Enlightenment and God. (biblical view)

Originally posted by dominicus
reply to post by bb23108

 

Yeah that's a rough one, I'd have to go back through alot of books or do some more research on that one. I figured the Transmitter's were/are a rarity. Many of the testimonies of the Enlightened One's that I've read, the Spirit came to them in solitude at it's own time/discretion .....so off the top of the head, can't name too many.

Will look into it.

It is much more obvious in the traditions of the East, but given that non-duality and the whole matter of Spiritual Masters was (is) not so readily accepted in the West, I imagine any Transmission function of a Spiritual Master or Adept or Saint was hidden much more in the West. That is what I meant when I said most Christians exoterics would frown upon this notion - just like they tend to relative to even considering Jesus a Spiritual Master, even though he is called master by his disciples!

Originally posted by bb23108

Originally posted by dominicus
reply to post by bb23108

 

Yeah that's a rough one, I'd have to go back through alot of books or do some more research on that one. I figured the Transmitter's were/are a rarity. Many of the testimonies of the Enlightened One's that I've read, the Spirit came to them in solitude at it's own time/discretion .....so off the top of the head, can't name too many.

Will look into it.

It is much more obvious in the traditions of the East, but given that non-duality and the whole matter of Spiritual Masters was (is) not so readily accepted in the West, I imagine any Transmission function of a Spiritual Master or Adept or Saint was hidden much more in the West. That is what I meant when I said most Christians exoterics would frown upon this notion - just like they tend to relative to even considering Jesus a Spiritual Master, even though he is called master by his disciples!

edit on 20-3-2013 by bb23108 because:

YEa in the East, they have tons of transmission, Third Eye opening, various channels, Kundalini, etc .....but I don't think they are the same as the Holy Spirit. Some I believe are, or may be, but not all.

The whole kundalini deal, is the root/bottom of spine becoming electric and rising up the spine opening chakras, channels, etc.

The Holy Spirit enters from the head and all the way down to the feet, and is like an Intelligent spirit that may also activate kundalini and open channels (as was in my case) but it is also a Spirit that will float around your house, inside of you, others will become aware that it is in the house and what not, ego slayer etc.

ALso wanted to post about the Sufi Saint who also spoke about being One with God and got killed for it:

Mansur believed in union with the Divine, that God was within him, and that he and God had become one and the same. Mansur was cut into many pieces because in the state of ecstasy he exclaimed Ana Abrar-al Haq "I am the Abrar of truth". He was executed in public in Baghdad. They cut him into pieces and then they burnt his remains. He kept repeating "I am the Truth" as they kept cutting his arms, legs, tongue and finally his head. He was smiling, even as they chopped off his head. Al-Hallaj wanted to testify of this relationship to God to others thus even asking his fellow Muslims to kill him (Massignon, 79) and accepting his execution, saying that "what is important for the ecstatic is for the One to reduce him to oneness. " (Massignon, 87) He also referred to the martyrdom of Christ, saying he also wanted to die "in the supreme confession of the cross" (Olivier Clément. Dio è carita, p. 41) Like Christ, he gave his execution a redemptive significance, believing as he did that his death "was uniting his beloved God and His community of Muslims against himself and thereby bore witness in extremis to the tawhid (the oneness) of both. " (Mason, 25)

Source Wiki Page

That Sufi Saint was truly taken over in ecstatic communion with the Divine! A very inspiring story.

Yes, I agree there are many gurus in the East that can stimulate various yogic energies in the aspirant, especially once the aspirant has prepared themselves, and learned various yogic techniques. And yes, many such gurus look to work the kundalini in others.

What is much rarer are actual spiritual masters who transmit the Divine Conscious Light from Above and this varies with the realization of such masters. Swami Muktananda specifically transmitted to devotees the Light above and they would wake up from the confines of the lower body-mind into above the mind realities. As we have already discussed, such experiences however do not generally open the heart to its inherent truth beyond the ego-I.

However, as rare as these types of spirit transmission masters are in the East, they are seemingly rarer in the West. Assuming Jesus actually was a spirit transmission master, what was his impulse or "plan" for this to be carried on after his physical death? I understand that he spoke in terms of his followers seeing and relating to him even after his physical death, and of course this is what people understood as his gift to them forever.

