Turkey shot down Russian Jet: reportedly by two F16's

a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

You're starting to catch on: yes, Erdogan is a gangster. What you don't understand is that Putin is a bigger gangster. Read up on the history of gangland Chicago. Putin is Al Capone, Erdogan is Bugs Moran. When Capone hits Bugs Moran, Moran has to hit Capone back harder. Of course, you'll be happy to know that Al Capone came out on top thanks to a Valentine's Day present.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

You're starting to catch on: yes, Erdogan is a gangster. What you don't understand is that Putin is a bigger gangster. Read up on the history of gangland Chicago. Putin is Al Capone, Erdogan is Bugs Moran. When Capone hits Bugs Moran, Moran has to hit Capone back harder. Of course, you'll be happy to know that Al Capone came out on top thanks to a Valentine's Day present.

Well congrats to Erdogan!!!!


He has in one action:

1) Contracted his economy by BILLIONS in one swoop because he's such a tough guy

2) Is now going to make NATO allies and the EU, and the Shanghai Cooperation countries suspect of his activities

3) Emboldened the SUNNI Fundamentalist factions more

4) Lost all future contracts with Russia, it's MAIN Energy partner for decades..


YAY ERDOGAN!!! TOUGH GUY!!!

a reply to: DJW001

That depends on which group they affiliate with. The ones who joined the FSA are not terrorist; those who joined al Nusra or DAESH are probably committing terrorist acts and are therefore terrorists. Remember: "terrorist" is a label used by politicians to demonize their enemies, as well as a word to describe people who actually use terror as a tactic.

So you define the FSA as freedom fighters and not terrorists? The same FSA that has been selling weapons and hostages to the likes of ISIS? Funny that.
www.ibtimes.com...

Video of man that spent time with Isis saying fsa is selling them weapons and that Assad is the only force truly putting up a fight against them

Because your definitions and reasoning contradicts itself from thread to thread, just like Russian policy. Is there a reason for that?

As do your own by the looks of it

a reply to: sosobad

Nobody knows who the "FSA" is anymore. Not even ranked members in Congress who sit on intelligence committees.

Nobody does, only the FSA does.

a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

Who are the "FSA"?

Tell us. Who are they comprised of? Let's answer that very important elusive question, shall we?

This should get you started. Note their enemies list: it includes the Syrian Army, al Nusra (al Qaeda), and "ISIL." Something tells me you believe otherwise; if so, please educate me politely.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

Who are the "FSA"?

Tell us. Who are they comprised of? Let's answer that very important elusive question, shall we?

This should get you started. Note their enemies list: it includes the Syrian Army, al Nusra (al Qaeda), and "ISIL." Something tells me you believe otherwise; if so, please educate me politely.

If only life were as simple as a Google or Wikipedia page.

*rolls eyes*

a reply to: sosobad

So you define the FSA as freedom fighters and not terrorists? The same FSA that has been selling weapons to the likes of ISIS? Funny that.
www.ibtimes.com...

I never said the situation wasn't fluid. There is a saying in that part of the world: "the enemy of my enemy is my friend."

originally posted by: BatheInTheFountain
a reply to: sosobad

Nobody knows who the "FSA" is anymore. Not even ranked members in Congress who sit on intelligence committees.

Nobody does, only the FSA does.

Don't worry DJW001 supposedly does so you can sleep safe in that knowledge

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: sosobad

So you define the FSA as freedom fighters and not terrorists? The same FSA that has been selling weapons to the likes of ISIS? Funny that.
www.ibtimes.com...

I never said the situation wasn't fluid. There is a saying in that part of the world: "the enemy of my enemy is my friend."

HAHAHAHAHAHA So yeah, let's provide them with Billions in weapons then...

So we can see how 'fluid' they are. ALLAHU AKBAR!!!

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: sosobad

So you define the FSA as freedom fighters and not terrorists? The same FSA that has been selling weapons to the likes of ISIS? Funny that.
www.ibtimes.com...

I never said the situation wasn't fluid. There is a saying in that part of the world: "the enemy of my enemy is my friend."

But you define the Turkmen that joined the FSA as not terrorists so which is it? I know you are trying to make a point but those living in glass mansions shouldn't throw stones

a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

If only life were as simple as a Google or Wikipedia page.

*rolls eyes*

Thank you for your polite and in depth explanation. There are no good guys or bad guys, just enemies. To return to the topic of the thread, Erdogan had no choice: it is the Law of the Schoolyard. If a bully smashes you in the face and says: "Oops! It was an accident," you can be pretty sure it wasn't an accident. If he does it again, you have no choice but to stand up to him. If you don't, he'll extort your lunch money for the rest of your life. You have to promise him that if he so much as looks at you sidewise, you'll put his lights out. And you have to do it. Sucker punch and lay him out.

