Speaking of the Devil....

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Thus fascism, by popular tongue, would render into a police-state scenario/ideology. Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin and later Franco were all fascist despots presiding over brutally and rigorously enforced police states.

This is something that was come up with in the decades after WW II, and has percolated down into pop culture, and has nothing to do with the actual historical ideology of Fascism.

Nazism is about as far from socialism as your bullsh*t is from cattle.

According to modern pop culture's defining the term to mean anything that is not what we are told we live under.

its connection to Mussolini and Hitler and so on.

Like I said, ignoring the original term, and going with a basically propaganda driven version of a definition of the word.

flanked by their respective symbols under the motto «Two peoples and One struggle».

They were both against Europe being taken over by the Soviet Union, the same thing that NATO exists for since the Italian's and German's military capabilities were crushed in the war.

Anyway, the topic here is if Hitler was Satan, or that if "Hitler's throne" was somehow Satan's throne in actuality, and was predicted in biblical prophecy.
I would say that that sort of idea comes from basically a comic book level caricature of who and what Hitler was, that is fueled by the cover created by the actual responsible bodies, as I suggested earlier, the unholy trinity of conspirators, Roosevelt, Churchill, and Stalin, who used an attack on Poland as a pretense to start the war, then immediately agreed on dissolving the state of Poland once the war started.

a reply to: NOTurTypical

Are you a Nazi sympathizer?

Just someone who believes in getting history straight and not perpetuating myths that keep going on in mainstream media that Germans are naturally evil somehow. That, and the fact that these ideas are not pushed for no good reason, that there is actually a pay-off for those behind it, and not to the benefit of the regular person.

Now I understand that ideologically, for your beliefs about an apocalypse, the mythology is useful for propping it up, which is the justification for the existence of the modern so-called state of Israel, that supposedly, according to the eschatological scheme, has to exist to "fulfill prophecy".

Anyway, I do not buy into the scheme, that some people read the Bible and were able to come up with this whole chain of events that has to happen just that way in the future. I think that we are living right now the predicted future according to prophecy, which has been going on since Christianity began.

a reply to: jmdewey60

There is no fascism ideology. Faschism isn't the name of an ideology, claiming Mussolini had anything other in mind than power and greed, say any philosophical or political motivation would be historical anachronism. What you are demonstrating here, while claiming your opponents do the same.

Since you don't seem to get even the most fundamental issues concerning this, I'll try a bit of shouting instead, since you seem like the kind who like authority and fasces:

FASC-ISM means BATON-ISM, POLICE-ISM, it is NOT an IDEOLOGY, it's a VIOLENT POLITICAL STRATEGY, a CANCEROUS state of affairs where the STATE ATTACKS ITSELF, and FASC-ISM is about as rooted in ideology as is TERROR-ISM.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Nice work. I will truly come back & discuss properly, I feel like the boy who cried wolf, I solemnly swear in the presence of these here gathered witnesses that I will add something of substance shortly, I'm just trying to stay in the loop. Or not.. (??)

a reply to: jmdewey60

Have you ever heard of a little thing called the European Union? The German chancellor is its most influential member, aside from the equivalent of the CEO & Board of Trustees.

There is no mythology anywhere in British media, nor I suspect in American media, that claims that Germans are evil. We always claim that Fascism is evil, and that it raised its ugly head/s approximately 70 years ago. Eventually it was beaten back into the Abyss, thanks to Russians, Brits & Americans (not forgetting the Commonwealth & Gurkha types, etc, too many to mention...) We (meaning our forefathers, God rest them) beat it down, and it stayed down. People like YOU are trying to resurrect its wicked ghost by alleging that there is some sort of philosophical virtue in Fascism. There is not, nor ever was.

The insanity of Fascism as touted by various Nazi bigwigs had roots in the occult lore concerning the 'Norse ray', used in Black Magic, and they held that there was some sort of inherent genetic virtue in the Germanic/Teutonic/Aryan man.

However, we of course know that when we give up the ghost, we are all absolutely 100% equal before Infinity. So stop being a dumbass, and learn the real history of the war behind the war before you start making up bull# and drawing curious souls into an ever-descending spiral of demonic misery.

