Forced to take flu vaccine or get fired.

The killed vaccine works - if the new flu is similar enough to the previous year's flu.

As far as vaccines working in general - of course they do. You can get antibody titers and watch them come up. Had to get a chunk of vaccinations in the military, later they took blood samples, measured them for antibody titers and revaccinated me for the ones that didn't take sufficiently (they don't do that for everyone). If vaccines didn't work, you wouldn't generate measurable antibody responses to them. It's pretty unequivocal.

I have to take the flu vaccine every year. It's non-negotiable. I get a lot of other ones, too, like it or not, they don't bother me much, but then I've got the constitution of a bear I suppose. The pneumonia vax makes me ill for a day, the others just hurt but I only get them every third year or so.

toast317
Flu season is right around the corner ladies and gentlemen. Here's my situation... I landed a great job at a hospital, and a lot of hospitals all around the US are now requiring a flu shot or you get fired.

I can understand their point of view to an extent. Lots of sick patients with the flu coming in, very easy for an outbreak in the hospital, however making it mandatory instead of just promoting it a lot and attempting to convince the employees is still wrong.

I just moved out at age 20 and it's been 2 months since I got my first apartment. It's been...interesting. The "real world" really hits you like a brick wall when you first move out, but it's a really nice feeling at the same time. Feeling like I'm in control of my life and stepping out into the big world. This job was key to making my life at the moment go smooth.

While being a part time college student, I am currently working security at the hospital and making $22/hr which is definitely not bad at all for a college student and all at my age. Really landed a sweet job. However...You have to ask yourself how far you're willing to go for your beliefs. Lots of us here online are opposed to flu vaccination. I completely refuse to comply, no matter how dumb of a move for me financially it is.

I was approached by my boss for the second time this week today, and told if I don't get it by wednesday, don't bother to return to work. I plan on doing just that. I can get another job, and already got one lined up, but the pay is not nearly the same, and it's going to be rough. But sometimes you got to stand up for what's right.

I read a saying today, it stated "Someone who can't sacrifice anything, can never change anything."

How far are you guys willing to go for what you believe is right? Maybe we are all crazy and the NWO isn't real, but I know one thing for sure. Right, wrong, I rather follow what I believe in. No matter what, no matter how little, or how small the issue may be.
Keep on fighting the good fight.

I never do flu shots. All the people I knew that got them got sick and I didn't. I believe the modern flu as we know it is intentionally injected into people so that it can spread a cull the population, and make a whole lot of money.

I remember when the swine flu came out a few years back. My doctor wanted to give me the swine flu shot. I refused and demanded the pneumonia vaccine instead because the flu doesn't kill you it's the secondary infection that did. After some arguing and me threatening to shop around, he ave me the pneumonia vaccine. That vaccine has been around a long time and has been tested as effective and safe.

People, don't just let the government inject some unknown thing into your body. Be smart.

reply to post by toast317


Stop believing everything you read on conspiracy sites. Go get your shot and go to work. I get one every year. No flu, no problems.

Run along now.

Flu Vaccine is not a must for me, i take it depending on how i "feel" that year, regarding epidemic.

But you know whati find it funny? The bunch of people trying lump all vaccines into 1, as if they work the same.

Arn't you glad you have your legs? and not eaten by Polio? Arn't you glad 1/5 babies don't get meningitis and die because their brain becomes jelly and explodes?

Anyway OP, you can buy into these anti-vaccine crew and ruin your life if you like...

Billions of people are taking vaccine and no one is dropping dead, if someone does get sick, the anti-vaccine crew will jump at the vaccine and blame it for the death, and not the other 1000 reasons why they might have died.

Person takes a photo with a beer bottle. After 5 yrs dies from an accident. Anti-Vaccine crew comment? He was drunk driving.

reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

The flu vaccine does "not" stop you from getting the flu.

I never said that vaccines "stop you from getting the flu". Flu vaccines only HELP one's immune system fight off a flu infection. The only thing that is absolute, regarding one's health, is death.

They "can not" make a vaccine for the flu for the same year because the strain of flu that may be prolific for this year has not been identified as of yet.

Though it is, indeed, a "crap shoot", the odds of contracting the flu are greater for those that have not been vaccinated against it.

They "can not" make a vaccine for the flu for the same year because the strain of flu that may be prolific for this year has not been identified as of yet.

The flu vaccine's 70-80 percent success rate, for some years, indicates that you don't know what you're talking about.

