Eighty thousand deserters in Ukraine

a reply to: charlest2

charlest2 the OPs claim to begin with was full of more holes than Swiss cheese.

a reply to: andy06shake

Maybe so. I have already repeated the old saying, "The First Casualty In War Is Truth".

a reply to: andy06shake

The closest one could come to saying NATO is in Kursk is that ex NATO military volunteers are in Kursk using nato provided equipment.

Just like…

Chinese volunteer in the ranks of the Russian army

t.me...

It hardly means that the Ukraine is at war with China because Chinese volunteers are in the Russian military using Chinese equipment.


ETA not sure if you can link due to that # appearing in the link.

a reply to: charlest2

....., but the Soviet era of Russian history is long gone. Kaput! But you can't get beyond the past, can you?

But that's exactly what Putin is wanting to do.....by any means necessary.

a reply to: NorthOS

Russia has all sorts of foreign troops and regiments on the field NorthOS.

Same as the vast majority of the drones and artillery they are now firing at Ukraine are of foreign origin aka Iranian or North Korean.

If NATO forces were in Kursk they would be in Moscow by the next fortnight.

Simply down to the fact that the Russians cannot manage to muster combined arms nor stand against the likes of modern armies that can.

a reply to: NorthOS

That offensive is also being supported by NATO, mainly US and British, surveillance, intelligence, and planning. US operations are indirectly neck deep in that operation. The Ukrainians are not even remotely capable of pulling this off without US and NATO assistance.

a reply to: RickyD

But that's nothing like what happened in Ukraine.

The US didn't make Yanukovych take Putin's bribes nor did they make him switch from the pro-EU ticket to pro-Russian policies as a result of those bribes against the wishes of the people who elected him.
Nor did they force him to order his troops to open fire on protesters and kill over 100 people.

The US didn't fund and instruct Russian Militia's to agitate and provoke throughout Luhansk and Donetsk or carry out terrorist attacks against Ukrainian government buildings and organisations.

Your analogy bears little or no resemblance to the events in Ukraine.

And if something like that were ever to happen in Ireland - which is ridiculous because the Irish people simply wouldn't let it happen - as much as I or my countrymen may not like it there would be # all we could or should do about it because Ireland is an independent country and they make their own choices, it has # all to do with the UK.....just as what Ukraine chooses to do has # all to do with Russia.

Step one foot into my country and its a completely different proposition altogether.

a reply to: charlest2

That offensive is also being supported by NATO, mainly US and British, surveillance, intelligence, and planning.

I think special forces have been in Ukraine since the beginning just to advise and keep Zelenskyy safe.

But you will need to provide proof as to the claim you just made if indeed thats the case.

Ukraine can do things for themselves you see and make decisions.

US operations are indirectly neck deep in that operation. The Ukrainians are not even remotely capable of pulling this off without US and NATO assistance.

Again some proof there might be nice.

If they can learn to use our NATO toys charlest2, they can learn to adopt our superior battle tactics and way to wage war against the Russian scum invaders, just a thought.

a reply to: Freeborn

No he isn't. You know better than that but you just will not admit it. He had no intention of going into Ukraine until NATO threatened Russian sovereignty by trying to push NATO capabilities right up into their front door. NATO was formed to be a purely defensive organization but eventually evolved into a purely aggressive organization bent on surrounding Russia with military encirclement. Putin's actions are wholly defensive and you know it.

a reply to: charlest2

Putin's actions are wholly defensive and you know it.

Sorry, I completely and utterly disagree with you.

Putin has been chomping at the bit for ages to try and reclaim as much of its former satellite countries as possible as he dreams of reclaiming Russia's 'former glory'.

If Ukraine wanted closer ties with NATO/EU then that is/was entirely up to them as an independent country.

You disagree, that's fine.
People have different opinions....that's the way the world should be.

a reply to: Freeborn

It's plain as day he wishes to see the Russian Federation return to something reminiscent of the former Warsaw pact.

Complete and utter pipe dream all the same.

And never going to happen.

Simply down to the fact that the world spun.

a reply to: Freeborn

That's your right to do so. You have a right to your opinions however incorrect they may be. Me too. One of these days I hope you take off the blinders and see the reality of this situation.

We live under the rule of wholly corrupted governments now. Honor and virtue no longer governs us and materialistic greed rules the day, and corruption facilitates the greed. Maybe it always has.

a reply to: charlest2

I would love to see you living under the rule of Putin's corrupt government charlest2.

Because chances are we would indeed be getting locked up for some of the conversations and opinions expressed.

15 years in gaol or sent to the front lines being on the menu should you choose to vocally disagree or even peaceful protest.

The fact of the matter is we have it relatively good in both our respective nations.