Did you know that.. Never mind - go read up for yourself. And stop talking bollocks - you're dishonouring the dead. I'm fairly sure I'm on the money with my opinion of your thought processes. Back to reality now, please.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Damn, the Fenrir is furious, getting all frantic and red-eyed here, can't hold him back much longer I'm afraid, and I don't know for how much longer we can keep our ouroboros sucking his tail-- And now an oath?!? Oh dear. Better buy another sixpack and toss the Wolf another ox.

Another thing that made Pergamon famous was an invention, parchment. It came as a result of the Egyptians enforcing an embargo on papyrus to the Greeks (and also the Romans I think). That's why parchment is called Pergament in many Germanic languages.

He who controls the written word, holds in his hand the power of the mightiest weapon known to man. He who holds pen and paper, can allow the serpents (books, sentences) descend upon (in this case) the parchment, so in that respect, parchment or in today's technology, paper or the screen in front of you-- are thrones for Satan. After all none of us would know much anything about John's Satan had we not owned and/or read a copy of the Bible. Satan comes with the Bible, but after Hellenism had swept over the area the Bible starts pointing in direction of the Olymp as the nest of our royal dragon, forwarding his divine powers to the kings and emperors, presidents and prime ministers of our world, even today we reduce accidents by naming our spaceships and other odyssey endeavours, like deep-sea exploration and so on. It actually works too. Moving working magic.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

People like YOU are trying to resurrect its wicked ghost by alleging that there is some sort of philosophical virtue in Fascism.

Did you miss the part where I said that it wasn't Fascism?
So I could not have been promoting Fascism.

The insanity of Fascism as touted by various Nazi bigwigs had roots in the occult lore concerning the 'Norse ray', used in Black Magic, and they held that there was some sort of inherent genetic virtue in the Germanic/Teutonic/Aryan man.

Have you ever considered that this is a sort of urban legend perpetuated by things like Raiders of the Lost Ark?

And stop talking bollocks - you're dishonouring the dead.

I think that we jeopardize our future by protecting cherished memories that make us feel good about the past even if how we think of it is actually not historically accurate.
I know that I wouldn't do something like tell my ninety something year old father that he was really just working for the corporations when he went off to WW II, but to people my age and younger, I think we need to start handling the truth since the people who we are protecting are pretty much out of the picture now, and we can shake off all that war-time propaganda now.
If you want mainstream media to tell you history, then there is actually a good movie to watch, that puts it in the right perspective, The Book Thief.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Faschism isn't the name of an ideology . . .

That is just wrong, and that mistaken assumption can be rectified simply, by doing things like looking up the term in Wikipedia.

a reply to: jmdewey60

OK. Tell me about the great minds behind the Fascism ideology. Which thinkers and political philosophers have written what books? Fascism is a violent power strategy that comes in the shape of manuals, not manifestos. Fascist "societies" are often based on confiscating fortunes from rich minorities and putting parts of their feudal like class-society into the gallows or into forced labour under terrible conditions, like slavery, another such strategy. Introversive divide and conquer. Recipe for disaster. Machiavelli and Nietzsche may have inspired many fascists, but neither of them ever coined or related their ideological philosophies to anything you could call fascism. Pull your head up of the sand and do some tidying up in your sources. Real history my arse.

BTW: The Secretary General of NATO is a socialist.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

confiscating fortunes and putting parts of their feudal like class-society into forced labour under terrible conditions, like slavery, another such strategy.

OK, and can you correctly picture what America is all about by pointing out what happened to Japanese American people and how they were treated during WW II?
Anyway, you are just talking about a mythological definition for Fascism that was come upon after the fact to demonize the people who were destroyed in WW II.
Like I was trying to say earlier, the German government in the Hitler era was socialist, which is the opposite of Fascism, that is for the workers, as the name suggests, the Worker's Party. So people in war-time labor camps were actually considered criminals, and is not an example of how the general population was meant to be treated per the party's ideology, any more than prisons in the US represent how Americans are expected to live under our system of government.

originally posted by: jmdewey60
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

confiscating fortunes and putting parts of their feudal like class-society into forced labour under terrible conditions, like slavery, another such strategy.

