Trans Activism, Trans Regret, and Resources for Desisters and Detransitioners

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

I know I'm just considered the oh-so-TERFy-bitch, but honestly, I cannot tell you how much that hurts my heart. I have no doubt that people who would go to such extreme measures to change their reality are hurting something fierce, and really just want to find what will stop that hurting. Even if that means killing themselves because nothing is sooooooooooo much better than the mental and emotional hell they are living in as evidenced by the high rates of mental issues -- and too many multiple issues per person.

And everyone KNOWS this! The self-proclaimed EXPERTS know this! But the ones who know it and understand it best are also the ones who know and understand best how to manipulate and extort and exploit their pain for personal gain.

There are no words adequate for their depraved hearts. None.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: Boadicea

The new rage is to start transitioning kids starting at age 3.

Oh lordy. At 3 years old, my daughter wanted to pee standing up like her brother... I explained the anatomical realities and physics of the matter, and we were done with it.

I suppose today I would have to offer her the option of phalloplastic surgery or else be charged with child abuse!

originally posted by: Boadicea

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: Boadicea

The new rage is to start transitioning kids starting at age 3.

Oh lordy. At 3 years old, my daughter wanted to pee standing up like her brother... I explained the anatomical realities and physics of the matter, and we were done with it.

I suppose today I would have to offer her the option of phalloplastic surgery or else be charged with child abuse!

So starting as young as 3 they create a social transgender identity. This persists until about 16. At that stage they will do the surgery etc. But by starting at age 3, what you will do is take that 95% who will normally outgrow it, and create a strong trans identity in them to prevent that. So what we will see in the future is few and fewer outgrow this, and then advocates will say see, it's an identity and they are born that way.

Prepare to have your heart hurt. The mother is basically coaching the child to be trans.

Is Three Too Young for Children to Know They're a Different Gender? Transgender Researchers Disagree

This is Rainbow Day Camp, in the East Bay town of El Cerrito. It was created specifically to be a safe place for transgender kids, and in fact, being transgender is so unremarkable here, when I asked Gracie what makes it “special," she shrugged and said:

“You get to do fun stuff.”

Her mother, Molly, tried to coax a reporter-friendly answer out of her.

“What is special about you, and the same as everybody else in the camp?” she prompted.


“I don’t know,” Gracie said.

“You’re transgender and there’s other kids that are transgender, too...”

“I’m transgender and there’s other kids that are transgender, too.”

www.kqed.org...

“What if we do this?” Molly recalled asking a gender therapist, back when they were debating the pros and cons of letting Gracie transition. “What if we let our son walk into the world in a dress with fairy wings, and crowns, and high heels, and even just in regular girl clothes … and then he changes his mind?”

"That's not the question,” the therapist told Molly. “The question is, what if you don't do it?”

So the therapist more or less refused to have a conversation about the risk of this, and told the mother if she doesn't her child might kill herself basically.

a reply to: sapien82

I am much better versed in the astrological principles of masculine and feminine, but I know they do correlate with the Hermetic principles. And I confess that I do think in astrological terms, including masculine and feminine.

As such, every sign, house and planet is assigned masculine or feminine except Mercury/Gemini/3rd House, which is androgynous -- neither male nor female, but also both male and female (as embodied by the dual nature of the Twins which symbolize Gemini). Likewise, because every natal horoscope comprises every planet, sign and house, everyone has both masculine and feminine qualities and energies, in unique proportions.

Much like we know the physical body comprises both male and female attributes and factors, we can and should also expect the heart and psyche to comprise both masculine and feminine. But there is no such thing as transgender in astrology. Like anything/everything else, it's about balancing and harmonizing and synthesizing the parts into the whole.

originally posted by: Boadicea
There are no words adequate for their depraved hearts. None.

Do you really think its a case of depravity?

I would hope it is well meaning ignorance.
These people aren't going in by force.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

So the therapist more or less refused to have a conversation about the risk of this, and told the mother if she doesn't her child might kill herself basically.

