Ban the Gun, Repeal the Second Amendment.

Originally posted by hesse
Stop crying americans... You don´t seem civilised enough to carry guns...

We invented nearly everything, conquered nearly everywhere, and stomped the hell out of England with a ragtag group of patriots to start our impressive reign.

You Euros can keep your effeminate ways and we'll keep our guns.

reply to post by Alfie1


A low estimate of guns in the US is 50 million....... so 9,000 out of 50,000,000

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin

So here I am sitting watching the news, I see a young boy talking about how he “saw and heard” the bullets of a gun man. The headline below this innocent child’s face reads “27 people killed in Connecticut shooting, 18 children”.

I am not to beat about the bush hear but as a British guy looking in on this I am shocked, there have been more of these type of mass shootings this year than I can count. Every month I am seeing some state governor passing on his heartfelt condolences to the families of the dead.

How about this instead America rather than having your leaders “apologise” to all the dead families how about you do this? Get out of the Wild West and the 18th century and BAN THE GUN!!! You are not cowboys anymore, you are not John Rambo the British are not about to invade you.

For the “guns don’t kill people, people do”, stop hiding behind an old cliché, if you lot bothered with proper gun control I would not be watching this disturbing story.

To be clear, I am not saying ban all guns or ban the gun overnight, what I am saying is that you lot need to grow up and some proper gun regulation. You need gun reform, it’s very simple, none of you gun enthusiasts needs 40 guns with 1200 rounds of ammunition.

Stop hiding behind that ancient bit of paper, your constitution, you all need to grow a set and sort out your gun problem before you have anoter 18 dead kids, who knows next time it could be one of yours, I pray it is not and i pray for the families of those affected

I used to think it would be sensible for them to ban guns in the USA, however following the 'Fast and the Furious' gun scandal where the USA's own government gave guns to mexican gangs so they would go back to america and kill people (so they could ban guns) I wouldn't trust them with a barge pole.

I call conspiracy on this as they got caught out on the Fast and Furious and now they've got some patsy with a learning disability to do something outrageous in order to force gun control.
MkUltra is still up and running as evidenced by what happened to Jason Russell of 'kony' fame.

I think the founding fathers were on the money with the 2nd amendement.
After all you they had george bush as president. I'd want a gun too if he was in charge of my country.

As ben franklin said: "When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny"

America is not a civilised country, they are giving guns to gangs in syria and libya...
If it wa somewhere in Europe, I'd say of course ban guns. But In america, the people need them to keep them safe.

The crocodile tears shed by Obama says that this was all set up.

Originally posted by wingsfan

Originally posted by hesse
Stop crying americans... You don´t seem civilised enough to carry guns...

We invented nearly everything, conquered nearly everywhere, and stomped the hell out of England with a ragtag group of patriots to start our impressive reign.

You Euros can keep your effeminate ways and we'll keep our guns.

Actually The United Kingdom invented nearly everything we rely on in modernity.
The USA has only merely adapted things.

Shootings will still happen even if you ban all guns from ownership.

There would be far, far less shootings. If guns were more expensive they'd be less prevalent and it would be harder for kids and criminals to buy them.

Anyone who wants to purchase a new gun legally after a full, complete background check, should be required to submit to a full psychiatric evaluation. A card is issued similar to a licence if the person passes the evaluation, and from then on that gun owner must submit to a re-evaluation every 2 years, or lose their right to LEGALLY own guns.

Anyone who owns guns now must also comply with the above or lose their right to LEGALLY own guns.

All costs are the responsibility of the person seeking to own guns or the gun owners. All LEGAL gun owners should be held legally responsible and liable for the security and safety of their firearms and ammunition.

Wont make a difference now, but into the future it could.

