China threatens Australia for investigating origin of COVID 19

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Irishhaf
a reply to: Jay-morris

For active military you would be correct, but when you consider everything North Korea can put into the field vs everything China can North Korea dwarfs chinas military. (Hint north of 6 million paramilitary that would fight if ordered)

Active armies

China 2,183,000
India 1,444,000
United States 1,400,000
North Korea 1,280,000

China has the biggest population in the world, if China was brought into a world war, which is eould be, sorry but their army, active or not active would dwarf every nation on the planet.

Lmfao.
Your first mistake is counting the enemy.
Your second mistake is thinking that those numbers matter.
China could put a gun in the hands of all its citizens and it still doesn't stand a chance.

a reply to: mortex

Agree'd to some extent, qualitative or quantitative, skilled soldiers OR human waves.

During the second world war Human waves won but they led to the development of the Assault rifle in the form or the German Stg44 which inspired both the AK and M16 developed by the Soviets and the US.

Had the Germans had enough of these and still had the quality soldiers they had spent earlier in the war they perhaps would have been able to beat back the human waves of the Soviet conscript's - BUT then again maybe not the soviets were pretty tough lad's and take away the gun's they were often more than a match for there German counterpart's.

The Chinese are NOT a single nation, the HAN are by far the largest portion of there population but in fact China has several languages, several distinct cultures and despite the ruling HAN dominated communist party's claim of unity there are divisions in there society.

The point is though that the Chinese HAVE learned the lesson's of Quality and Quantity, they do still perhaps rely upon Quantity but make no mistake they also have plenty of Quality if not as high quality as is found in our own armed forces in the west, they currently have a weak navy but are racing to address this issue.

And remember they invented sneaky dirty fighting, well no they did not but they did Codify it.
en.wikipedia.org...

Since roughly one in three people in the world today is Chinese I would seriously rather that change came from within there nation, there are unsavory people there but hey there are here too, there are bad and good everywhere - and in all government's regardless of the ideology they follow.

I would no more want to see young Chinese in Body Bag's than I would young British or American's or for that matter anyone else, they are still some mother's son's and daughters remember.

I do not HATE the Chinese, there are thing's I hate about SOME of the Chinese but hey there are thing's I hate about some of my own nation's people.

Where I stand is that China is in contravention of international LAW on it's seizure of parts of international waters and other nation's territorial waters BUT I believe whole heatedly this was an predictable and inevitable outcome of NEVER curtailing them for there invasion of Tibet as they should have been.

It was over a longer time scale but it was a repeat of allowing Hitler so seize Austria, Czechoslovakia and other areas of Europe, China is just playing the same card's but over a longer time and perhaps better than he did, when the furor dies down they will just take a bit more and then when they are strong enough they will take it all.

BUT remember it is not China it is the Chinese GOVERNMENT that is responsible for this policy.

originally posted by: Ohanka
I would withdraw recognition of the People’s Republic of China as the legitimate state of China and instead recognise the Republic of China.

That would rile them up.

China has already started making credible threats of intention to invade them. It's possible they'll try to use the virus as an opportunity.

asiatimes.com...

www.taiwannews.com.tw...

originally posted by: mortex

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Irishhaf
a reply to: Jay-morris

For active military you would be correct, but when you consider everything North Korea can put into the field vs everything China can North Korea dwarfs chinas military. (Hint north of 6 million paramilitary that would fight if ordered)

Active armies

China 2,183,000
India 1,444,000
United States 1,400,000
North Korea 1,280,000

China has the biggest population in the world, if China was brought into a world war, which is eould be, sorry but their army, active or not active would dwarf every nation on the planet.

Lmfao.
Your first mistake is counting the enemy.
Your second mistake is thinking that those numbers matter.
China could put a gun in the hands of all its citizens and it still doesn't stand a chance.

Tactically, their military hardware is inferior but their manufacturing capacity is greater. So they can come pretty near to sending as many boats/planes/etc as the USA has missiles.

The one thing people often forget though: They may have a billion people they can send as soldiers......... but they're mostly somebody's only child.

The political backlash, were they to start taking casualties, would be tremendous.

Maybe they can settle this as they did in the old days without all of this war talk...
In the left corner, we can have the formidable Australian Kangaroo versus in the right corner the very cute but fearsome Chinese panda and let them go at it and may the best mammal win.

originally posted by: harold223

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
See, it's stuff like this which makes me wonder about this whole Wu-Flu thing! The world is upside down. Everything is backwards! Crazy!