It is interesting to consider if there was a line of spiritual realizers in Christianity that tried to carry this function of spirit transmission on, or at least that was the plan - but the direct lineage died out because of having to go too underground with these esoteric teachings, perhaps? Was this something the early Gnostics perhaps were charged with doing?

This is why I asked you if there are other examples like Seraphim because without such living examples of realizers, the true essence of any spiritual tradition can soon become replaced by dogmatic institutionalization and so not be based in the founder's heart-intention. On this note, I will look into what that woman you mentioned earlier teaches or speaks of.

To state the obvious, I find this whole matter of Jesus being a Spirit-transmitting master very interesting. I wonder what Seraphim's peers thought about his transmissions! That account I posted earlier sounded like a very intense spiritual transmission.

reply to post by bb23108

However, as rare as these types of spirit transmission masters are in the East, they are seemingly rarer in the West. Assuming Jesus actually was a spirit transmission master, what was his impulse or "plan" for this to be carried on after his physical death?

Yes most definitely it was the plan.

It is interesting to consider if there was a line of spiritual realizers in Christianity that tried to carry this function of spirit transmission on, or at least that was the plan - but the direct lineage died out because of having to go too underground with these esoteric teachings, perhaps? Was this something the early Gnostics perhaps were charged with doing?

It may have been that way w/ the Gnostics as they spoke of a "Perfection" that happened to many elders "experientially". However I don't agree in a lineage based on living "Masters", because for me, when I got the Spirit, I was solo at the house and my practices were hard core reading, seeking God, speaking to God, praying. One time I fell in sexual debauchery and was just pissed and sad at having been a slave to lust, no matter where 'I' go, lust follows, so I rode my bike to a field in a forest preserve near me, dropped to me knee's and yelled out, "Where are you Father? I need you, I need Truth no matter what it is. I am nothing of myself an see the insatiable madness of the world. Reveals yourself so I may know you."

Boy did he ever, a few months later ...then more and more as I grow towards Union and surrendering the 'I' as false.

My point being, that I did not necessarily have it transferred. Though my Christian friend and Bible study teacher at the time, there was definitely something about, a warmth, an aura, couldn't put my finger on it. Still I never trusted, nor will I ever trust people/humans because of various lessons I learned as a kid. So my path has always been direct. I don't care who knows what, who says what, I go direct to the God and have sought God, and then BOOM the Spirit hits me with 10+ years of mystical experiences and ever longer moments/time in Union.

So my take is, you can be, for example, an inmate, find a Bible in your library or solitary confinement for that matter, unravel the NT to the best of our understanding, practice the precepts, and eventually the Spirit and experience the Divine light, Union, all that would happen even in solitude with no physical lineage.

This is why I asked you if there are other examples like Seraphim because without such living examples of realizers, the true essence of any spiritual tradition can soon become replaced by dogmatic institutionalization and so not be based in the founder's heart-intention. On this note, I will look into what that woman you mentioned earlier teaches or speaks of.

That's my point, that the transmitters aren't necessary. There is already built in, into everyone a direct line of communication to the Divine, albeit the functions thereof are interconnected to intuition and heart and very few have access to the depths of those 2. So the more a person is reaching out, seeking that, the quicker the Divne Mysteries begin to occur.

If you study the Desert Fathers and the Philokalia, there were tons of Monks living in the deserts re-creating Jesus' 40 days, though many of them would remain in the deserts for the rest of their lives working out Union/Enlightenment. When younger monks joined, they would usually cling to an Elder who would teach them the ways of the Inner life and Enlightenment/Union. SO at least that time there were MANY scattered transmitters. But they also speak of how some Monks would go into Solitude in the Desert and every so often when they recieved a visitor friend, they would recall to them where they currently were on the Path, ie.e illumination, Dark Night, Union, Purification, Out of Body, Ecstacies, etc ...though it was spoken w/ much humility

To state the obvious, I find this whole matter of Jesus being a Spirit-transmitting master very interesting. I wonder what Seraphim's peers thought about his transmissions! That account I posted earlier sounded like a very intense spiritual transmission.

YEa Jesus said here:
John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;"

But then in another verse it says not to grieve the Spirit ...which implies if you grieve someone, they will not stay or be around as much.

