Pope Francis - Do not be fooled by false messiahs

reply to post by undo


AfterInfinity has a link there, but it's a series of set prayers -- five "decades", with some other stuff thrown in, but the majority of it are The Lord's Prayer and Hail Marys. There are five mysteries that you are supposed to contemplate as you are saying the prayers. I rarely say it outside of places where it is being said by others (if you go to Mass a 1/2 hour early, there are usually people reciting it, and most Catholic wakes have it, as well,) and it has been, for me, more of a meditational kind of thing -- if I'm stressed out, saying a decade or two of the Rosary is fairly calming, for whatever reason.

reply to post by adjensen


Eusebius in his Letter to Constantia (sister of Constantine the Great).

“Surely then, you are seeking His image as a servant, that of the flesh which He assumed for our sake. ... How can one paint an image so unattainable ..., unless, as do the unbelieving pagans, one is to represent things that have no possible resemblance to anything? ... For they [the pagans] make such idols when they wish to form the likeness of what they think to be a god or, as they might say, one of the heroes or anything else of like nature, yet they are unable even to approach a likeness, and accurately represent some strange human forms. Surely, even you agree with me [said Eusebius] that such practices are illegal for us. 15 Have you ever heard of such a resemblance yourself in church or from another person? Are not such things excluded and banished from churches all over the world, and does not everyone know that such practices are not permitted to us alone.”

www.askelm.com...

Maybe you cannot see it but these are idols that is just all there is to it no matter what doctrine says.

My apologies Adjenson, Charlie did mean it….my bad!

yamammasamonkey
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Funny, the pope goes by the title "Vicar of Christ", vicar comes from the Latin word vicarious which translates "instead of", it is generally accepted within and without the Catholic Church that this title infers that the pope is the replacement for Christ. I propose he is either very confused or very deceptive.

And Pope means Father, there is only ONE Father, there is no need for another stand in.

adjensen
reply to post by undo

 

AfterInfinity has a link there, but it's a series of set prayers -- five "decades", with some other stuff thrown in, but the majority of it are The Lord's Prayer and Hail Marys. There are five mysteries that you are supposed to contemplate as you are saying the prayers. I rarely say it outside of places where it is being said by others (if you go to Mass a 1/2 hour early, there are usually people reciting it, and most Catholic wakes have it, as well,) and it has been, for me, more of a meditational kind of thing -- if I'm stressed out, saying a decade or two of the Rosary is fairly calming, for whatever reason.

i read most of them and they are all very scriptural with the exceptions of 1) apostolic catholic church and 2) stating the mysteries. i understand the need for tradition, faith building and meditative relaxation via repetitive actions, although i would point to my prior posts regarding unnecessary things, that are not necessarily bad on their own but may in the long run, hamper your growth in your relationship with your redeemer.

for example, i'm in a relationship with my husband. i know the things he likes and the things he doesn't like. if every time i talked to him i said the exact same things as if i were quoting a cooking recipe, he'd be wanting to toss out my cookbook after a very short space of time. you aren't in relationship with the apostolic catholic church but with your redeemer, so they are like, extraneous, if you get my meaning. mud and spit was extraneous when jesus healed the blind man. pray along these lines doesn't mean recite word for word. you are allowed to talk to him. he's not going to bite your face off or send you to purgatory for just chatting with him. at least, that's what i get out of the text when i read it.

undo
reply to post by adjensen

 

can you explain the whole "which prayer you're on" thing? i mean, do you compile a list of things you want to pray about or do you have like a list of official predesignated prayers you recite?

Math 6:7

And in your prayer do not make use of the same words again and again, as the Gentiles do: for they have the idea that God will give attention to them because of the number of their words.
- Basic English Bible

yamammasamonkey
reply to post by adjensen

 

Why then do Catholics pray to Mary and dozens of Saints?

Catholics are not worshipping Mary or the saints. They are talking to them and asking them to intercede with Jesus for them. It's no different than you asking your other to pray to God for you. Well ...except for the fact that the saints and Mary are in Heaven and are a bit closer to God than your mother is.

the2ofusr1
Make no mistake about it ,that when Jesus returns ,every one will both see and know who He is ..before that though the anti-Christ will deceive many .....

