Are Native Americans Considered Foreigners in America?

I'm sorry, I just always wanted to ask that question.

Anyway, I fully expect to get overrun by another country any day now so I'm sure it will become a moot point for me soon.

I believe it is fundamental for human nature to venture out and claim new territories as their own. I don't believe the Natives of North America were any proof against that nature. I went to Japan a couple of years ago and saw an aboriginal group festival (the Ainu?) and seriously they looked just like a mixture of the the Haida Indians of our Queen Charlottes with outfits and trappings of the Polynesian people (am I still allowed to call them that?)

And the only reason we can no longer analyze Kennewick man to determine native ancestry is because a clan claimed him a couple of decades ago and gave him a "proper burial". Which means we no longer have access to him. So whether he was caucasian or not is also a moot point. But it wouldn't have proved that Caucasians were here "natively" anyway.

reply to post by XaniMatriX


You do not know that because they are just now discovering sites like the Crow Creek Massacre. Were Europeans waring more, sure that is very likely. We know Europeans were waring because we have more than oral history. We will continue to piece together early American history for some time with finds like this.

Other info...

A part of my 2nd verse in the song I posted

Sure back in the day minority treatment was inhumane

But they just swapped out the physical for a mental set of chains

So you Slave away night n day hope n pray it be ok

end of the month still got these bills to pay

There has to be more to this so it seems

Or is that just the concept of the American dream

Everybody wants the high life that’s all we see

Reality check unplug the TV

I hope and pray for America’s future. I feel that it is going to have to come from “We the People” and not some politician. Unity is the key, and we have to be able to cross these social barriers in society.

Edit to add: I got to call it a night. Catch you all tomorrow.

Blending and integration wasn't part of the original plan... pretty sure it never was after either.

On October 12, 1492, Columbus and his crew came ashore to the Bahamas and were greeted by a native tribe called the Arawaks (Davis 4). In his journal, Columbus praises the Indians for their immediate generosity and for their “well built bodies and handsome features” (Zinn 1). However, soon after Columbus met the natives he writes about his intentions toward them: “They would make fine servants… With fifty men we could subjugate them all and make them do whatever we want” (qtd. in Zinn 1).

Link to above text

American Native Aborigines are foreigners. They were not the first peoples to migrate to the Continent.
The Clovis culture were the first here and they were European.. many thousands of years before the wave from Asia.
The proof is in their remains and tools. which are distinctively of a European nature.. White man.
Clovis culture has been found from the east to the west in North America. But whatever killed off the Megafauna killed off the Clovis people too.

reply to post by IntrinsicMotivation
This is a slight slant on your topic, but will give you an idea of some opinions towards it.

If Hitler Was On The $20 Bill, How Would The Jews Feel?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Though I don't have time right now to fully read your thread it is a contradiction for a NATIVE American to be considered or thought of as a foreigner! As they are more native to the US then any European immigrants!
I consider what happened to the American Indians to be wrong in every definition of the word!
Even to this day the American Indians continue to be exploited! I'm thinking of Jack Abramoff and the scandal that rocked the Washington lobbying hierarchy! To think of all the hurt he caused and he only served less then 4 years and is now out and about to capitalize on his fame! I am truly sorry for all that has happened to you and your people! God bless you and yours!

If anything, we need to get rid of a lot of holidays. We're all Americans apart of something so much bigger than our ancestry, race, and nation. We are apart of the greatest human civilization that has ever existed. We've (the collective we) have been around for at least 250,000 years, and we've only advanced significantly in the past 200 or so years to what we are today.

Native American history is American history. As is black history, white history, etc. I second Morgan Freeman in that in order to get past race, we must focus less on what divides, us, and more on what unites us as people.

Originally posted by HelenConway
reply to post by intrptr

 

The concept of land ownership was also foreign to the English - until the 'rulers' stole common land during enclosure.

The English lived off the ' common land' which meant communal/

The process of enclosure done by force, by th e 'rulers' caused violence and bloodshed, and remains among the most controversial areas of agricultural and economic history in England

Many of the early 'americans' the english colonists - came from villages where common land was used by all - it was not individually owned at all.

But I do agree the settlers did murder the wolfs and buffalo - but most of this happened in the 1800s.

It was not done by the early English settlers in the original colonies.

edit on 29-5-2013 by HelenConway because: (no reason given)

Maybe they were too busy killing Indians to kill the wolfs and buffalo at that time!

Seems like everyone is considered a "foreigner".

Also, seems to me that at the end of the day and if one were to look at these things with an open mind and their own natural intelligence then what we are left with is 99% folk lore.

Personally i have never seen proof that north america was not sparsely populated until the industrial revolution really took hold and that was not until at least the 1830s. So really most of what we do know we seem to get from books and movies written by people who were not even around during the periods we are discussing.

People are going to believe what they want to believe but that is just not reality, and i think this is what leads to so many problems for humans as a civilization.

I also have reason to believe that the distant past was a hell of a lot more tame than we arewere led to believe as far as human to human interaction. Unless you were unlucky enough to be strapped to a rock and sacrificed to some god which i do have reason to believe did occur simply due to taking beliefs too far, even if i have no way of understanding that mindset so....

I know some people will look at this as being provocative but it is actually the opposite and is a pragmatic perspective.

We seem to spend far too much time scratching some bad itches but these are our own problems to which i have no answer for.