This is the proper approach to gun control.

reply to post by woodsmom


I want to apologize for responding in such an emotional manner.
This is an emotional subject, and another emotional subject of losing more freedoms is becoming interwoven quickly.
My heart truly goes out to those families, as a parent, I am sure many feel the same, I immediately get scared for my children. Nobody should have to worry about the safety of their children while they are at school.

reply to post by Alfie1


I will address your statistics with mine. There are approximately 63.1 million people in the UK. There are approx. 311, 591, 917 in the USA. So while the UK has less per capita. The US isn't as bad as you make it seem 8775 people killed out of 311million. So why are all americans unresponsible? Seems like a majority are responsible. Now find the statistic that shows how many of 8775 gun deaths were done while commiting crimes. My guess is that you will find that some of the gun deaths were done by law abiding citizens that were being threatened. And some will be by gang activity. So your stats are a little misleading. Check the nra website for stats your findings may be a little different. Thank you

reply to post by ausername


The people that want to use guns for criminal purposes will use guns for criminal purposes irrelvant of all these checks. I sincerely doubt this 20year old with autism was using the weapons legally. Same with regard to all the drug dealers. Is there much point in penalising the ordinary citizen?

We all know what's going to happen this is being setup to testify to the fact that all these dead shooters had "mental disorders". Some new mental disorder will be invented and used as the first step to not allowing the purchase of guns. I work in State/Fed facility where guns are banned and we had a specific gun threat against my boss with the individual saying he had a trunkload of guns and was coming over to kill her 3 months ago and we were locked down all day. I GUARANTEE you if I could have got my barretta out from my glove box people would have been relieved...

Originally posted by wingsfan

Originally posted by hesse
Stop crying americans... You don´t seem civilised enough to carry guns...

We invented nearly everything, conquered nearly everywhere, and stomped the hell out of England with a ragtag group of patriots to start our impressive reign.

You Euros can keep your effeminate ways and we'll keep our guns.

Your arrogant racism really does your country credit....NOT!

I apologise for not responding to any comments on this thread for quite some times now however I have been busy with other things.

I will try to respond to some of you however I first want to say this.

Upon reflection I can see how this thread would anger some in America, my reaction I know was a “knee-jerk” reaction to a really awful story that I was posted as it was still breaking.

That said I do stand by my position that grater gun control is required in America to prevent more of these mass shooting. Some will have undoubtedly have by now raised the point that rights are not subject to the laws of man as they come from our very nature. I do not recognise “the right to bear arms” as a legitimate right of man, I do however recognise the right to self-defence however I do not view the two as being one of the same.

If a burger brakes into your own and threatens your family with a gun and you have a gun in your home then I think you have the right to shoot the burglar. However I do not think that neither you nor the armed hood has the right to own a gun in the first place. I believe that Gun ownership should be prohibited in an ideal world, the burglar should not even have the opportunity to threaten you with a gun as he would be unable to own a gun.

That being said I do also recognise that we do not live in a ideal world, criminals determined enough will always find a way to get their hands on a weapon and furthermore there are so many Guns in America that it would be impossible to have everyone hand in their guns.

Therefore I am of the belief that Guns should face much tighter regulation; I do not believe it is necessary to own assault weapons, they should all be banned. Likewise I do not understand why a person needs to own multiple weapons, if it’s a hobby, then go and join a gun club, I personally find guns repulsive and cannot understand why anyone would brag about owning so many “tools” whose only purpose is to kill another living being. I also think it should be made much more difficult to own a gun in the first place, I do not think it should be legal for any citizen to carry a fire arm in public unless their job requires them to do so (such as an armed security guard while on duty). I also think that the sale of weapons to individuals under the age of 25-30 should be either be out lawed or subject to though regulation. Speaking of regulation overall I think that the entire system should be made uniform across all states, firearms should become an issue for the federal government and not for the state and it should be stricter with harsh punishments for those who flout the laws.

I hope this clarifies my views.

It is also perhaps pertinent for me to again repeat a couple of points, a comparison between knife crime and guns is unfair as is the number of deaths cause by cars. Also would people please stop insulting my national pride by calling me “English” and referring to me as a “subject”, I feel just as free as anyone else does and I am happy to be part of a society that has strict gun controls, I even signed a petition to ban hand guns after the dumblane shootings.

Originally posted by Fireman205253
reply to post by Alfie1

 

I will address your statistics with mine. There are approximately 63.1 million people in the UK. There are approx. 311, 591, 917 in the USA. So while the UK has less per capita. The US isn't as bad as you make it seem 8775 people killed out of 311million. So why are all americans unresponsible? Seems like a majority are responsible. Now find the statistic that shows how many of 8775 gun deaths were done while commiting crimes. My guess is that you will find that some of the gun deaths were done by law abiding citizens that were being threatened. And some will be by gang activity. So your stats are a little misleading. Check the nra website for stats your findings may be a little different. Thank you

Thank you for being the only one to actually address the statistics. Of course I appreciate that the US has 5 times the population of the UK so it would be appropriate to multiply the annual UK gun murders total of 58 by 5 making 290. But compared with the US figure of 8775 this is miniscule. Btw these figures are for gun murders and not all gun deaths.

