Breaking BAASS, Assessing AATIP and Doubting Thomas ‘DeLonge’

a reply to: mirageman
I think you should confront your enemy, Elizondo, I am convinced that you would change your mind about everything

a reply to: mirageman

Is that a picture of Phill Class? It doesn't look like Casey.

a reply to: peaceinoutz

A Different Klass?



Hmmm....

originally posted by: gippo888
a reply to: mirageman
I think you should confront your enemy, Elizondo, I am convinced that you would change your mind about everything

He wouldn't be able to tell me anything because of his NDA.

originally posted by: mirageman
He wouldn't be able to tell me anything because of his NDA.

I think a chat between friends with a beer ...
Beer solves many things, brings people together

originally posted by: gippo888
a reply to: Arbitrageur
Sorry, I know your opinions very well and they don't convince me
I was superficial because I do not wish to return to the Phoenix case ... I have already given
Sorry, I can't to have a too detailed discussion in english ...

This isn't the right place to go into detail on the Phoenix lights case anyway. However, it does have something in common with the TTSA promoted Tic-tac video which is on topic here, and that is in both cases there are videos which factually refute some eyewitness testimony and that's not an opinion, that's a fact. In the Phoenix lights case, not all eyewitness testimony is refuted by the video, so some people had more accurate perceptions than others.

When I listened to the discussion of the work by the UAP task force on television, I noticed the defense department officials were cognizant of this issue because they didn't want to come out and say that they didn't trust their military personnel as witnesses, but they did emphasize that they needed more than word of mouth, they needed video or other data not subject to all the different ways humans can misinterpret things. So that was somewhat encouraging to hear, but I doubt Fravor ever got any disciplinary action for his failure to flick the switch on his helmet to turn on his camera, and all we have from him is his story. Maybe in the future pilots will be told to turn on their cameras when they encounter UFOs, so at least there will be some video to back up the story. Whether we in the public ever get to see that video is another issue.

originally posted by: mirageman
I see the Art of Deception worked even on you Arby!!!

Can you see what it is yet?

Aparently it did, LOL. I don't even remember where I got that version, is this one better?

In surveying the ufo scene, we have to admit that TTSA did cause a heightened interest in UFOs and influenced the political mainstream to get concerned.

Whatever their motivation was, for better or worse, that seems to be the case.

a reply to: peaceinoutz

Ultimately, though, it appears the whole thing was entirely focused on the United States. Aviation authorities and military operators in other nations are not reporting UFOs or UAPs as a problem out there in the 96% of the world's airspace.

A lot of newbies seemed to think that some kind of breakthrough had been made. Which I suppose was understandable. But many are drifting away from the topic after 5 years of noise, grift and spin. With no ultimate progress.

Oher than entertainment, what did it really achieve?

Who really benefitted from it?

a reply to: mirageman

A lot of newbies seemed to think that some kind of breakthrough had been made. Which I suppose was understandable. But many are drifting away from the topic after 5 years of noise, grift and spin. With no ultimate progress.

I agree, and that’s one of my pet theories about why they did this.

Don't think I was giving them any praise or credit. All it proves, at least to me, is the mini-psyop status of TTSA. Any amateur psychologist aware of the mass media in America could have predicted their success in Jinning up interest when they already had an industry of ufo minor hysteria.

The fact is they used all their vaunted technology to look at UFOs since, what--- Project Sign, then all the others and found nada, so why not let the podcast warriors and Don Quixote scientists fail as well, and then ufology will die a slow death or maintain its small fry status as a quirky entertainment and dreamland occupation.

A refresher…..

Direct Link

The Project SIGN documents.

👽

Duplicate Post…Ooops
👽

originally posted by: Ophiuchus1
A refresher…..

Direct Link

The Project SIGN documents.

👽

Thanks for that

a reply to: mirageman and peaceinoutz

There is another possibility ...
Maybe you were wrong about the TTSA, Elizondo, Delonge ...
Perhaps their attempt was genuine and they just wanted a little truth
Your aggression has only harmed the people who tried to change the situation that was totally blocked, as has happened in ufology in the past.
World public opinion has not noticed anything, only in the US has someone read some articles ...
The Pentagon will let the necessary time pass and it will end like the Project Blue Book, the politicians will change and understand that the UFO theme does not bring votes.

a reply to: gippo888

One has to have a perspective on two things: the US government's notorious UFO history and its equally notorious military-industrial complex.

As for sincerity? We’ll Bennewitz was sincere, but was Doty and those behind him sincere? What matters is intent, and some people behind this group can’t be trusted. Sincere About what? Making the US military-industrial complex look good because they are some heroes saving us from the evil aliens?
I always said they would Jinn up ufology interest; that’s no big thing: Madison avenue technique to foster interest in ufology.

And BTW, ask the many who gave their money to TTSA about sincerity.

a reply to: gippo888

There is another possibility ... Maybe you were wrong about the TTSA, Elizondo, Delonge ...

If you read the very first post in the very first thread then I think much of it stands up. Especially the back story.

Your aggression has only harmed the people who tried to change the situation that was totally blocked, as has happened in ufology in the past.

