Breaking the Strong Delusion: Our Morality vs. God's Morality

a reply to: Bleeeeep

Could you please point out where I lied so I can address it? Any lies were unintentional so if there is a mistake I would like to clear it up.

Please understand that we have two different perspectives of Christianity. I understand that from your perspective I want to "raise myself up" and I'm driven by the same pride and arrogance of the Devil himself. I assure you that's not the case. I do not believe God exists, so in no way am I trying to raise myself to his level or above it. Absolutely nothing of the sort.

I'm not sure what you think I think I'm so deserving of.

I have read those verses and am familiar with how faith works. As you no doubt have seen by now, I used to be a Christian.

What don't I have an idea about, specifically?

Why am I asking questions about a God I do not believe exists? Because truth is important to me. Without asking questions answers will never be found. I tried to structure my OP in such a way that allowed readers to come to their own conclusions, by asking the questions themselves. Instead of an OP that seems closed to discussion. No doubt it seems that way to a lot of people anyway.

originally posted by: graphuto
Interesting that most of these people's problems are the same problem that Lucifer/Satan had. Pride. To exalt themselves above God.

VERY good point...

Sadly, this might explain why so few make it to Heaven.

I wonder if the very thing that got Satan drop kicked out of Heaven is the same thing that keeps most from entering in?

Melisa: But if they could just see you...

Jesus: Not even that would be enough. Look at Satan, he stood before me in the very throne room of God. But he thought the beauty and the power bestowed was somehow earned. Gave himself over to pride. Scratch any sin and just below the surface you'll find pride...

He refused to admit he was wrong. Eventually Lucifer became entrenched in his pride and God could no longer influence him. God reluctantly removed from his position of Chief Covering angel. Lucifer was thrown out of Heaven, along with the angels who had chosen to follow him. Satan had it all, he really did, think about it for a moment, his title was “Chief Covering angel” That means he was over ALL the other angels in Heaven! Source

“I will ascend above the highest clouds, I will make myself like the Most High.” Isaiah 14:14

originally posted by: graphuto
Interesting that most of these people's problems are the same problem that Lucifer/Satan had. Pride. To exalt themselves above God.

That's an unfair assumption that is wrong in most cases. I can't speak for everyone of course, but as far as atheists go, no. You can't exalt yourself above that which you do not believe exists. Atheists aren't people who believe God exists but choose not to follow him. We have yet to see evidence in support of the existence of any God and thus have no reason to conclude that there is one.

originally posted by: WakeUpBeer
We have yet to see evidence in support of the existence of any God...

Life is not an open book test.

Not long ago, the Lord gave me $200,000. I said, "Lord, what am I going to do with it? I don't need it. What did You give it to me for?" He said, "You passed my test."I said, "Passed your test? What in the world did I do to pass Your test?" He said, "You fulfilled a scripture. Tell them everywhere you go...tell them that the Bible is my test; every time they fulfill a scripture, tell them to never worry about the answers to their prayers."

Misguided Faith by Norvel Hayes.

Once you reach the other side, you'll understand.

God has revealed Himself to everyone...

NO one is inexcusable just because they say they don’t believe in Him.

Melisa: But surely no one would choose that if they knew you really existed?

Jesus: Not so, nobody goes into hell blindfolded. In one way or another, I've revealed myself to everyone.

Source

As to those who live in tribes without God’s Word, God has revealed Himself in the hearts of all men. Through general revelation, man can sense God’s existence and see His power. www.tillhecomes.org...

In Ro 1:18-20, Paul was declaring that God has revealed Himself to all mankind. Old Testament scriptures proclaim that God has revealed Himself to everyone through nature (Ps 19:1-3), but Paul was stating here that there is an intuitive revelation of God within every person.

There are five words used in these three verses to describe the extent to which God has revealed Himself to mankind, and they are worth special note. Any one of these five words used by itself would have made a strong argument for Paul's case. However, the combination of these words in just two sentences emphasizes the certainty of Paul's claims.

The use of the word "all" in Ro 1:18 shows the extent to which God has revealed Himself. God has placed a witness within every person against all ungodliness and unrighteousness.

