Beyond Bigelow & BAASS, After AATIP and on To the Stars...

a reply to: ConfusedBrit

I wonder how TheFinalTheory would feel about this. Wasn't what Fravor described exactly what TFT said here on the forums?

There are some important points that have been made so far since we first addressed the Daily Star and the 490 (or was it 600+) pages of Project Lue Book.

But there are few points that I think we need to circle back to.

Does anyone recall what day the NY Times article Glowing Auras and ‘Black Money’: The Pentagon’s Mysterious U.F.O. Program went to press? It was the weekend edition for Dec 16/17th 2017 to be precise. Which was also the last time Project Bluebook was in operation before it was officially closed the following day in 1969.

Is that significant?

Before the last US Elections an email was sent on Feb 15th 2015 about a NYT article....

Fwd: Leslie Kean - NY Times


From:eryn.sepp@xxxx
To: john.podesta@xxxx
Date: 2015-02-15 23:53
Subject: Fwd: Leslie Kean - NY Times

See email from Leslie below. Thoughts on this?

Reporter is either Dennis Overbye or Ralph Blumenthal. She doesn't say it but mentioned it previously on your last day. Let me know if you want me to probe for more (UFO pun intended).

Sent from my iPhone

Begin forwarded message:

> From: Leslie
> Date: February 15, 2015 at 17:10:11 EST
> To: eryn.sepp@xxxx
> Subject: Leslie Kean - NY Times
>
> Eryn,
>
> Jumping off John's tweet, A New York Times reporter whom I know is writing an op-ed calling for release of files and a new government project on UFOs. He has invited me to co-author. It will include only things already public, like the CAP briefing in 2011, the foreword in my book and the foreign agencies.
>
> I don't know if it will be published, but he's trying. I want to make sure John has no objections to me co-authoring it; I think that will make it better and I can be sure it's on the mark. Can you run this by him to be sure?
>
> Sorry to bother you off duty!!
>
> Thanks,
> Leslie

Was this call for a new project on UFOs already agreed in principle with the Democrats before the election?

By November of 2015 it seems that Hillary was disappointed not to be able to discuss UAPs on the Jimmy Kimmel show.

He didn't end up asking her about UFOs! She was very disappointed. She practiced UAPs for 5 minutes beforehand.

But then in March 2016 she got her wish....



Sure it was a bit jokey. But she did mention UFOs or UAPs. Then maybe these UAPs could be a threat..

Was the original NY Times story meant to announce a new Democrat initiative to study UFOs? Their Project Blue Book II? All timed for the weekend of the 48th anniversary of the official end of the original Project Blue Book?

But then the Republicans won the election and perhaps a desperate Plan B was sprung into action during 2017.

Could that explain why we ended up with TTSA? Who seem to be concentrating on entertaining with their rather amateurish approach, vague statements and general refusal to engage with anyone who really knows about ufology?

originally posted by: mirageman

Was this call for a new project on UFOs already agreed in principle with the Democrats before the election?

Leslie Kean has often called for a new 'Project UFO' and believes the USG holds many related secrets (although she accepts it may all be terrestrial tech in the end). It would probably be more surprising if she wasn't pushing for such a project in these types of correspondence.

By the way, is the 2016 Kimmel-Clinton interview the first time he has asked about a candidate's UFO disclosure plans BEFORE an election rather than during or, most usually, after their Presidency?

Sure it was a bit jokey. But she did mention UFOs or UAPs. Then maybe these UAPs could be a threat.

Or UAVs - which certainly ARE a potential threat. At least a database is being compiled now... at last.

Was the original NY Times story meant to announce a new Democrat initiative to study UFOs? Their Project Blue Book II? All timed for the weekend of the 48th anniversary of the official end of the original Project Blue Book?

It's very interesting timing, isn't it? Perhaps they should have waited for the big "50" this year instead; after all, "48" is a bit... meh. Was the timing primed to tantalise the public's interest over the Xmas period (rather than deflating the public's interest in 1969 - as intended back then)

But then the Republicans won the election and perhaps a desperate Plan B was sprung into action during 2017.

It's such a shabby Plan B that maybe a 50th anniversary kick-off WAS the better option. And if Plan A had gone ahead, how supportive would Clinton have really been once she was in the White House? She certainly would have had a greater interest in the subject than any other President since Carter, but does she see it as anything more than a vote-grabber?

