Why don't you believe? (@Non-Believers and Skeptics)

Originally posted by aivlas
Some of it seems to be a crutch to help people deal with the fact we are just here
Some of it is for misdirection and control
Some of it matters
Some of it is trolls

I suppose that could indicate either side of the argument however I still like it.

I don't see it as such. It's not us vs them. It's curious people vs crazy people. This is how I see it. I have had my share of what may be defined as paranormal experiences by some, such as black helicopters, ufos, alien abduction, astral projection, spirit possession and what's not but never once did I claim any of my experiences to be real in the way our OP presented about aliens.

Originally posted by Slave2Fate

Originally posted by longlostbrother


It's basically political.

People that are believers gave it stars and flags to support the underlying contention: skeptics are wrong... And smelly.

Yes, I can see that already even having only joined this forum recently. It's a typical 'us versus them' mentality when we are all actually looking for answers here. Just with differing methodologies. I have found that when there is collaboration between the two camps that the most progress is made. The progress toward understanding the UFO phenomena (both physically and psychologically) is all I'm really interested in.

Originally posted by stanislav
Not only that your previous post was fantastic but you are also a great mom. God bless you even if "he" doesn't exist LOL! I speak from personal experience. Unfortunately I am one of those victims who was able to delude himself into believing all kind of crazy stuff for over 10 years. So I know exactly what these type of people are going through because I went through similar process and it took real courage to get out of my self inflicted delusions. It's really scary. And this is why I am so glad that you are teaching your kids to be always skeptical and be rational. Always question everything because you wouldn't believe how many people are going to lie with a straight face about piratically anything, especially about things that require no proof.

Originally posted by MaMaa

Originally posted by stanislav
I think YouTube and the internet in general opened endless possibilities for people who otherwise would never get a chance to be taken seriously in real life. The fact that you can upload any video on YouTube and then claim it was an alien craft even thought it is obvious to most it is not, is a common on the internet. I would say without any hesitation that 99.9% of all videos in which they claim to be that of real ufos are either hoaxes or misidentification. I only leave 0.1% simply because there is always a chance regardless of how slim it might be.

I agree and it also gives them forum to be aghast at all the non believers who dare not believe their irrefutable proof! LOL Being a mom I find that I even have to stop my boys (I have four) when they just jump to conclusions or don't think something through. I am often heard saying "ok,wait a minute, slow down and think it through for just a minute" Always trying to teach critical thought since they don't teach it in the schools anymore. I figure if I can teach this then they won't be as likely to be one of those people who believe anything without giving it any serious thought.

It would be ignorant to be close minded and not accept that something could be true, but then again it would be even more ignorant to believe the 99.9% of the crap out there and take it as fact. That is why we have brains, to think it through.. or so I tell my kids. LOL

Sorry I'm so late to reply to this, life is busy this time of year. Still I wanted to say thank you, that was very kind of you to say.

You are MOST welcome darling!

Originally posted by Slave2Fate

Originally posted by MaMaa

Originally posted by stanislav
I think YouTube and the internet in general opened endless possibilities for people who otherwise would never get a chance to be taken seriously in real life. The fact that you can upload any video on YouTube and then claim it was an alien craft even thought it is obvious to most it is not, is a common on the internet. I would say without any hesitation that 99.9% of all videos in which they claim to be that of real ufos are either hoaxes or misidentification. I only leave 0.1% simply because there is always a chance regardless of how slim it might be.

I agree and it also gives them forum to be aghast at all the non believers who dare not believe their irrefutable proof! LOL Being a mom I find that I even have to stop my boys (I have four) when they just jump to conclusions or don't think something through. I am often heard saying "ok,wait a minute, slow down and think it through for just a minute" Always trying to teach critical thought since they don't teach it in the schools anymore. I figure if I can teach this then they won't be as likely to be one of those people who believe anything without giving it any serious thought.

It would be ignorant to be close minded and not accept that something could be true, but then again it would be even more ignorant to believe the 99.9% of the crap out there and take it as fact. That is why we have brains, to think it through.. or so I tell my kids. LOL

I have 2 kids myself and I'm always trying to impart critical thinking skills to them. It is an undeniably valuable life tool that will help them in more ways than just debating UFO's or Bigfoot in a public forum. Education is important however the application of said education with things like critical thought, comprehension and analytical processes is possibly even more so.

