It's About To Go Down...

a reply to: v1rtu0s0

I don't hold with Bush's antics neither v1rtu0s0, or Tony Blair's for that matter nor any of the two Gulf wars over imaginary WMD.

Still no excuse or justification for Putin's antics in Ukraine.

Neither does it mean he should be allowed to continue or threaten the world with the use of nukes.

originally posted by: Vroomfondel

originally posted by: WanderingMrM

originally posted by: Vroomfondel

originally posted by: MidnightWatcher

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
I scanned through this thread and made a few observations.

The US is largely responsible for the war between Ukraine and Russia. It was the biden administration, through the consulate in Ukraine, that urged Ukraine to shut down the opposition party tv stations and seize the assets of Viktor Medvedchuk, leader of the opposition party. Assets that included a pipeline that carried Russian oil to Europe. Within 2 weeks of that event Russia started massing troops on the Ukraine border. That was not Feb of this year, it was Feb of last year. Russia waited a full year before actually crossing the Ukraine border. I suspect that Urkaine acted under the assumption that the US would step in if Russia retaliated. Instead biden did nothing while Ukraine took it full in the face. Then biden started sending "help".

A seal team could easily get in, bomb the pipelines, and get back out safely. That is not beyond the realm of possibility. If destabilization is the goal, that would be a means to an end.

As for world war, I think it would be wise to understand the difference between global conflict and world war. There could be isolated conflicts all over the world without a world war being declared. I can see quite a few smaller conflicts in the coming years but a world war, that is some serious stuff. I have to be realistic and say it could happen. But I think, at least for now, that is too big - too soon. There is no upside to world war. Not any more.

Medvedchuk was added to a terror sponsor list by the UN, not the US or Ukraine.

Most of the rest of your claims happened as a result of russia's invasion.

Meaning they could not have been the 'cause'.

That is absolutely incorrect.

Medvedechuk being added to a terror sponsor list is akin to US parents being labeled domestic terrorists for wanting to protect their 5 year olds from pornography in the classroom.

Also, everything I mentioned happened in Feb of 2021 except for the part about biden sending help. Russia sat at the Ukraine border for a full year waiting for diplomatic solution to the problem. None was offered. Only after a full year of waiting did Russia actually invade Ukraine. This is not opinion, it is historical fact.

Russia actually offered Diplomatic solutions to NATO, E.U and America but they laughed and basically spat in Russia's face while wiping their asses with the proposed solutions and agreements.

Yet now everyone is like "Why you invade poor innocent Ukraine? Why you be like that Russia?".

That is exactly it. Russia offered diplomatic solutions but none were offered in return. He gave diplomacy a full year before actually crossing the Ukraine border. I am not a huge fan of Russia or Putin, but I am a big fan of historical truth.

.


putin's offer wasn't an offer, it was a series of absurd demands.

Give me half your country and I won't invade and steal it all.

Of course the world laughed.

a reply to: WanderingMrM


"NATO and the U.S did push it to this point"


NATO and the US invaded a European country to steal it's land and resources?



Been watching too much russian teevee again?

originally posted by: MidnightWatcher
a reply to: nickyw


"maybe the west only relearns that stuff through conflict. out of the fire kind of thing"



Did 'the west' invade a European country and make repeated nuke threats upon learning it's military was completely inept?

Yes?!?

originally posted by: MidnightWatcher
a reply to: nickyw


"maybe the west only relearns that stuff through conflict. out of the fire kind of thing"



Did 'the west' invade a European country and make repeated nuke threats upon learning it's military was completely inept?

Yes?!?

originally posted by: Dalamax

originally posted by: MidnightWatcher
a reply to: nickyw


"maybe the west only relearns that stuff through conflict. out of the fire kind of thing"



Did 'the west' invade a European country and make repeated nuke threats upon learning it's military was completely inept?

Yes?!?

Is this opposite day again?


Nobody told me.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

There is always a skirmish or two running somewhere. But nothing that would qualify as global conflict.

Generally, proxy conflicts fought on behalf of the superpowers one way or another.

As for Putin, he isn't as crazy as some would like to believe. It is politically expedient to portray him that way, which is exactly what the the dutiful media have done.

He's still backed into a corner of his own making, getting more paranoid as the days grow longer, and losing support by the minute, whilst wanting to save face and screaming that he's not bluffing.

Which is not the safest most stable state of mind to be in far as i can establish.

If Putin was a hostage situation Police would have shot him by now.

However, this isn't li'l kimmy screaming about blowing up the world if Dennis Rodman doesn't bring him some Frito's and a Dr. Pepper.

It's a fecking hell of a predicament to be in and shows the fact that we have learned nothing from history, so there is that.

fwiw

www.politico.com...

The U.S. Embassy in Moscow is urging American citizens residing in Russia to leave immediately amid Vladimir Putin’s escalation of the war in Ukraine.

“U.S. citizens should not travel to Russia and those residing or traveling in Russia should depart Russia immediately while limited commercial travel options remain,” the embassy said in a security alert issued Tuesday.

don't see how anything is different than the last few months
aside from the mobilization?

something else we don't know about?

originally posted by: ElGoobero

something else we don't know about?

Someone blew up a pipeline yesterday.

The US Navy almost certainly knows whodunnit, and the Whitehouse knows they can't keep a lid on it for long.

Hopefully it doesn't mean the idiot is about to take action against whodunnit, but this is what State would say if that was being contemplated.

a reply to: ElGoobero

Has Russia recalled all of its diplomats in the West yet.?? I heard that a lot of ancillary staff and family were leaving embassies as fast as they could to go home. But when the Ambassadors are recalled you will know it isgetting hot.

a reply to: bastion

Belgium has lots of great beers. They even export a few to the US. It just happened to be that Anheuser-Busch InBev SA/NV is a Belgium company. In addition to Budweiser they have Miller too. And as plain as Bud is, that it consistently tastes the same batch after batch after batch at a multitude of breweries is a credit to the brew masters.