Alternatively... putting my CT specs on... would she have exploited public interest in the subject for more sinister objectives, aided and abetted by certain individuals around her?

What would the Press have made of such a move? Or the majority of the public at large? Would she have risked becoming a laughing stock? I suppose we may never know.

a reply to: mirageman

The ‘threat mongering’ may have also reached politicians, but I have the feeling the source of TTSA lies in the defense industry.

The two pivotal people that got the TTSA ball rolling are both related to defense contractors:

1. Tom was first invited to a party at Lockheed Martin to chat with their Lead Executive, Robert F. Weiss, who retired in 2018. This was his entry into the defense community.

2. The resulting chain of meetings ended up at General William N. McCasland, who helped him put together his TTSA team.

Tom may have been given the impression he was the initiator of it all, but in reality these two men initiated his two pivotal actions: His introduction into the defense community and the assembly of his TTSA team.

General William N. McCasland retired in 2013 and started working at a defense subcontractor under the name of Neil McCasland after his retirement.

Dr. W. Neil McCasland is currently the Director of Technology at Applied Technology Associates of Albuquerque, NM. ATA is an award-winning, small business providing high performance, state-of-the-art custom solutions, technical services, and assembly, integration, and test capabilities for ground, air, and space applications.
Prior to joining ATA, Dr. McCasland served a 34 year long career in the US Air Force, retiring in 2013 in the grade of Major General.

Source

So, when exactly did Tom meet ‘the General’? It must have been before October 1. 2013, unless he met him after his retirement.

Did Dr McCasland ever go public on the UAP topic? Was he ever questioned about his relation with TTSA and Tom DeLonge?

a reply to: Guest101

All excellent points. But should we assume a single project was being planned for years building towards what is now TTSA?

What if Plan A was something not involving DeLonge?

Leslie Kean was part of UFOData with Chris Mellon and she had been discussing things with Podesta long before the elections (as had Tom). Isn't it possible there were two different groups involved here? The Air Force guys - McCasland, Carey and Weiss dropped off the radar as soon as Wikileaks named them. None of the journalists seem to have gone hunting for them either. Or maybe they did and they refuse to comment?

Kean claim in the NY Times that Elizondo only worked with the Navy and CIA...which is now very apparent.

But Mr. Elizondo said the only thing that had ended was the effort’s government funding, which dried up in 2012. From then on, Mr. Elizondo said in an interview, he worked with officials from the Navy and the C.I.A

NY Times Article Dec 2017

So, although this is all a theory, isn't it possible that two separate elements were forced together under the TTSA umbrella once Donald was elected to the Oval Office?

That's why we've had mixed messages. Mellon and Zondo with their ultra cautious statements about an unknown threat and DeLonge coming from a completely different and totally woo angle until he was tamed.

a reply to: mirageman

Maybe you’re right. What do you think is the motive of the other element?

We should not underestimate the huge budget that is going to be allocated IF the US Government acknowledges the existence of an unknown, serious threat that is way ahead in technology.
So, if Delonge can be played to stir up Congress, why not take a shot at it?

The defense industry and the banks will benefit (while the US debt will rise further and the interest is going to be paid by the tax payers).

To me, the motive seems to be either money or a sincere believe in the phenomenon (in spite of the absence of hard, verifiable proof).

originally posted by: Guest101
a reply to: mirageman

To me, the motive seems to be either money or a sincere believe in the phenomenon (in spite of the absence of hard, verifiable proof).

Or could a third motive be one or both of those elements combined with a new method of massaging and controlling the populace? (I tended to flinch at such NWO notions in relation to ufology, but I suppose we must investigate those white rabbits if they wiggle their ears seductively at us). Less than a dozen governments in the world openly take UFOs seriously, but if the USA joined that meagre list, how many others would follow the lead? After all, the USA boasts arguably the three main pillars of world ufology and mythology: Roswell, Area-51 and Rendlesham (albeit UK soil).

Would Clinton have created global waves by more or less mirroring the words said by the general in that airport restaurant as Tom recalls them...

The general looked me in the eyes and said, ‘It was the Cold War and everything we did at the time was because nuclear war could break out at any given time... And somewhere in there we stumbled upon the UFO phenomenon.’