I couldn't agree more! It will help them through their entire lives. I am hopeful that it will give them the tools to rely upon themselves to make their lives good ones. I think far too many people lack critical thought, fall into patterns of following others and not thinking for themselves.

Originally posted by Druscilla

Originally posted by TheIceQueen
I definitely believe that there is extraterrestrial life out there. It is beyond close minded and naive for one to think that we are 'it' in a practically infinite universe that holds trillions of galaxies. In Our yet 'exploration' of the universe, we have not even gone past our own sun (in fact we are still billions of miles away from it), something that we see everyday and revolve around, our understanding of the universe and knowledge of so is so undeveloped and minuscule- it is ignorant for one to say in fact what is and what isn't, what exists and what doesn't in such a case.

It's also extremely naive and beyond gullible to fall for and believe in any of the stuff on Youtube, or coming out of the UFOlogy circus as well as putting stock in sloppy thinking that banks on fantasies about any sorts of sundry countless types of extra-terrestrial-hybrid-robot-insectoid-reptilian-anunnaki-grey-white-blue-light-being-invisible-benevolent-demon-angel-atlantean visiting, living, collaborating, and/or involved with this planet in any sort of way.

How wide-eyed mouth-breathing gawking and gushing gullible do you have to be to lose all sense of any kind of critical thought that relies on even the barest bit of corroborating verifiable evidence?

Show us one of these aliens; give us some empirical data, and I'll be happy to get in line to rub rainbow crystals all over my 15th pine scented eyeball to go wowing at the wonders of the 851st dimension while high-fiving my higher, lower, upper, sideways backwards, forwards, upside down and diagonal selves.

edit on 27-11-2012 by Druscilla because: (no reason given)

^^ lady you made my day and yes you are right, that had me in fits of laughter ^^

You know how to cheer us up you really do... ice crystals, rubbing, pine scented eyeballs
Empirical data for us and the lady allready please believers..

Originally posted by stanislav
I don't see it as such. It's not us vs them. It's curious people vs crazy people. This is how I see it. I have had my share of what may be defined as paranormal experiences by some, such as black helicopters, ufos, alien abduction, astral projection, spirit possession and what's not but never once did I claim any of my experiences to be real in the way our OP presented about aliens.

I certainly don't mean that there are benefits to be had when collaborating with mentally unstable people. I have found that there are some quite reasonably 'sane' proponents of the ETH who can examine the evidence with a critical eye and still ask the hard questions in favor of their hypothesis. Those kinds of people are the type I'm referring to.

I'll readily admit that such people are relatively rare as it seems that most of the ETH'ers simply regurgitate what they've heard/read or been lead to believe by those who have an 'agenda'. It is no coincidence that a lot of what you read on the pro-alien sites often don't give the full story. They omit anything that might shatter the illusion in most cases. That's why independent verification and research into this phenomena is so important.

I completely agree with you.

reply to post by Slave2Fate

Just looked at the recent posts on this thread, it really does look like jealousy from non believers now. No wonder extraterrestrials choose to remain hidden from some people.

I also don't believe those posters commenting so vehemently even believe their own ignorance, it looks like they are too scared to open their minds to the possibilities that they know are probably true but shatters their current belief system.

I guess some people prefer being shrouded from the truth, a sort of self denial, a denial of the truth of nature and very essence of the universe and all within.

Their loss.

reply to post by Slave2Fate


Obviously you didn't read any of my posts on Plasma Universe then. I know about plasma and I believe that there is extraterrestrial intelligent life.

Originally posted by theabsolutetruth
Just looked at the recent posts on this thread, it really does look like jealousy from non believers now. No wonder extraterrestrials choose to remain hidden from some people.

Yes, because the evidence you've presented is soo compelling...

reply to post by theabsolutetruth


I have to say in some ways I am very jealous of people who can hide away and/or downplay the real issues that need to be sorted and instead focus on certain aspects of this site

Another thing I have noticed is the seemingly bass ackward method of research that a lot of ETH proponents use. They have their conclusion (alien visitation) all laid out before the research even begins. That's not how it works when trying to examine an unknown. The conclusion comes last, after all of the evidence has been gathered. All of the evidence, not just what you want to hear. You can't omit anything that might go against your preferred hypothesis otherwise you have just thrown objectivity out the window and left any scientific credibility in the dust. The method of investigation and research you use is actually more important than the conclusion you come up with.

reply to post by longlostbrother


I didn't write on this thread for the purpose of providing evidence.