Regardless, that is a whole heaping pile of money lost if people are unable to afford it due to economic collapse, which is the point. Or does Belgium not like the taxes that InBev provides?

originally posted by: anonentity
a reply to: ElGoobero

Has Russia recalled all of its diplomats in the West yet.?? I heard that a lot of ancillary staff and family were leaving embassies as fast as they could to go home. But when the Ambassadors are recalled you will know it isgetting hot.

At least on the US side, it hasn't reached that point yet.

The civilian warnings come first.




I have no idea what the crazy russians are doing, but I haven't heard of a recall yet.

where do you want us to go lol?

i have auto-immmmune dizease.

so i got nothing to lose.

if things go down, well then, pr0pagangists and l0bbbyists, think they are the bottom feeder skum who propelled this.

'nothing to lose' lol

Wouldn’t you send your useless eaters to slaughter if it didn’t have a appreciable effect on your realm?

a reply to: Freeborn

You are having some serious wet dreams, I can almost garantee you no one is going down without a fight, when # hits the fan, we all go in and out, no one will be left out.

a reply to: Dalamax

Wouldn’t you send your useless eaters to slaughter if it didn’t have a appreciable effect on your realm?

Personally, no I wouldn't....but we aren't talking about me are we.

So, all those 58,000 Russians who have died so far meant nothing to Putin?
All part of some great, elaborate ruse?

And this is the sort of guy people have spent months trying to defend.
Who have believed every one of his lies.

Sounds like a real nice guy doesn't he, someone really worth dying for.
Someone worth defending and selling your soul for.

Sorry, all sounds a load of absolute bollocks to me.

Some of my thoughts on items and thiings related to this thread

Um,Putin stopped the flow through NS1 not Biden. All Joe did was stop the finish of 2. now he went and blew up 2 pipelines filled with a ton of natgas. You know what is in natGas? Methane. So much for being worried about global warming and the fishing in the area.
So the sonar in the area went down in April and they didn't fix it and now this. In Joe's own words,"Come on Man."
NS2 was 90% completed. Remember Trump stopped it,Joe let it start back up till Ukraine. NS 1 was not fully shut down till Aug, read that Aug. Why would the Russians destroy them.
not only destroy them but a day before a competing pipeline goes online? If the USA didn't blow the Nordstreams then they used a proxies and my money is on Poland. Poland and Russia hate each other almost as much as the Poles hate the Germans.
This is going to push a full on war in Europe fast. There are two was to end it now and both are very very unlikely for different reasons. 1 Putin has to be removed. 2 USA has to start producing more.
We saw how much of a bunch of idiots the left is by what they did with Manchin yesterday,they do not understand the way to compromise. So we now have a govt shutdown coming fast.
So you are going to tell me the Russians pulled off this extremely complicated sophisticated operation like this when there is a # load of NATO naval assets in the immediate area conducting exercises? Yet these same Russians could not keep the Ukes from sinking their flagship in port? Or could not pull off a simple hit against the Ukranian leader with what appeared to be around 50 guys? Or take over an airfield on the opening day of the war with tactical surprise getting 100% of the initial airlift KIA? and now over 6 months into the conflict they manage to pull off this operation ?Who the # you trying to kid?

Right now all indicators point to someone else besides 2 nations doing this Russia and Germany.Everyone else had motive. Means is where the list narrows. Even with the seabed being as shallow as reported still to get two near simultaneous explosions, nah Russians cant get stuff that tight. There was a SOP USN vessel within 30km of the site .
As forsaying convicts and the dregs are a sign of Russian desperation , it is Russian SOP throughout history to do stuff like that and those troops used to fight hard.
This is from The Military balance 2022 listing for Russia,notice anything missing?
MBT
2,927: 650 T-72B/BA; 850 T-72B3; 530 T-72B3M; 310 T-80BV/U; 170 T-80BVM; 350 T-90A; 67 T-90M; (10,200 in store: 7,000 T-72/T-72A/B; 3,000 T-80B/BV/U;

200 T-90). Seems like a lot of what they are using in Ukraine the crappy MBT is not even in the count.
Guess what another 1.1 billion to Ukraine today. Yet our inflation is above 8% unemployment is starting to creep back up,store shelves are starting to get thin again. Gas going back up again. This is not just random # happening. It never is. I am not on Russia side and I am in no way on Bidens side. I am on humanities side. The left had its try, it failed miserably. The right had its chance and you know what it was not totally pretty but it worked.I am not talking Nationalism but the right as done by the Eisenhower and Regan admin.

a reply to: captnchuck

I thought they averted the gov shutdown yesterday? I’m not seeing anything about any no votes yet. Unless they are hiding that info.

a reply to: captnchuck


"Um,Putin stopped the flow through NS1 not Biden. All Joe did was stop the finish of 2. "


Europe stopped NS1 by ceasing to purchase russian gas.

Then just to make sure, Germany removed critical pipeline components for 'maintenance' and sent them to Canada, where they apparently got lost.

joe didn't stop NS2, it was completed around the time he took office.

He did speak out about not using NS2, but it wasn't about finishing the physical pipeline.

a reply to: Freeborn

The meant nothing to Putin part i don't doubt.

Those 58,000 poor Russians were simply meat for the grinder to him.

And he's apt to care even less because they failed to achieve their objectives.

Plenty more where that came from in his eyes.

He doesn't care who dies as long as it advances his cause.

He surrounds himself with yes men and sycophants.

Who are obviously too timid, afraid, or fearful of losing favor or position that they do nothing but whisper sweet nothings in his ear and tell him just what he wants to hear.