I thought Paul already had done his damage to the message? The question I want to know: Are the 144000 sealed ones in revelation the same as the people that are experiencing kundalini awakening now days? They are increasing in number are they not?

Char-Lee
And Pope means Father, there is only ONE Father, there is no need for another stand in.

*sigh* I'm sure you called your father, 'father'. Guess that means you are going to hell, right?
Well.. don't worry ... so are Paul and TImothy and Job and Elisha and Joseph and .....

Call no man father hyperbole

Joseph tells his brothers of a special fatherly relationship God had given him with the king of Egypt: "So it was not you who sent me here, but God; and he has made me a father to Pharaoh, and lord of all his house and ruler over all the land of Egypt" (Gen. 45:8).

Job indicates he played a fatherly role with the less fortunate: "I was a father to the poor, and I searched out the cause of him whom I did not know" (Job 29:16). And God himself declares that he will give a fatherly role to Eliakim, the steward of the house of David: "In that day I will call my servant Eliakim, the son of Hilkiah . . . and I will clothe him with [a] robe, and will bind [a] girdle on him, and will commit . . . authority to his hand; and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem and to the house of Judah" (Is. 22:20–21).

This type of fatherhood not only applies to those who are wise counselors (like Joseph) or benefactors (like Job) or both (like Eliakim), it also applies to those who have a fatherly spiritual relationship with one. For example, Elisha cries, "My father, my father!" to Elijah as the latter is carried up to heaven in a whirlwind (2 Kgs. 2:12). Later, Elisha himself is called a father by the king of Israel (2 Kgs. 6:21).

Acts 7:2 - Stephen refers to "our father Abraham,"
Romans 9:10 - Paul speaks of "our father Isaac."
Paul continually called Timothy his 'son' and Timothy called Paul his 'father'
1 Cor. 4:17, 1 Tim. 1:2, 2 Tim. 1:2, 1 Tim 1:18, 2 Tim. 2:1, Phil. 2:22,
Paul spoke to converts as 'father' and 'child' Titus 1:4

PAUL - "I do not write this to make you ashamed, but to admonish you as my beloved children. For though you have countless guides in Christ, you do not have many fathers. For I became your father in Christ Jesus through the gospel" (1 Cor. 4:14–15).

Peter referred to Mark as a father/son relationship - 1 Pet. 5:13

The apostles referred to followers in the father/child relationship -
2 Cor. 12:14, Gal. 4:19, 1 John 2:13-14, Gal. 4:19; 1 Tim. 1:18; 2 Tim. 2:1;
Philem. 10; 1 Pet. 5:13; 1 John 2:1; 3 John 4

"My little children, I am writing this to you so that you may not sin; but if any one does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous" (1 John 2:1);

"No greater joy can I have than this, to hear that my children follow the truth" (3 John 4).

InverseLookingGlass
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Don't be fooled by the perverted religion known as, "American Christianity" and the false "profits"

In this sect, the teachings of the Bible are abandoned, cherry picked or subverted to support the sustaining values of American imperialism.

1. Claim dominion over everything and everyone on the Earth in God's name.
2. Indiscriminate use of violence to achieve commercial objectives. Use of torture for terrorism.
3. Glorification of "mercenary" as a career choice.
4. Abandoning of humanitarian conscience in lieu of selfish materialism
5. Adopting narcissism in lieu of spiritual awareness.
6. Claiming racial birthright within the sect.

I am not sure if you are talking about all of us American Christians or just to a denomination. As an American Christian I ask, what are your false assumptions based on?

1: The only dominion I have over is my home and my dog, but I feed my dog and give him water, and he loves me back.

2: I am not a violent person, neither do I support violence, but know that if violence were to affect me, then perhaps sometimes a violent response would be warranted. But what movies do you watch?

3: Would you prefer a defenseless nation?

4:Christians have food banks and homeless shelters.

5: I don't go around wanting people to see how pretty I am, but then again, why are you hating on the beautiful people? Isn't that what non-Christian people say?

