boom]
You're right.. it would be like saying you're responsible for slavery.. providing you actually owned slaves. The bushes are a political family, Bush Senior put Saddam in power.. that family has been pulling strings for generations.. perhaps centuries. In reality that family has supported two facist regimes now.. though in all fairness I think they've only created one dictator; getting rid of Saddam wasn't atoning for sins of the father though.. they just couldn't control the monster they created so they decided to literally step in, kill it and and take it's place.

You just dont get it do you?

Yeah I get it.. it's obvious you buy the 'muslims are evil' bs propoganda that your government spoon feeds you.

What would you have us do? let the terrorist run free??

if you knew your facts you'd know the america CREATED many of the terrorists.*

Thats what they want!! as far as handling the problem, their hasnt been another attack on US soil since then,

Embassies don't count?

so I guess we have handled it!

I didn't know the war on Iraq had finnished and that they caught bin laden. When did this happen? You haven't handled anything.

Sorry, but we arent fighting this war just to keep you land safe,

My land? Yeah right. Bali isn't far from Australia and got bombed. All america has done has made westerners in other countries a target as well. Thanks very much for that.

its for us, and since 9/11 we havent had 1 singe attack here,

I remember anthrax attacks and snipers. Where was the US when the UK got bombed? They were bombed for being american allies so there have been attacks since then.

and yet the globe over has had bomb after bomb go off!!! Ya the USA has it wrong!

..and as well as putting Saddam in power.. the USA also trained [created]Osama bin laden.*

The USA is like a little delinquent who gets a kick out of lighting little fires in other peoples backyards and then expects to be treated as a hero for calling the fire brigade just as those houses burn to the ground.

..and it's created the problem by imposing extreamily racist international policies on other countries while underminding their culture and lifestyle.. as well as invading them and calling it 'self defence'.

Wow, I cant even say I'm supprised the race card got played here!!
When you dont have a valid argument just scream racisim!!

What race card? Racism can be disrespecting and insulting other cultures. The American government frequently does this.. it imposes it's will on other countries without a thought for the customs and traditions. Much like when you denograte the muslims here by insulting them for praying five times a day. Maybe you should think about that.

[edit on 12-5-2007 by riley]

Nice way of half quoting me, to make it spin the way you want!!
The hitler/genocide thing that was clever!! Just like the media, spin/half quote to make it fit in your favor!! You liberals are all the same!

Originally posted by magicmushroom
Nice one Nef I take it Red is reading up on history as he's been quite for a bit. I can only assume he was on a trolling exercise as it is totally illogical to ask people a question but do not engage them in logical discourse but use the I can shout louder than you trick.

One hopes that such a person does not represent all his fellow Americans.

No I wasnt reading up on my history, I was busy doing things like playing with my kids, mowing my lawn, going out fishing(it was opener in minnesota today), and having a life outside of the internet. Sorry Mr. old and wise mushroom, I dont sit on here 24/7!

Well what is it Mr. fungi, am I a troll or a child? Or do you still have yet another label for me?

Well Red thats just the problem maybe you should, and maybe you should travel. Trolling is an acitivity, are you a child, look in the mirror and tell me what you see.

If you are going to qoute history and facts at least try and make some effort to have an undersdtanding of it especially when its your own.

When you ask the reason why dose a person hate be prepared to hear some home truths, you may not like it but it may be the thruth.

Originally posted by magicmushroom
Well Red thats just the problem maybe you should, and maybe you should travel. Trolling is an acitivity, are you a child, look in the mirror and tell me what you see.[/qouote]

I have no need to look in the mirrior, you are the one who called mr out a ssuch!

If you are going to qoute history and facts at least try and make some effort to have an undersdtanding of it especially when its your own.[quote/]

WHAT?

When you ask the reason why dose a person hate be prepared to hear some home truths, you may not like it but it may be the thruth.

Its your truth not mine! Nothing any of you have said here can be backed up with any facts whatsoever!! You all claim conspiracy, and retoric to the Nth degree without so much as a "third gen nukes" crap!

Why is your opinion more valid than mine?? The towel headed mastermind himself has said he did it!!!

Is GW really that good of friends with some towel wearing, cant wipe my a** after a poop, sand dwelling folk, all for oil, etc etc!!

Sorry Mr. old and wise, I know feel you are aged and feeble!

