F.B.I. Raids Office of Trump’s Longtime Lawyer Michael Cohen

a reply to: Meniscus

They are probably still going through things still.
They better not take any towels. Cohen will be charged for that.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Aazadan

So it's now Trump's fault that a corrupt FBI/DoJ is illegally targeting anyone who ties to represent him?

I've heard everything now.

TheRedneck

That's not what is happening. You're being naive or you're denying information. The whole system is not in cahoots to get trump. It's not a system wide or even agency wide conspiracy to end his presidency. It's just ridiculous to think that hundreds of employees could stay quiet to pull off the kind of coordination something like that would require.

a couple of points:

- seems this was a referral, and the bar for a search warrant is actually very high in this type of case. and many rules in place for it. and rules in place to maintain client-privilege.

- During nixon days like 40 people where busted and it took over a year. this is a long process, it needs to play out; stopping it midterm is bad for everyone.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: yuppa

Maybe Trump should order Sessions to file indictments on Mueller's family? I'm sure he can find something in their history if he looks hard enough. Hey, it's apparently all fair game now. Might as well get with the (empty) rule book.

TheRedneck

Well mueller did it to flynn so its only fair.

a reply to: Meniscus

It’s bank fraud (maybe) because when the bank asked what it was for he almost certainly didn’t say “to pay off a pornstar for may boss.”

Lying on the application would be the bank fraud.

Doubly so since the reason for the lie was dodging reporting it to the election commission..

That said Like hillary’s Emails. We don’t normally send big wig politicians to jail for procedural errors..

originally posted by: Ghostinshell
a couple of points:

- seems this was a referral, and the bar for a search warrant is actually very high in this type of case. and many rules in place for it. and rules in place to maintain client-privilege.

- During nixon days like 40 people where busted and it took over a year. this is a long process, it needs to play out; stopping it midterm is bad for everyone.

The judge was co erced somehow prolly.

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: Meniscus

It’s bank fraud (maybe) because when the bank asked what it was for he almost certainly didn’t say “to pay off a pornstar for may boss.”

Lying on the application would be the bank fraud.

Doubly so since the reason for the lie was dodging reporting it to the election commission..

That said Like hillary’s Emails. We don’t normally send big wig politicians to jail for procedural errors..

How is it fraud? the money is still paid back and they didnt run away with it. A loan app is not a federal document.

a reply to: Sillyolme

It is against the law to lie to a federal institution like a bank to obtain a loan.

It is not against the law to lie to a bank.

A bank is not a Federal institution... it is a private entity.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Sillyolme

It is against the law to lie to a federal institution like a bank to obtain a loan.

It is not against the law to lie to a bank.

A bank is not a Federal institution... it is a private entity.

TheRedneck

DING DING DING! YOU'RE CORRECT SIR!

a reply to: Sillyolme

That post was a reply to Aazadan, in response to his amusingly inaccurate claims.

But to claim that there is no concerted effort to remove Trump from the Presidency?

Really?

NOW I've heard everything! Until someone says something even crazier... that bar keeps moving in this thread.

TheRedneck

a reply to: yuppa

Yeah, I seem to have a bad habit of interjecting facts into this fantasy realm we're apparently living in.

Just for kicks, what have i heard so far?

• NDAs are all mutually binding.
  
• NDAs are usually unenforceable.
  
• Lawyers cannot sign contracts (must be terrible trying to buy a car or house)
  
• It is illegal to lie to a bank.
  
• Banks are part of the Federal government.
  
• It is illegal to take an interest deduction if you lied to a bank.
  
• A practicing attorney knows less about the law than a poster on ATS who thinks NDAs are always mutually binding.
  
• Having a 'taxi medallion' (whatever that is!) is equal to money laundering.
  
• Lawyers cannot sign for their clients.
  
• Lawyers can be disbarred for taking out a mortgage.
  
• No one in DC wants Trump out of office.
  
• Lawyer-client privilege does not apply to a lawyer and his client.
  
• Sex with a porn star is a felony.
  
• Porn stars are 100% honest and must always be believed no matter what.
  
• Melania wants to nullify her prenup so she can divorce Trump.
  
• The Washington Examiner and Wikipedia web pages contain codified law.

And I probably missed several.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Sillyolme

It is against the law to lie to a federal institution like a bank to obtain a loan.

It is not against the law to lie to a bank.

A bank is not a Federal institution... it is a private entity.