6: There are white Christians, black Christians, Asian Christians, Hispanic Christians...and it goes on. What racial birthright in the sect? BTW, I have mixed ancestry, Ashkenazi and Sephardi Jew, Hungarian, French, Germanic, Middle Eastern and Chinese Asian. But I look white, but still I ask, what racial birthright in my sect?

reply to post by WarminIndy


Are you a typical Christian? Or one of those mystic/progressive types?

FlyersFan

Char-Lee
And Pope means Father, there is only ONE Father, there is no need for another stand in.

*sigh* I'm sure you called your father, 'father'. Guess that means you are going to hell, right?
Well.. don't worry ... so are Paul and TImothy and Job and Elisha and Joseph and .....

Call no man father hyperbole

Joseph tells his brothers of a special fatherly relationship God had given him with the king of Egypt: "So it was not you who sent me here, but God; and he has made me a father to Pharaoh, and lord of all his house and ruler over all the land of Egypt" (Gen. 45:8).

Job indicates he played a fatherly role with the less fortunate: "I was a father to the poor, and I searched out the cause of him whom I did not know" (Job 29:16). And God himself declares that he will give a fatherly role to Eliakim, the steward of the house of David: "In that day I will call my servant Eliakim, the son of Hilkiah . . . and I will clothe him with [a] robe, and will bind [a] girdle on him, and will commit . . . authority to his hand; and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem and to the house of Judah" (Is. 22:20–21).

This type of fatherhood not only applies to those who are wise counselors (like Joseph) or benefactors (like Job) or both (like Eliakim), it also applies to those who have a fatherly spiritual relationship with one. For example, Elisha cries, "My father, my father!" to Elijah as the latter is carried up to heaven in a whirlwind (2 Kgs. 2:12). Later, Elisha himself is called a father by the king of Israel (2 Kgs. 6:21).

Acts 7:2 - Stephen refers to "our father Abraham,"
Romans 9:10 - Paul speaks of "our father Isaac."
Paul continually called Timothy his 'son' and Timothy called Paul his 'father'
1 Cor. 4:17, 1 Tim. 1:2, 2 Tim. 1:2, 1 Tim 1:18, 2 Tim. 2:1, Phil. 2:22,
Paul spoke to converts as 'father' and 'child' Titus 1:4

PAUL - "I do not write this to make you ashamed, but to admonish you as my beloved children. For though you have countless guides in Christ, you do not have many fathers. For I became your father in Christ Jesus through the gospel" (1 Cor. 4:14–15).

Peter referred to Mark as a father/son relationship - 1 Pet. 5:13

The apostles referred to followers in the father/child relationship -
2 Cor. 12:14, Gal. 4:19, 1 John 2:13-14, Gal. 4:19; 1 Tim. 1:18; 2 Tim. 2:1;
Philem. 10; 1 Pet. 5:13; 1 John 2:1; 3 John 4

"My little children, I am writing this to you so that you may not sin; but if any one does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous" (1 John 2:1);

"No greater joy can I have than this, to hear that my children follow the truth" (3 John 4).

And Jesus said "Father Abraham".

Lazarus rested in Abraham's bosom.

NewAgeMan
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Imho, the Pope's words are intended to strike at the heart of the satanic world system, which I've recently discerned is based on an attempted theft of God's glory which was given to us through Jesus Christ as the Head, and which worships or idolizes the creature (horn sign) instead of the Creator and which is after self glorification or the misuse of the idea of self glorification through a sales-hierarchy which commands attention or a focal point of awareness, to attract followers. It's a misdirection in other words, who's aim it is to basically substitute God's glory for one's own.

Much of the advertising world, movies, pop idols, superstar politicians, corporate greed and all manner of overt and cover manipulation of the masses by "PTB" and wicked "powers and principalities" would fall into this category.

It's an attempted inversion of God's kingdom, by attempting to shift it's focal point to the earth plane instead of above in the heavenly one, while glorifying the creature, and the self, instead of the creator, and the other, where the true glory of God is evenly distributed to one and all based on his love for each and every one of his children, a "domain" wherein there is no possibility for jealousy or covetousness or competition, since everyone celebrates everyone else's mutual glorification and it in turn glorifies themselves also in this same one and wholly good spirit of mutuality and brotherly love, aka koinonia.

