Ukraine Style war would mean UK forces would be done in 6 months

a reply to: Freeborn

Love reading your stories FB and do get your point Just the Yanks like us there for poitical reasons. Poodle on a lead and all that. Probably do like the skills though, we do have a very professional force still. Never doubted in English indeed whole British isles (both of them) people's ability to take on any foreigners whatsover. We regularly have the strongest man or belt winning heavyweight boxing champion for a reason. We can certainly fight when necessary. It's the industrial base and supply chain to the front that scares me. I've watched our industry be exported overseas for 40 years under every government and with their effective compliance. I just don't see we can turn on the switch for a full war state these days on our own. The plants are gone and even more scary to me at least, the skills are gone too. Skills that can't be learnt in a month indeed a year and more. Takes decades to industrialise a nation and that has been lost to us. Talking of skills well impressed by your panel beating skill set. Holy smoke I'm fascinated by anything metals based and that is one proper learned, beautiful, real skill to have. I'll be thinking about that this afternoon

originally posted by: BedevereTheWise

Yes there seems to be rather strange assumption that we would fight a future war the way Russia does.

It has been very strange. I call it WWI, but with drones too. People say OMG! When Putin launched his latest missile, it could either carry 4 1800-pounders or 36 200-pounders. Then we have the B2 after a massive attack on all AAA etc fly from the US non-stop drop it loads just inside of Ukraine's territory and send 80 GPS guided 500 pounders to their targets. Or send 40 guided missiles that break down into 6 guided missiles, and then each drop 20 heat seeking bomblets. These bomblets can blow up vehicles and also shoot out Thermite type explosion, which will burn a build to the ground or take out a small group of soldiers as it homes in on a heat source. That is 5000 per drop. Now do 10 drops per day and you have 800 500-pounders or 50,000 bomblets... We are not even talking fighters, A-10/A-11, guided missiles, other bombers AWAC, Helicopters, ETC ETC.

No need to go into Russia proper and the war is over as they end up dead when they enter Ukraine. That is without a single boot on the ground other than support, no fighting needed.

a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Russian youth fight because they know how much evil by outside forces has been inflicted on their nation since 1917.

Like what?
Ok, Nazi Germany....but who else?
Dates and details mate.

They know how the outside world has at times sought to destroy them as a state and to this day seeks to do so.

When?
No-one wants to destroy Russia....they just want Russia to stop invading other countries.

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Russian youth fight because they know how much evil by outside forces has been inflicted on their nation since 1917.

Like what?
Ok, Nazi Germany....but who else?
Dates and details mate.

They know how the outside world has at times sought to destroy them as a state and to this day seeks to do so.

When?
No-one wants to destroy Russia....they just want Russia to stop invading other countries.

And NAZI Germany and Russia were effectively allies at the start of the war.

I still can’t wrap my head around how self proclaimed British “men” feel no need want of firearms. Too much daytime television has them convinced they can punch their way to freedom or fend off a machete with their hands. Or that they can pull out their hunter knife and disarm a person with gun. Hilarious.

As tho a fist is somehow more righteous or honest. Why drive when you can walk?

I guess that’s why I keep reading about them and their family’s getting stacked up in the street daily.They bring fists to knife and gun fights and actually honestly believe they are going to be effective in defending what they love.

Yes the guy on the John the Deer with a 22 is literally the only one capable of defending himself and your government is actively trying to destroy them.

originally posted by: Athetos
I still can’t wrap my head around how self proclaimed British “men” feel no need want of firearms. Too much daytime television has them convinced they can punch their way to freedom or fend off a machete with their hands. Or that they can pull out their hunter knife and disarm a person with gun. Hilarious.

As tho a fist is somehow more righteous or honest. Why drive when you can walk?

I guess that’s why I keep reading about them and their family’s getting stacked up in the street daily.They bring fists to knife and gun fights and actually honestly believe they are going to be effective in defending what they love.

Yes the guy on the John the Deer with a 22 is literally the only one capable of defending himself and your government is actively trying to destroy them.
:Cheers:

We don't need to defend ourselves from guns because our laws make it far less likely idiots have access to guns.