TheRedneck

It's called fraud, smartie pants.

a reply to: crtrvt

Only if you lie on the application about your ID or your collateral.

What you do with the money they loan you is your business. Why do you think they pay funds directly to a car dealer or real estate company? To protect their collateral. As long as you have the collateral already, it's not fraud to do as you wish with your money.

TheRedneck

www.cnn.com...

In his first comments since the FBI raid on his home and office, Michael Cohen said the FBI agents "were extremely professional, courteous and respectful."

The comments contrast with President Donald Trump who complained Monday that agents "broke into the office of one of my personal attorneys."

"I am unhappy to have my personal residence and office raided. But I will tell you that members of the FBI that conducted the search and seizure were all extremely professional, courteous and respectful. And I thanked them at the conclusion," Cohen said in a phone conversation on Tuesday with CNN

He said that he is very loyal to Trump but after what happened on Monday, he'd rethink how he handled the payments to Daniels because of the impact on his family

a reply to: TheRedneck

Let me try again to clarify this:

I own a house. Let's say I can go to the bank right now (well, in the morning anyway) and probably get a loan for at least $50k. I don't have to tell the bank what I am going to do with it, why I want it, or who I am going to buy what from. I own the collateral (my house) that secures the loan. As long as I don't destroy my collateral, it'[s nobody's business but mine if I want to stick 50,000 bills in dancers' garters.

If I were trying to buy this house, and did not already own one, I could probably take 20% of the price, have it appraised, and borrow the rest. In that case, the house I am buying is the collateral which secures the loan. I am required to buy the house in order to have the collateral to secure the loan. If I do not buy the house, and do not pay back the loan, that is fraud. The money was loaned contingent on me buying the house and putting it up as collateral. As a matter of fact, even after approval, the bank will not front the actual money until I am closing the house sale. That's to prevent me from not buying the house and therefore not having collateral for the loan.

Cohen was not buying a house. He already owned it. He already had the collateral. It was his money to do with however he wished. There was no fraud. It doesn't matter if he told them he was going to build a church. You cannot defraud someone by lying about something that is none of their business.

It's not that hard a concept... is it?

TheRedneck

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Meniscus
a reply to: F4guy

I must be missing how a personal equity loan is bank fraud or breaks campaign finance laws. If you pay off a porn star to sign an nda.

Paying money on Trumps behalf constitutes a gift. There is a legal limit on how much money you can gift to a Presidential candidate.

Trump repaying the money also goes against the legal limitations on what campaign funds can be used for.

If Trump repaid Cohen out of his personal funds, this wouldn't be an issue... using campaign funds has strings attached though.

Basically, Trump is such a stable genius that he took a relatively minor civil suit, and then made every legal misstep he could have possibly made, and turned it into a major criminal suit.

So the 750K clinton gave McCabe's wife was within the limits?

Interesting, it was paid by an LLC tho, not a personal contribution.

originally posted by: Phage

originally posted by: Meniscus
a reply to: F4guy

I must be missing how a personal equity loan is bank fraud or breaks campaign finance laws. If you pay off a porn star to sign an nda.

If he lied to the bank about what he was using the funds for, that's fraud.
If the payment was made in an effort to support Trump's election it was a violation.

So how much over appraised value will a bank give you in a refinance?

I needed an appraisal before I got a refinance.

Took the money and got a lower intrest rate and got double pane windows.

A fraction of what I got.

I don't remember having to account for every single dollar.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: MotherMayEye

Did you shuffle over $100k in a lump sum to a shell company first, thence to a lawyer representing some other person? Seems the bank might want to know more about that sort of transaction.

Well it worked with Perkins Coie and GPS and Steel.

Right?

That was millions of bucks.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Phage

With my HELOC I had "checks" that I used. I wonder if the bank would have been interested if I wrote a check for $130,000 off of it, to a single entity.

Why would they? Did you sign an agreement with them stating what the money could be used for?

A bank loan is exactly that: a loan. What you use the money for is your business as long as you maintain the collateral requirements specified in the loan contract. It's no different than using a credit card... does VISA tell you what you can and can't purchase with their card?

TheRedneck

Someone should arrest Tom Selleck for the reverse mortgages that bastard is pushing!!

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: MotherMayEye

Of course you don't have to use the money for home improvements. Some people pay for their kids' college. Some people take a cruise. But it's the bank's money.

Of course, if you tell the IRS you used it on home improvements you may find you have a problem.

Not their money.

When you sell your house, do you have to tell anyone what you are doing with the money besides the ex wife?