Eyewitness: 4 Man Team Behind Sikh Temple Shooting

reply to post by ProjectJimmy


Nice to have a journalist on board here on ATS. Look forward to reading more of your posts. Its a rare that we see post from someone actually doing leg work to get the story, that is real journalism and something this site desperately needs. I, as well as 90% of the posters here solely rely on second hand information from the internet. I envy you.

reply to post by tide88


Haha, thank you my good man, I do love my job! I went to university in Milwaukee actually, which is why I got sent back here for this story, at previously mentioned Marquette. They are still the kind of place that emphasizes leg work, good questions and going to get the story instead of just reading press releases. I'll give the credit to my professors and teachers there, many of them are old hats at the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel or retired reporters and editors from other organizations.

As for being on here, well I tend to get into a bit of trouble for not assuming everything is a conspiracy, it's rather comical sometimes. I am from a very old aristocratic family in England that has been active in politics for some time, Seeing what I have growing up as well as my family and such, I find a lot of the "us versus a mysterious them in the elite" that is on here to be quite rubbish. The biggest advice I try to give on here generally comes to the theme that we are all human, and even our so-called elite overlords don't always know what they are doing nor do they have some nefarious evil plan to dominate the world. They are more interested in making lots of money and really that's about it. It's not something they are always that good at either, which I find funny.

It is exactly that perception though, that I am seeing with this story though, people are jumping to the conclusion that it is some plot by shadowy characters to bring about the end of freedom in the United States. They seem to want some evil empire to fight from their computer desks. This sadly, I believe, leaves many of them blind to the real evils in this world, which we have seen far too much of lately.

reply to post by Asktheanimals


And if you had read some of my posts after I replied to you, you would see that I have stated that getting all eyewitness testimonies are a good thing, and that it helps gather evidence.

As I have said before, my problem is with the people on here that automatically scream conspiracy/coverup/black op, before even waiting to see what evidence presents itself. And unfortunately there seem to be more and more of these people joining every day.

And as I have said before, I prefer to get as much information as I can before making a decision on what I think may have happened. And even then, once I have made a decision, it doesn't mean it is set in stone, and that's the end of the story, because new evidence may be presented that changes my ideas on what happened.

I just hope I never end up in front of a jury that has some of the people from here on said jury, because I will be on Death Row before a case is even presented in Court!!!!

I would think that eyewitness reports of multiple shooters would be newsworthy.
Perhaps the media is getting it's talking points from elsewhere (not "free and independent")?

Originally posted by CosmicCitizen
I would think that eyewitness reports of multiple shooters would be newsworthy.
Perhaps the media is getting it's talking points from elsewhere (not "free and independent")?

edit on 6-8-2012 by CosmicCitizen because: (no reason given)

In general eyewitness accounts are only used in news reporting when a story is breaking, because they are notoriously unreliable. People in a panic cannot be counted upon to provide objective accounts nor should they be. Through my interviews I have found that many of the eyewitness accounts of multiple shooters (usually 2 instead of the guy saying 4) were due to the fact that the shooter was highly mobile in the attack. He started inside and then moved outside, this lead to some confusion initially.

Further, it appears that people inside the building reported multiple shooters when the police arrived and exchanged gunfire with the alleged shooter. It is also possible that the account of 4 shooters in a tactical team were actually an early report of one of the SWAT teams arriving. The Milwaukee Police Department SWAT team wears outfits such as those which were described by the alleged witness, and conducted operations at the site. Even more confusing was the presence of multiple SWAT units at the scene which wear different uniforms. MPD wears dark blue with black, while the Milwaukee Sheriff's Department wears brown or blue with both having some green elements. The FBI agents which were on site were wearing Federal Blue departmental shirts with jeans, and large lettering so they would have been easily recognizable.

Many of the eyewitnesses and secondary witnesses reported a very chaotic scene, which is highly disorienting to most individuals. Shock, panic and other highly stressed states are common in people going through traumatic situations. As such, their reports are not given the same level of credibility in journalism as those of trained professionals who have had years of experience in such events.

reply to post by DarknStormy

I would rather be asleep than bank my hopes on a stupid theory which most likely means nothing except too the inventor of it..

I hope nothing, just trying to get to the bottom of it like everybody else.
I'm sure the confirmed fact that the one shooter that they are focusing on was a former member of a military psy-ops unit means nothing too.

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist

Number 7 is a great number.... Its my number and it represents a lot of good things out there according to Astrology & Numerology!!

Absolutely! But that doesn't mean it can't be perverted to serve negative intent. Symbols and numbers are neutral, it depends on what your intent is with them.

Interesting ...anyone see a connection between this new information or incident as a whole and the previous "rumored" Obama to fake assassination attempt involving white supremacists ?!?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I don't see why a lot are automatically dismissing the 4 man team accounts simply because of the number of fatalities. A team doesn't mean all 4 went in guns blazing. One could be a lookout, one could be for crowd control, etc. Not saying there were definitely 4 involved, just confused at the logic on dismissing this. We don't know if he/they went in for mass casualties or specific targets.

It's easy for witnesses to get details wrong, especially when panicked. However, I'd expect it would be more likely that 4 people could get mistaken for 6, or 10 or even 15 people. But it's less likely that 1 person would get mistaken for 4 people. Once you add more than one person to the mix it's easy to get mistakes, but I think it's harder to mistake multiple suspects from just one single suspect. I will admit though that as mentioned previously, the fact that some people could later confuse law enforcement as suspects is also possible.

