John Lear's Moon Pictures on ATS

Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by Chorlton
The thread has gone from the Sublime to the ridiculous and has lost the plot

Not to worry good stuff coming soon, but I have been busy with mundane life issues

No plot has been lost, I assure you, but hey your welcome to contribute something meaningful anytime

We have shown hundreds of images in the almost 200 pages... some fantastic, some not so good... thats the way it goes.

Yes indeed you have shown many pretty pictures of craters and rock formations and strange geological formations. All things you would expect to see on a desolate lifeless uninhabited satellite of the earth.
Can you give me a shout when you find something interesting.?
Thanks

Originally posted by Chorlton

Can you give me a shout when you find something interesting.?
Thanks

There are many 'somethings' interesting. Start at page 1. See you in a coule of weeks

Originally posted by Chorlton
Can you give me a shout when you find something interesting.?
Thanks

Really?

How do i shout over this keyboard?

I agree with Zarniwoop...start with page 1 and make your way back over to the current page. About the time I had caught up, i got photoshop and decided to look for myself.

Its amazing what you see when you approach something without preconceptions.

No, what I saw were pictures of a lifeless desolate moon with bizarre rock formations.

What anyone see in any picture is down to them. I dont have as fertile imagination as some here and I simply dont see 'mining machines' and all the other weird things that some people see. You may make assumptions as to what they may be but thats all.
Take a look at Google Earth, at some of the stranger places on Earth, South America, Africa etc and you can probably make some pretty wild assumptions about rock formations etc there.

Its like the good old The Rorschach Tests, one person sees a butterfly, one sees an inkblot.

To make statements about unknown rock and crater formations on a lifeless moon thousands of miles away and make those statements and assumption sound like fact is patently wrong.

[edit on 20/7/07 by Chorlton]

You're right. There's nothing for you to see here - so move along. By the way, that nose on your face isn't real either. This thread only applies to those of us who believe that our noses are, in fact, real.

As for the picture in the last post of the previous page..... I didn't really see anything that struck me as odd (except for a gigantic crane at the 9 o' clock position of that crater LOL).

Don't sweat it guys...

"You can lead a Horse to water... well you know the rest

Originally posted by Chorlton
No, what I saw were pictures of a lifeless desolate moon with bizarre rock formations.

I do not doubt that you do not see anything. Perhaps the Universe has decided you are not ready yet

In the image below, if you can see nothing but a blurry rock, then thank you for your opinion, but there is nothing more we have to show you that will convince you.

Its like the good old The Rorschach Tests, one person sees a butterfly, one sees an inkblot.

For some not experienced this is true, but others spend hours studying and researching these images, and more hours finding supporting documents to present our case.

To make statements about unknown rock and crater formations on a lifeless moon thousands of miles away and make those statements and assumption sound like fact is patently wrong.

Then I humbly suggest you right NASA a letter and explain this to them, because their scientists do exactly the same thing..

In a recent Mars image Mike Singh found these tracks...




Close up of what Mike called a "ramp"


Found by analyzing this image...

hiroc.lpl.arizona.edu...

After writing a team member pointing this out we actually got a reply... LOL the standard "moving rock" reply, but at least they responded..

Hi Ron,
Thanks for this. The consensus is that these are boulder tracks. Others have been seen also. Interesting, though.


Best,
Paul

Funny thing is... they look very similar to the tracks we found on the Moon... also "moving rocks"

Sorry mate but I see nothing in any of those pics that are at all amazing

The mars pics? Its well known Mars has horrendous wind and dust storms
which could and probably do account for those tracks and to show several badly out of focus pics and claimanying of themis simply stretching peoples imagination too far.

You obviously have a fertile imagination. So do I but I dont attribute meanings and reasons for things which will probably never be proven in our lifetime.

Those tracks? moving rocks? we have them here on earth too.
www.billandcori.com...
sophia.smith.edu...
And I suspect there are thousands of other pics taken on earth that you couldpoint to alien or human mining. The difference here is that we can go there and find out. We cant go to the moon and take a peek.