Mostly all denominations agree the Comforter is the Holy Spirit which as/through Grace, begins the mystical transformations into Ego-Death and towards Union.

reply to post by dominicus
The trouble with the do it yourself approach tends to be that most aspirants have to do a lot of seeking before finding the Divine, and even then, particularly in the beginning, it is more experiential and temporal, and so fades into memory.

If one is graced with a true master who transmits the Divine, then that gift is given from the beginning because such a master wouldn't be able to offer anything less than what he IS. I imagine there were some followers of Jesus who just were gone in him continuously - having seen the Light from the beginning.

Women often seem more open in that way, because men tend to be more competitive, even about spirituality. I imagine there were some women around Jesus utterly ecstatic. There are certainly traditions for this kind of bhakta in the East - utter dependance on Grace.

It sounds like you are saying that Grace is your master in some very real sense.What if you met someone such as Seraphim when you first starting feeling the impulse to realize the Divine? Your depth of reception would likely have been quickened. Of course during Jesus' times, the spiritual master, especially a true transmitter of the Divine Light, would have to be very discreet, I imagine. But such a one could greatly serve a one-pointed person.

I want to add what I told about enlightenments in this thread: www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by bb23108

The trouble with the do it yourself approach tends to be that most aspirants have to do a lot of seeking before finding the Divine, and even then, particularly in the beginning, it is more experiential and temporal, and so fades into memory.

It's a double edged sword. Yea as you mentioned, that's the trouble with going about it solo. But the benefit, which has been in my experience, is that everyone around me was living with watered down teachings and without the direct experience, feeding me mil when I was ready for meat. Hence the Spirit came.

But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

That's the next step in the Christian Path above and is the changing from consuming Spiritual Milk to Meat.

You get the Spirit, and then you are taught direct experiences, the Now, Transcendence, Bliss, Divine Love, Nonjudgment, Deep Surrender, etc. I used to be a hardliner Atheist and still know quite a few people from those circles, many of the very intelligent people with Phd's and what not. One of them was an Engineer and was quite intrigued in my changes and shifts away from Atheism. Eventually when I explained to him Spiritual things from the perspective of Quantum Physics and how science has created it's own Bias Bubbles and Taboos (One of which was the study of Consciousness itself until just recently, last few decades) then he started to come around. I knew all the best Atheist arguments, but when the Holy Spirit experiences happened, I immediately new the best counters to their arguments and when I shared these with my Engineer friend, he eventually shifted to Agnostic and is now leaning towards a variety style of Theism/Mysticism himself.

If one is graced with a true master who transmits the Divine, then that gift is given from the beginning because such a master wouldn't be able to offer anything less than what he IS. I imagine there were some followers of Jesus who just were gone in him continuously - having seen the Light from the beginning.

Many people can't/won't have a Master because the Ego refuses to acknowledge that there is someone who is a "Master" of something. Even when Jesus was around he was seen as a threat to those who held positions of Power and to the Dogmatic Fundies who thought OT Judaism is end all be all God of all things.

Women often seem more open in that way, because men tend to be more competitive, even about spirituality. I imagine there were some women around Jesus utterly ecstatic. There are certainly traditions for this kind of bhakta in the East - utter dependance on Grace.

I had this discussion with a guy I met at a retreat who was also closing in on Enlightenment. He was adamant that women are more wrapped in ego due to looks, status quo, emotional changes due to hormones, and overall more scattered then men. I simply responded for him to look around, as the retreat had more women than men. Personally I think both sides have strengths and weaknesses that can prevent or be optimal towards the path.

It sounds like you are saying that Grace is your master in some very real sense.What if you met someone such as Seraphim when you first starting feeling the impulse to realize the Divine?

Actually, I was eventually put in touch with a Hermit who lives in South Africa, and I would correspond with him almost daily through e-mail. HE would give me certain advice about Observing the Observer and Resting as Awareness and I wouldn't listen for a quite a while. The ego wanted to figure it out itself and refused to see it itself as an illusion. Eventually I gave in to the advice and it panned out, and then after 3 years of advice he told me he has nothing else to teach me. These days, I'd cling to a Seraphim.

Your depth of reception would likely have been quickened. Of course during Jesus' times, the spiritual master, especially a true transmitter of the Divine Light, would have to be very discreet, I imagine. But such a one could greatly serve a one-pointed person.