Therefore, no one will be able to stand before God on the Day of Judgment and say, "God is not fair." He has given all people who have ever lived, regardless of how remote or isolated they may have been, the opportunity to know Him. They are without excuse.

www.awmi.net...

a reply to: WakeUpBeer

I won't point out all your errors, but I will clarify that by me asking you of what you thought you were so deserving of, I meant deserving of rights.

What is it that you have done to deserve rights? Especially such rights that would allow you to judge God?

And it was rhetorical questions -- unless you think you actually do deserve rights? That you have done something that makes you worthy of any grace? That any covenants weren't by his grace alone?

I know that I haven't done anything of worth compared to him, and that is what I was getting at - that none of us deserve anything by what we have done, but only by what God wills.

It is ridiculous to even ponder such.

God is so unequal to us that even after billions of people, and all this time, and with all of his help, we still haven't a freaking clue. I mean this entire reality is made up of his language, and we're running around like some jackasses. It's sooo brilliant - what he is doing - it is just... it's marvelous. He has made reality his language and it is so simple that a child can understand it but it dumbfounds our highest mountains or highest awareness.

I mean, who can play king of the hill with God? It is so stupid funny, that we actually do try it.

a reply to: Bleeeeep

Were the God of the Jews, Christains and Islamists alive today he would cedrtainly have made himself known - why keep quiet unless of course:

You were nothing other than a war lord who terrorised the Jews into submission by impalling them. The rabbis/priests/imams saw the power he had and wanted a slice of it for themselves so kept his memory alive as it is today.

Doesn't a yone question whny so many prayers aren't answered and there is no saving humanity from the brinks of disasters whatsoever. Were a god to exist he would be capable of manifesting in the material world and would be bossing everyone into submission to his will still, he would rule the world…. so where is he?

a reply to: Shiloh7

Who do you think you're looking at?

By whose breath do you have life?

Where do you think you are?

John 14:20

Yep.

Ask yourself: Can you put a boundry on reality? If you say yes, then what is outside that? And if something, then what is outside that, ad infinitum. And what's the one place that doesn't need boundries like that? It's in the mind's eye. Now, what do you really think this place is? Our current paradigm isn't logical. The Bible, however odd it may seem - it works.

originally posted by: Shiloh7
Doesn't anyone question why so many prayers aren't answered and there is no saving humanity from the brinks of disasters whatsoever…. so where is he?

God doesn't answer everyone's prayers...

Prayers that focus on our own passions and selfish desires are best left unanswered.

“As I look at the way the disciples prayed back then and as I look at the way Jesus taught us to pray, I realize it’s a lot different from what I was taught. Prayer to them was really different, they asked for things that were different from what I typically asked for. We have to check ourselves and ask am I concerned about the things of God?”

Is it possible that our prayers go unanswered because we are praying out of a sense of obligation or maybe for the wrong things? Are our prayers supposed to be a list of things we want, or are they really intended to be an ongoing dialogue with God about the things He wants? Maybe if we align our prayers with God's mission, we would see God answer our prayers in supernatural ways that we could never imagine.

James 1 says if we doubt, he's not going to listen to us, James 4 says if we ask with the wrong motives, he's not going to listen to us, first Peter 3 says, if I don't honor my wife, man my prayers are going to be hindered, he says in Isaiah 58 if I don't care for the poor it doesn't even matter if I fast and pray, he's not listening, in Amos I don't even want hear the noise of your songs, you know I'm not going to listen to that... He says if my people would humble themselves, you know and turn from their wicked ways I mean there's conditions, you're absolutely right, he does not listen to every prayer, but he listens to mine...

If one of my kids wants something from me, first they will yell ask from where ever they are in the house. If I don’t respond, they will come looking for me. And if they’ve discovered I’ve locked myself in my bathroom, they will knock on the door. You’ve got to love their persistence. We should have the same sort of zeal when we want something from God.

Ask – receive, Seek – find, Knock – the door will be opened. Now carrying that same child-parent analogy forward, do I give my whiny kid everything he/she asks for? Nope. But I give them something. Sometimes it is a NO. Sometimes a swift kick in the pants. James says when we ask with the wrong motives we don’t get what we want. But Jesus says, “Ask and it will be given to you,” so what is up? I don’t know. This is something I need to ask, seek and knock on this week. Source

The Bible tells us a couple important things about asking.

