Russia Ukraine Update Thread - part 2

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

originally posted by: MidnightWatcher

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

originally posted by: WeDemBoyz
a reply to: Soloprotocol

Really bad comparison. Those russians aren't fleeing an invading army, rather, they are fleeing responsibility.

They can't win, can they?. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

They are human beings avoiding conflict and persecution just like the fleeing Ukrainians, Syrians, Iraqis, Kurds, Afghanis, Eritreans, etc etc

Would you rather they stayed and got shoveled into the meat grinder or worse 10 years in a gulag?

We'd rather they convinced their government to end it's land grabbing invasion of Ukraine.

But I for one and very happy that many of russia's neighbors are giving the russian escapees safe harbor outside of russia.



Elections have consequences, especially when electing a land grabbing madman for 20 years.

Most of those fleeing are late teens or early 20's I hardly doubt they've voted for Putin. I hardly doubt anyone in Russia has voted for Putin. He doesn't seem the type to play by the rules of democracy.

Since when are the consequences of poor election choices limited to affecting only those that voted?

Or voted for a particular side?

ruZZia really has a pathological phobia against the gays doesnt it, a poof under every bed, a lesbo around every dark corner waiting to get you. Id say there is some projection going on but thats a given when it comes to ruZZia, they'll die to make the point of 'no homo' i guess.

We worship Satan here in the West? news to me... no one i know has ever been to a pride parade, or been forced to go to one. But hey gotta lie to ruZZian, we've learned that much... the brainwashing is impressive to be honest if it wasnt so scary.

It is funny that their rhetoric is so closely matched to the American far right of late (granted any far right anywhere is basically in the same ideological basket).



No real need to even give an opinion on this one really... sooner this guy is hanging from a tree with 100 bullet holes in him the better for the world in general. Thankfully from what ive read he's not in any real sort of position in the DPR, but still he's an indication as to the more extreme ends of the DPR separatist mindset even if they try to distance themselves from people like him.

And ive said it many times before... but all those on ATS that are pro putler and ruZZia... THESE are the people you are backing and saying are the good guys.

a reply to: MidnightWatcher

So you feel like you should be responsible if some extreme party took power in America with a 51% majority? Like if a communist party won all the elections and decided to join Russia or China would you feel like you should be responsible to stay in the country and fight against the “consequences” of the election?

For most people (without connections, money, power) in a democracy, if you are in the minority, you can either rebel (which is not democratic at all) or leave. The west and NATO countries should be thrilled with all the Russians leaving Russian to avoid going to an unjust war.

originally posted by: SgtEsquire
a reply to: MidnightWatcher

So you feel like you should be responsible if some extreme party took power in America with a 51% majority? Like if a communist party won all the elections and decided to join Russia or China would you feel like you should be responsible to stay in the country and fight against the “consequences” of the election?

For most people (without connections, money, power) in a democracy, if you are in the minority, you can either rebel (which is not democratic at all) or leave. The west and NATO countries should be thrilled with all the Russians leaving Russian to avoid going to an unjust war.

I didn't say 'should be responsible'.

I said poor election choices affect everyone, regardless of whether or how they voted.



We are all currently paying the price for those 81 million ballots, for example.

a reply to: MidnightWatcher

Yes of course electing bad politicians have negative impacts on people. However, your comments seemed to suggest that all Russians are responsible for Putin being elected or his choices. Those Russians fleeing Russia are being very democratic by voting with their feet.

Actually I just reread your posts. I’m way off with my assumptions. I’m leaving my above comment for some clarity with anyone else reading the thread.

originally posted by: SgtEsquire
a reply to: MidnightWatcher

Yes of course electing bad politicians have negative impacts on people. However, your comments seemed to suggest that all Russians are responsible for Putin being elected or his choices. Those Russians fleeing Russia are being very democratic by voting with their feet.

Actually I just reread your posts. I’m way off with my assumptions. I’m leaving my above comment for some clarity with anyone else reading the thread.

originally posted by: BigfootNZ




And ive said it many times before... but all those on ATS that are pro putler and ruZZia... THESE are the people you are backing and saying are the good guys.

That`s also my thought , it`s conserning how ATS has started to be place where more and more voices support openly land grabbing, invasion, violence, terrorism, war etc etc.....when it`s done by Russia / Putler.

The litle man Putin has really got inside to many heads here in ATS

It`s obvious that people should be able to condemn Russian war/terrorism if they also comdemned USA wars/actions in Iraq for example, but they do not. This is the double standart. And then they whine how Russia is doing just the same as what USA has done in the past when they are trying to justify Russian actions taking conversation to Iraq war etc.

So basically, they hate or claim be opposing what all wrong / violence USA did earlyer, BUT NOW ARE GIVING FULL APPROVAL WHAT RUSSIA IS DOING, plus hating the president of Ukraine and telling lies about him.


USA wars = super bad and evil
Russia wars = Oh, finally justice is coming....hail violence, hail wars, hail land grapping....they get orgasm what Russia is doing.


Many people have really lost it big time common sense , and humanity .

11 October Update

Key Takeaways

* Russian forces conducted massive missile strikes across Ukraine for the second day in a row.

* Army General Sergey Surovikin’s previous experience as commander of Russian Armed Forces in Syria is likely unrelated to the massive wave of missile strikes across Ukraine over the past few days, nor does it signal a change in the trajectory of Russian capabilities or strategy in Ukraine.