Yea but like I said many didn't recognize him and were wrapped in their own "story." I did a thread a while back and asked if a Spiritual Master knocked on your door tomorrow and asked you to follow/learn from but leave behind everything, too many people were like " but my kids, my job, mortgage, business, this that etc" I understand having responsibilities, so it's more aimed at those w/o kids or whose kids are grown and independent, some just still cling too much to let go and follow a Christ

Originally posted by Angle
What if reaching enlightenment is the same as being obedient to God again.

That sounds like a very appropriate conclusion to me, and to quote you I think you've hit the nail on the head here.

The problem is finding God is very difficult while plunged so deep into material. And every second you spend not being enlightened (or obedient to god), you stray even further away from enlightenment, making it even more difficult not only to truly obey god in your thoughts, but to even recognize which godly thoughts or actions you had in the first place! Most people are so far from enlightenment they can't even come closer to enlightenment with their entire effort focused towards enlightenment. Still others are so hopeless that they cling to the idea that they are enlightened when they certainly are not.

I read a book about some true Buddhist monks that are part of a very long tradition going back entire millennium, and even with their entire lives dedicated towards becoming enlightened only a very small fraction of those monks actually become enlightened masters.

I wish I could tell you how to become enlightened but I myself am not yet an enlightened master but I have hope for this year and a big plan to attain this goal, although this thread has done a good job of enlightening me - albeit temporarily.

Originally posted by dominicus
Many people can't/won't have a Master because the Ego refuses to acknowledge that there is someone who is a "Master" of something.

Yes, and this is especially true in Western cultures. However, anyone who learns any art or science is usually taught much of what they know - so this refusal to acknowledge a true spiritual master has more to do with the ego feeling threatened rather than based on some actual intelligent discriminating conclusion.

Originally posted by dominicus
I had this discussion with a guy I met at a retreat who was also closing in on Enlightenment. He was adamant that women are more wrapped in ego due to looks, status quo, emotional changes due to hormones, and overall more scattered then men. I simply responded for him to look around, as the retreat had more women than men. Personally I think both sides have strengths and weaknesses that can prevent or be optimal towards the path.

Yes, both men and women have their strengths and weakness, and in fact, when we notice that we are actually both male and female in terms of our energy, and also at core beyond both when it comes to real spiritual transcendence, it doesn't matter. It's just in the beginning there tends to be a difference in orientation generally speaking - women may be able to relate more to feeling Grace directly (being more feeling based) while men may relate to more the insight approach (being more mentally based). Of course, these are just generalities.

Have you seen any esoteric Christian writings or commentary relative to Adam and Eve that would support the notion that they represent the two aspects of the whole body, with the female principle being the tree of life (the physical body) and the male principle being the tree of knowledge (the mind) - and when the two are fully integrated (not split apart), then Jesus can be realized in the center - i.e., the Heart or the Garden itself?

Originally posted by dominicus
Actually, I was eventually put in touch with a Hermit who lives in South Africa, and I would correspond with him almost daily through e-mail. HE would give me certain advice about Observing the Observer and Resting as Awareness and I wouldn't listen for a quite a while. The ego wanted to figure it out itself and refused to see it itself as an illusion. Eventually I gave in to the advice and it panned out, and then after 3 years of advice he told me he has nothing else to teach me. These days, I'd cling to a Seraphim.

Cool story. Is this hermit still out of the public eye?

Originally posted by dominicus
Yea but like I said many didn't recognize him and were wrapped in their own "story." I did a thread a while back and asked if a Spiritual Master knocked on your door tomorrow and asked you to follow/learn from but leave behind everything, too many people were like " but my kids, my job, mortgage, business, this that etc" I understand having responsibilities, so it's more aimed at those w/o kids or whose kids are grown and independent, some just still cling too much to let go and follow a Christ

I will have to check that thread out. I figure that if someone truly recognized Jesus as master, they would not be able to help themselves. Of course, these days, we are way more complicated by tendency and might not have the free energy and attention for this recognition to move us to drop everything. Of course, that might not be necessary, as you mentioned at one point, as such practices can be done by householders.

reply to post by bb23108

Yes, and this is especially true in Western cultures. However, anyone who learns any art or science is usually taught much of what they know - so this refusal to acknowledge a true spiritual master has more to do with the ego feeling threatened rather than based on some actual intelligent discriminating conclusion.

