Why Time Does NOT Exist!

Originally posted by blue bird
One could say, that space is a human construction also...in fact if you are a solipsist - everything is just in your had!

In a sense yes, and in an other sense, no.

If it were not for my brain as we currently know it to carry out cognitive functioning, thus perceptions et al. then I would not experience life the way that I do; as an intelligent, thinking, reasoning, rational Human Being of and on the living organism that is Earth, and if you think about it: the Earth is on me, too. The sky is not only above, it is also below. The Earth is circular.

Every thing that you see is a construct of Human perception and experience, yes. Everything is in my head as a concept, but not literally. Every thing, hence "ever-y", would go on for ever, thus can not be contained. Every thing has no beginning and no end, so it is not only in my head as a concept, but it is my head as the eternal make up of Existence: energy.

The idea of space is a Human construct, yes. Most think of space as the vast "blackness" 'out there'. Space is in fact any thing and every thing, including me. I am space, space is I, space is in I and I am in space. There Exists no "emptiness" of Existence, Existence is every where, every thing, for ever.

Every thing is also just in your head, and if you deny that it's only because it's in your head to do so

[edit on 6-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

LastOut - how do you know that there is “no beginning and no end“?


* and, yes... it is a mental “construction“ through our senses - and perception of objective reality...

Originally posted by StellarX
I don't see why a open system can not behave in consistent ways as well or why closed systems must behave in completely predictable ways...

An "open" or unlimited system is consistent in being unconsistent (excuse my use of "un", I do have my reasons), where as a "closed" system may appear to be completely consistent with its limited and expected results. The results are limited and therefore expected because the system is limited.

Example. In a lottery with balls numbering 4 and 6, where three balls will be drawn to conclude a winner... we have a closed system; a limited system. All possible outcomes are known. 1.)444, 2.)666, 3.)464, 4.)646, 5.)446, 6.)664 (466, 644)

There are two variables to be drawn every ten seconds, 4 and 6. There are 9 of each variable. We have a 50% chance of either a 4 or a 6 on the first draw. From there we can induce and deduce percentages.

There are 2 variables being drawn in to a 3 number combination. 2X3=6. We know for SURE that the numbers will be dispersed in 6 different combinations, but after further investigation we know that there are 8 possible combinations in total. AxB+A, where A = the number of variables and B = the amount of digits in a combination. We also know that this equation is limited, yet always consistent with the implementation of P.E.M.D.A.S. AxB+A, A+AxB, BxA+A, A+BxA, etc.

A "closed system" is limited. An unlimited system is not closed, nor is it consistent, only through its constant unconsistencies. It will be unlimited with an unlimited amount of symbols to choose from and an unlmited amount of combinations to create. Also it will have an unlimited amount of equations.

[edit on 8-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Originally posted by blue bird
LastOut - how do you know that there is “no beginning and no end“?

Because it knows me. To comprehend nothing is to know Eternity, is to know thyself.

Eternity is a construct of the mind, to deny it is to deny your self.

Every where we look we have eternal objects, whether it is the "Gods" of religion, or the energy of Existence.

It is time to know who, what, and where we are. It approaches quickly

Heres something to think about... You know how God has the power to do ANYTHING he wants?


Well does he have the power to NOT exist?

If so then who or what made time? I think about multi-verses all the time and how they make sense to me. In dreams and deja-vu's is what I think. when we dream we vist our selves on another universe(s), but what I don't get is how we have all 5 of our senses and awareness and "consciousness" when we dream... Which makes me also wonder if we really do time travel to another universe within our dreams. They do say that if multi-verses do exist then there are infinity of them, theres one or many more of the same perception or imprint of ourselves here or that we left "yesterday". Which I think Time-Travel is possible.

The most and biggest question i ask my self is what it would feel or be like to have consciousness and awareness 2 places at the same time...

There is no God.

What you should ask your self is what would it feel like to have a consciousness of eternity?