1. We might ask for things that when we don’t really understand their full impact. Mark 10:35-45

2. We might ask with the wrong motives. James 4:3

3. We might not even ask at all. James 4:2, John 16:24

Why do I want more of God? Do I really understand what I am asking for? What would my life be like if I had a deeper, more intimate, relationship with God?

Am I asking for wrong motives? What is my motivation? Am I asking for more because of some need to get something? Would more of God mean my glory or His?

Whether I understand the consequences of my request or not, whether my motives are selfish or not, at least I’m asking. How sad it is that we wouldn’t have all the best of God simply because we didn’t ask.

Be Careful What You Ask For!

“I thought you could just ask for anything, say anything ... you know He’s like a big genie up there,” Chan said. “But you got to be careful what you say.” When the Crazy Love author was first taught how to pray, people advised him to just say whatever came to his mind.

“And so I did,” he remembered. “I would just start opening my mouth and talk to God about whatever and there’s some truth to that but I noticed in the Bible there are also some warnings that we have to be very careful how we approach God. For example, Ecclesiastes 5 says guard yourselves, guard your steps when you go near to the house of God. And it says draw near to listen rather than to offer the sacrifice of fools who do not know that they are doing evil.” Don’t just go and start talking, Chan exhorted. Come silently, come slowly, be careful.

Christians Not Praying How God Intended

a reply to: Bleeeeep

Have I told any lies or just said things you don't agree with?

As far as rights to question the validity of God go, I've already covered that in multiple replies. If you are someone who wants to believe in something without question, you have every right to do so. Do you also believe the gods of other pantheons are real? Or do you question their validity? Do you believe they are just mythological figures? How could you question their existence? We can't comprehend or understand the mind of a God and in your opinion have no right to judge him. I can only assume you have applied the same logic to all the other claimed Gods and Goddesses throughout history. If you haven't, why not?

One of my favorite questions to ask is,

Why won't God heal amputees?

Does God answer prayers? If so, then how do we explain this disconnection between God and amputees? What should we do with the piece of empirical data that amputees represent? We need to somehow explain why God would answer millions of prayers on earth, yet completely ignore prayers for amputated limbs.

Not once has there been a documented case of a restored lost limb! Jesus makes it clear that all prayers are answered, with enough faith. Where is it implied that sometimes the answer is no? In the case of amputees, it seems that the answer is always no. Here are some verses about prayer:

Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!
Mathew 7:7

For truly, I say to you, if you have faith as a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you.
Mathew 17:20

I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done. If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.
Mathew 21:21

Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.
Mark 11:24

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I go to the Father. Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.
John 14:12-14

Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
Mathew 18:19

Keeping it on the moral topic: Did Jesus misrepresent how prayer works? Is there not enough faith from those who pray for miracles to have them answered? It's pretty selfless to pray for amputees, don't you think?

Murgatroid, if you link healed amputee stories like you did in another thread, please make sure they are verified accounts and not anecdotal sources.

Thank you!

originally posted by: Murgatroid
Prayers that focus on our own passions and selfish desires are best left unanswered.

So true. It makes sense, too. If God is Love, and Love is not self-seeking, then it makes sense that God will answer prayers that are based on Love and not self-seeking.

If a prayer comes from selfishness, especially if it's materialistic like, to be rich or to have a huge house or car, then who is that prayer to really? Not God who is Spirit, Love (Agape - Selfless Love).

I like The Saint Francis Prayer:

Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace;
Where there is hatred, let me sow love;
Where there is injury, pardon;
Where there is discord, harmony;
Where there is error, truth;
Where there is doubt, faith;
Where there is despair, hope;
Where there is darkness, light;
And where there is sadness, joy.

O Divine Master, Grant that I may not so much seek
To be consoled as to console;
To be understood as to understand;
To be loved as to love.
For it is in giving that we receive;
It is in forgetting that we find;
It is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
And it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.

Getting more focused on this thread about the morality of God:

If you know Love then you know God because God is Love (1 John 4:8) and Love is not self-seeking (1 Corinthians 13:5). God is Light and there is no darkness within him at all (1 John 1:5). You are The Light of The World and your Light is not supposed to stay hidden under a bowl but to do good works to glorify your Father in Heaven. (Matthew 5:14-16)

Without self-seeking, but only with Agape-Love (Selfless-Love), we would easily forgive and love our enemies, and give to others and go the extra mile for others.