China holds way too much debt from other countries. The worst thing they could do is piss off that country by threatening some kind of economic punishment. These are sovereign countries for cripes sakes! All they would have to do is write-off some, or all, of that debt and there's not a gawd damned thing the ChiComs could do about it! It's not like they're going to come marching in and start repossessing stuff...they can't. It makes no sense!

In the case of Australia, I completely disagree with the poster above who says the US doesn't have their back. China makes one move on Australia and the US is going to rain fire on China!

Even with that said, China exports way more goods to Australia than Australia exports to China. What's the biggest export to China from Australia? Beef? What? Now let's look at what China exports to Australia...freaking everything! Australia can shut China's pie hole in a NY second just by responding with..."Okay, if you're not going to import our stuff, well, then we won't import YOUR stuff, China!" End of discussion...game over! Just that fast. NEXT?

Makes no sense. No sense at all.

It is a bit complicated I'm afraid. China buys raw minerals from us that represents a pretty substantial chunk of our GDP. A Chinese boycott will throw Australia into a dire economic situation.

The above is unfortunately accurate. Australia’s economy is highly resource based. This has implications for a lot of things.

In the scope of this conversation, the implication is China can do a lot more damage to Australia economically than the other way around. And they know it. And that’s why they threatened it.

originally posted by: Jay-morris

Why would they release it on purpose? Why would they want to mess up the world's economy, one thst their own economy relies on so much? It makes no sense at all.

Now, I know that some people want this to be true because a war with China excites them, but it's not going to happen.

Because they are a murderous communist regime that don't care for their own people, so what makes you think they care about the world?...

Just like every other socialist and communist leaders do, they crave power and control.

BTW, i don't crave any war with China... But it seems that you do crave communist dictatorships as you, and many in the left defend them to no end, no matter what they do...

well china can go root its boot because Australia will not be passive if China wants to get heavy they will soon learn.
that being said I have many Chinese Australian friends and they do not mirror the CCP.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk
Debt=Money. That's how a debt backed system works.

We can't just write off the China (money/debt) problem without destroying the US dollar. They have piles of our money. That is the debt. China is buying up US businesses and properties with this money. We are effectively transferring ownership of a piece of the U.S. in exchange for our debt(usd) to them.

Our debt can't be written off unless we say screw our money system, we're starting over, anybody still holding U.S. Dollars are hereby getting the shaft. That would include Americans too.

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: OsirianObsidian

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Iscool
a reply to: Willtell

Well let's see...China on the left hand...US and Britain, S. Korea and Japan on the right hand...

Screw China...

Oh come on! This would be a world war! Amazes armchair soldiers who just cannot understand this!

China has quantity.

The US has quality.

China will always be behind the United States in everything. Military, AI, robotics...everything. It's because they don't have a culture of encouraging innovation - everything they have has been stolen from other countries.

The PLA would be wiped off the face of the planet in a world war. You want to know why? Because the Chinese people hate the CCP. They would use it as an excuse to start a revolution. Half of their population would use it as an excuse to rise up for democracy.

The only thing China is good at is cyber warfare and taking out combat command stations. It's one of the reasons why Australia is developing Plan Jericho - which is what the US JEDI system will be when Amazon finally gives up their stupid court actions - a fully integrated, whole of military, AI augmented approach to battlefield tactics that doesn't rely on one central command.

Couple that with Boeing Phantom Works' AI powered UAV that can fly alongside F-35 and other aircraft that is being built at the moment in Australia, and I'd back an allied force of the US, UK and Australia against China any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Let's put it this way: China has to pursue building a 6th generation fighter jet because their 5th generation fighter isn't as good as the F-22 Raptor. Their jet will be online in the 2030s...when the F-22 is 40 years old. And the US is building a new jet to replace the F-22 soon. It'll probably be fitted with scramjets and operate in LEO or something crazy.

That's how far behind China is when it comes to military tech. So as long as I've got a decentralised combat command that can be accessed from multiple locations (say, from the new Starlink array of satellites), I'm taking Team Blue.

Jesus! I never brought this up to somehow convince people that China would beat America in a war. Firstly, if it was just China and America, of course America wins that war. No one could compete with America in that aspect.

But we are talking about two of the biggest superpowers in the world. Both of these super powers have nukes. Both of these super powers have allies. It would be WW3 no doubt about it.

My point is, when are people going to bloody learn that we are brainwashed and manipalated to believe that this is ok? It's not ok.

We have people talking about wars and invasions lime it's a bloody videogame or a movie. It's not a videogame or a movie. We are talking about millions apon millions of innocent lives lost. All for what, a small percentage of the population (Governments)

It's just frustrating that even though we have advanced in the technical sense, our way of thinking has not changed in thousands of years.