If you believe in time travel and that every experience is merely a frame that is frozen in "time" for ever, then you are all ready conscious in many more than 2 places at once. You are still conscious yesterday and the day before, and you know this because you can re-member it in your memory.

You are the eternal consciousness.

Multi-verses? Infinite possibilities in an eternal expanse of space and time is a more in depth definition.

There is no "bubble universe", there fore there are no "multiple universes". Only an eternal expanse; an infinite illusional reality: Existence, eternity

[edit on 14-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Originally posted by bodebliss
Because entropy increases and never decreases, nothing can be put back as it was. This is the one way arrow of time.

Outsight: Insighting Incite; exciting. Please do read seriously.

Nothing can never be put back as it was because nothing ever was some thing, and nothing can ever be put back as it was because nothing never was some thing.

Nothing can never be put back as it is because nothing ever is some thing, and nothing can ever be put back as it is because nothing never is some thing.

Nothing can never be put back as it is because nothing ever was some thing, and nothing can ever be put back as it was because nothing never is some thing.

Nothing can never be put back as it was because nothing ever is some thing, and nothing can ever be put back as it is because nothing never was some thing.

Entropy is only for an enclosed and limited system... explained above. Why can't entropy decrease? Why does entropy only increase? If you say entropy can only increase that is because you are judging entropy from entropy, thus your conclusions on what entropy is capable of doing and what entropy actually is... are limited.

Homogeneity is all ready achieved through an omnified field (or what we have been calling an unified field), and this omnified field already Exists, but Humans are yet to be aware of it... or the majority of Humans.

There is no arrow of time, only a perceptional delusion that we will all soon over come... together

[edit on 14-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
There is no God.

What you should ask your self is what would it feel like to have a consciousness of eternity?

If you believe in time travel and that every experience is merely a frame that is frozen in "time" for ever, then you are all ready conscious in many more than 2 places at once. You are still conscious yesterday and the day before, and you know this because you can re-member it in your memory.

You are the eternal consciousness.

Multi-verses? Infinite possibilities in an eternal expanse of space and time is a more in depth definition.

There is no "bubble universe", there fore there are no "multiple universes". Only an eternal expanse; an infinite illusional reality: Existence, eternity

[edit on 14-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

But what about the causious feeling you know as the present self? It would be really werird to have awareness at 2 different times at once, being there physically, like u are in present.

Originally posted by Jager673
But what about the consious feeling you know as the present self? It would be really werird to have awareness at 2 different times at once, being there physically, like u are in present.

I understand what you are saying, yet a "memory" is the present of the past, and every present moment is a remembering of the future. The only difference with a memory of the past is that you appear to have no more choice because the choices have already been made. Yet what feels like the present moment is only the future in regress and the choices of the present feel as if they contain an unlimited amount of potential for change, but this is really an illusion too. All of our fates have and have not been sealed in the trichotomy of eternity, that which is and was of our choosing.

Work on having super clear memories and you will feel what it is like to have consciousness in 2 places at once. You can do this and achieve it in many different variations there after, like say... mechanically and mathematically? If you want to build a time machine... you have the means to do it... use your imagination freely and let no one stop you or change your mind. Your imagination exists because the things you imagine exist, so as long as they are in agreement with the underlying logic and principles of Existence, that which are ruled by the defining factor of Nothing masked as eternity, and so as long as you accept your self and the Existence to be "God"

[edit on 16-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

This natural progression from order to disorder ( entropy) is speaking volume about imposing arrow of time on the system.

Originally posted by blue bird
This natural progression from order to disorder ( entropy) is speaking volume about imposing arrow of time on the system.

Some times it's like speaking to a brick wall Please excuse my venting, I ask you kindly as we all vent now and then.

Existence is ordered and diss ordered all ready. There is no progression from one to an other, only through awareness, but never will we stop at diss order. We will intertwine both and comprehend them simultaneously as we live through and as them.