Most definitely ego threat. That's what ultimately got Jesus. Too many Egos in positions of power were threatened wit the possible loss of that position and a ripple too big in the lake that was the status quo. Even many/most Jews that were waiting for him to return, didn't believe he was who he said he was and wanted him dead.

nd in fact, when we notice that we are actually both male and female in terms of our energy, and also at core beyond both when it comes to real spiritual transcendence, it doesn't matter.

Yea, my physical shell is male, but I was always in touch with intuition, grace, art, music, poetry etc. It was just a few years ago I remembered pre-existing prior to a body and was at that point gender-less, just a unit of Consciousness. That sure makes it easy to let go of the typical Western stereotype of having to be the drunk fighter womanizer. Many go through that anyway, but these days I'd rather be a sober meditator, lover, and peoplizer. Most woman I had in my life anyway came to me in the most unlikely scenario when I was least expecting it, and that has always worked out the best ....but you know that's niether here nor there.

Have you seen any esoteric Christian writings or commentary relative to Adam and Eve that would support the notion that they represent the two aspects of the whole body, with the female principle being the tree of life (the physical body) and the male principle being the tree of knowledge (the mind) - and when the two are fully integrated (not split apart), then Jesus can be realized in the center - i.e., the Heart or the Garden itself?

I think I've seen something similar mentioned in Kabballah but not sure. It would make alot of sense, although most woman are also wrapped in ego/mind these days TBH. It's definitely an interesting principle, especially when you consider that at a certain point you need the mind to realize that the mind is limited and a dead end, and to use its wisdom to find the heart, which is its source. Seen it with my own 2, the Ego/Mind unravel from the heart to take its place in the head upon waking, then returning to the heart in deep sleep.

Cool story. Is this hermit still out of the public eye?

Yeah, he spends majority of time in complete Union/Oneness/MErged/Enlightenment.......although that's all there really is now for him, the actual sitting practice of the body configuring to That, is all that's left for him. He gets like Bishops and Zen folks and various traditions swing by to hang out with him and get some pointers on how the mind is not who you are ultimately, etc.

I will have to check that thread out. I figure that if someone truly recognized Jesus as master, they would not be able to help themselves. Of course, these days, we are way more complicated by tendency and might not have the free energy and attention for this recognition to move us to drop everything. Of course, that might not be necessary, as you mentioned at one point, as such practices can be done by householders.

i'll dig back in the past posts and pull it up

reply to post by bb23108


Do you mean teacher with spiritual master? For God masters the teacher. Without God the teacher would not know. mho

reply to post by On7a7higher7plane

Originally posted by On7a7higher7plane

Originally posted by Angle
What if reaching enlightenment is the same as being obedient to God again.

That sounds like a very appropriate conclusion to me, and to quote you I think you've hit the nail on the head here.

I think the Judaic god makes a very bad role model for a species so susceptible to addictions and delusions.

I read a book about some true Buddhist monks that are part of a very long tradition going back entire millennium, and even with their entire lives dedicated towards becoming enlightened only a very small fraction of those monks actually become enlightened masters.

But you admit that some do, right? Without worshipping a god? Imagine that.

Originally posted by Angle
reply to post by bb23108

 

Do you mean teacher with spiritual master? For God masters the teacher. Without God the teacher would not know. mho

I was just saying that people seem to have no problem accepting a teacher for various studies, etc., but when it comes to realizing the Truth, many people think they can do that on their own, and feel that accepting a Spiritual Master (who has realized the Truth) is wrong.

dominicus and I were talking about how such people don't want to accept a Spiritual Master (such as Jesus) because of the threat it makes to the ego.

ah, yes.

It reminds me of this. Sometimes when somebody asks me to do something or just anything, I say no because of something, and when that something is not bothering me I might say yes to the opportunity. But yeah, for me it is something that confuses myself so I become apathic to things.

Originally posted by dominicus
I think I've seen something similar mentioned in Kabballah but not sure. It would make alot of sense, although most woman are also wrapped in ego/mind these days TBH. It's definitely an interesting principle, especially when you consider that at a certain point you need the mind to realize that the mind is limited and a dead end, and to use its wisdom to find the heart, which is its source. Seen it with my own 2, the Ego/Mind unravel from the heart to take its place in the head upon waking, then returning to the heart in deep sleep.

