Lets End the Fantasy of "being employed" or Having a Career in America

And, they will make sure that there is always more people than chairs!! Contrary to what some in high office claim, they do not want 0 unemployment! Then, the companies would have to increase wages and in other ways be more competitive for the labor..

I've said it in another thread, but I'll say it again.

There is work out there. Probably not work you are looking for, with your Art History degree, but it's out there. You may get dirty. You may get sweaty. You may have to relocate. Go learn a trade.

Sure it's not as glamorous as being a museum curator, but you make good money. And it's better than sitting around bitching about not being hired because you got a degree that is worthless.

I think high schools should put more emphasis on trade schools as an option.

Yes, becoming a plumber, welder, HVAC technician or mechanic isn't as ritzy as working at NASA, but there is always a demand for them, and they generally pay pretty well.

The economy has changed. There aren't a lot of openings for philosophers or english majors. Those days are over. So you do what you need to do to work, instead of hoping someone is going to hire you for your worthless degree you paid $80,000 for.

Actually, the skilled trades are a good thing to get into if you can now. They've been unappreciated for so long, there's a need for them. And, that need will only grow as more and more of the ones we have retire I imagine.

The sad thing is that there used to be apprenticeships for them. There are some out there still, but they seem to be hard to find! My advice to the younger crowd would be that if you can find on, go for it

Originally posted by Darkrunner
I've said it in another thread, but I'll say it again.

There is work out there. Probably not work you are looking for, with your Art History degree, but it's out there. You may get dirty. You may get sweaty. You may have to relocate. Go learn a trade.

Sure it's not as glamorous as being a museum curator, but you make good money. And it's better than sitting around bitching about not being hired because you got a degree that is worthless.

I think high schools should put more emphasis on trade schools as an option.

Yes, becoming a plumber, welder, HVAC technician or mechanic isn't as ritzy as working at NASA, but there is always a demand for them, and they generally pay pretty well.

The economy has changed. There aren't a lot of openings for philosophers or english majors. Those days are over. So you do what you need to do to work, instead of hoping someone is going to hire you for your worthless degree you paid $80,000 for.

What happens when you cant even find one of these not so glamorous jobs? Relocate with what money? Where is this notion that people are being pickier today coming from? I have applied to places that were crap jobs for low pay but I didn't have the required experience and I have done all kinds of crappy jobs. In the end of the day their is still not enough work for the population and on top of that the work that is available is also controlled by other people just to bolster your dependency on them while they profit off of your dime. A lot of things need to change a whole lot of things, I don't think chalking it up to people with worthless degrees being picky these "damn kids" arguments do nothing, and even if they were valid arguments what does this say about the generation of parents that raised them? We really do need to work together as a country as I pointed out in the OP not only with the death of the traditional career, comes the burdens of taking care of those that came before us as what they had saved all these years may not be enough to sustain them tomorrow. We really do need to get out of this us versus them as this mentality is prevalent in almost everything I see today politics, religions, and now sadly today's work force. Instead of being right to make a point we should be right in the decisions we make as a nation . My 2 cents

reply to post by dawnstar


Yeah over year long waits for union apprenticeships, military doesn't seem to help get you a leg up other then that education bit apparently alot of people here think is BS (not all but many) this issue presented really is a knotted ball of cluster***k that there is no easy way to even detangle to look at the problems for what they are individually, I have been trying but can never seem to express what I see in a meaningful way.

There's a lot more to this than a lack of careers, what we're seeing is a streamlining of many jobs, people move to the service sector as a result which is the lowest skilled and lowest wage jobs available. That also means they're a prime candidate to be replaced by technology. In China they've already started producing and using robotic waiters in restaurants. Over time they cost a mere 10% of what a human costs, after including energy, initial cost, and maintenance.

For some mysterious reason, these things haven't yet caught on in the US but when they do we are in for a massive world of hurt. If you think unemployment is bad right now, what happens when 75% or more of our service sector is replaced with machines? We're quickly approaching a point where only half the population has to work in order to provide for everyone, and create so many luxuries that people can't consume more. That means there is going to be extremely high unemployment in the next decade or so.

