Time to take the gun from the American public!

To the OP:

I can see we differ in opinion on this subject. If you feel you don't need guns in your home to protect you and your loved ones, fine. That's your choice and you are free to do what you wish. But don't go around trying to tell other free Americans how they should go about defending themselves and their loved ones. That is our choice and our freedom.

Wow, tough room...

Hammers, we should ban hammers also. No one really has a need for those big ole honk'n hammers except professional carpenters. Only good for killing parents...

Link

reply to post by silverbullett

If you feel you don't need guns in your home to protect you and your loved ones, fine. That's your choice and you are free to do what you wish.

Yes, and his neighbor should put up a big sign to divert any potential criminals to the easier target of the neighbor with no guns on the house.

A public service!

Originally posted by StayAlert1
Well as stated above, Auto wrecks killed more people last month than guns. So what you want to take away cars too yes. Lets not be selective if we are going to prevent death. Start with the real killers. Like abortions. You care about a guy who got shot but have no stand for the unborn?. The list goes on. Heck a ball point pen is a weapon.

Yawn, seems like a trole post to get the pro gun lobby in here riled up. on a fresh list.
OP where did you say your from?

People need to stop aging as well!!! This is having a monstrous effect on our economy! Stay young people!

Originally posted by kawika
reply to post by silverbullett

 

If you feel you don't need guns in your home to protect you and your loved ones, fine. That's your choice and you are free to do what you wish.

Yes, and his neighbor should put up a big sign to divert any potential criminals to the easier target of the neighbor with no guns on the house.

A public service!

edit on 4-4-2012 by kawika because: add quote

There is a pic somewhere on the inet of this. Anyone got it by chance?

Originally posted by lacrimaererum
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

 

why now?

we are supposed be becoming more educated, more aware, more enlightened, more understanding, more compassionate, more intelligent, better people?

there is no future for a society where a person carries a weapon in his pocket that can end the life of another human (quite often a child or a relative) in the blink of an eye.

How about one that can be driven into a crowd of people? Yes, I'm talking about a car.....far deadlier than a gun.

reply to post by sting130u


Oh, yes quite right...

Here it is

if you dont like american law....leave! If you dont live here, then STFU

This one?



Damn, beat me to it!!!

Originally posted by lacrimaererum
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

 

why now?

we are supposed be becoming more educated, more aware, more enlightened, more understanding, more compassionate, more intelligent, better people?

there is no future for a society where a person carries a weapon in his pocket that can end the life of another human (quite often a child or a relative) in the blink of an eye.

Then I guess they better get rid of baseball bats, butter knives, forks, grapefruit spoons, lacrosse bats, rocks, branches, electricity, cars, planes, etc. and let's not forget hands. Or maybe you think everyone should be lobotomized since it does start in the brain?

If you are prepared to eat the sh*t from you're government and say um um good, you deserve what you get. I CC'd for 4 years overseas and never shot anyone in anger or stupidity, but I'll tell ya, my job saved a lot of people from murder by limpit mine or other home-made IED, guns in the hands of criminals and terrorists, necklacing (tire and gasoline), etc. Yeah, you go with that idea... pffft.

When everyone carries guns, everyone is polite. Because there is always somebody faster, smarter, has a bigger gun or better aim or with more friends to back them up, so people tend to play nicely.

Cheers - Dave

reply to post by bobs_uruncle


Don't forget to ban all catfish.

I could beat a child to death with a 25 pounder.

This is a hot topic in the media to serve an agenda. Yeah, puts the gun use option ONLY in the hands of the criminals. That's just what we need more of. /sarcasm

Well, really? OP's opinion of banning, might as well outright go and announce we're going to be part of what we broke away from on Independence Day.
The Second Amendment defines us as a nation.

Originally posted by JonoEnglish
If all of you pro gun Americans grew up in the UK, most of you will probably be of the same opinion as most Brits regarding armed civilians and vice the versa for us.

It's what you're brought up with.