Originally posted by nosacrificenofreedom
Though I don't have time right now to fully read your thread it is a contradiction for a NATIVE American to be considered or thought of as a foreigner! As they are more native to the US then any European immigrants!
I consider what happened to the American Indians to be wrong in every definition of the word!
Even to this day the American Indians continue to be exploited! I'm thinking of Jack Abramoff and the scandal that rocked the Washington lobbying hierarchy! To think of all the hurt he caused and he only served less then 4 years and is now out and about to capitalize on his fame! I am truly sorry for all that has happened to you and your people! God bless you and yours!

You are wrong! Clovis Culture were Europeans that migrated to this continent Over 12,000 Years before the wave of migrants from Asia. Does it bother you that the Caucasoid Race were here first and this is their Continent and they just repopulated what was rightfully theirs?

The only place in the world we (and I mean everyone) can call home is Africa. Modern man migrated from that place to everywhere else.

The bigger question, in my simple mind, is how large a percentage of people still think of aboriginals as 'less than human'?

Originally posted by Youareallschizophrenic
Clovis Culture were Europeans that migrated to this continent Over 12,000 Years before the wave of migrants from Asia. Does it bother you that the Caucasoid Race were here first and this is their Continent and they just repopulated what was rightfully theirs?

You know that you're going to have to cite your sources, right?

Originally posted by ParanoidAmerican
reply to post by frazzle

 

I was going to make a post about this might still but it goes with what you are saying as well..

"he resolution defines that homeland as those lands identified in the 1851 Fort Laramie Treaty and “all such lands as located in traditional Crow territory according to tribal oral history.”

That's a lot of territory. Oral history describes Crow land as situated within four tepee poles: the north at the Bear’s Paw Mountains in northern Montana, the west at the Absaroka and Beartooth Mountains, the south at the Wind River Range in Wyoming and the east at the Black Hills of western South Dakota and northeastern Wyoming."


I read this the other day and it made me wonder what the Sioux/Lakota would have to say about this since they assert rights to some of this land as well other tribes.


Crow Tribe asserts rights through tribal resolutions

edit on 29-5-2013 by ParanoidAmerican because: (no reason given)

A lot of the information regarding the Lakota Freedom Movement has been scrubbed from the net but if you really want to know what they think you could try the link below, there is a great deal of wisdom to be found there if you'll take the time. www.republicoflakotah.com...

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by Youareallschizophrenic
Clovis Culture were Europeans that migrated to this continent Over 12,000 Years before the wave of migrants from Asia. Does it bother you that the Caucasoid Race were here first and this is their Continent and they just repopulated what was rightfully theirs?

You know that you're going to have to cite your sources, right?

Site my sources?? This is common knowledge and if you want to know more I suggest you do the research as I will not spoon feed you knowledge.

Originally posted by Youareallschizophrenic
Site my sources?? This is common knowledge and if you want to know more I suggest you do the research as I will not spoon feed you knowledge.

I beg to differ. You are using some serious generalisations here. I am suggesting that you do the research so that I don't have to spoonfeed you. Besides...you are making the statement so it's up to you to back it up with current data.

Originally posted by Youareallschizophrenic

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by Youareallschizophrenic
Clovis Culture were Europeans that migrated to this continent Over 12,000 Years before the wave of migrants from Asia. Does it bother you that the Caucasoid Race were here first and this is their Continent and they just repopulated what was rightfully theirs?

You know that you're going to have to cite your sources, right?

Site my sources?? This is common knowledge and if you want to know more I suggest you do the research as I will not spoon feed you knowledge.

There is no "common knowledge" regarding Clovis other than in your mind.

What happened to them (Clovis) is still a mystery today. Their whole existence is shrouded in controversy with many possible answers to the ongoing mystery.

It is surmised that native American tribes encountered by early explorers are descendants of these mysterious people, but for now we do not know.

randygodwin.hubpages.com...

One thing's sure, if you try to sign your stolen property over to Mr. Clovis, you'll be laughed out of town.

The world is our home and who ever takes care of it than it belongs to them, without raping it and killing the very earth that nurtures us, I don`t care who lives beside me as long as they treat the world as our home. I don`t care who was here first, the animals have been here also and do they have a say in mans greed. What if I we grow gills am I gonna tell the fish I was here first or will I relocate them, oh yeah we did I have them swimming in tanks.

Originally posted by IntrinsicMotivation

Originally posted by txinfidel
reply to post by IntrinsicMotivation

 

The simple answer to this conundrum is that the Brittish convinced many of the natives to fight along side them.

The white man just did not come and simply dominate and take over.

Your response is in line with the white people I mentioned in the op.

“Be Quiet Native American! You Lost The War!”

Their land was invaded and they sought out help, can you blame them?

One man’s terrorist is another man’s Freedom Fighter.

How will you feel when you find yourself in Native American shoes?

Let’s be real……

Native Americans helped the new immigrants from Europe survive in this land. Eventually those same immigrants would cause genocide to Natives and almost erase them from the books. Then not much later those same immigrants would treat their own people with disgust as they came over on the boats to America.

It has become socially and politically acceptable to degrade discriminate against and utterly forget that we exist.

We are the invisible or forgotten race. Some of the blame lies with us, we have not been as verbal about our plight as other minorities. But non the less it is now kosher to treat us like 3rd class citizens if even that.

*2-3 generations go by*

What is a native American? There is no such thing, it is made up. This country was empty when the Europeans came.