My town is already in this situation, we don't have robots but we just don't have jobs either. We haven't had a new business start in the past 5 years that hasn't gone under within a year. We're a town of 16,000 and have an official unemployment rate of only 7% which is lower than the national average, however that doesn't take into account the 4000 students in the population that don't have jobs because they're students. This is backed up by anecdotal evidence as well: I volunteer to run a game shop on friday nights which get a lot of people coming in playing card games that are in the 16-30 age group. Of the 60 or so people we get only 4 of them have jobs, including myself (and my job is only during the school year), only one of them has an actual career. At my job tutoring students, again the vast majority simply don't work because there's no job for them. Even the college I work at admits only 12% of it's graduates find work.

All the education and work ethic in the world isn't going to change this fact, and it means we're going to need a new economic system because the current one just can't support what's coming.

Originally posted by Brotherman

Originally posted by Darkrunner
I've said it in another thread, but I'll say it again.

There is work out there. Probably not work you are looking for, with your Art History degree, but it's out there. You may get dirty. You may get sweaty. You may have to relocate. Go learn a trade.

Sure it's not as glamorous as being a museum curator, but you make good money. And it's better than sitting around bitching about not being hired because you got a degree that is worthless.

I think high schools should put more emphasis on trade schools as an option.

Yes, becoming a plumber, welder, HVAC technician or mechanic isn't as ritzy as working at NASA, but there is always a demand for them, and they generally pay pretty well.

The economy has changed. There aren't a lot of openings for philosophers or english majors. Those days are over. So you do what you need to do to work, instead of hoping someone is going to hire you for your worthless degree you paid $80,000 for.

What happens when you cant even find one of these not so glamorous jobs? Relocate with what money? Where is this notion that people are being pickier today coming from? I have applied to places that were crap jobs for low pay but I didn't have the required experience and I have done all kinds of crappy jobs. In the end of the day their is still not enough work for the population and on top of that the work that is available is also controlled by other people just to bolster your dependency on them while they profit off of your dime. A lot of things need to change a whole lot of things, I don't think chalking it up to people with worthless degrees being picky these "damn kids" arguments do nothing, and even if they were valid arguments what does this say about the generation of parents that raised them? We really do need to work together as a country as I pointed out in the OP not only with the death of the traditional career, comes the burdens of taking care of those that came before us as what they had saved all these years may not be enough to sustain them tomorrow. We really do need to get out of this us versus them as this mentality is prevalent in almost everything I see today politics, religions, and now sadly today's work force. Instead of being right to make a point we should be right in the decisions we make as a nation . My 2 cents

Just saying it's an option. Look into your local unions. They offer apprenticeships. You might not want to be a carpenter or a lineman or a boilermaker, but it's better than being unemployed.

And it's sure as hell better than flipping burgers.

But I am not sure what YOUR solution is to the unemployment crisis. I'd like to hear what you think should be done.

The engine of recovery that ends recessions is small business. The problem with the current recession is that the government only recognizes "big business" solutions. So, billions in bailouts to the auto industry (but unemployed people don't buy cars!), billions to the banks (but unemployed people cannot get a home loan), and billions in "shovel-ready projects" that only employ a few hundred people for 3 years.

The solution, both anecdotally and statistically, is to start your own business.

Most of you never will, because it takes initiative, creativity and discipline. And frankly, most humans don't really have it in them. probably only 5%, when properly motivated.

Then there are all the red-tape hurdles and taxes waiting to slow you down.

I know that the internets has a fascination for the young people, but I think there is plenty of opportunity in the real world, probably more so.

One of my friends is an out of work programmer. When his computer armoire collapsed, he went to the lumber yard and built one from scratch. A neighbor saw it in his garage, and asked him how much he wanted for it. My friend said $100, but then realized he didn't want to go to the trouble of making another, and so he said "three hundred bucks" to make the neighbor go away. Instead, the neighbor paid him three Benjamins. Now my friend makes office furniture "on spec" in his garage, and sells it at flea markets. His stuff brings top dollar because he doesn't use any particle board or cardboard, and he will stain it to match your stuff or leave it naked. I don't know how he fills out the tax forms for that, if you know what I'm saying.

