massive disrespect

Bikereddie
Sorry, but i think this a bit harsh. Any person who serves in the Armed forces deserves respect, from anyone, no matter what their views or beliefs.

Respect: Yes.

Authority on Truth: NO!

Everyone deserves initial respect, and it should only be denied in reaction to misdemeanor, I think we can all agree on that. However, that bears no relevance whatsoever to objective truth, and if someone feels offended by objective truth and appeals to respect in order to distort it, the fun stops. If you can't handle the truth, ok - just don't demand others follow suit out of respect.

PS: I'm actually not convinced that military personnel are entitled to greater respect than all other human beings, anyone care to make a case for that? To me it appears as if this was just part of glorifying the armed forces.


[edit on 27-3-2006 by Lumos]

Originally posted by Lumos
PS: I'm actually not convinced that military personnel are entitled to greater respect than all other human beings, anyone care to make a case for that? To me it appears as if this was just part of glorifying the armed forces.


[edit on 27-3-2006 by Lumos]

I believe the general idea is that they risk theyre lives to defend the country (idealistically) and that they deserve the respect of the masses that they defend and fight for.

I dont necessarily agree with the idea aswell, in some aspects, but thats the general idea.

As a ex military man myself and some might remember i also went iraq last year to do some close protection work i can hold my hand up and say "Yes our goverments are BENT as hell" and thats after 6 years serving my goverment in the Armed forces and being sent to many theatres of operation. I have never seen such dodgy employers

I generally don't disrespect anyone personally, but I will disrespect and deny and mock anyone's ignorance, or anyone's attempt to bolster an argument with poor logic, questionable evidence, or little or no proof.

I won't respect your beliefs, particularly if I think they're ridiculous.
I won't respect your heritage, because you did nothing to earn it.
I won't respect your age, because some people live long but never learn.

I will respect your ability to clearly and logically communicate your opinions.

Originally posted by esdad71
NIST, FEMA, 9/11 Commsion and Silverstien properties insurance all came to the same conclusion

All of those organizations you mentions are GOVERNMENT sanctioned organizations, or have a vested interest in having the official story be considered the truth. As far as the insurance company, how could they investigate when all the evidence was quickly removed from the crime scene?
You must have a problem with your sinuses because the official story stinks.

How can you trust what they say? They all started with an assumed conclusion, the buildings were bought down by aircraft flown by terrorists and the resulting fires. They then made the facts fit the conclusion, ignoring anything that contradicted the official story.

Can you not think for yourself? Do you need an authority to do it for you?

If you haven't noticed yet those who do think for themselves are all concluding "inside job", "demolitions charges"....

You are blinding yourself by wrapping the NIST report around your head.

Sry but some of us are not so easily immpressed by so called 'authority' and prefer to make up our own minds.



BTW thanx for all the wats guys! People really are starting to wake up to the truth.

everybody that joins the military, and serves their country deserves respect from everybody else, ( well not everybody, there are people who dont agree with the war) so besides them, think about we made a choice to serve our country, to protect the citizens of the united states, and to die for our country in some soldiers cases. We did not have to do this, there was no draft, we chose because we love our country. Now I dont believe in everything the government tells me, I know theres alot of shady stuff they do, but im not a robot I can think for myself and i have my own opinions...I joined the military to serve the country I love. There is a real terrorist threat out there, and I think I deserve a little respect for that, and so do the thousands of other soldiers, who fight and give their lives everyday. If I wasnt medically discharged I wouldve chosen to stay in Iraq and fight and serve, Its about love and pride for your country, not for your government.

The problem is Casey, the war in Iraq has nothing to do with you, your country or the citizens of it. It has a lot to do with corporations and governments pushing their limits of control.

Sry but 'serving your country' is an empty statement now.

Yes we volunteered to join. What we didn't volunteer to do is be used as guinea pigs, to be used to force the agenda of banks and corporations, to inflict revenge for the bush family.

Questioning the government doesn't make you any less of an American, in fact as an American it is your right and your duty, according to your constitution, to question your government AND to overthrow rogue government.

[edit on 27/3/2006 by ANOK]

Originally posted by Lumos
Everyone deserves initial respect, and it should only be denied in reaction to misdemeanor, I think we can all agree on that. However, that bears no relevance whatsoever to objective truth, and if someone feels offended by objective truth and appeals to respect in order to distort it, the fun stops.

