Islam's Incorruptible Qur'an Is Corrupt

reply to post by mideast


DEFLECTION. The subject is the Qu'ran. It is corrupt. It is in error.
Therefore, it can't be from Allah or God or any other magical source.
How do you explain an 'all knowing' God who dictates thousands of errors in a
supposed holy book? Answer ... God didn't dictate it.

Originally posted by maes2

Originally posted by Sahabi
I renounced Islam several years ago.

I am a former Sunni Muslim who followed the As-Salaf As-Saalih madh’hab (Salafi School of Thought). The Salafi methodology believes in a strict interpretation of the Qur’an and Islam, based upon the understandings of the first three generations of Islam.

I consider you an honest person. however I doubt. sorry for my unfriendly start but let it be.

so tell us how many Shia, Sunni and Christian have you beheaded as some polytheists or infidels !

tell us how you earned money from Saudi Arabia for killing and spying against the people of middle east. for suicide bombing in the mosques of Iraq, Pakistan and ........

tell us how you transfer the western weapons into Syria.

tell us who have told you to stop physical attacks against muslims and people of middle east and start a propaganda like an apostate.

how the security organs of monarchies of middle east and CIA and MOSSAD or MI5 are connected with the Al Qaeda.

we have seen many people like you. I should have said all of these and many other things.

In all of those examples that you mentioned,.... THEIR belief in Islam caused them to justify those actions. Those actions are a very sad reality

My hands are clean of those things you mention. I did not go to a "Salafi Mosque". I was the only Salafi in the entire community. And in my entire life, I have only had 3 Salafi friends during a 1-year period. I believed in the Salaf way of understanding Islam, that's it. I wasn't a sectarianist.

However, my very deep and dedicated faith in Islam cultivated a deep sense of separation within myself towards non-muslims. The ideology of "us versus them", "us separate from them", and "Muslims elevated above non-Muslims". You know that's what it teaches in the Qur'an, you know that Muhammad's actions and words prove it. What kind of world peace can we have built upon separation, fragmentation, and superiority-complexes?

And that is why I presented this information. I now have love where I once had hate. Peace.

Originally posted by logical7]
They why did people in the west believed that the sperm contains a tiny human!!! Till just a few centuries back!

Why does the Qu'ran state that humans are made from clay ... no wait, humans are made from nothing .. .no, no wait, humans are made from mire ... wait, it's really dust ...
From the Qu'ran
Again ... nothing supernatural about how humans are made in the Qu'ran.
It's all either wrong, or it's information that was already known.

Originally posted by logical7
Who knew the life cycle of locusts is like an analogy of how dead would be resurrected from graves?

The cycles of locusts was known. As for it supposedly being an 'analogy of how the dead would be resurrected' .. that's not science, that's a religious belief.

Who knew that there are unseen things that are created in pairs too? Like pairs of sub atomic particles?

The Summerians. See the previous posts.

Originally posted by logical7
Who knew about finger prints?

Every human being with a hand.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
reply to post by mideast

 

DEFLECTION. The subject is the Qu'ran. It is corrupt. It is in error.
Therefore, it can't be from Allah or God or any other magical source.
How do you explain an 'all knowing' God who dictates thousands of errors in a
supposed holy book? Answer ... God didn't dictate it.

I just know you and your crew follow your interests and change stance whenever possible

Do you even believe in god ? I really doub that , because the god is the great witness and his follower is not living in hypocricy.

Unless your god is present sometimes and sometimes he is absent.



I don't know much about all knowing god you want to introduce , I just know the god who says stand for your home , your body , your soul , your mind.

And that is the key point for all Islam-bashing.

Otherwise Islam is not important and West will be in peace with us like they are in peace with Buddhism. West doesn't care what or how we believe. It cares about it's interests. And no matter how many different stance they take , they are always in same direction about their interests.

The main problem with Islam is that Muslims are sitting on greatest natural resources of the planet.

Originally posted by mideast
Do you even believe in god ? I really doub that ,

Beliefs are irrelevant. Stick to the topic. Answer the question and stop deflecting with insults.
How can an all-knowing God dictate a book with thousands of errors in it? Scientific errors.
Historical errors. The answer ... An all-knowing God wouldn't and therefore, the Qu'ran isn't from God.

And that is the key point for all Islam-bashing.