Another guy couldn't get hired. To keep from getting more depressed, he volunteered at the local hospital. After 2 weeks of pushing carts around, they found out he could work on computers. They gave him a modified job; He works 35 hours a week and gets the same pay as the regulars, and even in-hospital health care (which is he needs, and is why he volunteered there). It's not perfect, but he isn't starving as quickly.

The people who are succeeding in this economy are making their own success, instead of looking for a big institution to provide a non-existent job for them.

reply to post by Darkrunner


I dont have a solution Im not god cause thats what its going to take to fix all this which is pathetic for me to say as I don't believe in the almighty in a traditional sense. I think the best solution is to start getting people citizens on the same page young and old, regardless of political ideology that is where I tend to seeing a start to meaningful change. As other posters mentioned, this system of economy we are using is bound to fail a lot sooner then later, wait till all the service and sh1t jobs start getting replaced by efficient machines I guess then the average youth will need to work at finding a job 200% then versus the required 110% of today. Like it or not jobs/ careers in this country are dying.

reply to post by Aazadan

We need a new way of thinking.
Production has risen, profits have risen, the only thing that hasn't is wages and the labor market!
We have had a portion of the labor pool happily not working and getting checks for decades compliments of our gov't.
We have streamlined the production process and have the capacity to go even farther in that direction. We have put an army of people to work, just to deliver checks to those who were "needy" .
The fact is we have not needed everyone in the labor pool working for decades!
And we'll need less in the future unless the great solar flare comes our way!
And, at the same time, we will have the means to produce more!
So, well, if we can have less working an still produce enough of the necessities for all,
maybe it's time to realize that we don't really have to work that hard, maybe we should work less and give more the opportunity to contribute also? I mean for every dollar we've given the "needy" in aid we've probably spent ten times as much administrating that aid. Maybe we would have been better off if most of us just worked part time, and had those needy, at least the ones that were able to, work part time also, still paid them the same amount.
the other solution would be to better teach and train our workforce, so they are capable of the doing the jobs we have. And, well, we are doing just a grand job of that, aren't we?? It's costing more and more to get an "education" and we are ending up less and less adapted to the job market! And because we are graduating with this insane debt, it makes it necessary for us to make insane wages!

Originally posted by dawnstar
Actually, the skilled trades are a good thing to get into if you can now. They've been unappreciated for so long, there's a need for them. And, that need will only grow as more and more of the ones we have retire I imagine.

The sad thing is that there used to be apprenticeships for them. There are some out there still, but they seem to be hard to find! My advice to the younger crowd would be that if you can find on, go for it

I agree as this is what I posted earlier.

Machinists/CNC operators are in high demand, even here in over-taxed New Jersey. Many of the vo-techs and county colleges have adult retraining programs that teach the basics and have job placement programs and there still is not enough to fill the slots.

reply to post by Brotherman


We could very easily see a real unemployment rate of 50% in 10-15 years. Many people are working on replacing service sector employees with machines right now. When those jobs are gone, there's nothing for the unemployed to move to. It will either be crime, and life in jail where they atleast get fed or it will require a massive expansion of a welfare system, or full time employment will become a thing of the past and everyone only works 15-20 hours per week (costs would adjust to the income people have so people would still support themselves on that). One of those three things is coming and our current system doesn't support any of them.

Originally posted by Brotherman
I saw an ad in craigslist.org earlier today advertising for a male to male video actor claims great pay no experience necessary

Seems legit.

Originally posted by Aazadan
reply to post by Brotherman

 

We could very easily see a real unemployment rate of 50% in 10-15 years. Many people are working on replacing service sector employees with machines right now. When those jobs are gone, there's nothing for the unemployed to move to. It will either be crime, and life in jail where they atleast get fed or it will require a massive expansion of a welfare system, or full time employment will become a thing of the past and everyone only works 15-20 hours per week (costs would adjust to the income people have so people would still support themselves on that). One of those three things is coming and our current system doesn't support any of them.