Also if you read the thread title it isn't about believers giving proof, it is about things preventing some people from admitting possibilities.

A load of believers giving evidence would be thread derailing.

If you want to look for evidence then you should try other threads or research.

Originally posted by aivlas
reply to post by theabsolutetruth

 

I have to say in some ways I am very jealous of people who can hide away and/or downplay the real issues that need to be sorted and instead focus on certain aspects of this site

Presumably you are accusing me of this, which is basically a preposterous accusation.

Would you elaborate on that which you think is so important that you think another ATS member should be spending time on instead of this thread?

Perhaps you could take your own advice if you think posting here as some sort of avoidance of important things.

Oh wait...perhaps it was just another senseless attack.

Lets see, Et who is way over our heads, has the remote on time, processes everyone on earth over and over, giving missing time (on the dvd player, they have the remote and can push pause, forward and backwards at will), can interfere with all devices, along with our paramilitary that have even been rumored to kill, when the topic of ufology is above top secret, why would anyone presume that anyone would ever have proof, even though some have some amounts of it, such as the implants removed, the dna on the hairs found, and other things. Also family regressions and studies. You'd have to be extremely closed minded and anti social, ignoring the testimony of countless people, to think there is no evidence.

However, back on the evidence. Those who are more credentialed and have higher security clearance than most of the presidents of the US, don't have proof either, just their word.

reply to post by theabsolutetruth


Just responding to

Just looked at the recent posts on this thread, it really does look like jealousy from non believers now. No wonder extraterrestrials choose to remain hidden from some people.

It was not aimed at anyone in particular, more a broad brush. It's not like I can't think things are a waste of time if I want to, luckily that is still my choice.

Originally posted by theabsolutetruth
reply to post by Slave2Fate

 

Obviously you didn't read any of my posts on Plasma Universe then. I know about plasma and I believe that there is extraterrestrial intelligent life.

Well, could you be helpful and point me to it at least? As I stated earlier, I'm fairly new to this site and am still getting to know my way around as well as any specific member contributions such as yourself.

Furthermore I am not talking about the plasma clouds present all across the universe. I'm talking specifically about self generating spontaneous manifestations of dusty plasmas inside our own atmosphere. If you know about those and simply dismiss their relevance out of hand then what criteria are you using to do so? Do you not agree that atmospheric plasmas can (and have been in the case of Hessdalen lights) be mistaken for UFO's?

Originally posted by theabsolutetruth


Also if you read the thread title it isn't about believers giving proof, it is about things preventing some people from admitting possibilities.

Im calling out all the Non-believers and skeptics personally; to understand why they do not believe in Extraterrestrial and other unknown phenomena.

Again, where does the OP "call out" the skeptics for not being open to the POSSIBILITIES?

The OP was very specific - it's a believe or explain why not scenario. Most people in this thread are clearly open to POSSIBILITIES, regardless of their personal beliefs. This is just another thinly-veiled evil skeptic thread... just what this forum needs.

Originally posted by Unity_99
Lets see, Et who is way over our heads, has the remote on time, processes everyone on earth over and over, giving missing time (on the dvd player, they have the remote and can push pause, forward and backwards at will), can interfere with all devices, along with our paramilitary that have even been rumored to kill, when the topic of ufology is above top secret, why would anyone presume that anyone would ever have proof, even though some have some amounts of it, such as the implants removed, the dna on the hairs found, and other things. Also family regressions and studies. You'd have to be extremely closed minded and anti social, ignoring the testimony of countless people, to think there is no evidence.

However, back on the evidence. Those who are more credentialed and have higher security clearance than most of the presidents of the US, don't have proof either, just their word.

Are you referring to the 'implants' found by the podiatrist (foot doctor) Dr. Leir? What could his medical training in podiatry possibly give him to say that anything he removed from patients was of alien origin?

Furthermore testimonies are avenues for investigation. They can point to where investigation should be done. They are not evidence of anything in and of themselves.