And enjoy a modicum of freedom of speech and expression.

I dont think Russia can claim the same or anything reminiscent of the sorts.

a reply to: andy06shake
Your fellow citizens are being arrested for exercising their god given right to free speech.

Legislation.gov

127Improper use of public electronic communications network
(1)A person is guilty of an offence if he—
(a)sends by means of a public electronic communications network a message or other matter that is grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character; or
(b)causes any such message or matter to be so sent.
(2)A person is guilty of an offence if, for the purpose of causing annoyance, inconvenience or needless anxiety to another, he—
[F1(a)sends by means of a public electronic communications network, a message that he knows to be false,]
[F1(b)causes such a message to be sent; or]
(c)persistently makes use of a public electronic communications network.
(3)A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable, on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months or to a fine not exceeding level 5 on the standard scale, or to both.
(4)Subsections (1) and (2) do not apply to anything done in the course of providing a programme service (within the meaning of the Broadcasting Act 1990 (c. 42)).
[F2(5)An information or complaint relating to an offence under this section may be tried by a magistrates' court in England and Wales or Northern Ireland if it is laid or made—
(a)before the end of the period of 3 years beginning with the day on which the offence was committed, and
(b)before the end of the period of 6 months beginning with the day on which evidence comes to the knowledge of the prosecutor which the prosecutor considers sufficient to justify proceedings.
(6)Summary proceedings for an offence under this section may be commenced in Scotland—
(a)before the end of the period of 3 years beginning with the day on which the offence was committed, and
(b)before the end of the period of 6 months beginning with the day on which evidence comes to the knowledge of the prosecutor which the prosecutor considers sufficient to justify proceedings,and section 136(3) of the Criminal Procedure (Scotland) Act 1995 (date when proceedings deemed to be commenced) applies for the purposes of this subsection as it applies for the purposes of that section.
(7)A certificate of a prosecutor as to the date on which evidence described in subsection (5)(b) or (6)(b) came to his or her knowledge is conclusive evidence of that fact.]

You had better be careful what you say or tweet. You say or tweet something that hurts someone's sensibilities and you will be arrested.

You still think you live in a free society? England is turning into an authoritarian fascist state. On top of that, you are being Africanized and Muslimized and your government is facilitating this without any regard for your indigenous citizens. They are killing your friends and fellow citizens just like they are doing over here. They are just doing it with knives and machetes where guns, knives and clubs are being used over here.

We are witnessing the destruction of western civilization in real-time.

Agenda 2021 and 2030 now. The elete are winning this fight against humanity.

a reply to: charlest2

The moronic buffoons who choose to mob and riot were locked up for good reason charlest2.

They were not imprisoned for peaceful protest.

The same with the few who were prosecuted for inciting racial violence and hatred or promoting lies that led to an increase of chaos and destruction on the streets.

I do live in a relatively free society and i dont fear what i have to say.

And do and say as i please for the most part without fear of government intervention.

Nobody is killing my friends and fellow citizens, and again for the most part, bar living in the likes of London, the UK really is nothing reminiscent of the way you're attempting to paint and portray the place.

Do bad things happen, they do indeed, but destroying the place or wanting to see 6% of the population dead or removed to god knows where because we dont hold with their religion certainly is not the answer.

What we are witnessing is massive problems with immigration combined with the fact that there is nowhere near enough social housing or NHS resources available for the people already here.

And if you wish to lay that blame at anybody's doorstep, you need to blame Tory policy and rule for the past 14 years.

Labour are ar@eholes also, make no mistake about it, and a feck up already but they are simply fecking up the game on the chessboard the Tories gave them.

Anyhoo andy rant over its may be my bedtime soon. LoL

a reply to: andy06shake

They are still hunting down peaceful protesters from Jan. 6th just for protesting on the capitol grounds steps and most of those that did enter were peacefully meandering around inside without causing any destruction. Those that did cause violence that day were Antifa and other infiltrators inserted into the crowd to incite and inflame the situation. I personally witnessed 5 Antifa disrupting police trafic trying to get down to the capitol via Constitution Avenue. The police escorted 4 busloads if Antifa into the area the very evening prior to the rally and there were FBI and other government agitators infiltrated into the crowd. It was a setup and Nancy Pelosi was the instigator of it all. The vast majority of the more than 1,265 defendants never even entered the building and caused any damage but they were arrested and jailed for unrealistic sentences just because they were there.

I was lucky enough to stay far enough away to not be subjected to their wrath. Others that did foolishly venture onto the capitol steps are not so lucky. Some have even been in jail to this day without trial. 3 and a half years later. The right to a speedy trial is written into our constitution, but that's nothing more that a piece of butt-wipe for these crooked SOB Democratic politicians over here.