So he's saying in other words, watch out for anyone who tries to set themselves up at the head of the table in the context of a hierarchy born of a vain glory sought out in the form of the attention and admiration of followers, because that is not the spirit of Christ who comes only to serve, and not to be served by and who said "if I seek only my own glory then that is no glory at all!"

When you really and seriously consider this all the way through, what you will discover, as I have, in a careful and close examination, with discernment, of the satanic world system - is that in making this attempt, all they've managed to really accomplish was/is to hand the last laugh over to Christ as God and all God's children, at the devil's expense.

The weight of God's glory crushes and breaks the back of our pride and vanity and in so doing re-builds us up, authentically. It's actually quite humorous, for those who can see it and who discern with wisdom and the spirit of truth.

Could someone please comment on this I thought it was important and relevant to this discussion, thanks.

AfterInfinity
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Are you a typical Christian? Or one of those mystic/progressive types?

AfterInfinity, after many, many discussions with me, I think you would have gotten the idea by now. I am a Christian mystic. I believe in the mystical experience above the dry, traditional traditions. I have found spiritual meaning in some traditions but if any tradition leads people to do terrible things, then I don't accept those ones.

That's not progressive as one thinks progressive is.

No, not typical at all. I think I have said that many, many times on ATS. I am not Orthodox.

reply to post by FlyersFan


i would suggest that one of the things that brought gentiles into the fold was the ability to have faith without the need for things or traditions to support that faith. case in point: the roman soldier, remember him? he says (paraphrased), i command troops under me. i tell them to go do this and do that, and they do it. you have command over healing. just say the word and my servant will be healed.

what was jesus' response to that?

reply to post by WarminIndy


Oh, that's right. You're the Christian mystic. Well, no wonder you find yourself at odds with that 5-count description. But I don't suppose I need elaborate on that...you've already read what I have to say on that matter.

I have found spiritual meaning in some traditions but if any tradition leads people to do terrible things, then I don't accept those ones.

Taking liberties with God's instructions. Some would consider that blasphemy. Not that I mind.

reply to post by FlyersFan

Pope Francis warns about substituting leaders of this world, for Jesus. I found that rather interesting. He especially warns the young people to be careful. Do not follow the leaders of the world who are charismatic when in fact they are evil in their hearts.

I see religion including the Vatican full of false of Messiahs.

As for Political Leaders, many of these people are failed at business, failed at real employment, bad actors, career academics. The point is they are not the best material for leading anyone anywhere, let alone a country.

AfterInfinity
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Oh, that's right. You're the Christian mystic. Well, no wonder you find yourself at odds with that 5-count description. But I don't suppose I need elaborate on that...you've already read what I have to say on that matter.

I have found spiritual meaning in some traditions but if any tradition leads people to do terrible things, then I don't accept those ones.

Taking liberties with God's instructions. Some would consider that blasphemy. Not that I mind.

edit on 18-11-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

AfterInfinity

The original taking liberties with God's instructions caused all these problems. That was the original blasphemy.

reply to post by WarminIndy


whereas the opposite problem of legalism that ignores the plight of your fellows is also heavily spoken against by jesus. if your fellow has a crutch to prop himself up, even if he doesn't need it but is convinced he does, you don't steal his crutch and let him fall face first, on the ground (where he may end up truly needing it. the medicine should never make the patient worse). you try to convince him via gentle persuasion and affirmation of things like common sense, that he doesn't need it.

reply to post by Char-Lee

Maybe you cannot see it but these are idols that is just all there is to it no matter what doctrine says.

Until you can prove that Roman Catholics think that the Pope's ring is a god, and worship it as such, your quote is barking up the wrong tree -- Eusebius was talking about idols which were representative of pagan gods.

Once again, I have given you proof of the actual church teaching that says we worship God, and God alone, all you've managed to show is that you don't care what the church teaches, because you have it in your head that "respect and affection" are the same as "worship", which anyone can tell you, they are not. You accuse your friend in South America of worshiping the Pope, I guarantee you that if you bothered to ask her if she did, she would say "absolutely not."