They take an educated "guess" at which one they "think" may develop, throw a couple of viruses that we have already been exposed to (which means you most likely already have built antibodies against them naturally by previous exposure) into a petri dish and "hope" to grow their new Franken flu virus; then make everyone take it. This improves their chances that someone, somewhere, will finally mutate a virus that will cause the extinct level pandemic that probably would never occur in nature without their help.

That's nothing but "fear mongering"! There are no viable viruses contained in flu vaccines.

The CDC web site clearly states that the virus they cook up is by guess work and is hit or miss.

Wow! I'll bet their honesty surprised the Hell out of you!

Everyone that takes a flu shot becomes a guinea pig; is tagged and tracked (that is why you have to prove you got the shot and bring documentation for record keeping to your job, they get paid for every person they can prove got the shot and there is a bonus pay off those those that rack up the highest compliance numbers.

The people are being duped. Anyone that reads what the CDC says on their web site with their thinking cap on, and is capable of just a little critical thinking, will see an upfront, in your face, acknowledgment from the CDC that the flu vaccine is a crap shoot. We are all guinea pigs and this game has nothing to do with "stopping" people from getting sick.

Unfortunately too many have been so taken over by the control of the Borg queen/king that they will never be able to see the truth, so those of us that can are hated and considered a threat to the hive. They will force you to assimilate or you will be eliminated.

You should use that for a new thread. Paranoid rants tend to garner a lot of flags and stars.

See ya,
Milt

Articles like the one below lead me to one thought - when people get the flu they are going to blame those who did not get the shot, and shots will become mandatory. The article is just another doctor pushing the vaccination - but with a twist of not being vaccinated being equivalent to being irresponsible.

I believe in New Jersey kids cannot enter public school without one. It's already starting. My child has never had the flu and he has never had a shot. He has had a few fevers in 12 years but they last a few hours and go away. Why would I want to give him a shot when his immune system is working so well?

Maybe I'm wrong - maybe it is a good idea. But right off the bat I think of how the flu is not a fixed disease. It evolves. Therefore I would think we would want our immune systems to go through the process (if it doesn't kick it out before you even notice), of evolving with different strains.

Reading the debates on it is confusing. I can see why it would be required in hospitals but what ever happened to good hand washing, good manners, and staying home when sick? Still seems too new for me. Just like antibiotics were the best of the best. Now finding out they have only caused disease to become stronger.

Oh yes - the flu began last year in my area of the country in November (usually happens after the new year). This year it has already begun. Half of my sons class was out of school sick today. Flu shots are being advertised everywhere I look and most are free. Seems like they are really worried about something if giving them away.


kplr11.com...

reply to post by juspassinthru

I've got better things to do than spend my time researching for your benefit. Did you stop at the first articles you found? Dig a little deeper.

That comment only shows that you don't possess the integrity to support your own claims. Well done!

Your rebuttal on this single issue confirms my point that vaccine recipients can infect the unvaccinated.

I didn't attempt to rebut your "point". I only questioned the validity of your comparison.

They call it rare but provide zero data. Not one reference statistic. Zero.

That only proves that you didn't click on the link. Because you're so damned helpless, here's the rest of that paragraph:

One study of 197 children aged 8 through 36 months in a child care center assessed transmissibility of vaccine viruses from 98 vaccinated children to the 99 unvaccinated children; 80% of vaccine recipients shed one or more virus strains (mean duration: 7.6 days). One influenza B vaccine virus strain isolate was recovered from a placebo recipient and was confirmed to be vaccine-type virus. The influenza B virus isolate retained the cold-adapted, temperature-sensitive, attenuated phenotype. The placebo recipient from whom the influenza B vaccine virus strain was isolated had symptoms of a mild upper respiratory illness. The estimated probability of acquiring vaccine virus after close contact with a single LAIV recipient in this population was 1%–2%.

Regardless, just suppose some of your vaccine shredders had been injected with Baxter's bird flu contaminated vaccines? Suppose it might be a problem then?

Sure! I'll play, if you're willing to provide valid sources, and you make the first move. This isn't the place to do it, so make a new thread.

See ya,
Milt

I am required to get flu vaccination and I comply.

2nd

reply to post by BenReclused

BenReclused
reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

 

The flu vaccine does "not" stop you from getting the flu.

I never said that vaccines "stop you from getting the flu". Flu vaccines only HELP one's immune system fight off a flu infection. The only thing that is absolute, regarding one's health, is death.

If the flu vaccine doesn't stop you from getting the flu then why are they forcing us to take it?

They "can not" make a vaccine for the flu for the same year because the strain of flu that may be prolific for this year has not been identified as of yet.