I know you are trying hard, but its pointless. All you can do is surmise, postulate, guess and suggest. You will never have proof untill someone goes there, and untill they do, its all hot air, I will continue to doubt any suggestions of mining on the moon or of anyone actually being there now, human or alien, and no amount of furry out of focus photos or photos of craters on the moon with geological formations is going to change my mind.

Thanks for trying though

Sorry mate but I see nothing in any of those pics that are at all amazing

The mars pics? Its well known Mars has horrendous wind and dust storms
which could and probably do account for those tracks and to show several badly out of focus pics and claimanying of themis simply stretching peoples imagination too far.

You obviously have a fertile imagination. So do I but I dont attribute meanings and reasons for things which will probably never be proven in our lifetime.

Those tracks? moving rocks? we have them here on earth too.
www.billandcori.com...
sophia.smith.edu...
And I suspect there are thousands of other pics taken on earth that you couldpoint to alien or human mining. The difference here is that we can go there and find out. We cant go to the moon and take a peek.

I know you are trying hard, but its pointless. All you can do is surmise, postulate, guess and suggest. You will never have proof untill someone goes there, and untill they do, its all hot air, I will continue to doubt any suggestions of mining on the moon or of anyone actually being there now, human or alien, and no amount of furry out of focus photos or photos of craters on the moon with geological formations is going to change my mind.

Thanks for trying though

Originally posted by Chorltonbut its pointless.

In your opinion... Fortunately that opinion is not shared by many. Believe as you wish... doubt what you will and believe me I am not trying for your benefit and I shall waste no more time trying to convince you.

Oh... as to those badly out of focus images... the ones I posted above are not out of focus and the large one in the link is the best HiRISE image of Mars yet shown by NASA... and the tracks are clearly visible in those. If that image looks blurry to you I would suggest either a visit to an eye doctor, or have your equipment checked



[edit on 20-7-2007 by zorgon]

But those 'tracks' are the same as those in death valley and could probably be explained by the storms.

Chorlton, I detect jealousy from you of what John and Zorgon have contributed and accomplished on these Earth Moon threads. Today we viewers of the Moon threads are not able to go to the Moon, but I do believe NASA and other secret missions who have been there know what is on and inside the Moon. One day some of the younger viewers of these threads will have the opportunity to go to the Moon but it will not prove if there is a breathable atmosphere because the tour guide might not let them take off their helmets.

Yes instruments can tell whether there is a breathable atmosphere on the Moon but instruments can be manipulated. You get me a ticket to the Moon and I will take my helmet off for the world to see. Two things are either going to happen I will live or die in a hail of glory. Rik Riley

Originally posted by rikriley
Chorlton, I detect jealousy from you of what John and Zorgon have contributed and accomplished on these Earth Moon threads.

Jealousy? of people posting pics of craters with strange suggestions about natural formations? You are way off here sunshine.

Today we viewers of the Moon threads are not able to go to the Moon, but I do believe NASA and other secret missions who have been there know what is on and inside the Moon.

AHHH wild speculation? you are among friends on the Moon Pictures thread then

One day some of the younger viewers of these threads will have the opportunity to go to the Moon but it will not prove if there is a breathable atmosphere because the tour guide might not let them take off their helmets.

I dont think any of the younger members will get to go there, maybe their grandchildren, but arent you worried about all those mines and the alien miners? as you seem to believe Lears ideas about mines?

Yes instruments can tell whether there is a breathable atmosphere on the Moon but instruments can be manipulated. You get me a ticket to the Moon and I will take my helmet off for the world to see. Two things are either going to happen I will live or die in a hail of glory. Rik Riley

There wont be any glory, you will just suffocate if you cant get your helmet back on to your spacesuit quickly enough. And with your dying breath you will whisper, "I wish I hadnt believed what those people on ATS told me" AAAAAHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhhnnnnnnnnn....................dead !

