I Converted A Catholic To Atheism

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
'Compounded' is a very good word for pretty much everything in general. Interconnectivity, duality, awareness, all of that good stuff. If it exists, some part of it exists at a much higher and lower level. "As above, so below"...such a phrase has never possessed more meaning in our lives.

Compounded has one specific profundity that has not necessarily been explored before. It is an abstract application in definition, but it is exactly what we are exploring on the cutting edge of science.

Originally posted by wildtimes
What are YOU most afraid of, Serdg?

Nothing.

At this point, I have been made to face every single one of my greatest fears (for better or worse).

I will just do the best I can in this life, thats all I can do..

edit: To be clear, there are things I would rather not happen. But in the end, we are all going to die. And in that moment, all of our suffering, joy, and any other experience collides in one moment of gratitude. I have been at that moment a couple of times now. There is simply nothing to fear.

I just want to clarify this for you, because I am partly responsible for the miscommunication and it seems to have led to negativity.

Originally posted by wildtimes
WHAT?!!

You think I'm a 'student' of Aft's? Hardly. SO WHAT? if he said something similar??????

I never said anything about teacher or student. Its important that he said something similar because we ALL seem to have the same goal of working towards a better tomorrow. It is the facet of taking personal responsibility (becoming the gardener) and not waiting for someone else to do it that matters.

Every single one of us that is currently participating in this discourse seems to have made the decision to help ourselves. Whether or not a God/s exist is not even relevant to this decision. It is interesting because it is a common vein and an important one, imo.

No, it doesn't 'suck to be me.'

Your electrolytes seem to be lacking.

Okay, you know what? I tried. If you have anything more to say, I may or may not respond, but do NOT put me in a handbasket with anyone else on this board, Serdg.

The way I see it, we ARE all on the same team (or handbasket) whether we like it or not. There WILL be similarities, and pointing out the positive ones is not something I feel is detrimental to the discussion at hand.

I share and share, go find a Catholic Church that is open, or ask someone in the Parish Office to open it for you
because you wish to pray. Go sit, better, kneel in front of the Tabernacle. You don't even have to pray. Jesus
is there, His grace will touch you.

Vince Flynn, a well known author died this week. He was 47. The man had it right, read his quote.

++ ++ ++

A close family friend of Flynn’s had this to say today about the author:

A friend of the Flynns, Fr. Peter Laird (who went to college with Vince), said that there were always two things in Vinnie’s hands: his phone and his ring rosary. Father added, “One was used to communicate with people on Earth, and one was used to communicate with God in Heaven.”…

We once heard him tell someone, “If you just stepped foot into a Catholic church you wouldn’t have so much anxiety.” Because Vince embraced his faith, he didn’t have any fear about dying. But as Father Laird said at Vince’s deathbed, “He just didn’t want to go so soon.”

Flynn was working on his 15th novel at the time of his passing. He is survived by his wife, Lysa, and three children.

www.theblaze.com...

Here is a direct link, I never knew what Vince Flynn looked like. He was very handsome!

www.theblaze.com...

reply to post by colbe


Hey now! You're treading on thin ice with that comment.

reply to post by colbe


I have plenty of exposure to such religions as it is. My various activities both social and business feature frequent forays into such territories. I have no doubt about my position in the matter.

Now that your friend is an atheist... what does he believe?

Originally posted by HarryTZ
Now that your friend is an atheist... what does he believe?

I am actually interested in this as well.

Obviously, we have the one core change, but did it change anything else?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

And you cannot prove the non-existence of a higher intelligence. Three can play at that game.

Beat me to this response InLight3D, I guess it now involves who is the biggest Bully on the Playground and how many players there are per side.

reply to post by vethumanbeing

Beat me to this response InLight3D, I guess it now involves who is the biggest Bully on the Playground and how many players there are per side.

It's not much of a response. An argument out of ignorance and the need for something bigger in order to have a meaning. I give myself meaning. If you need a god to give you meaning, if you need to believe in a god to feel like you're worth something, then that's on you.

reply to post by HarryTZ

Now that your friend is an atheist... what does he believe?

Something along the lines of humanism. He controls his own fate. Happiness is his to secure. He has the power to do and be what he wants.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by wildtimes

We humans all have to suffer, Aft.

It's part of the life experience. The 'imposition' of a "dominionist ideal" of destroying the planet because "it doesn't matter and Jesus is coming to save us" really, REALLY scares me.

AfterInfinity
As I said, I understand the purpose of suffering. I have incorporated a lot of Taoist principles into my atheist philosophy. The candle and the shadow, etc. There is always an opposite. Opposites lend meaning in similar fashion to the Torus model. I explained this to my friend, actually. It seems that few grasp the dual nature of everything. What I mean by this is the hilarious fact that dualism is compounded. No matter how far you zoom in or out, every duality has a duality has a duality has a duality has a duality. This is why balance is so important, because if you insist upon always choosing one side, you will forever be struggling with what to choose at each juncture. If you learn balance, you will be able to choose what is best for you at each juncture, filtering duality to the necessary degree to bring yourself harmony in this existence.
Now you know a small part of why I fear suffering. Suffering is a symptom of resistance. Resistance to what? And why? These are the questions we fail to ask ourselves, and so we fail to understand ourselves...and that's when we fail to imagine other possibilities.