Though it is, indeed, a "crap shoot", the odds of contracting the flu are greater for those that have not been vaccinated against it.

I actually gave the CDC better odds then they gave themselves. If they are going to make it mandatory, it seems that their percentages should be more consistent. I am not telling anyone not to take the vaccine; the choice "should" be completely up to them.

"For example, in a study among persons 50-64 years of age during the 2003-04 influenza season, when the vaccine strains were not optimally matched, inactivated influenza vaccine effectiveness against laboratory-confirmed influenza was 60% among persons without high-risk conditions, and 48% among those with high risk conditions."
www.cdc.gov...

They "can not" make a vaccine for the flu for the same year because the strain of flu that may be prolific for this year has not been identified as of yet.

The flu vaccine's 70-80 percent success rate, for some years, indicates that you don't know what you're talking about.

I may not know what I am talking about but I got the information straight from the horse’s mouth. I am sorry but I just don't like their odds.

"laboratory-confirmed influenza was 60% among persons without high-risk conditions, and 48% among those with high risk conditions"
www.cdc.gov...

"It takes at least six months to produce large quantities of influenza vaccine. For vaccine to be delivered in time for vaccination to begin in October and November, manufacturers may begin to grow one or more of the virus strains in January based on their best guess as to what strains are most likely to be included in the vaccine."
www.cdc.gov...

They take an educated "guess" at which one they "think" may develop, throw a couple of viruses that we have already been exposed to (which means you most likely already have built antibodies against them naturally by previous exposure) into a petri dish and "hope" to grow their new Franken flu virus; then make everyone take it. This improves their chances that someone, somewhere, will finally mutate a virus that will cause the extinct level pandemic that probably would never occur in nature without their help.

That's nothing but "fear mongering"! There are no viable viruses contained in flu vaccines.

Fear mongering? Must be by the CDC, since they are the ones pushing a product they don't even guarantee will work and have so little faith in, that their manufactures have to protect themselves from liability. What "are" they afraid of?

“Currently, only viruses grown in eggs can be used as vaccine virus strains. If specimens have been grown in other cell lines, they cannot be used for vaccine strains. However, more and more laboratories do not use eggs to grow influenza viruses, making it difficult to obtain potential vaccine strains. “In addition, some influenza viruses, like H3N2 viruses, grow poorly in eggs, making it even more difficult to obtain possible vaccine strains.”
www.cdc.gov...

The CDC web site clearly states that the virus they cook up is by guess work and is hit or miss.

Wow! I'll bet their honesty surprised the Hell out of you!

No. I wasn't surprised at all. I never accused then of lying, in fact, I encouraged people to go and read it for themselves and suggested that they give some thought to what is being said.

Everyone that takes a flu shot becomes a guinea pig; is tagged and tracked (that is why you have to prove you got the shot and bring documentation for record keeping to your job, they get paid for every person they can prove got the shot and there is a bonus pay off those those that rack up the highest compliance numbers.

The people are being duped. Anyone that reads what the CDC says on their web site with their thinking cap on, and is capable of just a little critical thinking, will see an upfront, in your face, acknowledgment from the CDC that the flu vaccine is a crap shoot. We are all guinea pigs and this game has nothing to do with "stopping" people from getting sick.

Unfortunately too many have been so taken over by the control of the Borg queen/king that they will never be able to see the truth, so those of us that can are hated and considered a threat to the hive. They will force you to assimilate or you will be eliminated.

You should use that for a new thread. Paranoid rants tend to garner a lot of flags and stars.

I admit that vaccines are a sore spot with me. I have no problem with vaccines and think they should be available to those that want them. I think it immoral, unconstitutional, abusive, and deceiving to force or assault someone that chooses “not” to take the vaccine. The vaccine being administered is sheer guess work and they know that they are giving you a product that they have no idea if it is or ever will be effective. They not only gamble with people’s health they gamble with their careers and lives.

People who want and get the vaccines have their protection; you are safe; of course not to flu circulating this year. We both are in the same boat with that one. You are safe from the flu that circulated last year; but so am I.


Greetings to you also.

My sister and I have totally different takes on this. She's a senior nurse - a matron at a local hospital - and won't have the flu vaccination (it's not compulsory for medical staff in the UK, and as previously mentioned, many refuse it). She even declined to take part in a photoshoot designed to promote uptake of the jab in the local area.

Part of her concern stems from her surviving breast cancer 11 years ago, since when she's followed a more or less vegan diet - though truth to tell, she's always been faddy about food and interested in alternative medicine and therapy.

