Mass shooting in Aurora, CO (At Batman Film Premiere)

reply to post by IamMe14

If that's true I don't know. I don't have a timeline to refer to, but I still think it explains not hanging out there all night.
Perimeters can be set up fairly fast. Dispatchers know exactly where each cop car is at all times. So roadblocks can be set up when needed in emergency situations. The cop shop was right next door to the theatre as far as I know. They had extra officers on that night because of something that was going on anyways. Forgot what that was but watch the video link I posted.
They're cops and catching the villain takes priority before he hurts others or gets away. While at the same time other cops were shuttling victims to area hospitals

Don't get me wrong, I see the descrepencies. As I said earlier it might be because they withhold or retract certain Information to build a solid case against him

reply to post by samcrow


Useful insight. I took an abrupt downturn in my studies too, but it was when I was 16 and discovering boobs and beer. From what it sounds like, he really wanted into that program and internship, probably had to push himself to get there. Then he gets there and instantly becomes an "undistinguished" spaz? I don't think a neuroscience internship is going to have a lot of beer and boobs distractions. So what the hell happened there? The work of both his mentor and the professor might hold clues.

Originally posted by bluemirage5
reply to post by heycitizen

 

Quite right. I had 3 kids all under the age of 5. Gosh, with my first two I was dead in the water come 10pm or earlier. Did this mother put coffee in her kid's milk?

I don't often go to the movies anymore but when I do I ALWAYS fall asleep half way through. God forbid if anything happened in our local theatre I'd sleep all the way through and would'nt hear any guns.

Coffee in the kids milk? Some mothers put alcohol to knock them out so they would sleep.

Some people can stay awake all night. I can miss sleeping for days, but quite right a mother with a baby is always sleep deprived. She may have family help other times and not really drained. I never had help. I just never asked, but that's me.

@Violet (sorry iPhone is acting up and i can't directy reply)


I heard the 23 min police scanner audio in detail. Just after 3 min into the audio they discuss having the suspect behind the theater and that he says he's alone and no others are involved. However, he also mentions that witnesses are giving information that contradicts this.

The officers are getting frustrated that they can't get into theater 9, they're yelling for gas masks which appear to not come quickly. They're also overwhelmed with the number of injured people out front. You can tell that even with all the preparation in the world it was still really difficult for them to deal with. As I mentioned they started taking people to hospitals in patrol cars.

With everything that was going on and having a suspect in custody almost immediately, setting up the perimeter was not what they dealt with first. It wad approx 10 min in that I first heard mention of this.

Originally posted by pasiphae
i'm not understanding the vicodin dosage. it comes in 500mg tabs. a regular strength tablet is 5/500. then there is vicodin hp which is 10/660. you're not to exceed 4000mg of acetaminophen in a day (the acetaminophen content is the second number). vicodin is a combination of acetaminophen and hydrocodone.

so i'm not understanding where this 100mg dosage came from. it doesn't make sense. i don't think it even comes in 100mg tablets.

Are they over the counter doses? Do they not give higher amounts of Hydrocodone on prescription and also prescribe it without the added paracetamol in the US?

I don't think we have Vicodin in the UK, we have Dihydrocodeine and Codeine (that i'm aware of) and is usually given in 15/500 or 30/500 doses (that i'm aware of), prescription only because it is classed as a narcotic and a controlled substance. Although i think you can get lower doses of Codeine/Paracetamol over the counter.
You can also get hold of it on prescription in the UK without the added Paracetamol/Acetaminophen.

Originally posted by bluemirage5
reply to post by happyhomemaker29

 

I asked earlier, I think on another thread, I want the POLICE mug shot, not one taken of Holmes in prison afew days later. I'm looking for what state he was in when he arrived at the Police Station.

Why won't they release it?

That I can't answer. Who knows. Maybe he was in such a state they couldn't get one, I honestly don't know.

reply to post by IamMe14


Looks like they are actually referring to the car "with the bomb unit" and not "with a body in it". Later there is mention of a possible "secondary device" when they are try to get the emergency vehicles cleared out.

You know what I don't understand? Two things.

