UCLA Police Taser Student For Not Showing ID W/Video

Originally posted by ludaChris
But you also forgot to leave out he was trying to incite other students into joining him with his little fight against "the man."

Only the police reported this. Not any of the 30-40 eyewitnesses, not the video, showing most of the event.

How strange.

I havent been indoctrinated[...]

Right.

Originally posted by gekko

Originally posted by ludaChris
But you also forgot to leave out he was trying to incite other students into joining him with his little fight against "the man."

Only the police reported this. Not any of the 30-40 eyewitnesses, not the video, showing most of the event.

How strange.

I havent been indoctrinated[...]

Right.

Yelling and screaming, resisting arrest, he was making a scene and clearly trying to make a political statement with this "stunt" as I like to call it. Other students were thinking of getting involved as shown in the video and police had to tell them to get back. This could have gotten out of hand very easily with the way this kid was acting, and the Police's main job is to protect and maintain the peace. What do you want them to do, bind and gag him? It is you who have been indoctrinated my friend, you have no comprehension that the police were called by a library security officer doing routine checks to make sure everyone who was in the library belonged, when he didnt show ID, the police were brought in. I will conceede that the repeated tasing of this man was extreme, but not completely unwarranted. He was looking for trouble and he found it.

Originally posted by ludaChris
Haha, so tell this to the people who repeatedly call UCLA Campus Police "rent-a-cops."

I wasn't talking to them, I believe you intended to, but instead you ended up saying:

Originally posted by ludaChris
This needs to be cleared up now and should have been cleared up much earlier in this thread[...]

(my emphasis)

Then you go on:

If you feel that you should call me ingnorant for reitterating that fact, maybe you just couldnt comprehend my posts.

Wow.

I just pointed out that the facts had been mentioned earlier, showing that you were probably not reading all the posts before posting yourself.

And then you go on calling out other peoples "comprehention of your posts". Im not trying to get to personal on you Luda, but if you criticize others for not having their facts straight, you might want to be damn sure you have your own facts in order first.

Oh btw, from page 13 I believe.

Originally posted by gekko
TrentReznor; The cops were real, they work for LAPD, they are not rentacops.

And that was the 2nd time I pointed it out.




EDIT TO AD:

First you say:

Originally posted by ludaChris
But you also forgot to leave out he was trying to incite other students into joining him with his little fight against "the man."

Then in the next post (after I point out the unlikeliness of this) you change the story and say:

[...] he was making a scene and clearly trying to make a political statement with this "stunt" as I like to call it. Other students were thinking of getting involved as shown in the video and police had to tell them to get back.

Uh. OK. I admit I cant quite comprehend your posts now Luda. Care to clarify?

[edit on 18/11/06 by gekko]

[edit on 18/11/06 by gekko]

Originally posted by ludaChris

I havent been indoctrinated, I'm simply educated enough to realize that if he had complied with the police it would have all worked out and he would have been probably banned from campus, depending on whether or not he was an actual student there. Oh, yeah, but he never provided ID did he? They had no way of knowing if he actually belonged there or not.

Your kidding right?

Your major is in emergency scene managment, or law enforcement? What the heck man you think just because you bow down to someone with a badge you are a good little citizen and everything will be a-ok in child land? You need to grow up and do it fast, because a lot of crazy sh!t is about to hit this country like you wouldnt believe.

I have the authority to be Incident Command, and shut down any portion of the county I reside in. The police then take orders from me. I understand what is happening better than you do son. You have been indoctrinated into being a person that makes an excuse for some mindless coward to risk someones life for nothing.

Your papers please...

[edit on 18-11-2006 by LoneGunMan]

Apparently Ludachris plans to be on the receiving end of 'the papers' world we'll soon inhabit. That's all well and good as long as you don't have a wife, a child, friends or free will!......re-evaluvate things Luda, please!

UCLA order outside probe of incident

Hoping to calm the furor created when UCLA police used a Taser to subdue a student studying in Powell Library, the university's acting chancellor announced Friday that a veteran Los Angeles law enforcement watchdog would head up an independent investigation of the incident.

Norman Abrams said he ordered the probe after the university received numerous calls and e-mails from parents and alumni raising concerns about the officers' actions during the videotaped Tuesday night arrest, which has been widely seen on TV news and the YouTube website.

See also the opinions of The Daily Bruin

UCLA's own newspaper.

There was a march of 200+ students regarding this incident.

Quite interesting as it unfolds.

[edit on 11/18/2006 by justgeneric]


And this is what is **expected of citizens when interacting with Police...as the COURTS see it:

Interactions with Police

* General
o Do not argue.
o Do not run.
o Never touch a police officer.
o Do not resist or complain.
o Do not make any statement.
o Do not consent to any search of your person, home, car etc.
o Upon arrest, request a lawyer immediately.