Originally posted by Chorlton
But those 'tracks' are the same as those in death valley and could probably be explained by the storms.

The thing I really like about skeptics is how they just make statements like that without anything at all to back them up.


No they are NOT like the ones in death valley. The ones in death valley are small rocks that they still do not have an acceptable explanation for... Wind movement when the ground is wet is just a theory as no one has seen them move

Now lets take the one on the moon. First of all using the scale of the image provided by NASA the size of the "rock" leaving that trail is several hundred feet, or about the size of a large house...

Could you please explain how the winds can move something that large?

Originally posted by Chorlton
AHHH wild speculation? you are among friends on the Moon Pictures thread then

LOL it is good to have friends... and in here they are numerous and no, they do not require being "saved" by you

Jealousy? of people posting pics of craters with strange suggestions about natural formations? You are way off here sunshine.

Interesting how you always harp on the pictures that you obviously have difficulty viewing, yet totally ignore any of the documents presented in many threads that show strange things going on. Explain to me why from 1996 to Oct 2006 they with held the full color images from Clementine and all we had from a 230 million dollar satellite was lousy pixalated images that everyone found anomalies in like this one




The best you could get direct from the US Navy archives (and this was version 1.5 of the mapper) was this...




Yet all along while they were snowing us with "Thats as good as it gets..." they had full color high resolution images available that look like THIS



And even this image I had to reduce to fit it in here... the full size is here...

I dont think any of the younger members will get to go there, maybe their grandchildren, but arent you worried about all those mines and the alien miners? as you seem to believe Lears ideas about mines?

And why would you make a rediculous statement like that? Arizona is building a commercial spaceport "Spaceport America" for 200 billion where Spaceship 1 will be offering flights in a couple of years. This space port is only one of about 20 private spaceports that the FAA has issued permits for.

There is a private company selling seats on a moon mission for 100 million a seat and all seats have already been sold out...

The Space Corp is recruiting like crazy... NASA has a current goal of putting an active base on the moon at the south pole by 2020 where Clementine satellite found ice about 100 km square area with a depth of 50 feet...

Norcat is running moon mining equipment demos in Sudbury Canada... [they are the ones that we called that have the extraterrestrial bucket excavator.

LPI has thousands of documents covering topics like glass making on the moon for fiberglass structures that use solar furnaces and have a by product of titanium and iron oxide and LOTS of free oxygen for fuel and breathing released from the lunar regolith.

Seems there will be hundreds of job opportunities for Lunar Miners in the next few years

We were told to get off in the 70's... the treaty has been broken... all bets are off... and I believe space command is ready to kick butt if anyone or anything gets in our way.

[edit on 20-7-2007 by zorgon]

Look mate this is all rather pointless. You have your ideas, I have mine.
You cannot prove there is mining on the moon and I cannot prove there isnt.
However, I choose to use Okhams Razor and Old Sherlock Holmes' idea, and I find that works for me, and in the case of the moon I find they ring very true

I realise an honest exchange of ideas is a good thing, but in our case its the immovable object and irresistable force (Im the irresistable one so the girls tell me :lol

Why do I ignore all of your techie stuff? because its totally irrelevant thats why.
You can present me with every scientific explanation you want, but one thing you cannot present me with is irrefutable evidence/proof of past or present mining/habitation on the moon or of any permanent structures.
You can post pictures untill yer bum drops off, but they arent proof.
You can postulate, prevaricate, suggest ,cajole and attempt anything you like to make it seem like there are bases on the moon.
But you dont have one ounce, one microgram of proof.

And as for Tourist trips to the moon? Like I said I suspect it will be my Great grandchildren who will get to go but I doubt any will go sooner.
Too many Health & Safety regulations to over come. If it takes NASA another 13 or 14 years to take 3 or 4 men back to the moon, I cant see Tourists going for at least 50 years, if that.
Me?, Id stowaway if I thought I could get away with it as they would never take an old cripple like me. Serves me right for piling myself up on the Isle of Man TT many years ago.