This is a pretty weak excuse. Are you seriously channelling your obvious disappointment for the failure of TTSA at an individual who posts both serious research and satirical comments about them on the internet?

The company raised over $1m from public money and frittered it all away. They appointed Directors with 'connections inside the CIA, Pentagon and Lockheed Martin. The failure was all theirs, my friend. If indeed it was a failure.

a reply to: peaceinoutz
Are you really sure Elizondo is like Doty?
Maybe the TTSA is just a bluff, the aim was to raise public awareness

originally posted by: mirageman
This is a pretty weak excuse. Are you seriously channelling your obvious disappointment for the failure of TTSA at an individual who posts both serious research and satirical comments about them on the internet?
The company raised over $1m from public money and frittered it all away. They appointed Directors with 'connections inside the CIA, Pentagon and Lockheed Martin. The failure was all theirs, my friend. If indeed it was a failure.

Please ... I'm not channeling anything
We have two very different points of view
I would certainly like a lot more but I am very happy with the result, I think TTSA has already achieved a lot
5 years ago I was not hoping to see the Pentagon involved in the UFO issue, the navy make incredible statements
How many of you thought to heard such statements?
Now would I want a concrete result? Of course ... but I'm not disappointed with the results obtained

a reply to: gippo888

No, I don’t think he is like Doty.

I once said he was the Doty and TDL was the Bennewitz of this routine, but it's not an exact analogy.
One issue I had with this group was the threat narrative.

I always said this wasn't an important psyop if it was one, such as the Doty/Bennewitz affair.
If all they wanted to do was raise the bar of awareness no big thing to me. But it may be more involved, like keeping the defense budget high and adding cash to the new space force.

Independent Space Force (2019–present)

U.S. Space Force logo used from 20 December 2019 on public social media accounts[24][25]
The Space Corps proposal gained new life when, at a June 2018 meeting of the National Space Council, President Donald Trump directed the Department of Defense to begin the necessary processes to establish the U.S. Space Force as a branch of the Armed Forces.

Okay, they came out in 2017 with this alien threat narrative
So in 2019 cometh the Space Force formally
then coincidentally, TTSA starts to disintegrate, basically.
Umm...

You are not from this country where the Military Industrial Complex lurks behind many things.

a reply to: gippo888

....5 years ago I was not hoping to see the Pentagon involved in the UFO issue, the navy make incredible statements

The Pentagon would be foolish not to track unidentified objects. But the real threat comes from terrestrial adversaries, armed with anything from intercontinental ballistic missiles to simple spy drones. And that is where the efforts are concentrated.

Nothing has changed in 80 years since Project Sign stated:

...No definite evidence is yet available to confirm or disprove the actual existence of unidentified flying objects as new and unknown types of aircraft. A limited number of the incidents have been identified as known objects....

Project Sign (p4 of pdf)

The Navy's statement in April 2021 was that....

...The Department of Defense has authorized the release of three unclassified Navy videos, one taken in November 2004 and the other two in January 2015, which have been circulating in the public domain after unauthorized releases in 2007 and 2017.

The U.S. Navy previously acknowledged that these videos circulating in the public domain were indeed Navy videos. After a thorough review, the department has determined that the authorized release of these unclassified videos does not reveal any sensitive capabilities or systems, and does not impinge on any subsequent investigations of military air space incursions by unidentified aerial phenomena.

DOD is releasing the videos in order to clear up any misconceptions by the public on whether or not the footage that has been circulating was real, or whether or not there is more to the videos. The aerial phenomena observed in the videos remain characterized as "unidentified." The released videos can be found at the Naval Air Systems Command FOIA Reading Room

Statement by the Department of Defense on the Release of Historical Navy Videos

Since then, the Navy has denied there are any further UAP videos that will be released.

...“The UAP Task Force has responded back to DNS-36 and have stated that the requested videos contain sensitive information pertaining to Unidentified Aerial Phenomena (UAP) and are classified and are exempt from disclosure in their entirety under exemption...

U.S. Navy Says ALL UAP/UFO Videos Are Classified And Exempt From Release

On the face of it, this appears that the Pentagon is actually embarrassed by the leaks of three videos. Especially as their intelligence services somehow failed to identify who leaked the FLIR video when ufologists did it easily. I mean how stupid must the US intelligence services be?

It seems this was all really about clamping down on security leaks.

I don't honestly think America has this tiny group of unelected secret keepers (yet somehow with massive outreach) to conceal the existence of extraterrestrials or whatever it is they are supposedly concealing.

When the day comes for a first contact we'll all know about it fairly rapidly!

originally posted by: peaceinoutz
One issue I had with this group was the threat narrative.

Maybe it was the only way to be listening ... to get the attention of politics

I always said this wasn't an important psyop if it was one, such as the Doty/Bennewitz affair.
If all they wanted to do was raise the bar of awareness no big thing to me.

Ufology has been making these attempts for 70 years without getting results

But it may be more involved, like keeping the defense budget high and adding cash to the new space force.

It could but, in my opinion, feeding the UFO theme is too annoying for the Pentagon
To raise the defense budget, it is much easier to fuel international tensions as Trump did with North Korea