No one wants a war. The point you’re missing is that you’re assuming China is negotiating from a position of strength and other nations need to submit to their grab for power. Their whole strategy is to convince people like yourself that their dominance is somehow inevitable - when the reality is that their dominance came off the back of banks like Goldman Sachs taking the money that the American tax payer gave them in 2008 and investing in the Chinese company that now owns the US based Smithfield.

They are strong because of globalist interests. Once those interests are removed and replaced with an interest in decoupling and their access to Western IP is diminished, their economy will collapse under the weight of its own debt to its citizens. China’s GDP is still 20% reliant on exports, and most of them go to the US.

There are two end games here: either China plays the role of Germany and declares war in order to escape from economic ruin...or they step away from the edge right now and realise that trying to act tough when the lack of transparency in the initial outbreak was the sole reason why this turned into the disaster that it did.

It’s not about them being responsible for the virus. # happens.

It’s about them being responsible for their lack of response to the virus, and the CCP need to honor itself in its anniversary year over the lives of its citizens.

originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Jay-morris

It would shrink faster than any nation also, considering such a war would 100% go nuclear with a likely surprise very successful first strike by US against China. Our boomers can put an SLBM anywhere in China within a matter of minutes, faster than they can react in any meaningful way they'd lose 80+% of their already dismal nuclear force and military assets

I truly believe we can win a nuclear war. And unlike all those others you rattled off, the United States has PROVEN it has the will to deploy nuclear weapons in warfare.

Just try us, China. Full spectrum dominance is just what it sounds like. That includes full spectrum dominance over China. If they want to challenge that, fine, but they better show up ready for a real fight.

Posts like the the above exactly proves my point. Arm chair soldiers talking about war as if it's a videogame or movie. Why do people talk like this? Why do these people have disregard for life for other nations in a war? Because they cannot distinquish government from its people.

Also the fact that they are completly brainwashed to think that this is ok.

originally posted by: mortex

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: Irishhaf
a reply to: Jay-morris

For active military you would be correct, but when you consider everything North Korea can put into the field vs everything China can North Korea dwarfs chinas military. (Hint north of 6 million paramilitary that would fight if ordered)

Active armies

China 2,183,000
India 1,444,000
United States 1,400,000
North Korea 1,280,000

China has the biggest population in the world, if China was brought into a world war, which is eould be, sorry but their army, active or not active would dwarf every nation on the planet.

Lmfao.
Your first mistake is counting the enemy.
Your second mistake is thinking that those numbers matter.
China could put a gun in the hands of all its citizens and it still doesn't stand a chance.

Your mistake is you do not bloody reads posts properly! I suggest you go back and read my posts before you talk rubbish!

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Because they are a murderous communist regime that don't care for their own people, so what makes you think they care about the world?...

Yeah because your own government loves and care for you! This is the point you do not get, or choose to ignore! China has a terrible government that has done terrible things. Your government is terrible, and has done terrible things. Because these terrible things were done outside your country? Does thst somehow make it better? Stop bring a hypocrite!

Just like every other socialist and communist leaders do, they crave power and control.

How brainwashed are you? This is what every bloody government craves, power and control!

BTW, i don't crave any war with China

Really?

But it seems that you do crave communist dictatorships as you, and many in the left defend them to no end, no matter what they do...

How the hell do I crave a communist dictatorship? Have you actually read my posts? I do not think so!
How am I defended them? I am talking about the bigger picture here, which obviously people like you cannot comprehend.

a reply to: OsirianObsidian

Firstly, China and the West economies are linked. All this talk in "We made China what they are today"is rubbish, considering all the millions of companies in the West that reliy on China and their products. Not just big companies but the millions of small companies too. So this " we made China what they are" is rubbish.

As for China being the next Germany. Is it China thst in the last three decades has invaded countries, leaving thousands of people dead, and completly destroying these countries?

Now, before you say "I am sticking up for china" I am not!

My point is, and has always been the fact that people tend to ignore their own givernment horrors, while pointing at other countries and saying how evil they are and need to be stopped.

Why do they do this? Because they have been conditioned to do this. This is how governments get away with what they do. In China, America, UK, whatever. All these countries have blood on their hands, but governments have a way of manipalating their people to believe it's not bad.

This is the problem, and the reason why we will always have wars and conflicts, because the normal folk let them get away with it time and time again!

It's sad and frustrating!

originally posted by: Jay-morris
a reply to: OsirianObsidian

Firstly, China and the West economies are linked. All this talk in "We made China what they are today"is rubbish, considering all the millions of companies in the West that reliy on China and their products. Not just big companies but the millions of small companies too. So this " we made China what they are" is rubbish.