Maybe the government will step in and create jobs for all of us in the form of slave labor work death camps like Stalin days we can build useless roads and tunnels preparing for WW3 all the while the top gets to continue ruling without impunity. They will say it is for nationalism and if you dont work you dont eat and cant play video games in your "dorm"

OK done with the wild sarcastic speculation mumbo jumbo

A video company paid homeless men $50 to be filmed while scantily clad women punched, kicked and whipped them, according to a lawsuit filed this month in a Florida court. ph.news.yahoo.com Lawyers for two homeless men said the website www.shefights.net sells videos on the internet of the so-called "beatdowns," starting at $2.99 for a two-minute "sparring session" clip and increasing in price to $33.99 for a 33 minute clip of two women beating a man. The lawsuit contends the beatings violate a state hate crimes law that specifically protects the homeless and that the producers are exploiting the poverty of transients for whom any cash is hard to come by. "What type of society would allow this to happen?" said Neil Chonin, the lawyer for the homeless men. "This company preyed on people who are desperate."

Wonder if these Homeless guys were giving 110% to get off the street


Yeah there are jobs out there all right, this is the society that allows this and also the same culture that pays for this as well. If you had no resources for work, no car, cell phone, address, steady shower, positive reinforcement, clean clothes, would you do this to get off the street?

I am under the impression some people on here will say take the $hitty jobs your expecting too much.

(this link was brought to my attention by my buddy ThirdReichMike Thanks Bro!

reply to post by Brotherman


I think there can only be local solutions to the economic changes, with minimal organisation, Food can be grown beer and wine can be fermented, tobacco can be grown. Cars can be fixed. Take a look at Cuba, they've been living without money for decades. They have good education and good healthcare. Those are the only two things, that's worth anything when its all boiled down. Waiting for money to fall from heaven is a waste of time.
Get organised, define a standard of living and make it happen. Or apply to emigrate to Cuba, that would send a message to those that are supposed to be running things lol.

reply to post by anonentity


I agree but the first step is to get everyone on the same page. In communities like mine where people are loving all the government benefits they will never give them up for something like that. Doing a craigslist job the one day I was in a section 8 house paid for in part by the government with all kinds of other benefits there were 70in plasma xboxs ps3s all kinds of neat stuff I dont think those people are going to ever give that up. We need to organise you are so correct about this!!!

Originally posted by tovenar

The solution, both anecdotally and statistically, is to start your own business.

Close thread. This is the exact answer.

If you aren't trying to do generate your own income in an environment that is becoming TOXIC TO THE AVERAGE WORKER....


YOU ARE A FOOL.

I don't care WHAT YOU DO....but do not sit here and expect a corporation to feed you, your parents, or any offspring that you bring into this world.

reply to post by supremecommander



Question, How does one start a successful business without enough money for start up costs taxes etc etc for those that are on the verge of starving and homeless?
I wouldn't even suggest an attempt at a .com business ran out of the public library. This is just a thought of mine though, there is more to it then just getting hired especially if you have ZERO resources.


Heres some Startup Biz Statistics


Some really interesting figures there even suggests that 71% of businesses fail around 10 years and if you notice the most successful businesses like having a day care or start a religious organization does anyone have an idea of what it costs to get the proper licenses and insurance etc etc lol this costs a lot of dough

According to Entrepreneur, the start-up costs for a childcare center range from $10,000 to $50,000.

Link

This is where I have to say.

This is the exact reason we need unions people.

People want to blame unions, well look how wonderful it is without them.

I support my fellow union tradesman. Because there is strength in many.

Is it really a coincidence that union bashing is high and support is low, and there is an abundance of crap paying wage robbing temp companies looking for fresh meat to throw into the grinder. Just another example of the worker getting screwed and the "man" getting richer...but hey lets blame organized labor...lol...

I tell you that there is no way in the hell that i would do what im doing now for minimum wage....no way ...and you wouldnt either. Every single guy that retires in my trade is busted up and ran down.

Corporation profits are high as can be but the ground and pound guy that is breathing in the asbestos with his knuckles bleeding is getting paid too much..lmao..

All this guy wants is just not to have to worry as much about the rent, electric bill, and maybe some insurance and food.

The rich s.o.b's can keep their bmw's and million dollar homes.

Just give a guy some breathing room.

Ok, rant over..star and flag from lj01