So, there we have it. You suffer because you fear suffering and as suffering is a symptom of resistance, (TO WHAT! AND WHY?!!). You are not failing to ask YOURSELF you are the EMBODIMENT OF IT. You fail to understand YOURSELF because you have no CLEAR ANSWERS. You are not Failing to imagine other possibilities YOU ARE FLAILING about to find at least ONE (idea) you can defend, make concrete/immovable. Your Resistance to a God concept is your Suffering and of your own doing/making.

reply to post by vethumanbeing

So, there we have it. You suffer because you fear suffering and as suffering is a symptom of resistance, (TO WHAT! AND WHY?!!). You are not failing to ask YOURSELF you are the EMBODIMENT OF IT. You fail to understand YOURSELF because you have no CLEAR ANSWERS. You are not Failing to imagine other possibilities YOU ARE FLAILING about to find at least ONE (idea) you can defend, make concrete/immovable. Your Resistance to a God concept is your Suffering and of your own doing/making.

Sounds to me like you're the one doing the flailing. "I don't know, therefore God". It never changes.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

Beat me to this response InLight3D, I guess it now involves who is the biggest Bully on the Playground and how many players there are per side.

It's not much of a response. An argument out of ignorance and the need for something bigger in order to have a meaning. I give myself meaning. If you need a god to give you meaning, if you need to believe in a god to feel like you're worth something, then that's on you.

We cannot stand apart from ourselves and objectively assign our own value or lack thereof, but in Christ an incalculable and immeasurable value is assigned to us even in spite of ourselves and we are lifted up out of the pit of ignorance and declared sons of the most high living God. It's empowering not dis-empowering you've got the wrong idea. It's also humorous where great humor can be found at the expense of all our prior ignorance, enough even to wipe away the tears from our eyes and give us real hope of the lasting kind. It is the restoration of our humor and joy wherein we need no longer fall victim to the injustices of the absurdities of all manner of human folly and ignorance because of a set standard of Justice and Mercy who's final verdict is forgiveness.

"Our liberation is God's compulsion."
~ C.S. Lewis

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

 

And you cannot prove the non-existence of a higher intelligence. Three can play at that game.

There's this thing called an 'educated guess'. Perhaps you've heard of it. It's when all of the world's science leaders come together, compare notes, and say, "There might be something out there, but it's probably not a god. More like a quantum function. Maybe a law that we can't yet nail down. But it's not a god. The evidence points in the wrong direction."

You know, that sort of 'educated guess'.

The last time I checked, a "guess" is not the same thing as "proof". My comment still stands.

reply to post by NewAgeMan

We cannot stand apart from ourselves and objectively assign our own value or lack thereof, but in Christ an incalculable and immeasurable value is assigned to us even in spite of ourselves and we are lifted up out of the pit of ignorance and declared sons of the most high living God.

Sounds like a long list of assumptions to me.

It's empowering not dis-empowering you've got the wrong idea.

In the equation you are describing, humans are something I call a "dependent variable". Without this "God", without Jesus, we're nothing. I want to feel like I'm something because I know I'm something because I am what I choose to be regardless of what any deity wants from me or thinks of me.

Not to mention I have no reason to believe in any of what you just said. That's what the faith is for, right? The magical ingredient. It just automatically transmutes everything and anything into truth as long as the source agrees with what is being transmuted. I don't rely on faith. Possibilities and probabilities, chances and odds, all based on scientific observation and professional analysis. If a scientist cannot tell me for a fact that a god exists and lay down a list of proofs that conclusively point to the Christian god, or any god for that matter, then I see no reason to believe it when you tell me.

Sorry.

"Our liberation is God's compulsion."
~ C.S. Lewis

Liberation from what? Wanting to be liberated? Our own imperfection? Our ability to seek independent happiness? Our power as a conscious society of capable individuals? Why do we need a god? Meaning? Direction? Happiness? Security? What is a god here for?

I can believe in myself. That's enough for me.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

The last time I checked, a "guess" is not the same thing as "proof". My comment still stands.

You missed the 'educated' part.

educated
adjective
Definition of EDUCATED

a : giving evidence of training or practice : skilled
b : befitting one that is educated
c : based on some knowledge of fact
— ed·u·cat·ed·ness noun

Educated guess - a guess based on some knowledge of fact. I have more facts and professional observations supporting my atheistic beliefs than any theist does for theirs.

"I don't know" doesn't mean "God" is a suitable answer. It's a cop-out. That's all.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Well, if the universe itself isn't proof enough then nothing will be. Something does not come from nothing, that's a fact.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Well, if the universe itself isn't proof enough then nothing will be. Something does not come from nothing, that's a fact.

Certainly. But that doesn't mean your god is the guaranteed answer either. It's one answer, out of many possible answers that you apparently haven't even begun to consider. Maybe because your god, your answer, is the one that gives you the greatest sense of meaning.

I prefer to craft my own meaning, instead of just borrowing it. Things that are borrowed are just so limited. There's no creative freedom. No room to be yourself. Only exactly what your god wants from you, regardless of what you want for yourself. And that's the best part of freedom, isn't it? Being happy. Being able to seek that which makes you happy. What's the point in being free if there's no room for who you are?