Oh enough of your crap already. You (UK) lost your ability to own a gun because of FEAR! In the early 20th century your ruling elite were afraid of communist revolt, and socialists wanted to disarm the people. After Churchill, you rolled, believed the government fear mongering about crime, and allowed your rights to be systematically eroded over time... which continues to this day. This is why we have a Bill Of Rights, a Constitution, a passion for liberty and freedom, and a desire to protect them all... THAT is how we were brought up... well most of us at least. You acquiesced, not of some morally superior tenet, but of fear.

we are supposed be becoming more educated, more aware, more enlightened, more understanding, more compassionate, more intelligent, better people?

According to whom??

Last time I checked we've invented neutron and hydrogen bombs in the last 70 years. In case you're confused that's not progress.



Dear GOD!!! We need to also ban Physics!!!

Simple fact, things like Nazi Germany could never fly in the USA.. Europe? I'm not so sure of.

reply to post by lacrimaererum


We AMERICANS like our Guns and you can try to take them, however Best Of Luck to ya!

This is just more mind control from the Obama admin so he can make more gun laws. His buddy Soros has already bought one gun company just to close them down. Problem is Georgy, we already have enough to send you and the rest of the Nazi carpet baggers out of our dear country. Even if you bring Russia and China in to do the job for ya. They will die on the beaches of America or get slaughtered in our Cities.

We are waiting!

Originally posted by libertytoall
Simple fact, things like Nazi Germany could never fly in the USA.. Europe? I'm not so sure of.

Germany is in Europe. It's a fact, Google it.

If you are a warrior who is legally authorized to carry a weapon and you step outside without that weapon, then you become a sheep, pretending that the bad man will not come today. No one can be “on” 24/7 for a lifetime. Everyone needs down time. But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to yourself... “Baa.”

Lt. Col. Grossman on Sheep, Wolves and Sheepdogs

"One Vietnam veteran, an old retired colonel, once said this to me: 'Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive creatures who can only hurt one another by accident...Then there are the wolves,' the old war veteran said, 'and the wolves feed on the sheep without mercy.' Do you believe there are wolves out there who will feed on the flock without mercy? You better believe it. There are evil men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. The moment you forget that or pretend it is not so, you become a sheep. There is no safety in denial...Then there are sheepdogs,' he went on, 'and I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf.'

...If you have no capacity for violence then you are a healthy productive citizen: a sheep. If you have a capacity for violence and no empathy for your fellow citizens, then you have defined an aggressive sociopath--a wolf. But what if you have a capacity for violence, and a deep love for your fellow citizens? Then you are a sheepdog, a warrior, someone who is walking the hero's path. Someone who can walk into the heart of darkness, into the universal human phobia, and walk out unscathed...

Let me expand on this old soldier's excellent model of the sheep, wolves, and sheepdogs. We know that the sheep live in denial; that is what makes them sheep. They do not want to believe that there is evil in the world. They can accept the fact that fires can happen, which is why they want fire extinguishers, fire sprinklers, fire alarms and fire exits throughout their kids' schools. But many of them are outraged at the idea of putting an armed police officer in their kid's school. Our children are dozens of times more likely to be killed, and thousands of times more likely to be seriously injured, by school violence than by school fires, but the sheep's only response to the possibility of violence is denial. The idea of someone coming to kill or harm their children is just too hard, so they choose the path of denial.

The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the wolf. He has fangs and the capacity for violence. The difference, though, is that the sheepdog must not, cannot and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheepdog that intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished and removed. The world cannot work any other way, at least not in a representative democracy or a republic such as ours.

Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn't tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, "Baa." Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog...

Understand that there is nothing morally superior about being a sheepdog; it is just what you choose to be. Also understand that a sheepdog is a funny critter: He is always sniffing around out on the perimeter, checking the breeze, barking at things that go bump in the night, and yearning for a righteous battle. That is, the young sheepdogs yearn for a righteous battle. The old sheepdogs are a little older and wiser, but they move to the sound of the guns when needed right along with the young ones.

Here is how the sheep and the sheepdog think differently. The sheep pretend the wolf will never come, but the sheepdog lives for that day. After the attacks on September 11, 2001, most of the sheep, that is, most citizens in America said, 'Thank God I wasn't on one of those planes.' The sheepdogs, the warriors, said, 'Dear God, I wish I could have been on one of those planes. Maybe I could have made a difference.' When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.

While there is nothing morally superior about the sheepdog, the warrior, he does have one real advantage -- only one. He is able to survive and thrive in an environment that destroys 98 percent of the population."