* The Russian Federation is likely extracting ammunition and other materiel from Belarusian storage bases, which is incompatible with the notion that Russian forces are setting conditions for a ground attack against Ukraine from Belarus.

* Russian sources claimed that Ukrainian forces continued to conduct counteroffensives east of the Oskil River and in the direction of Kreminna-Svatove.

* Russian sources claimed that Ukrainian troops continued ground attacks in northern and western Kherson Oblast.

* Ukrainian forces are continuing an interdiction campaign to target Russian military, technical, and logistics assets and concentration areas in Kherson Oblast.

* Russian forces continued to conduct ground assaults in Donetsk Oblast.

* Russian reporting of explosions in Dzhankoy, Crimea, indicated panic over losing further logistics capabilities in Crimea following the Kerch Strait Bridge explosion.

* Russian federal subjects are announcing new extensions and phases of mobilization in select regions, which may indicate that they have not met their mobilization quotas.

* Russian and occupation administration officials continue to conduct filtration activities in Russian-occupied territories.

* The GUR reported that Belarusian officials plan to send an additional 13 trains with weapons, equipment, ammunition, and other unspecified materiel from five different Belarusian bases to the Kamenska (Kamensk-Shakhtinsky) and Marchevo (Taganrog) railway stations in Rostov Oblast on an unspecified future date. Open-source social media footage supports this report.

More at URL above.

So much for the deployment of Russian troops to Belarus. Sounds like equipment and ammo is being pulled OUT of Belarus to shore up the Russian defense by Kherson.

Cheers

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2


Lukashenko giving away weapons, that Ukrainains can then destroy ...more scrap metal

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

The Russian Federation is likely extracting ammunition and other materiel from Belarusian storage bases, which is incompatible with the notion that Russian forces are setting conditions for a ground attack against Ukraine from Belarus.

The "War in Ukraine" (slightly russian leaning) Youtube channel reported (without evidence) that
russia gave belarus a 1.85b 'loan' (that doesn't need to be repaid) in exchange for belarusian missiles and other ammo a couple days ago, right before russia's nationwide missile terror attacks started.

While no evidence was provided, this guy has had a good deal of historical accuracy during the war.

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

Russian and occupation administration officials continue to conduct filtration activities in Russian-occupied territories.

Are 'filtration camps' what I think they are?

a reply to: Kenzo

You are wrong. What you are missing out is that this conflict in Ukraine involves the exact same monsters that have destroyed the Middle East.
Putin is at least dealing with security concerns on Russia's border. He has been citing those concerns for a long time to deaf ears. Well maybe not to deaf ears but to an American MIC that caused all this in the first place.
Land grabbing by proxy is the American way. Install a puppet government and control resources. Ukraine is a step too far for Russia and like it or not it's understandable.
It's time someone put a stop to the West's insatiable lust for war, threat of war and all the goodies garnered from that. Of course Russia can't do that but it can protect its own borders.
That's the difference.
I don't see any of those countries destroyed by the US sitting on its border.
I am no fan of Russia or Putin but I'll call out the sickness that is the USA and the West's foreign policy.

a reply to: MidnightWatcher

Yahoo, for whatever it is worth, defines the term:

New details have emerged of how Russian soldiers have forcibly removed tens of thousands of Ukrainians from occupied areas and sent them to “filtration camps” for hours of intense interrogation before shipping them off to various cities around Russia,

Sizing up who will be problems for the occupiers and shipping them out. Like they did in the Baltic states and Poland in 1939-40. Wonder if there will be repeats of the massacres that followed those deportations.

It is their way of destroying the local intelligentsia so that there is no meaningful leadership left for those who have the urge to resist the occupation.

Cheers

originally posted by: F2d5thCavv2
a reply to: MidnightWatcher

Yahoo, for whatever it is worth, defines the term:

New details have emerged of how Russian soldiers have forcibly removed tens of thousands of Ukrainians from occupied areas and sent them to “filtration camps” for hours of intense interrogation before shipping them off to various cities around Russia,

Sizing up who will be problems for the occupiers and shipping them out. Like they did in the Baltic states and Poland in 1939-40. Wonder if there will be repeats of the massacres that followed those deportations.

It is their way of destroying the local intelligentsia so that there is no meaningful leadership left for those who have the urge to resist the occupation.

Cheers

That's what I thought it was.

Making any referendums there even more absurd.

a reply to: midicon

It's time someone put a stop to the West's insatiable lust for war, threat of war

Did the 'west' invade Ukraine?

Did the 'west' take the opportunity to join russia's war in Ukraine?

Did the 'west' make any threats to join russia's war in Ukraine?

Even when russia repeatedly claims that they are already at war with the 'west'?




Then how does anything you posted make any sense at all?

Only russia went on a land grabbing invasion in Ukraine, and they did it twice in 8 years.

a reply to: MidnightWatcher

Not to mention that invading a neighboring country is not at all the same thing as "protecting one's borders".

Cheers

a reply to: MidnightWatcher

Yeah, don't mind the date. The year is 1940.

Cheers

a reply to: midicon




You are just repeating Kremlin propaganda/disinformation .

a reply to: Kenzo

I haven't listened to any propaganda. I'm an objective observer, nothing more. Silly posts like yours are just that.