I respect her view, but I'm pretty much at the front of the queue when it comes to vaccines and meds. I'm diabetic, so there's a good reason to protect myself, but what mainly persuades me is that although there are risks associated with vaccines - all vaccines - the risks posed by flu and other diseases are much greater.

To correct one misapprehension - being vaccinated protects yourself reasonably well, but it doesn't necessarily protect others. People who receive a 'live' vaccine can shed the virus for about seven days, and it's quite possible for asymptomatic - and previously innoculated - individuals to be carriers. 'Herd' immunity is best achieved by innoculating as many people as possible, starting with the most vulnerable.

I have worked in health care for 30 years. I haven't taken the flu shot for the last 5. Why? It's an undeniable fact that I am sicker when I get the shot. I am not saying the shot gives me the flu, I don't know what's at play here. I can't even remember when the last time was that I had the flu or any respiratory infection. I would walk away from my job if I were forced to get the shot. Obviously, t's something about my immune system that fights off these bugs. I don't trus thet the vaccines, I don't trust the preservatives they use in multidose vials, I don trust the research. If they're going to force all hospital workers to get the flu shot then no visitors should be allowed during flu season unless they can prove they've been vaccinated.
Some here have said it's to protect the public. Okay, then lets force grocery store and drug store clerks because they handle our food. Anyone who works in retail should be forced because they pass us our money.
Apologies if I sound pissed but I don't get why someone else thinks they have a right to decide how I manage mt health. I also seriouslt hate the new ATS format and it makes typing this on my phone an absolute pain.

reply to post by meemaw


You have some very common sense thoughts in your response to this. It makes sense. If going to require for hospital staff what about visitors. I get that hospital related deaths are high from people with low immunity being exposed to various things but how many of these are from the flu? With this new flu it is more deadly so this increases the likelihood of problems but the present vaccine isn't for the new flu. I feel suspicious that they are saying "free flu shots" on practically every street corner. It's weird.

I get it kills people but so do other diseases. What about putting some of this energy into immune zapping issues such as imbalances created by antibiotics or resistance to them to begin with? How many deaths have been reduced thanks to the flu shot? According to this article 2013 was a really bad year for the flu.

Basically - huge flu season in spite of free flu shots. These shots have been around awhile. Why were they seeing such a brutal flu season?

www.usatoday.com...

Then this article, in part blames a bad 2011/12 flu season on not enough flu cases the year before.

abcnews.go.com... 2B15%2Byears%26fr%3Dipad


I feel like we are about to be confronted with a real life version of The Stand by Stephan King. I think another poster may have been onto something. They released something into the population and now need to get a grip on it. Probably not - but they sure are afraid of whatever it is they see coming.

reply to post by toast317

Dude don't quit your job! Just get your paperwork together

Just tell the hospital you have the situation under control. A new vaccine is being researched to actually work right. it will stimulate the CD8 T cells to fight the flu. www.sciencedaily.com... So in the meantime you will eat two strawberries every day to build your resistance. www.antibodychain.com...

So what are they going to say, this is new improved science backing this information.

And it could just work, I'll have to eat a strawberry smoothy next time the flu breaks out. Now remember, when you shuffle your immune system to fight viruses, you lower the ability a little to fight infections.

Dianec


I feel like we are about to be confronted with a real life version of The Stand by Stephan King.

King based it on a DTIC paper, IIRC. There actually were some people working on variable antigen biowarfare agents, published it in open lit and everything, at one time I had a link to the thing. I wouldn't have found it (never had a good set of search terms that weren't buried by Stand references) but it was spelled out in that book by, I think, Ken Alibek. Once you knew the researcher's names you could find it pretty easily.

reply to post by NightSkyeB4Dawn

If the flu vaccine doesn't stop you from getting the flu then why are they forcing us to take it?

I haven't been "forced" to take a shot, of any kind, since 1968. Who's been "forcing" you to take shots, against your will?

I actually gave the CDC better odds then they gave themselves.

No, ACTUALLY, you didn't! The following are the only comments you made regarding the effectiveness of flu vaccines:

I think the flu vaccine is the biggest scam they have ever pulled over the eyes of the people. The vaccine they give you is absolutely useless for the strain of flu you may encounter this year. It is even questionable if it will protect you from the last year's flu. If you had the flu last year or were exposed to the flu last year then you already have natural antibodies to last years flu; so you are even better protected from last years flu. You still receive no protection from this years flu from the vaccine,

I know I may sound crazy or paranoid, but what is crazier than people lining up to to allow strangers, often they aren't even medical professionals, to jab them with toxins that they have already told you won't protect them from this year's flu, but it MAY protect you from the flu that you and everyone MAY have gotten last year or the year before. You have better odds of winning from a Lotto scratch off ticket then them even getting the strain right for the vaccine they make this year.