I hesitate to go to the NRA for stats. Aren't they a virulent pro gun lobby ?

I don't see how it is possible to argue against the proposition that more guns = more gun murders.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


People need multiple guns, for the same reason they need multiple types of screw drivers........
Can't hunt rabbit with the gun I hunt moose with, or the gun I kill coyotes with, and vice versa. Right tool, for the right job. Not all guns are the same, same as you wouldn't use a philips screwdriver on a flathead screw. My "assault rifle" I use for coyotes, that travel in packs, and would also use for an intruder if one was ever stupid enough, with hollow points.

reply to post by Alfie1


More people, piled on top of each other in urban environments = more violence........
Way more violent crimes in cities than the country areas, and it's not only because of population, but also mentality. People in cities act way different than people in the country. Attitudes and demeanors are like night and day.

reply to post by wingsfan

We invented nearly everything, conquered nearly everywhere, and stomped the hell out of England with a ragtag group of patriots to start our impressive reign.

I think you will find that the United Kingdom of Grate Brittan and Northern Ireland (not England) actually has historically Invented quite a lot, particularly in the fields of engineering, computing and military technologies.

Historically Brittan did conquer pretty much everything our navy once ruled the sea’s, let’s not forget who it was that actually colonised America, you will might find that your ancestors are British if you where to look hard enough.

If history teaches us anything it’s that superpowers come and go, once it was the Mongolians, Romans, the French and once it was the British and now it is Americas turn to play world number one but guess what tomorrow it will probably be China and after that it could be India or perhaps us Brits will get another shot.

America is a baby in terms of its history, I do not for a moment deny that it has done some grate things for the world but at the same time it has done its fair shear of wrongs. Please don’t think that just because your state is 300 years old it means its better than ours which have a millennia of history.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


How about instead of this incredibly ignorant argument you come up with one that actually works, and you better come up with it quick because in the next ten years you are going to find yourself at the mercy of any nut with a 3d printer.

Guns aren't going anywhere.

reply to post by Alfie1


I do under stand what your are saying. I will not argue that the UK gun deaths are lower, i did the math myself and it's true. I argue the fact the people are saying, American gun owners are irresponsible. With over 311 million people and 8775 murders. I just don't see this as being true. Let me put it this way. I want to say first this is meant in no way to sound racist just proving my point. If I say a majority of murders were caused by African Americans, would we say all African Americans are irresponsible? Of course not. We can't let the actions of few affect the image of the majority. Like I said, please don't take that as me being racist, wasn't intended for that just to prove a point.

reply to post by zedVSzardoz

so what about the 2011 Norway attacks.

Just because you haven’t had over 100 killed yet doesn’t mean that it’s not going to happen.

What are you going to be saying to me the day that 5 terrorists arm themselves up and go walk into 5 schools and start a slaughter.

Then you will all be asking “how could we have let them get those guns”.

I have been really annoyed at the ignorance of some of the comments and the completely narrow-minded approach to the "criminal V law abiding" scenario.

This is about OPPORTUNITY.

If a person with crazy tendancies does not have the opportunity to steal a gun from a responsible owner then shootings like this would not be so frequent or even happen at all, although it seems a person with a legal license to own a gun doesn't necessarily mean they are responsible if they have guns that can be stolen so easily because they were not secured well enough.

Stop passing the buck to keep your guns as a false sense of security and freedom and admit that THEY are why so many of these children got so easily shot.

Guns don't kill people, people do, but some people with guns are able to kill MORE and EASIER because of their availability. Take the guns out of the loop and the opportunities decrease.

Common sense.

The U.S. will have many more of these school shootings and it has become part of your everyday society. That's the price you must pay for making it possible to all the crazies over there who have an abundance of weapons to hand.

I wonder how many of the parents of the dead want more guns in a school and how many want a total ban on guns? Shame they rarely ask the important questions isn't it and just concentrate on the fear and horror of the event?

Sad.