A Texas judge grants a pregnant woman permission to get an abortion despite the state’s ban

originally posted by: navigator70

originally posted by: Dandandat3

originally posted by: navigator70
For all the people that virtue signal all the problems that can arise when a child is born into a less than ideal situation, Im still waiting for an abortion survivor and parent that wishes the abortion was successful. Until then youre point is mute.

Why are you insisting on testimony from an abortion survivor who grow up in less than ideal situations to tell you the benefits that would have resulted if he didn't survive his abortion?

The benefits of abortion are felt by society as a whole; not necessarily to the fetus itself.

Less awanted children puts downward pressure on social programs and less competition for those who were not aborted.

Abortion is a social tool for the benefit of society as a whole.

Thats a logical fallacy. The decision is made by the mother, not society. You also assume all abortion survivors become dependent on society and not productive members of society.

I don't think you understand what a logical fallacy is. But to answer the points you have raised.

1) My statement doesn't require that ALL unwanted children become a burden on society. I did not say "NO awanted children puts downward...."; I used the qualifier "Less" ... some awanted children do become a burden to society and abortion guarantees that less awanted children become a burden to society.

2) Sure a morher may decide what and what is not aborted. Just as a judge may decide who and who does not go to prison. Both are acting as members/agents of society; using tools to try and better society. Just because I am not deciding who goes to prison doesn't mean I am not benefited by a criminal going to prison. So to, I may not decided which fetus gets aborted doesn't mean I am not benefiting from the abortion.

Texas has gone too far in my view.

originally posted by: Dandandat3

originally posted by: navigator70

originally posted by: Dandandat3

originally posted by: navigator70
For all the people that virtue signal all the problems that can arise when a child is born into a less than ideal situation, Im still waiting for an abortion survivor and parent that wishes the abortion was successful. Until then youre point is mute.

Why are you insisting on testimony from an abortion survivor who grow up in less than ideal situations to tell you the benefits that would have resulted if he didn't survive his abortion?

The benefits of abortion are felt by society as a whole; not necessarily to the fetus itself.

Less awanted children puts downward pressure on social programs and less competition for those who were not aborted.

Abortion is a social tool for the benefit of society as a whole.

Thats a logical fallacy. The decision is made by the mother, not society. You also assume all abortion survivors become dependent on society and not productive members of society.

I don't think you understand what a logical fallacy is. But to answer the points you have raised.

1) My statement doesn't require that ALL unwanted children become a burden on society. I did not say "NO awanted children puts downward...."; I used the qualifier "Less" ... some awanted children do become a burden to society and abortion guarantees that less awanted children become a burden to society.

2) Sure a morher may decide what and what is not aborted. Just as a judge may decide who and who does not go to prison. Both are acting as members/agents of society; using tools to try and better society. Just because I am not deciding who goes to prison doesn't mean I am not benefited by a criminal going to prison. So to, I may not decided which fetus gets aborted doesn't mean I am not benefiting from the abortion.

It is a logical fallacy from the context that abortion survivors never regret being successfully aborted when you try to conflate your exaggeration of the benefits of abortion on society. Society doesnt make the choice. Further, those 'benefits' are based on a limited perspective that hasnt experienced or witnessed the positive outcomes of abortion survivors and their parents. Stories that are rarely ever told.

Also, the attempt to blame the ills of society on the prevention of abortion completely ignores the growing mindset of victimhood that is so pervasive in society today.

originally posted by: Rosby123

originally posted by: Vforvendeta
a reply to: Rosby123

Yes. We must force women to further support the medical, funeral and grief industries and label them monsters if they do not.
BTW do you have children?

Yes I have children and I don't think a woman should go through a pregnancy where the baby will die anyway either before it is born or after.

It's the only logical position.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha

That sounds like a serious number! Maybe 900,000 men could start taking birth control, you know, to share the responsibility!

It is an issue on both sides, but one would think women would be more serious about it since it is their body.

Let's say 33% of the population are women of child bearing age. about 111 million women. 111 million times 12 months = 1 billion 332 hundred million, 1,332,000,000 times that birth control did work! (Minus your 900,000, of course)

That sounds like pretty good odds to me!

If we say 15 to low 40s in age we are talking about 50 to 60 million, not 111 million, but who is counting...

Then we look at who is having sex and about 80% married are, but from 18 to 49 only about 20% singles are, and after age 30 that drops off to 10%. 50% of women are married, so if we just used 60 million. 26 million are married women having sex, but only like 10 million of unmarried women are having sex. That is a total of 36 million, and I bet a good number of abortions is in a smaller demographic of women in their 20 unmarried. That would greatly reduce the 36 million, but I'm not going to figure it out for you.

It's about 15 per 1000 women aged 15 to 45, but how many out of that 1000 have sex? So if we say 131 million women only 30% are getting laid and so that 15 out of 1000 is really 15 out of 300 active.

Birth control is like 99.6% successful and 5% of sexually active women are getting abortions... I think the worst part is the STDs going around, so rubbers are a key too.

But something isn't working very well in 2023.

originally posted by: Annee

What I say is: "If it's not your business, it's not your business".

It just infuriates me that this is still an issue that others think is their business.

OK then keep men out of it entirely. So you have the kid don't come knocking at the guy's door for support since you want them to have zero say.

originally posted by: Degradation33

Of 15-19 year old pregnancies, 29% of them end in legal abortion.. Age 14 and younger, it doubles over 50%.

There's a huge "throw your life away" element to why pregnant women in younger age groups choose to abort. And many times, it's their parental influence that persuades the decision.

Like one of my mother's most memorable quotes when abortion was relevant.

"I will break your arm before I let you throw your life away, I don't do grandchildren."

She got her wish. Never had to be a grandparent.