Your age has nothing to do with anything! Age only brings, alhiizhimers!

Originally posted by redseal

Originally posted by kaos1911
Mainly because the American dream is a lie. Americans constantly say that america is the one country in the world where people can start with nothing and make something of themselves. Its a lie america has the lowest social mobility in the world, the poor stay poor, the rich stay rich. Try reading Chomesky he may be a radical but only because he speaks the truth many refuse to believe.

BS BS BS BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am a prime example of where one can come from nothing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I got married at 21, I didnt have a career and my wife was a medical assistant making 11 dollars an hour, I was delivering pizzas making about 13 an hr with tips.

We both went back to school, worked 40 hrs a week and did the college thing during the day!! It was a very very long 3 years, little sleep, no time with each other, etc, etc.

Well now I'm a Jouyneyman Electrician making $30 an hour, and she's an RN making about the same!

Dont give me this sh#t that you cant make it!!

Some people just dont have the fotitude to do it! I.E. LAZY!!!!!!

It was a tough 3 years! No sleep, no hangin with the friends, no social life!!

But now i have what I wanted, Im not just some person who wouldnt work for it bitchin to everyone else why it all sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Your one person who's made it out of 300 million. Congrats but don't believe that your success is a reflection of the American dream. "200000" make it in America each year out of 300 million, the lowest social mobility in the world. It’s not due to laziness its due to the fact that America propagates a false vision the poor stay poor bar those exceptional few and the rich stay rich. The American dream is a lie.

Red you obviously are incapable of listening to anyone who has an alternative view. You want facts

Fact the US did not win the 1st World war
Fact the US did not win the 2nd World war
Fact the US got their asses kicked in Vietnam
Fact the US did not invent the car
Fact the US did not invent the computer
Fact the US did not invent rocket technology

So many facts to list but whats the point, you ask people for their views only to call them liars, ignorant etc.

Rather than engaging in logical debate you seek to shout down and insult people so can one assume your sole purpose here was to bait people just so you could slag them off.

Well thats a shame and to think they let people with minds like yours breed.

Originally posted by redseal
Nice way of half quoting me, to make it spin the way you want!!

I didn't do anything of the sort. In fact, unlike yourself.. I was decent enough to address most of your points. Feel free to explain each of them if you feel they've been misrepresented.

The hitler/genocide thing that was clever!!

It was you who mentioned Hitler in the first place.

Just like the media, spin/half quote to make it fit in your favor!! You liberals are all the same!

1. I haven't spun anything.. and you haven't answered anything. All you do is jump up and down abusing people, crying foul when they don't agree.
2. I'm not a liberal.

[edit on 14-5-2007 by riley]

Originally posted by redseal

BS BS BS BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am a prime example of where one can come from nothing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I got married at 21, I didnt have a career and my wife was a medical assistant making 11 dollars an hour, I was delivering pizzas making about 13 an hr with tips.

...Well now I'm a Jouyneyman Electrician making $30 an hour, and she's an RN making about the same!

Dont give me this sh#t that you cant make it!!

Some people just dont have the fotitude to do it! I.E. LAZY!!!!!!

It was a tough 3 years! No sleep, no hangin with the friends, no social life!!

But now i have what I wanted, Im not just some person who wouldnt work for it bitchin to everyone else why it all sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have to say that I have read much, not all (fortunately) of what redseal has had to say and I really feel pity for the soul. He is making $30 an hour and now has everything he ever wanted. Well at $30 an hour that's not much to say for his ambition if he HAS ALL he wanted! I won't go into what I earn because that is not the point/subject for this forum, however, for some reason he seems very worried about what people think of him (indirectly) and why people hate the US seems secondary. This is a sure sign of insecurities and I would be afraid to let him play with any kids given that he would, as a father, need to condition their minds, instill moral values and ensure that they grow up being valuable contributing subjects/individuals in the world as we know it and in the US of A especially. However, my perception is that these negativities are going to rub off on his kids and their minds will be forever warped by the actions and words of the father - VERY sad!

Your one person who's made it out of 300 million. Congrats but don't believe that your success is a reflection of the American dream. "200000" make it in America each year out of 300 million, the lowest social mobility in the world. It’s not due to laziness its due to the fact that America propagates a false vision the poor stay poor bar those exceptional few and the rich stay rich. The American dream is a lie.