So don't try to feed me that tripe. I know better.

I do live in a relatively free society and i don't fear what i have to say.

It's a creeping manifestation. One day you will wake up with your rights drastically diminished, one law or declaration at a time before you even realize it, and by then it will be too late to do anything about it. Frog in a boiling pot.

Even now, you are only free because your government allows you to be.

a reply to: charlest2

I agree entirely with you about the creeping limitations being put on our rights and civil liberties and it is a big concern.
I don't think anyone has denied that both of our countries have issues that need addressing urgently.
But at present I'd still much prefer to continue living in either of our countries rather than the vast majority of other countries out there.

And none of that has anything to do whatsoever with Putin's invasion of Ukraine.

a reply to: charlest2

They are still hunting down peaceful protesters from Jan. 6th just for protesting on the capitol grounds steps and most of those that did enter were peacefully meandering around inside without causing any destruction.

Dont try and feed me that tripe because i know better.

We all watched on live TV you see the same as Donald Trump.

And that was anything but peaceful protest, they built a wooden gallows ffs.

Kicked-in doors smashed windows and assaulted police and authorities.

Then there were the "Hang Mike Pence" chants along with idiots defecating in offices.

Those that did cause violence that day were Antifa and other infiltrators inserted into the crowd to incite and inflame the situation.

Bulls@it.

At least own what you did instead of trying to blame Antifa.

I personally witnessed 5 Antifa disrupting police trafic trying to get down to the capitol via Constitution Avenue. The police escorted 4 busloads if Antifa into the area the very evening prior to the rally and there were FBI and other government agitators infiltrated into the crowd. It was a setup and Nancy Pelosi was the instigator of it all. The vast majority of the more than 1,265 defendants never even entered the building and caused any damage but they were arrested and jailed for unrealistic sentences just because they were there.

Well, your anecdotes aside, if i break into a federal building peacefully it matters little.

And if the vast majority did nothing wrong then they have nothing to fear.

As to the sentences, can't do the time, dont do the crime, especially where your prison system is concerned.

I was lucky enough to stay far enough away to not be subjected to their wrath. Others that did foolishly venture onto the capitol steps are not so lucky. Some have even been in jail to this day without trial. 3 and a half years later. The right to a speedy trial is written into our constitution, but that's nothing more that a piece of butt-wipe for these crooked SOB Democratic politicians over here.

So don't try to feed me that tripe. I know better.

Better MAGA Qanonacrap methinks.

It's a creeping manifestation. One day you will wake up with your rights drastically diminished, one law or declaration at a time before you even realize it, and by then it will be too late to do anything about it. Frog in a boiling pot.

So don't try to feed me that tripe. I know better.

No, you dont, else you would not be coming away with such lies and nonsense.

Government control might be a problem, and they may indeed slowly be trying to erode away or change certain rights, but it not like the way you are making it out to be.

Nobody is coming to get you or force you to be anything you do not want to be unless you have done something wrong.

Even now, you are only free because your government allows you to be.

Freedom and security are illusory notions at best charlest2, and thats just a fact of the matter, you are only as free as the law of the land allows.

Which is good for you, because i dont think you could handle the anarchy and survival of the fittest, any more than the majority of the rest of us.

For the most part, you are free to do and say as you please, same as myself in my own nation, as long as we follow the law of the land and keep the head.

You should be happy to reside where you do charlest2.

Because there are far worse-off places to exist around the globe.

And by comparison, we have it relatively bloody easy in both our respective nations.

Plain to see if you travel out with your own country.

a reply to: charlest2

"Even now, you are only free because your government allows you to be."

Well, yes?

What's this got to do with this thread?

originally posted by: charlest2
a reply to: Freeborn

No he isn't. You know better than that but you just will not admit it. He had no intention of going into Ukraine until NATO threatened Russian sovereignty by trying to push NATO capabilities right up into their front door. NATO was formed to be a purely defensive organization but eventually evolved into a purely aggressive organization bent on surrounding Russia with military encirclement. Putin's actions are wholly defensive and you know it.

It is up to individual countries to voluntarily apply for NATO membership.

That is their choice and if you or Putin don't like it, tough.

Thanks to his invasion, he now has Finland and a Sweden in NATO.

So, after agreeing to respect Ukraine's sovereignty and not to attack it, he reneges on that and invades

And denied that Ukraine has a right to exist as a sovereign country.

"Wholly defensive"? No. Was there ever any threat of Ukraine invading Russia? They gave up their nukes.

Ukraine is an attempted land grab, pure and simple.

Putin started it and he can end it.

He won't because he would be humiliated so this war grinds on with thousands and thousands dead and injured on both sides.

That's down to his greed and lust for power.