OK, and can you correctly picture what America is all about by pointing out what happened to Japanese American people were treated during WW II.
Anyway, you are just talking about a mythological definition for Fascism that was come upon after the fact to demonize the people who were destroyed in WW II.
Like I was trying to say earlier, the German government in the Hitler era was socialist, which is the opposite f Fascism, that is for the workers, as the name suggests, the Worker's Party. So people in war-time labor camps were actually considered criminals, and is not an example of how the general population was meant to be treated per the party's ideology, any more than prisons in the US represent how Americans are expected to live under out system of government.

Unless you know, between 1943 and 1945 Mussolini called his fascist state «The Italian Social Republic». Socialism was a fancy word, a bone they could toss in, but Mussolini and Hitler were about as socialist as Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

. . . but Mussolini and Hitler were . . .

OK, then by the same logic, Roosevelt and Churchill were both Communist since they were allies with Stalin.

originally posted by: jmdewey60
Like I was trying to say earlier, the German government in the Hitler era was socialist

No, the socialists were executed and put into concentration camps. Strewth! Start off with the nazis' half-arsed false-flag Reichtag's fire. Socialism was the arch enemy of Hitler and Mussolini, so they did the old Roman wooly wolf routine, they posed as the new wine. And they failed. Like you do here.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Socialism was the arch enemy of Hitler and Mussolini, . . .

You seem to be mixing up socialism with Soviet style Communism. And not just a "style", but people working for the fall of Germany, and the takeover by the Soviets.
So it was more than just a disagreement over ideologies, one, the Soviet, believed in the dissolving of the state of Germany, and the nationalists, as the name should imply, were for there being an actual sovereign state of Germany.
The point being that yes, some communists were rounded up, as you suggested, but they were actually traitors to the country that they lived in.

originally posted by: jmdewey60
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

. . . but Mussolini and Hitler were . . .

OK, then by the same logic, Roosevelt and Churchill were both Communist since they were allies with Stalin.

No, Soviet was an enemy of Nazi Germany since Soviet were Socialist. Not much of Marx or Engels to be found among the roots of National Socialism I'm afraid. Communism is a socialistic ideology, Marxist-Stalinism is basically Fascism disguised as socialism as so much else sporting a guise of «socialism».

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

. . . Soviet was an enemy of Nazi Germany since Soviet were Socialist.
. . . Marxist-Stalinism is basically Fascism disguised as socialism . . .

So you don't have a problem with it being both of these things at the same time?
When you make these terms so fluid as to their definitions, they loose whatever meaning that they might have had.

a reply to: jmdewey60

No, not at all. When they ARE. Socialism can turn into fascism as can any other social experiment or political endeavour.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

No, not at all. When they ARE. Socialism can turn into fascism as can any other social experiment or political endeavour.

Or, the language can be corrupted to where "Fascist" just becomes a general derogatory term that is applied to any manifestation of the power of government that you do not like.

a reply to: jmdewey60

Again, can you please explain to us all what fascism is since you hold the light here and since everything that has been taught and learned about fascism is wrong.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

. . . please explain to us all what fascism is . . .

Earlier you had said that "Fascism is a violent power strategy that comes in the shape of manuals, not manifestos."
I would say that this comes from a post-war redefining of the term in order to be able to identify the German government's ruling party's philosophy as being fascist, keeping in step with the myth that was being created in the early Fifties of things like funding the war with belongings pilfered from luggage of transported people as they were being placed in camps.
You see similar mythologizing with current movies such as The Monuments Men, where supposedly Germans were "stealing" art treasures which happened to wind up in bunkers while the Allies were bombing the heck out of every city in the country.

If you look at the definition for Fascim at dictionary dot com, you will see the first two out of three definitions being ones that were created in the decades after WW II that were made up to make the word to mean basically, "whatever the Germans were in the Thirties and Forties under Hitler".

Once you get down to definition #3, you find what the original term meant before it was co opted into popular culture to mean the synonym of "NAZI".

"Fascism" originally meant a system of rule that was basically a form of corporatocracy, where the real power behind the government was the large corporations that called the shots and the people in the legislature and administrative and judicial branches were more like figureheads to give an appearance of legitimacy to how the country was being run.

Socialism, which the Hitler Era German government was, is the opposite thing, which is where the concern is for the average working class people and things were run to benefit them, rather than a small group of super-rich capitalists.