Matthew 5:44-48
But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

People aren't perfect in Love, people make mistakes, but Jesus said to be perfect even as Our Father in Heaven is perfect because completely living through Love is supposed to be our goal. If we love one another, then God lives in us and his Love is complete in us (1 John 4:12). When we live through Love, we lives in God and God lives within us (
1 John 4:16).

a reply to: graphuto

After they stole it and participated in land theft against the town. Again, if God can turn the tide of battle because of foreskins, then he could have protected Laish.

He didn't. Because he is hypocritical. He didn't give a damn about the children. He still doesn't. Amalek is to be genocided forever. We saw the standing orders about that already. How does that mesh with the new fabrication? It can't. It is irreconcilable. It is shows the Bible is fiction.

You are adding your opinion to the text to protect a make believe tribal war God. Lets get the order correct. Dan was seeking thier inheritance. The town was destroyed first. It was approved by YHWH via the priest and matches standing land theft orders given by YHWH to Moses and Joshua to a tee. They stole silver laden idols, and when caught, offered a slot to the priest on the perceived winning team. The prior list of genocide listed had nothing to do with idol worship. It is how YHWH rolls. He's either a psychopath or the invention of men.

This is not hard to figure out. Besides, early Judaism was polytheistic. Would you like to explore that angle next?

Such a biased, weak and small God. Maybe.... He wasn't God! Perhaps just a local fictional tribal war deity. Just one of many from the surrounding area.

I care less with name calling. Like non believer is slanderous or spooky. I think such blind defence of genocide is inhuman.

Do you support genocide too? Are you anti humanitarian? Is genocide is cool with you, long as it is your favorite God doing it?

I find this very sick.

Funny you bring up physics and math. Would you like to discuss the implications of many worlds without YHWH? Or better yet, observer effect with intent?

Wink.

a reply to: Bleeeeep

Whatever. Faith, or saving faith, my prayers are answered through my faith in my higher self, not God or Jesus.

a reply to: Not Authorized

Why do you keep mixing two stories? Amalek and Laish had nothing to do with one another...

a reply to: Bleeeeep

Again, you are not God's equal. And you can write any lie you want but it won't change the fact that you're seeking to judge him - that you want to raise yourself up - and I'm not giving you that...

i'll quit trying to raise myself up when he quits trying to pin me down with his thumb.

a reply to: graphuto

They are related. The "inheritance" narrative starts in the Books of Moses, leads to Joshua, into Judges, and thus continues into Samuel. Judges 18:1. What was Dan still seeking? Did not YHWH himself start the entire book as a continuation of Joshua's conquest in Judges 1:2?

As this thread is about God's morality, we can discuss YHWH's failures of morality using the entire text to draw out his attributes. For this purpose I choose to use a set of examples. I focus on YHWH's modus operandi, or in English, his overall "method of operation."

Genocide is demonstratively one of the preferable methods YHWH employs throughout the earlier texts. And no insults, ignoring it, calling me an unbeliever, or unleashing red-herrings to make me look at the tree, instead of the forest, will work or detract me from the obvious.

Let's focus further onto the bigger picture, and place YHWH's genocidal actions under today's morality microscope.

gen·o·cide
ˈjenəˌsīd/
noun
noun: genocide; plural noun: genocides

the deliberate killing of a large group of people, especially those of a particular ethnic group or nation.

Deliberate killing of a large group of people, or a particular ethnic group or nation.. That seems oddly familiar.. One needs only to open the pages of the Old Testament to see it commanded by YHWH, and carried out in action.

But said definition of genocide doesn't stop there. The Rome Statute for the International Criminal Court further defines genocide as the following:

Article 6
Genocide
For the purpose of this Statute, "genocide" means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

Did YHWH command any of those items within that list, at that at anytime? Yes. He did. Multiple times (see prior postings/links). The Old Testament is ripe with YHWH's genocide and commanded atrocities.