Sounds ultra-cheesy but, as you say, WHEN did this conversation occur? I can easily imagine Doty sitting in that restaurant chair, and perhaps it's no wonder that Tom left that chat with a spring in his step and new Woo in his soul. Evidently too MUCH initial woo for the big boys he started playing with.

a reply to: ConfusedBrit

The general looked me in the eyes and said, ‘It was the Cold War and everything we did at the time was because nuclear war could break out at any given time... And somewhere in there we stumbled upon the UFO phenomenon.’

I took issue with this quote from TDL for a few very specific reasons:

1. If what the "general" said is true: then the USG as a whole wasn't seriously involved in UFOs until post-Roswell/BlueBook/BattleofLA/etc. If that's the case, then are Roswell et al truly non-events in the eyes of the USG? Does that then throw out every proxy association (Wright AFB, Corso, MJ12, Twining memo, etc)?

2. There is a brief statement about a recovered body. The MIC has somehow recovered a once-sentient alien lifeform (I'm sure the CDC were promptly notified) and RandomGeneral #435 has been authorized to tell a B-level pop star about it. As usual, no documents or data just a wink and a nod.

3. "It was the Cold War...." aka "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times...". Every good story has an opening hook...

4. Doty. Need I say more?

Remember Unidentified where Tom and Lue look like they want to Bro-hug it out in successfully getting the US Navy to change their guidelines on UFO reporting and the "briefings" they coordinated at the executive level?

And this post that TDL put on Instagram stating the same and more?;

It was the Navy Office of Legislative Affairs (OLA) which organised the Congressional briefings by Naval intelligence officials.

Which briefing was TomLue getting excited about exactly?

1) Kohler's briefing of the Seapower subcommitee in December 2018.
2) Stratton's briefing on 7 May 2019.
3) Senior intelligence officials briefed on 19 June and 20 June 2019.

??

In FOIAS placed by John Greenwald, asking for emails regarding this topic there is this little gem;

Stratton to Wright [24 April 2019 2:25pm]:

"The US Navy is at the forefront of this effort but works across the Department of Defense to ensure other service partners maintain awareness for the safety of their aviators. The US Navy is not workingis not working with any entities outside of the US government."

Credit to Keith Basterfield and John Greenwald
Source

originally posted by: ParticleNode


1. If what the "general" said is true: then the USG as a whole wasn't seriously involved in UFOs until post-Roswell/BlueBook/BattleofLA/etc. If that's the case, then are Roswell et al truly non-events in the eyes of the USG? Does that then throw out every proxy association (Wright AFB, Corso, MJ12, Twining memo, etc)?

Roswell and the 1942 Battle of LA were never considered to be ET events at the time, rather they were potential foreign spy vehicles in the eyes of the press or the public, and once the inevitable ET angle became a meme, Blue Book was simply there to calm the public until 1969. I think there's no doubt the USG believes Roswell itself was a non-event, ET-wise, the USAF's 1994 and 1997 reports the last words on the matter. Tom's General cleverly covered those bases and spiced things up by describing a post-1947 retrieval - a perfect carrot to dangle.

2. There is a brief statement about a recovered body. The MIC has somehow recovered a once-sentient alien lifeform (I'm sure the CDC were promptly notified) and RandomGeneral #435 has been authorized to tell a B-level pop star about it. As usual, no documents or data just a wink and a nod.

As Tom pitched it himself, he could get the ball rolling so that the young'uns would trust their government and military again. I'm sure the General's eyes twitched as he listened to this sacrificial lamb's offer to make the Big Boys 'cool' again.

. "It was the Cold War...." aka "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times...". Every good story has an opening hook...

Heh. Rather than 'A Tale Of Two Cities', perhaps the General should have chosen 'Great Expectations' instead?

4. Doty. Need I say more?

Frankly, NO. I always imagine Dickie's aura floating around this entire saga - whether actively involved or not, I'm sure there's a smug smile beaming out from the shadows.

a reply to: Guest101

Maybe you’re right. What do you think is the motive of the other element?

The motive may well have been simply that Podesta had genuinely convinced Clinton to back a study of UAPs, should she win the Presidential Election. Her appearance on Jimmy Kimmel's shows she was introducing the concept to a wider audience. Leslie Kean, as noted above was preparing to work in a piece with Ralph Blumenthal in 2015 encouraging the government to study UFOs again.

Kean did not speak to any of the TTSA boys (other than Mellon who she knew through UFOData which we'll get to) until just before TTSA was launched.