[edit on 27-3-2006 by Lumos]

Good point. I have a lot of respect for any member of the Armed forces. Maybe i am biased here, but that is how i am.

As for the last line in your post

If you can't handle the truth, ok - just don't demand others follow suit out of respect.

I hope this was a collective statement... and not directed toward anyone in particular.

Fairplay you are a veteran and you fighting to keep alive to keep your buddy`s safe and to protect Iraqi`s. But alot of the soldires over there also like to murder and abuse people. And that is not disrespectful it`s clearly true.

I'm sorry, but why do any armed forces members deserve more respect over another human being? You volunteer, you get paid. Its a job, its a dangerous job, sure, but theres alot of dangerous jobs out there. What makes the armed forces deserve more respect then any other human being. To me, it just seems like its a building up of a class structure.

Originally posted by WolfofWar
I'm sorry, but why do any armed forces members deserve more respect over another human being? You volunteer, you get paid. Its a job, its a dangerous job, sure, but theres alot of dangerous jobs out there. What makes the armed forces deserve more respect then any other human being. To me, it just seems like its a building up of a class structure.

I said

I have a lot of respect for any member of the Armed forces. Maybe i am biased here, but that is how i am.

And i also said

Any person who serves in the Armed forces deserves respect, from anyone, no matter what their views or beliefs.

That is my view when people are putting down past or present serving soldiers. At no point did i say they deserve any more respect than the next person. Maybe you got my quote out of context?

From one veteran (retired 1 Sep 05) to another: to ANOK, R21, cavscout, and thesaint (and anyone else I may have missed) for proving that we can be vets and free thinkers. Also chalk up another WATS to ANOK for so clearly and concisely posting what I was thinking.

To those who are bad-mounting soldiers/veterans: I don't presume to 'know' you and how you think because I am not you and haven't lived your life. What makes you think that you know us?

I wanted to say much more, but everything I could say seems inane when compared to many of the excellent posts that preceeded mine.

Originally posted by Jaryn

To those who are bad-mounting soldiers/veterans: I don't presume to 'know' you and how you think because I am not you and haven't lived your life. What makes you think that you know us?

I wanted to say much more, but everything I could say seems inane when compared to many of the excellent posts that preceeded mine.

That my friend, is more than i could have said...

Its nice to know that there are some people who have the same ideals as myself.

Originally posted by caseythegeek21
We did not have to do this, there was no draft, we chose because we love our country. Now I dont believe in everything the government tells me, I know theres alot of shady stuff they do, but im not a robot I can think for myself and i have my own opinions...I joined the military to serve the country I love.

Very good but the irony that seems to be lost on you and other such brave and patriotic souls is that your bosses don't love your country, otherwise they wouldn't be raping it so.

Understand, war is a racket. Read the book titled as such by Brigadier General Smedley D Butler, one of your country's greatest military men to understand this.

Originally posted by WolfofWar
I'm sorry, but why do any armed forces members deserve more respect over another human being? You volunteer, you get paid. Its a job, its a dangerous job, sure, but theres alot of dangerous jobs out there. What makes the armed forces deserve more respect then any other human being. To me, it just seems like its a building up of a class structure.

no one ever said they deserve more repect because they where in the military i spent 4 years in the marine corps in seen a lot of things i dont believe i deserve anymore respect than anyone else as a major once told men we are all humans we put our pants on one leg at a time no matter what we did or who we are everybody deserves respect

No, you don't get it.- the military is not working for america anymore. You all can wave your flags and believe the fake opps, ignore the cost and the fact that the Iraqis have done nothing to us. How can you buy this insane lie about al-cia-duh with this passport that comes floating down from the towers and "investigations" that lie about little things like the melting point of steel 1200-3000, omit actual survivors testimony because of the "B" word leaving out the fact that the towers had massive concrete cores that went 2/3 of the way up the buildings, (and that pulverized concrete is alot of your dust) and then they come down at the rate of free fall 9-10 seconds thats zero resistance folks. you have to know that each floor would add time to that and we are talking about 70 whatever floors! The only three steel frame buildings to ever "collapse" from were on that day not to mention NORAD, WTF? is that the military you love so much? Jill Carol was released unharmed and WE TORTURE. So do your self a favor and google Kay Griggs or check out informationclearinghouse.info. And for gods sake turn off your TV. Allright if that lie isn't big enough for you than you can start believing that Moussoui was going to fly a fifth plane through NORAD and crash into the statue of liberty or whatever! I respect brave solders, but not blind warriors.