Furthermore, to expand on morality of today. We also have what is now known as "crimes against humanity":

Article 7
Crimes against humanity
1. For the purpose of this Statute, "crime against humanity" means any of the following acts when committed as part of a widespread or systematic attack directed against any civilian population, with knowledge of the attack:
(a) Murder;
(b) Extermination;
(c) Enslavement;
(d) Deportation or forcible transfer of population;
(e) Imprisonment or other severe deprivation of physical liberty in violation of fundamental rules of international law;
(f) Torture;
(g) Rape, sexual slavery, enforced prostitution, forced pregnancy, enforced sterilization, or any other form of sexual violence of comparable gravity;
(h) Persecution against any identifiable group or collectivity on political, racial, national, ethnic, cultural, religious, gender as defined in paragraph 3, or other grounds that are universally recognized as impermissible under international law, in connection with any act referred to in this paragraph or any crime within the jurisdiction of the Court;
(i) Enforced disappearance of persons;
(j) The crime of apartheid;
(k) Other inhumane acts of a similar character intentionally causing great suffering, or serious injury to body or to mental or physical health.

Does the shoe fit YHWH in that list as well? You betcha. War crimes are also listed in the next article, but, I think you get the picture.

By today's morality and standards, if YHWH made himself known today. He would be known as a serial mass murderer. A genocidal maniac with multiple "ethnic cleanings" under his belt. An easily identifiable pyschopath, a demonstrable criminal against humanity, worthy of the death penalty.

And no, wiggling your way out of these definitions by using a excuse like: "but but, YHWH doesn't match ALL of them, so, it doesn't apply!", will not work. Just one match on any of those items are sufficient to match the word to the deed.

Why do you defend and worship a minor tribal war god with an affinity for commanding on-the-fly genocide?

originally posted by: WakeUpBeer
Where is it implied that sometimes the answer is no?

This was answered in above reply to another post...

More below:

Possible Reasons Prayer May Not Be Answered

When our prayers go unanswered, the first thing many Christians ask is, “What’s wrong with God? Why hasn’t He responded to my prayer?” It’s a normal human response, because it’s a lot easier to blame God than to look into a mirror and say, “Maybe I’m the problem.” At some point we should ask if the problem resides within ourselves—that sin may have cut off our communication with the Father? Scripture states: “If I had cherished sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened” (Psalm 66:18) and, “Your iniquities have separated you from your God; your sins have hidden his face from you, so that he will not hear” (Isaiah 59:2). We cannot live however we want, and then enjoy open communication with God.

If you are tolerating sin in your life, don’t waste your breath praying, unless it’s a prayer of confession. “Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed” (James 5:16). Receive the Lord’s forgiveness, and then He will listen when you call out to Him.

Some prayer requests, no matter how well-intentioned, are simply inappropriate. They could be self-serving, frivolous, or not in accord with God’s nature. They put the focus on our agenda, rather than on God’s plans. A last-ditch plea for an “A” on the test will likely not succeed if the student has not studied. Prison chaplains have reported hearing criminals confess that the only time they prayed was when was when they felt they were in danger of getting caught—which would actually make God an accessory to their crimes.

Many Christians are quick to quote, “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!” (Matthew 7:7,8,11). But “it is God’s prerogative to give good things, things that we have need of, and if in our limited earthly perspective we ask for things that do not come under these headings God, like any good parent, reserves the right to say ‘No, not that; it wouldn’t be good for you—but have this instead.’ ” My 5-year old-daughter, Natalie, has an incredible sweet tooth. If we let her, she would be content to live on candy alone. Obviously, as her parents, we do not allow her to subsist on sugar alone—despite her frequent pleadings to do so—because we know this is not good for her health. Like any good parent, while God never simply ignores what we are saying, often He gives us what we should have asked for, rather than what we actually requested.

Fortunately, our God loves us too much to say yes to inappropriate requests. I wouldn’t want a God who would do any less than that. We may fool ourselves into thinking selfish requests are appropriate, but we can’t fool God. He knows when our motives are destructive, and He often protects us from them by saying no.

Before bringing a request to the Lord, we would do well to ask ourselves four questions: (1) Would it bring glory to God? (2) Would it advance His kingdom? (3) Would it help people? and, (4) Would it help me to grow spiritually? May our prayer be, “Lord, help me present requests that are in line with your will.”

There are times when God chooses not to give any reason at all for why He does not answer prayer. When Jesus was at the Pool of Bethesda, He only healed one paralytic (John 5:1-15), even though there were sick people lying all around the pool. We are never told why it was the Father’s will only to heal the one person and to allow all the other sick people to continue suffering. God is truly sovereign, and He does not have to explain himself to anyone.