The "universe"/existence is not a closed system. Mentally, through awareness, the Human mind is allowing its self more and more to see this. That is the only example of "universal" entropy that I can think of, and it is more so a personal enlightened awareness... and once entropy is achieved, order is not for gotten. For we will keep order and diss order. We are the idea of entropy, all the laws and workings of "physics" that we create to view the "universe" around us is not separate from us... for we are these very attributes. It is not only around us or outside us, it is in us and through us. We are the "universe"... we are Existence... we are synchronized with eternity

[edit on 16-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Human existence sounds,the way you are speaking, so alienated, unnecessary mystified.... escape from reality...

We are mortals...what is wrong with that?

Originally posted by blue bird
Human existence sounds,the way you are speaking, so alienated, unnecessary mystified.... escape from reality...

We are mortals...what is wrong with that?

Alienated? No, I am saying that we are every thing, connected to every thing because there is no space of Nothingness to Exist, ever. Thus we are all each other, there is never lonliness. Alienation is an illusion, an apperceptional delusion. This means that we are also connected to our cosmic brothers and sisters in the endless civilizations that spread throughout the glorious eternal cosmos. We must all (every planet with divine beings) go through similar ventures to reach civil maturity, it is only reasonable and logical to conclude such a solution. For to attain the technology to travel intergalactic and interstellar distances must also mean that a civilization has the awareness, responsiblity, and love to not destroy its self with the very real capable possibilites of those technologies to be used for destructive purposes.

Escape from reality? Well, what is reality? Who binds the limits to and of reality out side of the personal and collective self when there is no out side because we are connected eternally?

We are mortals. I agree. We are also eternal as energy

[edit on 16-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
An "open" or unlimited system is consistent in being unconsistent (excuse my use of "un", I do have my reasons), where as a "closed" system may appear to be completely consistent with its limited and expected results. The results are limited and therefore expected because the system is limited.

I'm not sure that you just said something so take another shot if you were attempting to make a point. .

Example. In a lottery with balls numbering 4 and 6, where three balls will be drawn to conclude a winner... we have a closed system; a limited system. All possible outcomes are known. 1.)444, 2.)666, 3.)464, 4.)646, 5.)446, 6.)664 (466, 644)
There are two variables to be drawn every ten seconds, 4 and 6. There are 9 of each variable. We have a 50% chance of either a 4 or a 6 on the first draw. From there we can induce and deduce percentages.

It could only be a closed system if we knew that the randomness we expect were not being influenced by the wishes of large numbers of people. These experiments have been done on large scale now and it has been confirmed that expectations of large numbers of people's affects their environment. Even with our basic understanding of physics at this point this is not in fact a closed system

There are 2 variables being drawn in to a 3 number combination. 2X3=6. We know for SURE that the numbers will be dispersed in 6 different combinations, but after further investigation we know that there are 8 possible combinations in total. AxB+A, where A = the number of variables and B = the amount of digits in a combination. We also know that this equation is limited, yet always consistent with the implementation of P.E.M.D.A.S. AxB+A, A+AxB, BxA+A, A+BxA, etc.

I'm not impressed and once again if you wish to make a point i am sure you could do it without resorting to systems you have dismissed in the past.

A "closed system" is limited.

A closed system is in fact closed and every action inside of it is understood and known to originate with internal forces; we are not currently aware of able to prove that such a system in fact exists.

An unlimited system is not closed, nor is it consistent, only through its constant unconsistencies.

If by unlimited you mean open you might have almost made a point consistent point. I don't understand, and i am generously assuming there might be, the proposed relationship between a open/unlimited system ( and i'm not sure how you want to prove that open must be unlimited) and 'un/inconsistencies either. Why can a open system not be act in consistent ways while drawing on energy/forces we can not trace or measure?

It will be unlimited with an unlimited amount of symbols to choose from and an unlmited amount of combinations to create. Also it will have an unlimited amount of equations.