The flu vaccine does "not" stop you from getting the flu.

They "can not" make a vaccine for the flu for the same year because the strain of flu that may be prolific for this year has not been identified as of yet.

The people are being duped. Anyone that reads what the CDC says on their web site with their thinking cap on, and is capable of just a little critical thinking, will see an upfront, in your face, acknowledgment from the CDC that the flu vaccine is a crap shoot. We are all guinea pigs and this game has nothing to do with "stopping" people from getting sick.

I may not know what I am talking about but I got the information straight from the horse’s mouth.

Your comments, cited above, sure as Hell weren't based on "information straight from the horse’s mouth".

Fear mongering? Must be by the CDC, since they are the ones pushing a product they don't even guarantee will work and have so little faith in, that their manufactures have to protect themselves from liability.

What's wrong with protecting one's self from liability. That's why doctors buy malpractice insurance. That's, also, the same reason I buy auto insurance.

What "are" they afraid of?

They're afraid of uneducated juries awarding unwarranted, and exorbitant, settlements to paranoid people that are likely to blame all of their ills on any vaccination that they may have had.

I encouraged people to go and read it for themselves and suggested that they give some thought to what is being said.

You sure as Hell didn't do that in this thread! The following are the only two comments that you made regarding the CDC website:

The CDC web site clearly states that the virus they cook up is by guess work and is hit or miss.

Anyone that reads what the CDC says on their web site with their thinking cap on, and is capable of just a little critical thinking, will see an upfront, in your face, acknowledgment from the CDC that the flu vaccine is a crap shoot.

I have no problem with vaccines and think they should be available to those that want them.

That's not what your other posts indicate.

I think it immoral, unconstitutional, abusive, and deceiving to force or assault someone that chooses “not” to take the vaccine.

Yeah, that would be bad. Fortunately, that ain't happening to you, or me, or anyone else that I currently know. Who do you know of, that has been forced to get vaccinated, or "assaulted" for not doing so?

People who want and get the vaccines have their protection; you are safe; of course not to flu circulating this year. We both are in the same boat with that one. You are safe from the flu that circulated last year; but so am I.

Nope! We are not "in the same boat", nor do any of us have an absolute guarantee that we won't catch any of the previous, current, or future strains of flu. It's even possible to contract the same type of flu that we may have had in the past. With, or without a flu vaccination, it's still, as you like to say, "a crap shoot".

See ya,
Milt

I'm a medical professional. Fortunately I no longer work within a hospital environment.
If I was forced to get the shot, given its my career, I would have to think twice, but since there are so many strains of flu, most of which are NOT covered by the vaccine (everyone got sick last year, if they got the shot), and now the bogus h1n1 vaccine is incorporated into the shot, I would have to stand my ground, but my field, would universally require the shot, because its all within the western medical system, so I would need a new career .

reply to post by BenReclused


The cdc Ama and who are ABSOLUTELY fear mongers.
Most of their official info is manipulated, and they put all this nonsense in he media, GET THE SHOT OR DIE!! YOUR KIDS WILL DIE! YOUR ELDERLY MOM WILL DIE! YOUR GOLD FISH WILL DIE. YOUR CAT CAN CATCH IT NOW.

They actually tried that one last year. I saw two articles at least.
We can now give our cats the flu.
What a crock

So all these terrified crazy cat ladies were on blogs actually asking if they should all go get the flu shot.

Please.... Ask any vet if he's ever seen a cat get the flu from mom.
There would be an epidemic of dead cats If this were true.

reply to post by gr1ill3d


The OP is 20years old. Who do you think are getting all the jobs you have applied for.
The kids right out of school. A dime a dozen, they don't have to pay them as much, and they're perky and look good.

Theyre not hiring the over 35s and up is my observations.
They can't ask you how old you are on a resume anymore, but the moment you out down work experience and the dates, hello.... They have a clue to your age range

reply to post by BenReclused


I will let this be. You have made up your mind and I have made up mine. I am not going to go through the things I said again line by line to point out that the things I said were indeed said, and the things I attributed to the CDC were taken straight from the CDC web site.

You are looking for a fight. Anything I say to you is going to be ignored or deliberately misunderstood. There is no hope of me having a civil conversation with you. I am sorry that I angered you. I guess both of us are a little passionate about the subject and before we slip into behavior that is unbecoming or in violation of ATS rules of decorum, I think it just best that we agree to disagree.