The murder rate per capita in the UK is about a 5th of the US.

Ah yes the logically fallacy that only the worthy should/do have access.

Your cops are all bangers eh?

I am not American. Guns are extremely important regardless of what your propaganda has taught you.
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

originally posted by: Athetos
Ah yes the logically fallacy that only the worth should/do have access.

Your cops are all bangers eh?

a reply to: BedevereTheWise

Worth?

Bangers?

originally posted by: Athetos
Ah yes the logically fallacy that only the worthy should/do have access.

Your cops are all bangers eh?

I am not American. Guns are extremely important regardless of what your propaganda has taught you.
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

Yes they are important and useful.

Nothing about that stops them from needing to be strictly regulated.

A banger is something extremely good. At least where I am from. Its probably beans or some # where your from.

A simple typo. But if all you can cling onto is spelling semantics not much of argument.
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

Why would you assume you need guns only to defend against guns?

Guns can shoot knife wielding and fist wielding assailants aswell. Actually they are better at then anything else.
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

a reply to: Athetos

I do not think anybody has an issue with using firearms to fight wars.

But that simply does not mean we wish to see them on our streets and in our cities in the same numbers and manner they are across the pond.

The majority of people in the UK are perfectly happy with our gun laws Athetos.

And again, you would be surprised at what's kicking about and available to some people, or what's tucked away and buried safe for a rainy day.

Each too their own, and different strokes for different folks.

originally posted by: Athetos
A banger is something extremely good. At least where I am from. Its probably beans or some # where your from.

A simple typo. But if all you can cling onto is spelling semantics not much of argument.
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

Sausages actually.

Wasn't argument, your choice of words made no sense to me. Regional variations in English can cause confusion.

I think firearm use and ownership should be regulated. Simple as that. However is getting wildly off topic.

a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Can't argue with the point you make about the loss of our manufacturing base and the skills that go with it, I'm 100% in agreement with you.
I have no faith whatsoever in any of the major political parties trying to address the issue.

My Dad was a welder. I myself worked on the river in Teesside for a while. I witnessed the demise of ship building industry and heavy engineering first hand. I've also seen the complete abandonment of whole communities due to the loss of our manufacturing capabilities across the whole of the North East, North West, Yorkshire, Scotland and other parts of the UK.
Its bordering on the criminal.

Perhaps we'll discuss it some time at length in a more suitable thread.

I’ve never much cared for what the majority of anything think. I find the majority often lacks.

a reply to: andy06shake

originally posted by: Athetos
Why would you assume you need guns only to defend against guns?

Guns can shoot knife wielding and fist wielding assailants aswell. Actually they are better at then anything else.
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

Yes. And if guns are easier to get also more likely to be used to attack you.

Off topic please set up a tread on UK gun laws and happy to continue there.

a reply to: Athetos

And you are entitled to think that way.

Same as we are entitled to feel the way we do about not having guns on our streets, or in the hands of every Tom, Dick and Harry.

Again, it's just different strokes for different folks.

Two different places, and as similar as they can appear, two different ways of life.

a reply to: Athetos

The UK is not the USA.
Yes, we share many common attributes and customs but gun ownership is one of those key differences.

I agree it would be folly in the extreme to introduce a carte blanche banning of many gun types in the USA, it would be carnage. Far too may guns in circulation both legally and illegally.

But they aren't that common here in the UK. Sure in rural areas many have shotgun licenses and there are those who have them for hunting, shooting and sport, but you have to jump through hoops to get one especially without a legitimate reason like farmers etc.

The vast majority of criminals do not have guns of any sort. Loosening our gun laws would only result in more criminals and nutjobs having guns. Gun related incidents would go through the roof. Many places in the UK are very violent places and fighting is a favourite national pastime for many.

As for advocating gun ownership to resist a tyrannical government.
How good did it do you guys?
So many believe Biden stole the 2020 election and was/is an illegal President.
How did your Second Amendment prevent that or aid in resisting his 'illegal' Presidency?

But none of that is the topic of this thread....and its been done to death over the years.
Plenty of existing threads to discuss this topic.

a reply to: andy06shake

PM for you mate.

a reply to: Freeborn

I got it buddy.