The American "Dream" isnt just handed to you, you do have to go get it.
It may not be due to laziness, but perhaps bad decisions, I have a sister in law who got into meth, her whole life is screwed because of that decision! Your decisions that you make are your problem not mine!!

Anyone here can go to college, I dont care if you have 3 kids with no daddy in the picture or whatever! I worked with a guy who had 2 kids, lived in an low income (subsidised) apartment, and now he makes the same as me! He got his college for free though! Why? because he had 2 kids way too young, and the state gave him a chance!! now while I'm paying off my loans for 10 yrs, he is scott free!!

This is the problem, we reward failure, and punish success. Its no differnt as many of you have proven here by your posts. America is succesful, lets badmouth, and berate them down to our level to make us little and unimportant nations feel better!

America is hated because of its government, not its people get that through your head.

We are not hated because of our culture (for the most part). Our foreign policy has been divide and conquer for a while now and there doesn't seem to be any changing soon.

Maybe once we start treating the rest of the world like they exist we'll have a better status worldwide.

Just maybe.

Also an apology might not hurt eh?

Maybe some reparations.



[edit on 16-5-2007 by biggie smalls]

I have to say that I have read much, not all (fortunately) of what redseal has had to say and I really feel pity for the soul. He is making $30 an hour and now has everything he ever wanted. Well at $30 an hour that's not much to say for his ambition if he HAS ALL he wanted! I won't go into what I earn because that is not the point/subject for this forum, however, for some reason he seems very worried about what people think of him (indirectly) and why people hate the US seems secondary. This is a sure sign of insecurities and I would be afraid to let him play with any kids given that he would, as a father, need to condition their minds, instill moral values and ensure that they grow up being valuable contributing subjects/individuals in the world as we know it and in the US of A especially. However, my perception is that these negativities are going to rub off on his kids and their minds will be forever warped by the actions and words of the father - VERY sad!

You feel pitty for me? Well thats great. The $30 an hour part was proving a point, That people can make it! Its not a benchmark for someone to strive to, go ahead make more, if you do, I'm all for it!! By the way $30 an hour in the USA is in about the top %20 of incomes, and I'm only 28 years old, were you their at 28??but any way.

And yes I will try to instill morals in my children, like respect, common sense, fortitude, and preserverance! You state it like its a bad thing!!??

First I was called a child, then a troll, and in this post unambitious, bad father!!

And you all call me the name caller!

All your true colors are shining through, and damn brightly!!!

[edit on 5/16/2007 by redseal]

Originally posted by biggie smalls
America is hated because of its government, not its people get that through your head.

The american people elected the government!! Get that through your head!!!!!!!!!! Oh ya along with blowing up the twin towers, GW also rigged the elections, What hasn't this guy done?? If mars blew up tommorow there would be a thread on how President Bush was responsible!!

We are not hated because of our culture (for the most part). Our foreign policy has been divide and conquer for a while now and there doesn't seem to be any changing soon.

What have we conquered, is Iraq or Afganistan now a part of the USA? Do the get to vote in our elections, can I buy some land over their???

Maybe once we start treating the rest of the world like they exist we'll have a better status worldwide.

Maybe they should start acting as such, sorry if the USA is ignoring you, the answer isn't suicide bombers! ENVY ENVY ENVY, its a sad thing.

Just maybe.

Also an apology might not hurt eh?

Maybe some reparations.

An apology for what? Reperations?????!!?!?!?!?!?!? Are you black, I dont owe you nothing! I never owned a slave, nor did my grandpa, great grandpa, etc etc! And in turn you were never owned, nor was your grandpa, etc!!!

Reperations????????? This is the whole point here folks!!!!!!, People lookin for a damn free ride!!!!!!

Dont even get started on affermitive action!!

Hey heres any easy one for the next name caller RACIST!

Dont even bother I saw it comming a mile away the second I started typing!



[edit on 16-5-2007 by biggie smalls]

Originally posted by magicmushroom

Fact the US did not win the 1st World war
Fact the US did not win the 2nd World war

Then who did, I think the USA might have had a majority role.

Fact the US got their asses kicked in Vietnam

You may want to look at the body count there mushy

Fact the US did not invent the car

Right again, but who was the first to manufacture/mass produce it?

Fact the US did not invent the computer

Was the abbacus a computer?

Fact the US did not invent rocket technology

Ok

So many facts to list but whats the point, you ask people for their views only to call them liars, ignorant etc.