Interactions with Police

* Stop and identify
o State statute that requires you to identify yourself upon request
o Usually must have some relation to ‘reasonable suspicion’ (NO probable cause)
o You will be arrested for a failure to comply, usually a fine
o If revealing your name may incriminate you, remain silent, this may be a defense after arrest

I think it should be obvious that both parties were wrong. Both parties could have done things differently. The actions of the police do not excuse the student's unruly behavior or his non-compliance as STATED by LAW. The student's behavior does not excuse the police's behavior...as I pointed out earlier in the thread they have policies and guidelines and they clearly were not followed.

Interesting stuff.


**expected: suggested really...but the courts will accept a great deal of argument on this.
[edit on 11/18/2006 by justgeneric]

[edit on 11/18/2006 by justgeneric]

Originally posted by ludaChris
There are also many here on this thread who do not seem to realize that Campus Police are not "Fake" or "Rent-A-Cops." They are sworn officers of the State/town/county or which they patrol or enforce the laws. This needs to be cleared up now and should have been cleared up much earlier in this thread, because some of the responses are downright ingnorant as to the fact that these officers are indeed sworn in and have all the same powers as normal cops or deputies.

I'm not going to get into this fun thread , but I do want point out something that many people might not realize.

In some places the Security Guards you see might be off duty police officers. I used to work somewhere where all our Security were off duty police and the head of our security was the Chief of Police of the town. It was always funny watching a drunk cause a problem even after the Chief identified himself and showed his badge. I still remember this one time an idiot, after the officers had identified themselves, still was stupid enough to push the officers in the chest and start a fight and call them "rent a cops" Moral of the story: Don't assume many law enforcement people are not Real Police officers as well. Assaulting an officer and resisting arrest are never a good thing to do. But hey, you go find that out yourself if you disagree.

"You need to grow up and do it fast, because a lot of crazy sh!t is about to hit this country like you wouldnt believe."

LIKE what?

Another point I hadnt even thought about:

(Thanks for the link justgeneric)

During the altercation between Tabatabainejad and the officers, bystanders can be heard in the video repeatedly asking the officers to stop and requesting their names and identification numbers. The video showed one officer responding to a student by threatening that the student would "get Tased too." At this point, the officer was still holding a Taser.

Such a threat of the use of force by a law enforcement officer in response to a request for a badge number is an "illegal assault," Eliasberg said.

Eliasberg is a ACLU attorney, so he might no be entirely unbiased but its still a valid point.

Do we want a society where people are threatened with extreme violence for asking for a badge number? After all, this is the only way to identify a police officer for a later complaint.

More on the impending case(es)


Attorney Steven Yagman has signed on as the lawyer for Mostafa Tabatabainejad.

He successfully won several cases recently involving civil rights infringements and most notably the case Gherebi vs Bush, Rumsfeld regarding treatment of Gherebi in Guantanamo Bay.

As yet no case has been listed in the courts system.


Yagman & Yagman & Reichman

Added this link with all the info available for YOU to sort through LOL...

UCLA Handbook

and the

[edit on 11/18/2006 by justgeneric]Student Conduct Code (opens a PDF)

Have fun

[edit on 11/18/2006 by justgeneric]

I agree that the students non-compliance to show his ID was wrong; however

the actions of the police were far in excess of the "crime." The student is going to win this case. Once the jury hears the other officer threaten the other students with tazering they will agree that the the officers overreacted based on that statement alone. The video is just icing on the cake for the prosecution.

The simple fact is that the student was a non threat and the officers responded with force in front of other students.

Idiot Student: 1 - Egomanical Aggressive Cops: 0





[edit on 18-11-2006 by xEphon]

Originally posted by xEphon
Idiot Student: 1 - Egomanical Aggressive Cops: 0

Damn right. This is stupid vs. evil.

Im certainly not defending the students actions, Im only criticizing the cops.

Originally posted by LooseLipsSinkShips
"You need to grow up and do it fast, because a lot of crazy sh!t is about to hit this country like you wouldnt believe."

LIKE what?

Like martial law and curfews, you dont want to read the stuff homeland security is requesting the fire dept. to get involved in. One major incident and if this recorporate system of governement that is in place (both dem and repub) think they can get away with it they will take the rest of your rights.

They are just waitng until the time is right. It doesnt bother me, I carry a badge that will get me past just about any checkpoint. You citizens do have to worry though. Less than 10 years you will be wondering why you asked "LIKE what".

Within two years I will stop posting on ATS...

OMG those Student conduct CODE book is interesting too.

How to conduct service to the... ?

we could say - A book that explains this: Who is the master - The dog, or the man who walks he's dog?


nice Conduct scripture...LOL*

And i think you people should listen to a lone gunman...He might tell specific what is going to happend to everything. maybezzz

In 2 years time I wont be on this Board either. What can i say.
I am gonna take my bike - And Drive away from civilization - Because Civilization Has lost it's mind.
So Im gonna leave Civilization to keep my mind clear in this madness we could call it. Some people travel far away - just to get away and never return.

It's an old ancient feeling - Going out in nature and be a fisherman for 2 hours - But with freedom - you are a fisherman - And alot of other things at same time - cause (system) didn't tell you that part.

Im gonna leave you for like forever...