When we look at percentages of all abortions per age group 15 and under is .2%, 16 to 19 is 8%, 20 to 29 is 60%, 40+ is 3.7%.

So maybe high percentage of abortions in teens, but overall account for a very small percentage of the total.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Annee

What I say is: "If it's not your business, it's not your business".

It just infuriates me that this is still an issue that others think is their business.

OK then keep men out of it entirely. So you have the kid don't come knocking at the guy's door for support since you want them to have zero say.

It takes 2.

How surprising a man thinks about himself.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Birth control is like 99.6% successful

LOL more serious numbers from you!

That depends on what kind of birth control you're talking about. The rhythm methods and pulling out methods certainly aren't 99.6%, which is an erroneous number for any kind of birth control, except maybe the IUD, that can easily lead to infertility if used for too long.

Hormonal injections are 96% effective and oral hormonal birth control is only 93% effective. 93% means 7 of every 100 women on The Pill will unexpectantly get pregnant every month, or a woman can expect her birth control to fail 7 out of 100 times. An unwanted pregnancy once every 10 years per woman on The Pill.

Serious numbers.

a reply to: Sookiechacha

Here is some serious numbers for you;

100 out of 100 women who don't have sex, don't get pregnant.

originally posted by: Annee

It takes 2.

How surprising a man thinks about himself.

It takes 2 for what? Old Sookie said men should stay out of it, so I said OK, then all of it too.

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: Sookiechacha

Here is some serious numbers for you;

100 out of 100 women who don't have sex, don't get pregnant.

100 out of 100 men who don't have sex, don't get a woman pregnant.

And men can have sex with multiple women in a single day.

a reply to: Annee

And the women choose to let that man sleep with them🤷‍♂️

I'm just saying, if a woman does not want to get pregnant, don't have sex. Easy as that. Just the same as if a man does not want the possibility of being a dad, they need not have sex either.

We are all grown ups, we know how babies happen, yet we want to act surprised when it does. Either grow up and accept accountability for your actions or don't do them in the first place.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Annee

It takes 2.

How surprising a man thinks about himself.

It takes 2 for what? Old Sookie said men should stay out of it, so I said OK, then all of it too.

For eons women have been blamed for everything including the sex if the baby.

Women are told it’s their fault. And their fault for choosing the wrong man if he takes off.

It takes 2. If the woman considers you at all — it’s her choice.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
93% means 7 of every 100 women on The Pill will unexpectantly get pregnant every month, or a woman can expect her birth control to fail 7 out of 100 times. An unwanted pregnancy once every 10 years per woman on The Pill.

Serious numbers.

You just pull what you want right off the top of the page and spin as you see fit...lol Thank You planned Parenthood...
The pill is 99%+, the 93% comes from misuse. This also is fuzzy math to suggest that 7% is 7 out of 100 will get pregnant with misuse since even if you have sex on the one perfect day you have at best 20% chance. So it isn't automatic since you have a 1 in 30 to be unlucky on the right day and then only a 20% chance if it does fall on that day.

Of course, it’s not always super-easy for many women to get pregnant, even if they time it correctly. “When you ovulate, the egg is only good for 24 hours each,” Whelihan says. “Even if you have [unprotected] sex on the right day of the month, there’s still only a 20 percent chance of conceiving [from that session].”

Back to my point, a lot of women are not using protection...

a reply to: Xtrozero

I made a terrible example. I also went to a high-school where girls were glamazon debutantes or doing heroin in the bathroom as a weight loss drug.

19.7 per 1000 women age 20-24.
19.4 per 1000 age 25-29

So it's really the 22 year old that has their (91% effective) ortho tri cyclen fail the beginning of their last semester.

All I wanted to say it's almost always that preventative, and often comprehensive preventative measures were taken, and it still ends in a totally accidental pregnancy.

And the "throw your life away" continues well into the 20's. "Not ready" is probably closer. Maybe they are not ready to stop having fun, and do not consider something 1st trimester independent life? And they drew the 9/100 straw of ineffective birth control?

That was the attempted point.

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: Annee

And the women choose to let that man sleep with them🤷‍♂️

I'm just saying, if a woman does not want to get pregnant, don't have sex. Easy as that. Just the same as if a man does not want the possibility of being a dad, they need not have sex either.

Reason for abortion.

No one else’s business.

originally posted by: Annee

It takes 2. If the woman considers you at all — it’s her choice.

So then you are suggesting a man should have a say in it all. That isn't what Sookie says.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: Annee

And the women choose to let that man sleep with them🤷‍♂️

I'm just saying, if a woman does not want to get pregnant, don't have sex. Easy as that. Just the same as if a man does not want the possibility of being a dad, they need not have sex either.

No one else’s business.

Except the fathers, but you don't care what men have to say on the matter, even when it is their business if it's their baby, so why should I bother bringing it up....

originally posted by: Degradation33

All I wanted to say it's almost always that preventative, and often comprehensive preventative measures were taken, and it still ends in a totally accidental pregnancy.

And the "throw your life away" continues well into the 20's. Maybe they are just not ready to stop having fun, and do not consider something 1st trimester independent life? And they drew the 9/100 straw of ineffective birth control?

That was the attempted point.

You bring up a good point with your high school example. We have been using overall numbers but we can deep dive some more.

Black women are 3x more likely to have abortions and over 70% of babies are born to single moms. This tells me there is a whole lot of unprotected sex going on. No comprehensive anything...

Another one is the huge percentage of STDs. Chlamydia is 500 per 100k and Gonorrhea is about 220 per 100k. Looking at this chart below it tells us what age groups are not doing much of anything. Interestingly, the number of women is almost double, and they can say.... No rubber, no sex....
And if they can't get the rubber part right I don't think they get other things more complicated like birth control right.