A good woman can make a man lose his mind in no time!

Yes, women are definitely as wrapped up in ego as men - but there often is a different expression because women are generally more "elementally comfortable" (at ease with the body) than men. I mean we call her Mother Nature, not Father Nature, etc. Whereas the male principal is more associated with conceptualization, etc. This is not to say anything negative about either male or female because both aspects are inherent in every body-mind, and should be integrated. The body should not be shunned arbitrarily nor should the mind be idolized or vice-versa.

The whole body-mind is truly the only identity that we can rightfully call "I" or "me". Certainly no one has ever seen the internal ego-I, as it is just a moment to moment activity, not an actual entity. It is only until whole bodily integration is the case (physical, emotional, mental, spiritual) that one can fulfill Jesus' core commandments - otherwise there is a dualism set up in the body-mind itself, like two warring parts - body vs. mind, ascent vs. descent, etc..

Originally posted by bb23108


The whole body-mind is truly the only identity that we can rightfully call "I" or "me".

edit on 25-3-2013 by bb23108 because:

Yes, what are those claiming it being different? Just ones trying to bring confusion?

reply to post by bb23108

The whole body-mind is truly the only identity that we can rightfully call "I" or "me"

Thta's just something that at this point in my life I cannot fundamentally agree with it. I've seen too many times in Union and Enlightenment experiences that I am not the body or the mind, remember pre-existing prior to any physical body, and have a sitting practice where the mind/thinking is let go of and there is not "mind" so to speak.

Certainly no one has ever seen the internal ego-I, as it is just a moment to moment activity, not an actual entity.

I have seen it as an Entity,as not I, as the cause of all problems. It's all over the bible too.

It is only until whole bodily integration is the case (physical, emotional, mental, spiritual) that one can fulfill Jesus' core commandments - otherwise there is a dualism set up in the body-mind itself, like two warring parts - body vs. mind, ascent vs. descent, etc..

Yeah I agree. The dualism/War between these aspects is all too real, and only when there is a ultimate transcendence past all of this whether through grace or insight and it's all seen as illusion, is when the person is finally at a place to let go into ultimate letting go of all the illusions into the integration you speak of.

But until then, it is vital to see that the mind is not you, the body is ultimately not you either (referred to as a temple in the Bible, and hence if the body is a temple, where are "You" located within this temple), and they call this negation, to negate all that is not you, or all that is not God, will reveal God.

That's what the cloud of Unknowing does. Unknow everything, all worldly programming that was put into you, and you including unknowing yourself, and eventually then God will become known

Originally posted by Angle
Yes, what are those claiming it being different? Just ones trying to bring confusion?

Well typically people identify the "I" as inside the body-mind somewhere - some point of awareness that is apart from the whole-body mind.

reply to post by bb23108


I think that's what dominicus just meant in his last reply (first alinea). I think he says he is the soul.

Originally posted by dominicus
Thta's just something that at this point in my life I cannot fundamentally agree with it. I've seen too many times in Union and Enlightenment experiences that I am not the body or the mind, remember pre-existing prior to any physical body, and have a sitting practice where the mind/thinking is let go of and there is not "mind" so to speak.

Oh, this just points to a need for me to define my use of these terms better. When I say "I" in reference to the body-mind, I am talking about the "I" we refer to in every day language - not who we actually are. Yes, we are beyond the body-mind truly, but for the sake of communication, it makes the most sense to me to refer to "I" as one's whole body-mind, not some ego principle inside the body-mind.

Originally posted by dominicus
I have seen it as an Entity,as not I, as the cause of all problems. It's all over the bible too.

I know that people refer to the ego as an entity, but it is better characterized as a moment to moment self-generated activity, imo - one of contraction of feeling and the focusing of attention in separation.

Originally posted by dominicus
But until then, it is vital to see that the mind is not you, the body is ultimately not you either

Definitely. Again, the "you" that you (as the body-mind we call dominicus) is referring to here, is beyond the body-mind.

Originally posted by dominicus
That's what the cloud of Unknowing does. Unknow everything, all worldly programming that was put into you, and you including unknowing yourself, and eventually then God will become known

Yes God becomes Obvious as the Unknown, beyond mind, knowledge, etc. Do you have a favorite book you can recommend on this aspect of the way?