[edit on 1-4-2006 by gfirst]

I am a Veteran too. Which is why the idea of the government I once was employed by comitting such a heinous act is a disgusting, sickening idea that makes me want to to vomit at that thought.

But unfortunately, its the very sick truth. Just because I dont like it does not change that very fact. The very facts speak for themselves. Loving your country does not, and absolutely should not reduce your ability to see that the real enemies of America are within our own borders.

After alot of careful research into 9/11, combined with my own experience and knowldge of how things work in defense and the government, I have come to the inescapable conclusion, based on the facts themselves, that 9/11 did not happen like the offical party line tells us it did, nor for the reasons it did.

Just because you do not like something does not make it untrue. Take the Iraq war for example. Even though I knew damn well there were no weapons of mass destruction to be found in Iraq, I was praying they would find something and that I would be proven wrong. I really was. It would do much for the soldiers there, their morale, and maybe even restore some lost faith I had in the system and decency of some of our leaders. But of course, I knew they wouldnt find anything, and the Iraq war was utter and complete BS for oil, not democracy. I knew this because I was stationed in Saudi during the between years, when we were enforcing the no fly zone and UN sanctions, back in 95. Every single day British and American bombers took off from the airbase to patrol, and sometimes bomb, Saddams military into oblivion. We had wiped out his WMD in those 12 years between the gulf war and this fiasco.

So you dont like the thought that maybe you were sent of to fight and put your ass on the line for the sake of a few rich sorry old geezers. How do you think I felt getting sent off to defend the Saudis, a regime more undemocratic, abusive, and dangerous than Saddams? As far as I was concerned, Saddam could have taken the whole damn stinking sand pit. Getting sent off to fight for an utter bs war is not your fault. There is nothing you can do. It does not diminish the spirit nor letter of your service.

But do not dishonor the millions who went before you, military and civilian, who risked their lives and sometimes lost them fighting against lies and corruption within our own ranks. Your duty to defend America extends beyond carrying an M16 or firing a missile. Remember your oath went you signed up and were sworn in. You will defend the U.S. Constitution and lands against all enemies, foreign AND DOMESTIC. Well, the real enemies of America are sitting in D.C. right now having a laugh at our expense. They shrug about the soldiers who have died for their pocket books. They are criminals masquerading as crusaders.

They are the war you should be fighting now, because they threaten your country more than any rouge plane or middle eastern wannabe Napoleon could ever do.

That is a very impressive post. As a vet myself I feel exactly as you do, we swore to uphold the Constitution and defend against all enemies foreign AND domestic. I thank you for your true patriotism. The truth movement is gathering momentum, it may take awhile before we are strong enough to make a move but it is going to happen. We have no choice but to confront this now, while we still have freedom of the internet to bolster our numbers.

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf,

Well said!

I just wish that I could give "applause" like the mods do because you deserve a standing ovation for that post.

That was a well-written response, Skadi; it made me want to salute the flag and hoist a mug to the memory of George and Ben and Tom and Patrick and the rest of the Founding fathers.

However, just to make sure that I understand, you are stating that you have seen the intel and know for a fact that the United States Airforce was not just striking SA stations and radar stations after the first war, and that ALL of those places that Scott Ritter said that Saddam was playing shell games (Before he curiously changed his tune after returning) were destroyed by bombs, and that everyone manufacturing facility, including mobile ones (except, of course, the mobile labs for the highly secretive weather balloon project) were destroyed?
You are also saying that you, as a single soldier stationed in Saudi Arabia, knew more about the onsgoings in Iraq than did the intelligence services of not only the U.S. (The same ones who were caught unaware by the fall of the Iron Curtain, I admit) but also the intel services that were briefing the leaders of other countries that also stated the dangers from Hussein and his chemical and biological weapons?
I would have to ask you how you know such detailed information and how you can say for certainty that this be the case as I have never known one soldier to have all the pieces before. Also, why, since this is totally contrary to what has been released to the press, would you state that which would be totally classified as it is obviously something "they" (and you know who they are) prefer us not to know. Seems they would not enjoy the release of information stating that we continued to bomb the Iraqi military, other than SA sites and associated radar stations.