That might be so but your opinion do not seem to be based on anything other than conclusions based on fallacies or misunderstandings of the forces in this universe we do understand. Why do you want to make it even harder than it has to be?

Stellar

Time is no more or less bizarre than 3 or 12 dimensional space.....there is no explanation reason or confirmed definition of either.

Whether physics or religion be your philosophy, no one will ever be able to explain everything, and quantum physics especially leaves that door open

You could waste an entire life searching for an explanation of existence, only to find that in searching, you missed the existence, and all you have at the end is an explanation.

Originally posted by StellarX
I'm not sure that you just said something so take another shot if you were attempting to make a point.

A closed system is measurable, there fore easy to predict, measure, and carry out all other forms of procedures that would come with the expectations of a closed system. Where as with a strictly unlimited and open system none of this applies.

The only consistency of eternity is that it is constantly changing, thus it is consistently unconsistent and unconsistently consistent. As far as the "un" is concerned; that's an allotment of language that is unconsistent with various other partitions of the same language (English). In- and un- are used in completely different interpretations for a multitude of words. I, as an amazing intellect, find this shockingly ominous. It is obvious to me that we are the creators and creations of our own destiny, thus if the very words we are using are not consistent with them selves then we are doomed to unconsciously destroy us and any hope for survival and an enlightened awakening.

It could only be a closed system if we knew that the randomness we expect was not being influenced by the wishes of large numbers of people. These experiments have been done on large scale now and it has been confirmed that expectations of large numbers of people's affects their environment. Even with our basic understanding of physics at this point this is not in fact a closed system

Actually it is the complete opposite. It could only be an unlimited and unclosed system if we knew that the randomness was not being affected and in effect confined by the limited expectations (wishes) of a limited amount of people(s): There are an unlimited amount of beings and thusly an unlimited amount of expectations and wishes throughout eternal Existence that spans the fabric of endless and ubiquitous space and time.

I agree with the experiments as I have read of them, but that experiment is still a closed system being operated within an unlimited system. When the unlimited system can be understood and operated you won't have to do any thing that you don't want to do. Earth will transform in every way.

I'm not impressed and once again if you wish to make a point i am sure you could do it without resorting to systems you have dismissed in the past.

I am not here to impress you. If you expect that my intentions are to entertain the yearning of your conjectured apprehensions about intellectual impressionsism then you will be viciously diss satisfied. I am here to spread the truth, not to full fill one's wants and needs.

I diss miss no systems. I am comparing the current model of physics which is based entirely on closed systems, including attempting to close Existence in to a bubble "uni-verse"(s), to the truth of the unlimited system that we all are and that we all share, that which some may refer to as "God".

A closed system is in fact closed and every action inside of it is understood and known to originate with internal forces; we are not currently aware of able to prove that such a system in fact exists.

It does and it doesn't. The awareness of all beings must be respected, thus every thing is and is not. Existence tells us this and explicitly so, even through "physics". All forces act upon each other and never is there a space of division and/or solitude of oscillations and temperatures throughout Existence, but if chosen to be viewed in such a way, then a closed system can be seen. The only way this closed system can be seen is to ignore the forces that are externally acting upon it.

To view a thing as separate is to isolate the self. This is where we currently are in cosmic terms. Untill we over come this lack of awareness we will never be modernly introduced to any one out side of our own world.

If by unlimited you mean open you might have almost made a point consistent point. I don't understand, and i am generously assuming there might be, the proposed relationship between an open/unlimited system ( and i'm not sure how you want to prove that open must be unlimited) and 'un/inconsistencies either. Why can an open system not act in consistent ways while drawing on energy/forces we can not trace or measure?

Because an unlimited system is unlimited in all ways, the only consistency is that the outcomes and measurements are unlimited, eternally. We can trace and measure every thing, there is only nothing that can not be traced and measured, but even still... nothing can be comprehended.

That might be so but your opinion do not seem to be based on anything other than conclusions based on fallacies or misunderstandings of the forces in this universe we do understand. Why do you want to make it even harder than it has to be?