As I said .... truth isn't 'bashing' .. it's just truth. I understand that you aren't allowed freedom of information in Iran and you aren't used to facts that counter your religious beliefs, but out here where there is freedom of information, those facts are readily available. Learn to deal with it.

ANSWER THE QUESTION ... how could an all-knowing God supposedly dictate a so called holy book that contained thousands of errors? And how about you admit that the supposed 'revelations' of science in the book are really nothing new but had been in the world for thousands of years??

alot of these holy texts written by followers of God heard voices, in todays world they would be put in a mental hospital and given strong cocktails of drugs. I believe in visions, and i believe there was a time when these voices were not so corrupted and could convey things properly rather than confused lies and such that cause people to harm another, What we call God we dont even understand, yet we still argue and fight like uneducated children. I think its all stupid.

reply to post by FlyersFan


when a person dies his body basically crumbles to dust, doesn't it?
Clay, dust, earth whatever you want to call it, contains all the elements which form the human body.
You want to take literal meanings to have a laugh, be my guest.
Its a fact that we are just stardust.

The other point, remind me again how did sumerians know about sub atomic particles
maybe then we have wasted a lot of resources to make giant colliders to investigate sub atomic particles.

reply to post by FlyersFan

As I said .... truth isn't 'bashing' .. it's just truth. I understand that you aren't allowed freedom of information in Iran and you aren't used to facts that counter your religious beliefs, but out here where there is freedom of information, those facts are readily available. Learn to deal with it.

Wrong and MSM based comment.

I have many doubts , questions and fear . But I don't ask the unbiased un-informed people.

That is the reality of ATS.

There are some overlords who dictate their opinion and they don't believe in a single thing.

+ which informed and well educated religious person comes here to inform others ?

I don't even know one.

Originally posted by logical7
The other point, remind me again how did sumerians know about sub atomic particles

You asked who knew about pairs. The Summerians did. The knew about DNA. Their symbol for 'medical' was the intertwined DNA strand which they added snake heads to.

But if you want to talk about when atoms were known about ... The theory of atomism was widely accepted and was from the Greeks. Check out Democritus from 300 BC. The Arabic word dharrah most commonly meant an atom. Suggested reading

Originally posted by logical7
when a person dies his body basically crumbles to dust, doesn't it?

RETURNS to dust. As in... becomes dust. But isn't created of dust. Or dirt. Or mire.
That's another error in the Qu'ran. One that is shared by the Bible.

reply to post by FlyersFan

How can an all-knowing God dictate a book with thousands of errors in it? Scientific errors. Historical errors.

maybe you should go back to the initial assumption that Qur'an has errors and not rush to conclusions when your assumption hasn't been prove true. Its a fact for you and your group for obvious reasons. Btw you were one of the jumpers to back the OP blindly just because his claim suits your desires.
I have been interacting with you for a long time.
You will just keep repeating what you already assume and then go. You will reply to this and call me wrong or something like "right back at ya.."

i don't think you have the required patience or humility to have a civil respectful discussion.

Originally posted by logical7
maybe you should go back to the initial assumption that Qur'an has errors and not rush to conclusions when your assumption hasn't been prove true.

It's not 'assumption' ... it's fact. And yes, I have proven it true. I have given the facts. As for the rest of your post .. it's all off topic and personal insults. I find it interesting that the minute facts come out that don't go the way the muslims want they scream insults and claim that the person presenting facts is 'uncivil'. that's comical. Go look in the mirror.

Address the facts ... the thousands of historical and scientific errors in the Qu'ran.
Address the facts ... that nothing in the Qu'ran was revealed information but was already known.
Stick to the facts and stop the deflection attempts with personal insults .. if you are capable.

Originally posted by truthermantwo
alot of these holy texts written by followers of God heard voices, in todays world they would be put in a mental hospital and given strong cocktails of drugs. I believe in visions, and i believe there was a time when these voices were not so corrupted and could convey things properly rather than confused lies and such that cause people to harm another, What we call God we dont even understand, yet we still argue and fight like uneducated children. I think its all stupid.

It is stupid and that is why you find stupids everywhere.

But if you are familiar with fighting the voices you should see things here ,too.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by logical7
The other point, remind me again how did sumerians know about sub atomic particles

You asked who knew about pairs. The Summerians did. The knew about DNA. Their symbol for 'medical' was the intertwined DNA strand which they added snake heads to.