The voice of the internet will die - So I might as well leave.
Internet also becomes more boring - If it will be voiceless.

Who likes being bored anyway? - If Internet gets boring - My voice wont be here anymore.

Bye now.

[edit on 18-11-2006 by Ram]

the boy who got tasered was OK because "he walked out of there."

He should file suit for physciological trama, which includes an unnatural fear of police and all other authority because of the tasering.

LoneGunMan - Can you tell us exactly what would be enacted during Martial Law besides curfews and checkpoints. Is there a good website I could go to?

How big of an area would we be allowed to travel in? Would check points be at every exit along the highways and byways? What about people who need to travel across country or different areas due to their jobs from truckers to people who make a living going to vairous shows such as antique shows? Would we be allowed to visit relatives living in a different county?

Would parents still be able to homeschool? Would we have to report somewhere every day for a roll call? Would we be moved against our will? Would we be able to take anything other than the clothes on our backs?

Would society be like V for Vendetta, or worse? Would they force everyone to work? What about homeless? Exactly what do they have planned, and what are you being trained for?

Are they going to corral certain citizens for experiments? Would there be any place safe to run to, or is every dangerous.

Sooo... Basicly. This is a typical "Bash the man in blue" speech from most people that just do not believe that force should be used for anything...

So. In your scenario a simple security guard comes up... "Sir. I need to see your ID."
He replies.. "No"
"sir. I do need to see your ID. You are here past hours for people who are not students"
"no"
"Please???"
"no"
Now... Security contacts the real campus cops... They are armed with Batons, Firearms, Guns...
For the first IDIOT who says why do they need a gun on campus I'll reply simply... "Uhhh.. for crimes that are violent???" Rape happens dude.

Cop walks up... "Sir You must leave this location now or show me id"
"no"
"Please??"
"No"
I'll bake you a cake...
"no"



As you can see. Being nice and polite is not going to work... So I'll show you simple protacol...

Cop responds. Asks for ID. His job is to secure and make sure something is not going on... You refuse. Yes. you can go to jail. Kiddies, I'll make it easy. THIS IS A STATE LAW!!! Not some college guard trying to play nazi... When he refuses the security guard does not have the authority to do anything so he contacts the campus cops *Those are the guys with batons, tasers, and guns* *Awaits the gasp from the left winger utupian idiots*

The cops not only have the authority to arrest a person and remove him but also to defend themselves. When this person starts to resist his own arrest by refusing to show ID.. Refusing to leave... Refusing to remain QUIET IN A LIBRARY and incite the other people around them. The cops realize they have to subdue there suspect in a swifter manner... Offering him a brownie will not make him shutup... Sorry for all you people who think that "peace if the only way" A person who is trying to incite a riot and who is refusing police authority can also be the type of person to reach for your gun and at 11pm at night that can be worrisome to the cops so they find a faster way to make the suspect no longer a threat. They hit him with 100,000 volts. They could have beaten him... they could have shot him... They could have wrestled with him and had the chance for people to then jump on them from behind.. *oh.. yeah... As I Recall the people who HATE guns and HATE violence would be the ones who would GO For the guns and for all the cops know USE Them on there proper owners...* So they tazer him and call it a day amongst a bunch of leftist college students who want to blame this on everything Bush has done since day 1 in office when I think the law they are enforcing was enacted in the mid 70's....

Wow... I don't have to be a college student to know that sometimes doing a small simple thing can save you and the other people around you alot of time and energy.

I do love though how people jump all over the cops for use of force. I do not think it was excessive and I have seen both first hand. *Never experienced it.. But have seen it*
"Oh what if he was a bomber or a drug dealer or a rapist or a jehova witness!!!"
Then if this didn't happen you would be jumping all over the cops for NOT doing anything.... *No offence to Jehova Witnesses*

Cops always get stuck with both ends of the stick... They always are told to enforce the law and when they have to use force they then get jumped up and down on by the people they are supposed to protect.
I will dread the day when a person has to call the police because they have an actual life/death emergency and they get killed cause the cops have been made so toothless all they can do is shoot marshmellows at the suspect with a rubberband gun cause they have to be "Politically correct"

Should of used a lead bullet. One less possible terrorist.
You are going to come into America from Iran, utilize our educational system, knowing what your people and government say about us and how they sponsor terrorism, and dare defy our security people? The audacity...

If the situation was reversed and this was an American in Iran the American would be dead and the people would be cheering in the streets because of it.

[edit on 18-11-2006 by Apoc]

I believe he was an american born citizen student. Good try though.

Originally posted by Annachie
This is a typical "Bash the man in blue" speech from most people that just do not believe that force should be used for anything...

You got it right. Dead on. Congratulations.

[/sarcasm]

Most of the "Bash the man in blue" people calling for the prosecution of these cops agree that the student was to be blamed for the situation arising in the first place.

If he had been carried outside and chucked in jail overnight no one would have had a problem with it.

Now, why don´t you go and read whats been said before on this thread before you comment further.

[edit on 18/11/06 by gekko]