As for China being the next Germany. Is it China thst in the last three decades has invaded countries, leaving thousands of people dead, and completly destroying these countries?

Now, before you say "I am sticking up for china" I am not!

My point is, and has always been the fact that people tend to ignore their own givernment horrors, while pointing at other countries and saying how evil they are and need to be stopped.

Why do they do this? Because they have been conditioned to do this. This is how governments get away with what they do. In China, America, UK, whatever. All these countries have blood on their hands, but governments have a way of manipalating their people to believe it's not bad.

This is the problem, and the reason why we will always have wars and conflicts, because the normal folk let them get away with it time and time again!

It's sad and frustrating!

China and the West are linked because China pegged their currency to the US dollar and went about targeting Western manufacturing companies with the promise that they could do it cheaper - which was fine when they were the equivalent of Vietnam or Thailand, but now they are the second largest economy in the world, they shouldn't have their currency pegged to the dollar artificially so they can oppress their people by pretending as though their currency is worthless.

Ask yourself this: if the yuan was worth 20 times what it is right now, would anyone bother to have their stuff manufactured in China? It's not like they are exceptionally good at it the way you'd say Japan was when they rose to become a global powerhouse economy in the 80s.

I don't have a problem with China as a country. But if you look at their expansionist rhetoric in the South China Sea, they have a government that will just keep pushing and pushing. They don't invest in other countries for mutual benefit. They invest in them for Chinese benefit - if they say they are going to build something, they will fly in Chinese workers to ensure that all the economic benefit flows back to China. Then when the country says 'We can't afford to pay for your work', they'll say 'give us the infrastructure we built, then'.

No one is asking for China to not stand up for itself and protect its national interests. They are asking them to take responsibility for the actions they took in doing so.

That's the difference between being a adolescent nation and an adult nation. Between being trusted and being treated with suspicion.

a reply to: OsirianObsidian

I am not saying China is perfect, no country is. And it's fair enough what you are saying regarding their currency pegged to the dollar artificially. I am not disputing that or arguing that.

I don't have a problem with China as a country. But if you look at their expansionist rhetoric in the South China Sea, they have a government that will just keep pushing and pushing

Is that any different to the West invading countries for their own agenda? People might argue that China are doing this because they are pretty much surrounded by American bases.

So, this is not about pointing the finger at one nation. It should be pointing the finger at all governments that have done, and still do terrible things. But we do not do that, because we have not been conditioned to do that.

Thst is my point

a reply to: neo96

You've got your eyes on the sauce awards for said rumors and myth or something? Dude, that's championship material!

"China's response to COVID-19 has been open, transparent, timely and responsible," said a health expert.

China wastes no time in sharing COVID-19 information: expert

No. Yes! D'oh!

Wow this thread escalated fast!!

If you want to get into WW3 doom pron then I have some tissues ready!

China - Biggest population in world? Give them a rifle each? Give them as much ammo as they can carry?

Being as though there is likely zero interest in invading and occupying China in any strategic military plan (same goes for US and Russia) how does the population size matter?

Second, China and their billion citizens, have a couple million perhaps in the military, how do they get to Australia, do they think they will take it over without every boat and aircraft wiped out before they pass Indonesia and if they do then what? What are they going to do with Australia, its fekn huge!!

Every ally with a submarine will be smashing them to bits in the south China Sea as will the Stealth Force c/o the US of A god bless you.

Its a fookin fantasy, if it went kinetic with China on a big scale, its either Nukes or bust, the world would just say, Chincom, you infected us all with your bat eating disease you filthy peasants, we have no interest in populating your country which is full of beings lower than dogs (on account that dog will not eat bats and pengolins because they are inedible), we dont want it, we wont nuke it, but dont spread out you filthy germs.

So, shut up giving it large on the world stage, you have just demoted yourself to something lower that dust in the order of relevance.

And that, is why China will no longer be a world player - China, say hello to India, it just replaced you!

a reply to: PublicOpinion

You've got your eyes on the sauce awards for said rumors and myth or something? Dude, that's championship material!

Are you really sitting there and saying the all the Corona snip didn't start in China?

Yeah man communist regimes are so effing trustworthy.

Bird flu.

Swine flu.

Bat flu.

Are people really that STUPID ?

China has some massive problems.

a reply to: neo96

Alright. You've got me with "sitting there".

Gimme some WMDs in Iraq style intrigue with spin and lies for another ... say 4 weeks... and we can talk about ignoring your Empire of Chaos for the profits. I could use some extra money for no sitting with good reason, why not?

Hush, hush now! We've got work to do!