Transgender Boy Wins in First Round of Girls Wrestling Tournament

originally posted by: Dutchowl
Taking testosterone would fall under steroids, wouldn't it? How did she/he not get disqualified wrestling as a girl?

It's an approved medical treatment being administered and monitored by a physician.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Those with Asthma can and do take steroids.. But their not "Anabolic" steroids.
Big difference.

originally posted by: seasonal
a reply to: NarcolepticBuddha

I agree, he should bow out and do a non contact sport.

Or just go become a ballet dancer

Dress up like the 'Nutcracker' and lift the ladies up.

a reply to: veracity

Aye but surely they understand the ethics of good sportsman ship hence the reason why we have rules in sport

surely they are aware that their own body is going through changes and due to these changes that may give them an advantage against the girls.

It's not about the individual but everyone and it's unfair to the competition as a whole
so to say its unfair to ask them to wait ? isnt it unfair on everyone else to allow them to compete given they may have a physical advantage due to hormone treatment
and why pander to a minority , just because they are trans ?

a reply to: sapien82

The treatments go on through a transpersons life; you're basically saying they should never be able to participate in high school sport.

It's unfair for Mack to wrestle girls. He wanted to wrestle other boys. Texas law forbids that.

Pander to a minority? LOL, the true colors come out finally. There is no pandering in acknowledging equal rights.

a reply to: sapien82
The whole issue is that Mac wants to compete with the boys, but he is being forced to compete with girls bc of a law that says you have to play by sex at birth and not what you identify with.

If this law was not made...then there would not be an issue.

originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: sapien82
The whole issue is that Mac wants to compete with the boys, but he is being forced to compete with girls bc of a law that says you have to play by sex at birth and not what you identify with.

If this law was not made...then there would not be an issue.

Sure there would be. Some would still be claming that it is unfair because he has Testosterone treatments.

Of course, those are monitored by a physician, the levels are recorded and maintained at normal teenaged boy levels ... but still, since the overwhelming desire among some seems to be to take issue with ANYTHING regarding equal treatment for transfolks, there would still be the same rather uninformed arguments.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: RedDragon
He should absolutely be allowed to compete. But he should not be allowed to take anabolic steroids and compete.

No one's being discriminated against because no one should be allowed to take anabolic steroids and compete in sports.

So I guess those with Asthma should be told to sit on the sidelines too unless they stop taking their meds...

You don't run into potentially ruining the sport with asthma meds. Anabolic steroids do a lot more and need to be treated specially. They make you superhuman and you leave humanity behind while you're on them.

I've already seen one sport that I love ruined for several years because of people taking steroids for medical conditions and then cheating with them, passing their testosterone level tests (cheating the tests) under doctor supervision and all. It's too much of a can of worms with too much potential for people to cheat by taking way more than their prescribed doses.

The UFC had to ban anabolic steroids for everyone with medical conditions because of what happened. It was a disgrace.

Picture yourself as a competitor. Can you imagine sacrificing things in your life, working yourself to collapse everyday in the gym, and then you have to compete against someone that has a doctor's prescription for anabolic steroids?

originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: sapien82
The whole issue is that Mac wants to compete with the boys, but he is being forced to compete with girls bc of a law that says you have to play by sex at birth and not what you identify with.

If this law was not made...then there would not be an issue.

Maybe they should develop a new class. It would make it fairer for all.

The National Federation of State High School Associations released Tuesday a new set of weight classes that will be in place for the 2011-2012 season. The upward shift was approved by the rules committee during the April 4-6 meetings in Indianapolis. According to the new guidelines, the beginning weight of 103 was increased to 106. That led to 10 of 14 weight classes being changed and only four (145, 152, 160 and 285) remaining the same. After 106, the weights are in order: 113, 120, 126, 132, 138, 145, 152, 160, 170, 182, 195, 220 and 285. .........

“Wrestling has always been a sport for the little guy, and they keep taking that away,” Barrick continued. “What are these guys going to do? They are two small to play football, basketball or volleyball. In some cases, they are too small for soccer.

highschoolsports.pennlive.com...

Isn't it funny how a thread like this sparks outrage and moral indignation and seems to gives one reason to post unfounded opinions and uninformed conjecture based on heated feelings, partial truths or outright lies and it gets a lot of responses but when a thread is started intelligently discussing some of the science and research behind being transgender beyond social issues and current events, it gets more or less ignored.

Some people here don't seem to want to learn and discuss things anymore. They just want to bitch and moan and push their partisan political or religious beliefs with their fingers in their ears going la-la-la-la.


Others that actually are more informed get dismissed or put down.