Lt. Col. David Grossman from The Bulletproof Mind

reply to post by Atzil321


You make a good point but, you forgot to factor in the fact of number of gun crimes stopped because of the victims being armed. Also does that number factor in accidents.

Not being an American, I only offer the floowing 'opinions' based on my personal observations of the US,on my many visits,numerous work-trips to all parts of your often beautiful country and on my own considerable reading and research through the experienced eye of longtime broadcast journalist and of a well-traveled, born and bred Kiwi.

Far be it for me to 'preach' to any American about the merits or otherwise of their constitutional right to bare arms as they see fit, within the confines of the law (though why they so vehemently and vocally protect this particular constitutional right over any other is beyond me, yet they've been so deafeningly silent, apathetic even to the overt, brazen removal of nearly every other personal right, liberty and freedom this revered and hallowed document provided them as a people. It's just beyond me)... so preach I wont. But... I do have some comparisons, analogies and some subsequent questions that I'd be very interested to get their perspective and view point on.

We don't have any gun laws in NZ that come even remotely close to that of the USA's; in fact our police officers do not even carry sidearms on their person in the normal course of their day,but are carried in the trunks of the patrol cars, ready for use if individual officer feels a situation warrants them 'tooling up' and to this end, the restrictions and controls around handgun ownership are incredibly tight, boarding on 'too bloody hard to bother with' for the average person, but if they're determined they can get the relevant 'endorsements' to their firearms license for a handgun.

(Now before you diehard 2nd amendment defenders start screaming your hysterical accusations at me for being some pussy-arsed, leftie, tree-hugging, anti-gun pinko, can I just say that I'm very content indeed with the pistol grip on my 12g Tactical Pump Action as a compromise to a handgun, which provides me far better 'stopping' results to be honest, assuming of course that two 'key factors' have taken place immediately beforehand; Those being: i. My 26'' 12g Mossberg failed to 'stop' the threat in question at a comfortable distance prior to this point in time and ii. I'd forgotten yet again to re-sight the Zeiss Scope on my Sarko A7 7mm 08... God, what a truly beautiful weapon, it has to be said! So we're all clear on that count right?? Excellent).

So its this lack of visible weaponry on NZ cops that has meant there's absolutely no need for liberal handgun laws allowing for the carrying of any sidearm by the public. Therefore, demand for handguns is virtually nil, meaning a black market barely exists aside from the occasional moron drug-dealer who couldn't shoot barn door because they always insist on holding the thing sideways to shot 'gangsta styles'... and that's assuming they can even find the right ammunition to load it with.

So in short, handgun crimes just aren't an issue in NZ and neither is the inherent or taught 'gun culture' in our youth growing up, through into their college years. Which leads me to my next point/question:

NZ has never had an instance of a young person or college student turning up at school with a hand gun, or an automatic weapon and shooting the # out of the place, killing as many of their fellow students as they possibly can (which points to a 'calculated decision' on the perp's part and not strictly being a case of an unstable, irrational or insane mind carrying out such a cowardly atrocity, its fair to say)... or a similar situation undertaken by an older, mature person with access to similar weaponry. Yet it seems every three or four months we see yet another 'madman' has gone postal and shot up their school, classmates, workplace and such like... usually with high powered automatic weapons too. Why do you think this is??

In many other parts of the western world (Norway and France being recent exceptions of course, but one of those religiously motivated and that's a whole other kind of mental instability and set of rules!) these kinds of events are aberrations. Can someone give me a rational, unemotional and reasonable explanation for this annomoly? I could summise, but I think my views on this particular point are pretty much self evident.

But in saying all of this, I do there's something to said about an 'armed citizenry' and the arguement it's a large deterent to any power (foreign or domestic) looking to invade or to take power covertly etc.I think there's definitely something to this, but should it mean handguns are so readily available to anyone willing to wait a few days for the 'background checks' to be rubber stamped? Why should one need to hide a weapon if its meant to be a deterent too? I reakon a M16 is far more concerning to an attacker than WOP 9mm! And why is having a handgun legally strapped to your hip such huge deal if there's really no 'Jessy James' or 'Cowboy' ego tripping going on here. Shouldn't longer barreled weapons be enough and consign pistols to scrap