But if you want to talk about when atoms were known about ... The theory of atomism was widely accepted and was from the Greeks. Check out Democritus from 300 BC. The Arabic word dharrah most commonly meant an atom. Suggested reading

a symbol of entwined snakes is enough to assume that they knew about double Helix DNA?!!

I am not talking about atom, greeks believed it to be indivisible and atom does not have pairs.
I am talking sub atomic particles that are paired, like electron and positron. Unseen pairs.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by logical7
when a person dies his body basically crumbles to dust, doesn't it?

RETURNS to dust. As in... becomes dust. But isn't created of dust. Or dirt. Or mire.
That's another error in the Qu'ran. One that is shared by the Bible.

edit on 8/20/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

the food you consume comes from plants directly or indirectly(meat), the plants take up many inorganic elements from "earth" and air to make organic molecules. When a body decays the reverse happens.
So you are basically made up of dust and water.

reply to post by FlyersFan

the thousands of historical and scientific errors in the Qu'ran. Address the facts

how about you post one of the thousands of error here and we discuss if its a fact or wishful fiction?

that nothing in the
Qu'ran was revealed information but
was already known.

i answered that, even if i agree that it was already known, wasn't there also a lot of wrong information available, how could anyone differentiate and choose only the right ones?
Could you please answer this?

Originally posted by dragonridr




Though it is possible does it diminish the research he has done into Islam. His personal beliefs really have nothing to do with the information he has presented. Ill be honest i am skeptical too having lived in Saudi arabia for 2 yrs and met several Sunni.As a general rule apostasy is very rare reason being is all the side effects involved. You are shunned by your family and friends also the possibility of being life threatening. Thats why most who pull away just become moderate arabs and talk the talk.

However back to the thread Islam does indeed claim that the Koran is the direct word of god and as he points out a lot of people altered it over time. So look at what he has put together see if you disagree and present why i would really be interested in such a debate. So far ive seen nothing but trolls coming in to defend a faith that it appears the op knows more about then they do. Let the debate begin!!!

The above that you wrote shows why Islam is used in a dualistic way. You are either with ous or against us thinking. If a religion has that mentality then I am definitely not buying it. It is all about wearing a garment not doing the most ideal thing. If you physically harm another person based of teachings that are said from god then you are from my point of view missing the point totally.

reply to post by Sahabi

hi Sahabi

isn’t there supposed to be a problem with the inscription on the dome of the rock

We find further evidence of an evolving Qur'an when we look outside the Qur'an to references to the Qur'an. We now have coins with supposed Qur'anic writing dating to 685 A.D. We also have the Qur'anic quotations on the Dome of the Rock sanctuary built by Abd al-Malik in 691 A.D. The quotations from both the coins and the Dome of Rock differ from the Qur'anic text today.(40) Two etymologists, Van Berchem and Grohmann have done extensive research on the Dome of the Rock inscriptions write "the earliest inscriptions contain 'variant verbal forms, extensive deviances, as well as omissions from the text which we have today.'"(41) This simply does not make sense if the Qur'an developed the way Von Denffer maintains. If these inscriptions had been derived from the Qur'an with these variants, then how could the Qur'an been canonized prior to this time?

From
www.givingananswer.org...



(nice op by the way)

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Originally posted by logical7

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by logical7
when a person dies his body basically crumbles to dust, doesn't it?

RETURNS to dust. As in... becomes dust. But isn't created of dust. Or dirt. Or mire.
That's another error in the Qu'ran. One that is shared by the Bible.

edit on 8/20/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

the food you consume comes from plants directly or indirectly(meat), the plants take up many inorganic elements from "earth" and air to make organic molecules. When a body decays the reverse happens.
So you are basically made up of dust and water.

were made up of water and oxygen, beryllium, cobalt, nitrogen, calcium, phosphorus, potassium, sulfur, fluorine, sodium, mercury, yttrium, hydrogen, copper, vanadium, thorium, iron, molybdenum, silicon, carbon, aluminium, iodine, manganese, arsenic, lithium, silver, niobium, nickel, selenium zirconium zinc, and tellurium.
However no where did i say dust. And dust is made of elements as is everything around us. you might as well say were made of cheese the statement has the same validity.