On Oct. 4,[2017] I [Leslie Kean] had the privilege of sitting down with Jim Semivan (TTS/AAS Vice President Operations), Harold Puthoff (Vice President Science and Technology), Christopher Mellon (National Security Affairs Advisor) and Luis Elizondo (Chief of Security and Special Programs) for a four hour meeting in Washington DC.

HuffPost

Not only that in early 2016 Mellon talked to Kean. He strangely ignored all the famous pillars of American ufology and was saying that he thought the 1989/90 Belgian UFO wave, the 1993 Cosford Incident (which was space junk burning up) and the Illinois UFO Incident of 2000 (Van Wagner Airship Group flying a blimp) were some of the most compelling cases he knew of and suggesting...

I think the conspiracy theorists will be angry and unconvinced, while the general public may conclude UFOs are not a worthwhile topic. If Clinton really wants to get to the bottom of the UFO issue, I think she should officially task NORAD with collection and analysis responsibility. Simultaneously, she should assign the Office of Science and Technology Policy the job of reviewing available evidence, coordinating with other countries and providing scientific assessments and recommendations.

HuffPost 2016

So Chris Mellon was obviously thinking completely differently before the US elections in 2016 than his sudden appearance in Oct 2017 on the stage with DeLonge. Although I don't know for certain what was being planned. We know from WikiLeaks that DeLonge hadthe attention of Podesta in in early 2015 about his own plans. It would appear from the above information though that both DeLonge and Mellon had very different ideas of how to address a study of UAPs.

Suddenly in Oct 2017 both we were working together. DeLonge was muzzled and surrounded by spooks. Zondo became defacto spokesperson for TTSA with Mellon also available for soundbites for the MSM. Why did we get this sudden fusion of these personalities into team TTSA?

a reply to: pigsy2400

Oh my!

Here's both Tom and Lue (DeLondo Brothers) at the end of "Unintended" when Zondo announces the news to Tom on his tablet. Obviously Tom has no idea how to check internet news himself and is astounded to hear the news that the US Navy have clarified their reporting procedures and it was all down to TTSA.



And yet it's there, clear as day, in this FOIA document that whatever they claimed they said that (unless the Navy are lying, or TTSA are an entity of the US government which SEC filings do not indicate) was not true.



Another huge question mark over TTSA and their claims I would say.



All they have to do is present evidence to prove they advised the US Navy in some capacity to revise their UFO reporting policies and things would change. Yet it seems TTSA will not produce much evidence at all to back up their claims these last two years.

What the hell is going on?

a reply to: Guest101

Both good possibilities. But I think Delonge just entered something that was long in operation and was passed around when he went on his secret meetings to be chosen by the ongoing UFO project of the US IC.

ONI, DIA, AFOSI, and the CIA all have connections to the ongoing UFO disinformation operation within the US government IC community
As we see they now all have tentacles to TTSA:

McCasland: AFOSI
Zondo: CIA, DIA, ONI

And we know the other CIA and DIA plants in TTSA:
CIA: Semivan, Puthoff

DIA: Mellon

Defense contractors: Steve Justice


Imagine an image of all these groups with their hooks in Delonge Butt

3,2,1........

a reply to: pigsy2400

And he's already gone..............

That one wasn't worth a look at all.....

a reply to: MichaelHorn812


Its called examination of a presented "truth" by an Individual(s) that is presented / sold and looking for facts and evidence to back up those claims to see if they can be verified.

Claims that claim strongly, that thier truth/story/theory is the "One and Only Truth" and that you should relinquish all other truth in place or "theirs/yours" well that's how cults start...

Considering your affiliations I can see why that line of inquiry would be upsetting, all things considered.

I don't believe that your post will be around for long either...

a reply to: pigsy2400

Oh my, this must of been the quickest vanishing ever😐.

a reply to: mirageman

(unless the Navy are lying, or TTSA are an entity of the US government which SEC filings do not indicate) was not true.

Well. The FOIA document you cited indicates just that? Not to forget all the security clearances for TTSA and those obvious elements of propaganda in the TV-show. Take your pick! Carrier Battle-groups, NDA heroes, alien threats or just the weird production level with this utter emotionalization of the topic as if it was an experiment from some mud-pitters to 'radicalize' the 'UAQ-Anon crowd'.

Same sh!t, different day. And I still feel played like a fiddle.