I'm not sure what to believe, but the only thing that concerns me is when eyewitness testimony that contradicts the official story gets brushed aside. Is there first hand eyewitness accounts that adamantly assert a multiple man team of suspects? I'm just getting up to speed on this incident so I haven't seen all the videos yet.

reply to post by IamMe14

Is there first hand eyewitness accounts that adamantly assert a multiple man team of suspects?

yes, there is as well as the radio communications indicating one dead suspect and another holding hostages ... that's at least 2 confirmed in my book.

so this has probably (highly likely) been said somewhere here already but these mass shootings are just in too perfect a time frame for Obama wanting to sign the u.n gun ban.

I figured its going something like this:
Obama wants to sign the U.N gun ban for the u.s into law, which would ban all civilians from owning any type of small arms weapon. Yet, knows that many people around the country wouldn't get behind it. (this is the problem)

Out of no where, a very close grouping of mass public shootings happens across the country, First one in a colorado theater. The next in Wisconsin and at nearly the same time you have the mosque shooting in new york. Not to mention the 'foiled' mass shooting in maryland I believe it was where a large cache of weaponry was found in the alleged attempted shooters apartment (I recall from the picture 3-4 pistols, 3 assault rifles in various calibers, 2 hunting rifles and one smg) (solution).

Because of a string of covertly self-inflicted national tragedies you will see the government office [white house] (not really) start up the mainstream media machine to highly publicize this very odd cluster of mass shootings which, between msm and local media reports and actual eyewitness testimony and other ignored crime scene evidence dont even add up, and thus, repeat what has happened since 9/11. Use fear to influence the people into giving up the very last 'right' penned into the u.s constitution that has so far safe guarded all the other rights penned into the constitution. (cause)

Im sure if what I've written here comes to fruition or that over time the events followed are similar, then the end of the democratic united states isn't too far off..after the general populace has been disarmed (as per plan according to Janet Napoletano) the newly forming fascist government will sweep through herding the sheeple (more like brain dead cows with how far obesity has grown) into the last housing they'll ever see..

im sure what i've said here isn't original in the long shot but I finally had that glimpse of events that are a short walk down the road while watching the abc report on the sikh temple shooting..

Originally posted by Komodo
or .. how about this..

1 is the shooter and the other 3 are lookouts to ensure no one escapes or and everyone stay's down.. and ditch the lone gunman for the fall

edit on 6-8-2012 by Komodo because: (no reason given)

I don't see this if they were all from a supremacist group. Having gone that far, why would they not 'assist' their guy instead of setting him up for the fall?

Of course if the other three were govt agents, then it would make more sense, imho.

I also expect more of the same kind of thing before the election. Plus they need to reinforce the need for the upcoming laws. Nasty business.

Originally posted by darklord

Originally posted by Sablicious
If it were a "co-ordinated" quartet, they would have killed more than jut half a dozen +1. They were in a temple--they were sitting ducks. Even a blind man firing randomly could have killed a handful under such circumstances.

Common sense: avail it.

Common sense would have us believe that the representatives WE chose to lead us i.e. the government, would NOT lie to it's people, and only has our best interests at heart.

Common sense would do no such thing. Hence why common sense ain't so common.

reply to post by Vitruvian


I don't understand why conservatives and Libertarians are being blamed. The guy was a self-professed Nazi .. or, in other words... a Socialist?

But I'd assume if a team of 4 men fired on a congregation more than 6 people would have been shot?

reply to post by Vitruvian


I have not heard much on him having an accomplish...

...considering a lot of people were wearing outfits, that seems like something that could easily be confused.

Originally posted by hakalugie4u
thats just the dubest thiong ive herd as there was only 7 seven shot come on if there were more shooters there would be more dead wake up ppl

Seven shots? Where did you get your news?

A single police officer was shot 9 TIMES! Still more evidence of a conspiracy, IMO.

If the perpetrators planned to convince us that this was carried out by a single person, then no, there would not be more dead. Maybe the proof is the fact that you bought it.

reply to post by ProjectJimmy


I would like to see, somewhere in the mainstream media, an interview, or at very least more information about Arm Kaleka and his background. He gave information on CNN, in a clear, coherent manner. Considering the described "chaos" his clear recall/description of his communication with his mother during the shooting is chilling, but has gone ignored since the CNN clip.

Direct relevance to the shooting... he was talking to his mother DURING the incident and would be able to provide more detail. He doesn't deserve to be shut out like this, but apparently this crosses some journalistic code of ethics to talk with him?

The presented facts of the case aren't going to change unless an avenue such as this can be pursued quickly before the next shooting draws our attention away again.

reply to post by ofhumandescent


Another likelihood is that carriers of wrongthought will be offed during the staged shootings. Never let a crisis go to waste. Just my instinct. They can and do read minds. If there are military members shot, at these shootings, who were known in small circles to have had patriotic feelings for Liberty, not blind obedience to corporate warlords, then the news will travel fast among the ranks. That the tech exists is beyond question of a doubt. It does.

of course it's just a coincidence that Arm Kaleka’s father just happened to be in temple at the time and its even more of a coincidence that he was shot and killed. A warning for all involved in the SIRIUS project that the government does not want it released.

reply to post by Vitruvian


This is crap!

You'd think that a temple that had been the target of multiple 'hate attacks" since 9-11 would have installed cameras...which would be able to show just how many shooters were involved.

But no, the agenda of gun control...the agenda of the Associated Press is really what's going on here.