As a mother, I cannot imagine anything more coercive than being told, "If you don't do this, your child will kill him/herself, and it will be all YOUR fault....." Mothers would do anything to protect their kids, even -- especially -- from themselves.

And that's the point of course.

I have to also say that I don't know anything more cruel than telling a kid that they have to change themselves... that they aren't perfectly imperfect just the way they are.

a reply to: Krahzeef_Ukhar

Do you really think its a case of depravity?

For most, yes, I really do. Because I know they know better. For starters, there is no science behind "gender identity." Science, by definition, demands observable, measurable, and tangible results that can be replicated by anyone and everyone under the same conditions. Anatomical sex is science. It is so observable, measurable and tangible that we can even determine the anatomical sex of not just newborn baby, but also a long dead skeleton. "Gender" is a theory -- at best -- that cannot be observed, measured, or otherwise quantified or qualified by standards that can be replicated. It is all subjective.

A while back I wrote a thread about the many many ways long established tried and true principles are being ignored and trampled for "gender affirmation": Trans Activism and "Gender Affirmation" is Breaking Our Kids. I cited the following principles:

• First, do no harm
  
• If it ain't broke, don't fix it
  
• Differential/secondary diagnoses
  
• The best treatment is the least invasive, with the fewest side effects and the fewest/least severe adverse outcomes
  
• Evidence based medicine
  
• Informed consent
  
• Parental rights to be informed and to say "no"

All of the above principles -- indeed, safeguards -- are being trampled to exclude all other treatment approaches and options for dubious results. Well, at least for the patients. The providers sure as hell know they'll be paid.

And every single one knows that what they are doing has absolutely no science behind it and that many many people are being hurt by it. Every. Single. One. They know.

These people aren't going in by force.

No, of course they're not. But these people are going to experts and professionals who are expected to not only know better than the patient, but to have the patient's best interests at heart, and to act accordingly.

If you go to the doc with the flu, you expect him to treat the flu, not take your appendix out.

a reply to: Boadicea
Fair enough.

I don't think people are going in with the flu.
I see it more as people going in with something weird we don't understand and doctors scrambling to find answers whilst dodging lawsuits.

Sure there's gotta be a couple of monsters but the vast majority are just doing what they believe is in the patients best interest.

Even if as you suggest it's doing horrific damage.

If they all know exactly how to make a trans person comfortable and are actively withholding this then they're all monsters.

a reply to: Krahzeef_Ukhar

You make an excellent point as well, and gave me a little broader perspective here.

It's true enough that gender affirmation and reassignment are not the cure for everyone, but it's also true that we don't know what the cure is. And there probably isn't one "cure" for everyone anyway.

So to that extent, providers have no perfect choices to offer their patients, and can only offer the "best" choice, which is better than no choice at all.

Thank you. I always appreciate when someone inspires me to expand my thinking!

a reply to: Krahzeef_Ukhar

I see it as what happens when psychology erodes from an actual discipline into nothing.

We see medical science try to fix the mind by trying to treat the body to conform to the mental state.

a reply to: Boadicea
Aww shucks...

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Krahzeef_Ukhar

We see medical science try to fix the mind by trying to treat the body to conform to the mental state.

Exactly. It's assumed that if "gender" and sex don't match, that the body is the problem... it makes no sense. The body is objective and "gender" is subjective. There is no good reason to default to subjective criteria when we have objective criteria easily available.

Breaking a healthy and functioning body does not fix a disordered mind.

originally posted by: ketsuko
We see medical science try to fix the mind by trying to treat the body to conform to the mental state.

Yeah, but sometimes it works.
It would be interesting to see if those people who happily get good limbs taken off ever regret it.

I'm not suggesting they are the same thing.
But I don't want the hacksaw removed from mental health just yet.