(1) Everyone looks relatively clean.
Of all the people you see in that SINGLE cellphone video from the night of the shooting, and the various photos from the news media of people just standing around...no one seems to be dirtied by all the people that were getting wounded around them (ie. blood splatters, flesh, etc.) gross I know but bear with me. witnesses spoke of heads being "blown off" and body parts being severed... the floor must have been COVERED... yet the people aren't..
Now I realize we're talking about Theater 9 and 8.... but according to the cell video, there were people who were shot still on the scene. So half the crowd, one might assume, is from Theatre 9 where all the shooting was going on.
Yet I'm not seeing blood splatters or anything. Except on that one guy that was being helped by the officer. (A side note about that cell video, also notice when the guy in the bloody black and white striped shirt walks past the guy with his arms crossed. He doesn't seem fazed. He doesn't move out his way or look at him really. Like this is all... staged. And a lot of people are standing so close to the front doors---all glass. If I knew someone had weapons shooting up a theatre, I would NOT just be standing casually right by the entrance... but then I did see the pictures were the yellow police tape seemed to enclose everyone pretty close tot he front of the theatre. Wouldn't they want to maybe back all those people up? Maybe a littler further into the parking lot? Or is this for lighting? -ahem- potential photo ops, because they do talk over the scanner about where the media can take pictures!! smh)

(2) Theatre-goers seem unaffected by the OC.
For people who were in an inclosed room with two gas canisters, they seem alright. Not coughing and wheezing. Not teary eyed or red eyed.
Q1: How long do the effects of OC last on a human being, in a closed room (not outdoors, no ventilation)?
Q2: Exactly when was this cellphone footage captured? I actually read somewhere (maybe here) that it was still while there was shooting going on? Which I don't think is possible because one of the witnesses said the shooting seemed to last forever (I bet it did!) but in fact probably only last a few short minutes.

Originally posted by IamMe14
I'm still stuck on this magic gas mask that was on the shooter's face at the time of arrest AND on the ground 150 feet away from his car hours after his arrest. I've gone through every possible scenario to explain this and I can only come up with one answer - there was an accomplice who was also in a gas mask and ditched it near theater 8.

I then have tried to figure out why the accomplice would toss it there but at this point i'm just speculating and there are way too many possible answers to that.

Surely another explanation is that the cops removed it after cuffing him, they would probably want to see his face to know what kind of person they were dealing with.

Originally posted by heycitizen
reply to post by IamMe14

 

Looks like they are actually referring to the car "with the bomb unit" and not "with a body in it". Later there is mention of a possible "secondary device" when they are try to get the emergency vehicles cleared out.

Thanks for clarifying, I completely heard "body" when I heard it. If I get some time tonight I'm going to write out a timeline of all the pertinent things stated in the police scanner audio.

Originally posted by DrHammondStoat

Originally posted by IamMe14
I'm still stuck on this magic gas mask that was on the shooter's face at the time of arrest AND on the ground 150 feet away from his car hours after his arrest. I've gone through every possible scenario to explain this and I can only come up with one answer - there was an accomplice who was also in a gas mask and ditched it near theater 8.

I then have tried to figure out why the accomplice would toss it there but at this point i'm just speculating and there are way too many possible answers to that.

Surely another explanation is that the cops removed it after cuffing him, they would probably want to see his face to know what kind of person they were dealing with.

They remove it and drop it 150+ feet away and then mark it as evidence as if it were found laying there? Sorry but that makes absolutely no sense, that's not at all a possibility. Look at the images of the scene again, you'll see just how far the car is from the gas mask. Keep in mind he was found in/at his car, therefore removal of his mask would have been done there... Not all the way over by theater 8, past theater 8 in fact.

Originally posted by pasiphae
so this article starts to unravel what he was like. he wasn't such a great student. he was very defiant.

www.csmonitor.com...

no one has answered my other question about the vicodin dosage. 100mg doesn't make sense. i think the reports are wrong.

also, the "gas canisters"...... we don't know what was in them. they may just have been harmless smoke bombs set off merely for distraction.

I know when I left the hospital from my surgery I was prescribed 5/500 meaning 5 mg vicodin, 500 mg tylenol.

Here are the typical dosings for vicodin.

Vicodin

Tablets of various dosages
Vicodin: 500mg acetaminophen/5mg hydrocodone
Vicodin ES: 750mg acetaminophen/7.5mg hydrocodone
Vicodin HP: 10mg hydrocodone/660mg acetaminophen

Dosages vary depending on the combination and the amount of hydrocodone and acetaminophen in each tablet. Typical dosing for Vicodin 5/500 is 1 to 2 tablets every 6 hours as needed.

Caution should be used when taking MAO inhibitors or trycyclic antidepressants

Hope this helps. This was what I could find on it, and what I'm taking as of this moment.

Give so little info coming from the officials, I wonder why we would have this info on his using Vicodin.

To make people think crazy drug addict shooting people...guns and drugs...