It gets tiresome. As someone that grew up transgender, it gets depressing. I can't help it but to not click. Most of the time I wish I hadn't.

a reply to: Freija


It has nothing to do with transgender science. Everyone accepts that it's a real condition. You're inventing a red herring that no one's talking about to pretend that you're smart. People are worried about anabolic steroids being allowed in sports.

I've already seen a sport that I love, the UFC, experiment with allowing anabolic steroids to treat medical conditions that require their usage. It ended up in lots of people taking steroids under their doctor's supervision for their medical conditions. They then cheated their tests to look like they were only dosing to normal testosterone levels. However, they were really taking astronomical levels of testosterone and were using the medical exemption as a loophole to roid out like the incredible hulk.

The UFC learned its lesson and had to ban anabolic steroids for everyone, even those with medical conditions.

Quite simple...if you are the exception, in this case "IT" should be kept from participating and any/all expense to do so, or challenge should be born by "IT". It is not the people's responsibility to bow to everyone's personal decision. It is their responsibility to conform or to take the responsibility themselves.

For example...English is the language of the USA. If you want something translated, if you want documents transposed or if you wish signs were in Spanish...YOU pay for them. It is not the responsibility of the people. Your unique situation, created by YOU means that YOU pay the cost.

Everyone accepts that transpeople have variant gender identities?

Not even close. Poster after poster has chimed in here with the crudest remarks claiming that transgenders are mentally ill, purposefully lying for some kind of ... perverted purpose, etc.

The concern about fairness in sport is, in my opinion, far down teh list for many posters here. They want to establish that they think TG is wrong and they don't want any sort of movement in traditions to be flexible in relation to trans rights.

I mean, let's not deny is is right before our eyes here.

Everyone accepts that transpeople have variant gender identities?

Not even close. Poster after poster has chimed in here with the crudest remarks claiming that transgenders are mentally ill, purposefully lying for some kind of ... perverted purpose, etc.

The concern about fairness in sport is, in my opinion, far down teh list for many posters here. They want to establish that they think TG is wrong and they don't want any sort of movement in traditions to be flexible in relation to trans rights.

I mean, let's not deny words that are right before our eyes here.

And people wonder why E.T.s havn't made contact with us yet.

Either they have and they deemed us too dumb too matter and have enslaved us using our own culture to do so or they just don't want to bother, because we're too closeminded.

---------

Honestly if he wants to wrestle the boys, he needs to wrestle the law 1st. It's not fair to the girls and they don't deserve that bad wrap for having their own opinions.

However Mac should of understood this was going to be an issue, and worked on getting this to be more of a case that HAS to be handled, as in having both genders sue him so that he has to goto court and have the matter handled right away. Otherwise this will just be a dog and pony show that opinions will muddy up and someone could possibly end up being hurt.

If he went into this knowing it was a court case and not him being free sadly, he could of set things up better, maybe even have planned out people to sue him to help speed things along and force a hand faster. These things cannot keep happening, I'd rather Mac wrestle boys than girls, for many reasons, your gender is in your mind, not your body, kinda where everything else is that makes us who we are is so why aren't many of yours open?

a reply to: Gryphon66

Of course, those are monitored by a physician, the levels are recorded and maintained at normal teenaged boy levels ...

Isn't that the problem, when competing against girls?

I see the problem not so much that Mac is transgender as it is that Mac is taking medications that changes the body's functional abilities.

a reply to: Gryphon66

The truth is that some people refuse to understand or accept transfolk and just want to make their lives as hard as possible in the name of "protect our children from boys in the girls room".

Small minds - big...otry

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn
a reply to: Gryphon66

Of course, those are monitored by a physician, the levels are recorded and maintained at normal teenaged boy levels ...

Isn't that the problem, when competing against girls?

I see the problem not so much that Mac is transgender as it is that Mac is taking medications that changes the body's functional abilities.

Mack wants to compete against other boys; Texas law requires him to compete against girls ... the whole "plumbing determines gender" crap.

originally posted by: veracity
a reply to: Gryphon66

The truth is that some people refuse to understand or accept transfolk and just want to make their lives as hard as possible in the name of "protect our children from boys in the girls room".

Small minds - big...otry

I am amazed at the bile directed at this topic. Everyone is free to have different opinions.

Rights are not limited by opinions.

a reply to: Tranceopticalinclined

You think maybe national coverage of a boy winning the Girls State Wrestling title might help bring attention to the ludicrous Texas laws?

As well as the laws which say that "plumbing determines gender."

I do feel sorry for the girls, and sorry for Mack. I hope these circumstances actually make a difference.