...
Turns out they don't regret it. Not many numbers to really go on.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

I know I'm just considered the oh-so-TERFy-bitch, but honestly, I cannot tell you how much that hurts my heart. I have no doubt that people who would go to such extreme measures to change their reality are hurting something fierce, and really just want to find what will stop that hurting. Even if that means killing themselves because nothing is sooooooooooo much better than the mental and emotional hell they are living in as evidenced by the high rates of mental issues -- and too many multiple issues per person.

And everyone KNOWS this! The self-proclaimed EXPERTS know this! But the ones who know it and understand it best are also the ones who know and understand best how to manipulate and extort and exploit their pain for personal gain.

There are no words adequate for their depraved hearts. None.

There is such a word: evil.

a reply to: Boadicea

Aww hahah , that is cute too I suppose

but i couldnt resist if it was my wee lassie to let her go for it and let her experience how messy it is and so she'd never want to do it again haha.

Hell even for wee boys its messy at first

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: Boadicea

Aww hahah , that is cute too I suppose

but i couldnt resist if it was my wee lassie to let her go for it and let her experience how messy it is and so she'd never want to do it again haha.

LOL -- that's pretty much what happened! She came running into the house from playing outside, ran into the bathroom, pulled her shorts down, then just stood there... and started crying. I'm watching all this wondering just what the hell is going on and I ask her. Then I laughed so hard she got mad at me! (I was that mom... I laughed at my kids... I confess)

So, yeah, she learned the hard way and it never happened again. But 30+ years later and she still doesn't think it's fair!

a reply to: Boadicea

ahhahahahahah hilarious

I have to admit id be just like you if I was a parent , id laugh at my kids expense , they are hilarious

thats funny , but reassure her, when you get past 40 its gets messy again after years of being able to control the stream like the ghost busters, and it only goes downhill from there

I mean at least girls dont necessarily have to look at the damn thing hanging there all wrinkly until they die

a reply to: Boadicea

The thing is, the vast majority of people break gender norms each and every day in one way or another.

this is it. Cant count how many times have I've broken it...or thought about breaking it, but I never doubted my sex/gender because of it.

I'm a kinky male that likes to experiment. I've had homosexual experiences, and of the kind I would not gladly admit in public. I still consider myself a straight male.

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: Boadicea

ahhahahahahah hilarious

I have to admit id be just like you if I was a parent , id laugh at my kids expense , they are hilarious

In hindsight, I am so glad that we did laugh at them... and, in turn, teach them how to laugh at themselves. It seems to me that we wouldn't have so many snowflakes seeking safe spaces if more parents laughed at their kids. They learn not to sweat the small stuff. They also know better than to let others dictate their worth. If anything, my kids are a little too cynical, but in today's world, that's probably a valuable survival skill!

I mean at least girls dont necessarily have to look at the damn thing hanging there all wrinkly until they die

Oh dear! I can never unsee that mental image now... perfect way to make your point though!!! You have my sympathies...

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

this is it. Cant count how many times have I've broken it...or thought about breaking it, but I never doubted my sex/gender because of it.

Right? I've thought about this quite a bit, because I really thought we'd put all the gender norms behind us. I grew up in the '60s-70s, and everything was on the table. Any and all gender norms were smashed to smithereens. We got used to girls in pants and boys with long hair. Long before David Bowie we had Liberace. Will anyone ever forget Rock'n'roll's spandex era??? We had Rosey Grier kicking serious butt on the football field and crocheting in his leisure time... no one was going say jack to him! People were just living their best lives and having fun with it. Now the most superficial and petty gender roles are taken oh-so-seriously. What the hell happened???

I'm a kinky male that likes to experiment. I've had homosexual experiences, and of the kind I would not gladly admit in public. I still consider myself a straight male.

This is something else that blows me away. Privacy is a thing. Confidentiality is a thing. Not all truths need to be shared. We don't need to share ALL of our experiences. But folks are jumping through hoops to slap a label on themselves and shout it to the world. I don't think the vast majority of the world wants to know. And we sure don't need to know. When did our private intimate lives become a freaking spectator sport? When did it become acceptable -- even expected! -- to kiss and tell? Why would anyone want to define themselves solely by their sexuality?