So we are going to have to agree to disagree. You will go on making your wild assumptions and posting your pretty pics and I will go on stating that pictures from orbit are no proof at all.

Have a nice weekend.

Originally posted by Chorlton
Look mate this is all rather pointless.

Yet you are still here...

You also seem very confused...

I dont have as fertile imagination as some here and I simply dont see...

You obviously have a fertile imagination. So do I...

I show you tracks of house size boulders on the Moon and your comeback is...

...horrendous wind and dust storms which could and probably do account for those tracks ...

Nice of you to confirm the atmosphere on the moon for John

Why do I ignore all of your techie stuff? because its totally irrelevant thats why.

Well then that about sums it up then doesn't it? You say you don't see evidence, but when presented you ignore it. But then many skeptics use those tactics... ignore the evidence when it doesn't agree with their little box... Wonderful way to deny ignorance... keep up the good work...

I bid thee good day, Sir



[edit on 20-7-2007 by zorgon]

Originally posted by zorgon
You also seem very confused...

I dont have as fertile imagination as some here and I simply dont see...

You obviously have a fertile imagination. So do I...

Im not confused at all.Its simply you mixing things up.
My imagination IS fertile but not as fertile as some here.Its simple really

Well then that about sums it up then doesn't it? You say you don't see evidence, but when presented you ignore it.

But thats my point, you have not presented any evidence at all, simply photos with your interpretation. That isnt proof. Just because you or John Lear says something doesnt make it the truth, you need to stop believing that what you post is automatically right.


[edit on 20-7-2007 by zorgon]

Originally posted by Chorltonyou need to stop believing that what you post is automatically right.

What I post is backed up by weeks of reseaerch and data that you chose to ignore in your vendeta against John and anyone who believes what he says

No what I need to do is stop trying to reason with people that ignore what you present...

One last time (and this is for the benefits of others in the thread seeing as you ignore "techie stuff")

REPORT ON THE CONSTRUCTION AND TESTING OF A
BUCKET WHEEL EXCAVATOR
Dale S. Boucher, Jim Richard
Northern Centre for Advanced Technology Inc. 1400 Barrydowne Road

The Northern Centre for Advanced Technologies Inc. (NORCAT), in partnership with Electric Vehicle Controllers Ltd. (EVC), is presently engaged in the development and adaptation of existing mining technologies and methodologies for use extra-terrestrially as precursor and enabling technologies for ISRU and for use as ISSE in support of longer term missions.

More specifically, NORCAT, in collaboration with Colorado School of Mines, has developed, constructed, and tested a bucket wheel excavator. The unit is based upon the design developed by CSM’s Mike Duke and Tim Muff.

Tim Muff is currently with Lockheed Martin... Norcat is running Lunar mining equipment testing and symposiums in the impact crater that is Sudbury Ont Canada. Norcat is under contract with NASA and the DoD

Chorlton, thanks for your response. You say do not be fooled they ARE mining cheese on the Moon. You missed spelled cheese it is spelled helium 3.

I forgot to tell you about plan B on the Moon if I should die by taking off my helmet of which I dought very much, but as a backup if there is not sufficient oxygen to breath. There is always the soul collector as my plan B, so my soul would not have to travel very far to be captured and prepared for recycle. Rik Riley

Originally posted by zorgonTim Muff is currently with Lockheed Martin... Norcat is running Lunar mining equipment testing and symposiums in the impact crater that is Sudbury Ont Canada. Norcat is under contract with NASA and the DoD

So what you and the information you have posted states is they are testing it for Lunar use. TESTING !
Thats fine

But it aint up there yet is it?. Both you and Mr Lear have stated that there are people (or Aliens) up there at the moment actually mining

There is NO mining at present taking place on the moon, not is there any permanent base on the moon at present.

I have no 'Vendetta' against anyone, so dont be so utterly ridiculous. However if people make outrageous statements, worded carefully to seem like that are factual when they quite obviously arent, then I and anyone else has the right to say so.

Pip Pip !