Originally posted by heycitizen
reply to post by samcrow

 

Useful insight. I took an abrupt downturn in my studies too, but it was when I was 16 and discovering boobs and beer. From what it sounds like, he really wanted into that program and internship, probably had to push himself to get there. Then he gets there and instantly becomes an "undistinguished" spaz? I don't think a neuroscience internship is going to have a lot of beer and boobs distractions. So what the hell happened there? The work of both his mentor and the professor might hold clues.

This is different from the changes a teenager undergoes. In this case, remember he was a top student, and he enters this PhD program where he'll find there are lots of other "top students" from around the nation and even the world. Suddenly, he's not so special anymore. He's no longer the top student. There are smarter people than him. For the first time in his life, he meets really smart guys, who outshine him in many ways. A typical response to this is for the student to shift gears, and find other interests where he can be special again. So, attention shifts away from his school work, maybe to other things like OWS or online chat rooms, or video games at the local pub, girls, or something. If he fails at all these other things in getting back that attention to himself of being special, then he'll conjure up some fantasy world where he's once again the star of the show.

Its good to fail as a teenager, a couple of times, because then one learns to cope early with adjustments to one's status in society. But, when someone has been very successful for most of their early years, and a failure hits later in life, it's just harder to cope, harder to adjust to the new reality, that everyone you meet is not "beneath" you in some way.

All these people he shot were lesser than him, in his mind, that's why he shot them. It was a way to re-establish his superiority. After all, a world in which there are people better than him couldn't exist, and if it seemed to exist, all must be illusion, and therefore it's ok to shoot at the moving bodies, that aren't really real anyway.

I'm lost on the Vicodin angle. I've been following this thread intermittenly, but I've missed something.

Who says he was using Vicodin, and what does it have to do with the shooting?

I can see how it might account for his behavior at the arraignment, but it is completely irrelevant for the 4 months of planning, booby-trapping, and carrying out of the shooting. Vicodin might make you crash your car, lose your keys, drown, even overdose and not wakeup, but it doesn't make you psychotic for 4 straight months.

What did I miss?

reply to post by 08051962


I've been scratching my head about the gas exposure the whole time. At minimum, you'd need to disrobe, throw away your clothes, and take one serious shower. But not one person did, not even the people with infants.

Then you have the eye witness videos. Half of them are very clearly fake, and contain weird repetitions of details like "one person". I think in one of the many Chris Ramos videos he actually says "I swear, there was just one guy". Like um, ok buddy, you're not on trial, no need to swear. Then he looks straight into the camera and gives a public service announcement.

Almost every interview video mentions tear gas, choking, etc. Yet nobody is being treated and they are all walking around in gassed up clothes? The Legarrato girl with the newborn is claiming to have shrapnel IN HER LEG during the interview, yet instead of going home, to a hospital, or to bed, she's doing tv. I don't care how much of an attention whore you are, if you have a soul, you go somewhere quiet and safe and take care of your baby. Hell, you don't even take your baby to a midnight action movie.

Stinks to high hell.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
I'm lost on the Vicodin angle. I've been following this thread intermittenly, but I've missed something.

Who says he was using Vicodin, and what does it have to do with the shooting?

I can see how it might account for his behavior at the arraignment, but it is completely irrelevant for the 4 months of planning, booby-trapping, and carrying out of the shooting. Vicodin might make you crash your car, lose your keys, drown, even overdose and not wakeup, but it doesn't make you psychotic for 4 straight months.

What did I miss?

Allegedly he stated when he was arrested, that he had taken 100mg of Vicodin.

Not sure how true it is.

Also if it is true and he has been taking it for a long time, he would be tolerant to all the effects you just stated.
When you start becoming tolerant and dependent, you need larger and larger doses.

Originally posted by heycitizen
reply to post by IamMe14

 

I haven't listened to the whole thing yet. What do you think of the description of the person with the backpack?

It's possible the person with the backpack was someone in the theater. When the shooting started, they managed to get out unharmed and chucked tail and ran like the devil was behind him. I know I would. I wouldn't think twice. My only thought would be put as much distance between me and the shooter as possible. Could be some teen that went to see the movie that night. Hopefully we'll find out one way or another.

reply to post by NAMTERCES


I get all that, but no one has ever said that he was a bad student, just that he was a bad intern, at Salk specifically.

All anyone knows is that he abruptly "quit the program" at Denver. There is no mention of his grades or performance there. His records there are sealed.

I have a question for those who have said in various posts that this or that "looked staged".

What does that even mean?

I mean, what are the qualifiers for something "looking staged"?
Is it just that it doesn't match the image in your mind?
How is everybody supposed to look in a situation like that?
Were I to, say, pick up a brick and chunk it at someone, would that appear staged because the brick was just too convenient?

Not to be a douche or anything. I'm just trying to understand.