Yes, I have just compared Erdogan and Putin to gangsters and children. Someone had to stand up to the class bully, Putin. Naturally, it would have to be another thug.

a reply to: sosobad

But you define the Turkmen that joined the FSA as not terrorists so which is it?

I thought I made that clear: the ones that don't use terror as a tactic.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: sosobad

But you define the Turkmen that joined the FSA as not terrorists so which is it?

I thought I made that clear: the ones that don't use terror as a tactic.

You said the fsa, you must mean "moderates" yes? The same "moderates" selling American hostages and weapons to ISIS? Yes?

a reply to: sosobad

You and others looking for the truth need to read this piece .....guaranteed not to be a big surprise but will surely give some much needed ammunition to this conflict . www.informationclearinghouse.info...

Israeli Colonel Caught with IS Pants Down

By F. William Engdahl

originally posted by: BatheInTheFountain


"Better deal with it"?

I live in Los Angeles bud. I don't have to "DEAL" with any of it. You speak as if I'm personally involved, I'm not, so I don't care.

Secondly....any modern radar in a NATO country with post 80s weaponry knows the make, model, signature, ID of whatever jet fighters they are tracking or locking on to. This wasn't a "Oh I thought it was Assad himself flying that plane" mistake.

Well , Russian nukes can and will reach you too . Los Angeles is not immune to the danger Russia provides .

So you are involved but choose to remain aloof ?
Fine by me .

As for the plane identification issue prior to shooting ; well if what you say is true we would have no need for Friend or Foe systems , would we ?

Russia has been told i.e tried to reason with , twice .

Russian ambassador was called by Turks and asked not to bomb Turkmens and not to violate the borders .

Russians were TOLD that TURKS will shoot ANY plane .

Putin choose to believe in his own hype and sent those pilots to die .

Obviously Putin is going to push out at least 2 million refugees out of Syria , headed for not Russia but guess where ?

Europe is in a mess , so as US & Turkey while Russia - Iran - China are laughing all the way to bank .

That is what you are asking to happen .

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

If only life were as simple as a Google or Wikipedia page.

*rolls eyes*

Thank you for your polite and in depth explanation. There are no good guys or bad guys, just enemies. To return to the topic of the thread, Erdogan had no choice: it is the Law of the Schoolyard. If a bully smashes you in the face and says: "Oops! It was an accident," you can be pretty sure it wasn't an accident. If he does it again, you have no choice but to stand up to him. If you don't, he'll extort your lunch money for the rest of your life. You have to promise him that if he so much as looks at you sidewise, you'll put his lights out. And you have to do it. Sucker punch and lay him out.

Yes, I have just compared Erdogan and Putin to gangsters and children. Someone had to stand up to the class bully, Putin. Naturally, it would have to be another thug.

Succintly put dare I say !

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: sosobad

You and others looking for the truth need to read this piece .....guaranteed not to be a big surprise but will surely give some much needed ammunition to this conflict . www.informationclearinghouse.info...

Israeli Colonel Caught with IS Pants Down

By F. William Engdahl

Just skimmed the start but holy #... Has this been picked up anywhere else??

Eta thank you for the link

a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

HAHAHAHAHAHA So yeah, let's provide them with Billions in weapons then...

So we can see how 'fluid' they are. ALLAHU AKBAR!!!

I am opposed to the United States getting involved in the region, or haven't you been reading my posts. Arming the rebels was a foolish mistake. As you seem to be aware, although you have never expressed it clearly, alliances and allegiances can shift rapidly there. Turkey, Iraq and, yes, Iran, have reason to get involved. There is a poisonous brew of religion and politics that non-Muslim nations need to avoid. I believe that this is a "struggle for the soul of Islam" that should be left to the ummah to settle by whatever means they see fit.

To return to the actual topic of the thread: the strategic logic of the situation absolutely dictated that Erdogan act as he did. No-one has explained why that is not the case. Erdogan can count on Russia not wanting to lose access to the Bosporus, nor running the risk of losing face by losing a military confrontation over it. Anyone see it differently?

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: sosobad

You and others looking for the truth need to read this piece .....guaranteed not to be a big surprise but will surely give some much needed ammunition to this conflict . www.informationclearinghouse.info...

Israeli Colonel Caught with IS Pants Down

By F. William Engdahl

As you know from having posted the original source of this off topic item on other threads, this is disinformation. Please start a fresh thread so I can debunk it in detail.

ETA: Or if you wish, I will start a thread in "Deconstructing Disinformation" tomorrow.

a reply to: DJW001

Go start your own thread and then you wont have to debunk it ......you will probably pick up a few flags and stars for your effort as well .....peace