And when your views/opinions clash you call me a child, a troll, and a bad father! Stating all the while you are old and wise!

Rather than engaging in logical debate you seek to shout down and insult people so can one assume your sole purpose here was to bait people just so you could slag them off.

Logical debate?? How can you when the best you folks can come up with is name calling!!??

Well thats a shame and to think they let people with minds like yours breed.

Wow here is another one, I'm unfit to breed!! Geez do you eat magic mushrooms too? Where are you comming from?

Your not old and wise, you elderly and stoned!!

Anyone with half a brain can spin this any withch way they want!

It all really comes down to who invented the wheel argument.

You can claim this and I can claim that. What is the definition of a computer, a manually operated machine or one that "works" on its own? Was the first auto a tractor or a sedan? Who flew first the ones who dreamed it up or the wright bros. who actually flew?

Idea vs. actuality, while on the drawing board look the same, are two distinctivly different things alltogether!

I dont care if a caveman thought up the internet! Untill its put to use its wothless!!

Hey I just had a thought!!! Time travel!!!!!! Please give me credit when the time comes!!! who cares if the UK implements it, I thought of it first!!!

Old and wise, man it gets more absurd every time I think of it!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by redseal

Then who did, I think the USA might have had a majority role.

How can you come on to a forum, and spout all the stuff you have - not know what you are talking about - and still try and argue your points?

Try looking on Wikipedia for WW1 and WW2 military casualties.

Red when people state what are known facts and you slag them off calling people liberals etc. it dose not show an enlightened mind.

Irrespective of ones nationality or education its not difficult to check these facts out, rather than mouthing off which just shows ignorance on you part you would hold a much stronger argument if you can counter with detailed info.

e.g. the US came into the 1ww in April 1917, the Army could just about muster 300k men by spring 1918 it was 420k, the war ended November 1918. One has to remember that by the time the US entered the war millilions had died on both sides and Germany was not defeated on the battlefield but due to the blockade to its sea lanes which starved the people out.

The war in Europe ended 8th May 1945 the war in the Pacific ended 2nd September 1945. One has to remember that by the time the allies landed in Normandy the Russians had the Germans beat and had for the last 2 years been pushing them back all the way to Germany.

The Russians at this time fielded nearly 12 million men, more than twice what the allies had.

Vietnam was not about a body count, most of those killed were civilians due to indiscriminate US bombing, but at the end of the day one of the worlds nuclear armed super powers was beaten by a third world country by men wearing pyjamas.

Do these statements above mean I hate the US or its people, no it dose not. Personally I have no reason to hate America or its people, but do I hate the politics, the foreign policy, the corporate greed yes I do but that is not a preserve set just for the US it could be any country on the planet including the one I live in

Red forgot to add I'm not ederly...


[Mod Edit: Please see T&C's section 2e. Thank you - Jak]

[edit on 18/5/07 by JAK]

Originally posted by redseal

...The $30 an hour part was proving a point, That people can make it! Its not a benchmark for someone to strive to, go ahead make more, if you do, I'm all for it!! By the way $30 an hour in the USA is in about the top %20 of incomes, and I'm only 28 years old, were you their at 28??

Yes.

Originally posted by redseal
And yes I will try to instill morals in my children, like respect, common sense, fortitude, and preserverance! You state it like its a bad thing!!??

Absolutely not - it is a good thing, BUT, as long as they are the right morals and not a rub off of negativity that creates a hateful human being in adult life.

Originally posted by redseal
First I was called a child, then a troll, and in this post unambitious, bad father!!

Nope, i did not call you a bad father but what i did insinuate is that, IMHO, what seems like a lot of negativity on your part and how worried you are about what people think about America also seems to be, in part, buried in the thoughts of what people think of you. Hell i may be 100% wrong because i do not know you at all except from what i have read here but, and again MHO, in terms of how your kids are brought up, which is of course none of my business, but a parent's negativity does rub off on kids and in terms of values I was making a point, based on the fact i do not know you, that your kids get the right values instilled in them. This may appear as a personal attack but it honestly wasn't. I did not say you are not doing this.

Originally posted by redseal
And you all call me the name caller!

Nope. I did not call you a name caller.

Originally posted by redseal
All your true colors are shining through, and damn brightly!!!

I do not know what colors you see so i cannot comment on that.