Stellar

I am not here to make things easy, I am here to make things peace full and intelligible for the future, nor am I here to express my personal opinions. What I present can not be proven wrong, ever, because there is no right, nor is there a wrong... there is complete acceptance of the duality that then reveals the most high triality: that is Existence.

I do not want you to stop questioning, only to refrain from calling it my "opinion"

[edit on 17-5-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Everything in existance is a wavelength, inter-woven and infinite (God, if you please, the ultimate frequency). 'Time' is the sensory reception of wavelengths of light, sound, heat, gravity, etc. at a certain point is space. 'Time' is relative to the perceiver when the waves of whatever they are observing passes over them.

Time is not a universal constant. You are always in your own 'present' and it moves forwards in tune to a certain frequency.

Think about a duplicate earth where they run at 2x our 'time'. They would not be perceptive to the fact that they were moving very fast in comparison to us. That is the frequency they are tuned to.

Fractals show visually alot about time and the way things in nature develop in patterns. Scaled duplication, infinity...


[edit on 5/18/2007 by Spoodily]

Possibly, you're all making this too complicated. The point is that time is an ILLUSION that WE perceive. It is a perception that is necessary to us, in our mortal/physical state. It is how we are "hardwired." "Who" (or what) did the wiring schematic, and how, and why, isn't something I intend to ponder here (although I do, often, elsewhere).

Example: A frog literally does not see a fly until the fly moves. Quite literally. That is, an electroencephalogram (EEG) of a frog's brain shows that the fly (as far as the frog is concerned) DOES NOT EXIST until it moves. The "why" of this makes no intuitive sense, as a frog's life would obviously be easier, and the frog would be be much more well-fed, if it could see the fly at all times.

Think about that. We are not frogs, but we are certainly also not aware of the true state of the universe around us. Not capable of being [fully] aware. Literally do not have the capacity. We can see flies before they move, so one must wonder about what it is that WE cannot perceive. In addition to the true nature of time, that is. Think about that some more...

Nevertheless, as we increase our knowledge (on a species-wide scale), and begin to utilize instruments to examine the universe around us at a level that we cannot do with our own senses (that is, to "see" the fly before it moves), we are also beginning to realize that the universe is far stranger than we can perceive. It is a universe that changes [(only???) at the quantum level] BECAUSE we observe it. It is a universe that appears to not "notice" the passage of time that we perceive. (If you have not yet read "The End of Time," mentioned earlier, you really should; excellent!)

It is good to be aware of this. It is impossible to truly understand it. It is also impossible not to try; this is another part of what makes us human.

Another something to think about, related to the "passage" of time: Why do dreams always end, in perfect context, right at the moment you wake up?

Curiosity is the cure for Boredom;
There is no cure for Curiosity.

Good Evening -

When dealing with things such as these, sometimes it's very hard to grasp them...

Why? Because we always think something has to be one thing or the other. Black or white. The thing is, when you're dealing with such unimaginably infinite and perfect things such as the universe and reality, sometimes something can be two things at once, or many things at once.
Sometimes there isn't a single truth.

An explanation of time I like is this. It explains in simple terms, how something can be two things at once. Ultimately, time depends on which perspective you look at it from.

View a rock from the outside and it appears still and unmoving, frozen in time.
View it on the inside at an atomic level and it contains billions of particles, all zooming around inside, independant of each other. Inside the rock there is movement, thus a concept of time. This is from out point of view.
Gods point of view, is from outside of the rock. In fact, he is the rock itself. He can view the single moment of everything all at once, compared to our limited point of view on the inside.

This short story explains time and why everything is a part of the whole, in a childlike story. So I love it. = )

I dont think I have posted this before here in this thread, sorry if i have : )

Time depends of something called "density flux" ratio. its electromagnetic force. we observe only natural density flux of earth and space.

[edit on 18-5-2007 by B3...]