The Challenge of Unanswered Prayer

Often, we can see in retrospect that some prayers prove better off unanswered.

The Bible clearly reveals several obstacles that can hinder our prayers. This is not to say that God only answers prayer when the conditions are perfect. He is God, and can do anything He wants, at any time He wants. No one can limit the work of the Holy Spirit, and divine answer to prayer has certainly occurred in some unlikely cases. However, our prayers may go unanswered for a number of reasons. If you have been praying diligently about a matter, and it seems as if God has stopped talking, maybe you need to reexamine your request. Maybe your request stems from self-serving motivations, or is simply inappropriate; maybe there is unwillingness on your part to face the real issue; maybe the answer to your prayer would be destructive in ways you don’t understand. Maybe it’s short-sighted or too small. Maybe God has something better in mind.

1. Unconfessed sin, or Disobedience (Exodus 23:25; Numbers 12:10; Psalm 66:18; Proverbs 28:13; Isaiah 1:15,16; 59:2; John 15:7; James 5:16; 1 John 3:21,22)

2. Lack of faith (Matthew 17:20; 13:58; 15:21-28; Mark 6:5,6; 9:23; 11:22-24; James 1:5-7; 5:15)

3. Violating the natural laws of nature (Romans 12:1; 1 Corinthians 3:16,17; 6:19,20; Galatians 6:7)

4. Old age/Appointed time to die (Ecclesiastes 3:2; Romans 5:12; 2 Corinthians 5:8; Hebrews 9:27)

5. Lack of social concern (Proverbs 21:13; Isaiah 58:3-9; Malachi 3:5,16)

Wrestling with unanswered prayer may cause our faith to grow in ways it never would grow otherwise.

6. Poor domestic and social relationships (2 Kings 20:3-5; Job 42:10; Malachi 2:13-16; Galatians 4:19; 1 Corinthians 11:29,30; 1 Peter 3:7; 1 John 2:9; Revelation 3:16)

7. Lack of prayer and fasting (Matthew 15:28; Mark 9:29; 11:23,24; Luke 11:1-13; Hebrews 11:6)

8. It may be divine punishment (Leviticus 26:14-16; Deuteronomy. 28:15,21; Psalm 119:6,7; Proverbs 3:11,12; Hebrews 12:6,10,11)

9. Failing to actually prayer for your request (James 4:2)

10. Refusal to accept medicine as God’s means of healing (Matthew 9:12; Colossians 4:14; 1 Timothy 5:23)

11. Not praying in the will of God (Luke 1:20; 2 Samuel 12:14-18; 1 John 5:14)

12. Improper motives (John 5:14; James 4:3; 1 John. 5:14)

13. The prayer was inappropriate (Matthew 17:1-8;20:20-23; Mark 9:2-8; 10:35-40; Luke 9:28-36,51-56)

14. The timing may not be right (Psalm 6:2,3; 41:3; Matthew 25:36; Hebrews 11:32-34)

15. The Kingdom has not arrived in its ultimate fullness (Romans 8:19-24; 1 Corinthians 15:52)

16. Sovereignty of God (John 5:1-15; Isaiah 55:9; Mark 9:23; Matthew 26:39)

ag.org...

a reply to: Murgatroid

Ah, sorry I missed that in your initial post. Thank you for clearing that up for me. It still doesn't answer the question about amputees though. Why do you think he has never helped them with a regenerated limb?

a reply to: Murgatroid

isnt there a rule about posts being more than 90% content from other websites?

a reply to: Not Authorized

Whatever man. Burn in hell for all I care. But you don't believe in any of that, so it doesn't matter now does it? I'm done talking to you.

You don't know what you're talking about.

For arguments sake, let's say the Bible IS true. What would you say to the Almighty God on that great and terrible day?
You'd rather suffer eternal torment (cut off your nose to spite your face) than accept that God IS. Know this, that you'll be crying out to Him for mercy, and will receive none.


We're to reject heretics after the 1st and 2nd admonition. I've given well more than that in the hope that you might learn something.
Good riddance.

Proverbs 1:22 How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge?

23 Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.

24 Because I have called, and ye refused; I have stretched out my hand, and no man regarded;

25 But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof:

26 I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh;

27 When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you.

28 Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me:

29 For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the Lord:

30 They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof.

31 Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices.