i'm confused about this forum

Look, this whole thing is not really very hard to figure out if you USE YOUR BRAIN!

Here are the facts.

Global Warming is NOT real. The data doesn't lie.

The supposed ‘consensus’ on man-made global warming is facing an inconvenient challenge after the release of new temperature data showing the planet has not warmed for the past 15 years.

The figures suggest that we could even be heading for a mini ice age to rival the 70-year temperature drop that saw frost fairs held on the Thames in the 17th Century.

Based on readings from more than 30,000 measuring stations, the data was issued last week without fanfare by the Met Office and the University of East Anglia Climatic Research Unit. It confirms that the rising trend in world temperatures ended in 1997.

Met Office releases new figures which show no warming in 15 years

Now let me ask you this... is global warming the same thing as climate change? NO! Global warming is simply one type of climate change. However, many people think of them as the same thing because the brainwashing media has blended them into the same thing, and then made global warming into a joke and therefore any talk of climate change is a joke. That's not how it works!!!

The Earth is indeed being destroyed by Humans in many different ways, for many different reasons. Pollution being dumped into the environment and direct destruction of the environment through deforestation are two large factors.

The data doesn't lie.

Originally posted by dannotz
reply to post by pasiphae

 

I agree with you, the attitudes people log onto ATS with are UGLY. That's Datroof.

It's like, everyone is just waiting for a reply so they can try to one-up the other person.

Nobody can conjecture anymore, or use their imagination.

And if you go a bit "out to space" you get some old crusty mean member that comes in with pie charts and 20 links telling you whatever you think you wanted to talk about isn't going to be talked about because they said so and they have charts and numbers.

The new members just try to argue or get their post count up most of the time, and the old members are so distraught that their good ole ATS just aint the same anymore that they come into every thread just itching to leave a reply that says;

"you stink, your ideas stink, i'm awesome, look at my 5,000 post count, [insert sarcastic witty remark], oh and here's a pie chart that says your wrong"

I totally get you OP, it's hard to scroll down past the OP sometimes, and other times it's hard to even read a threads OP because it was written so arrogantly with little to no factual information to back up their thoughts. And yes people, opinions and facts aren't the same thing.

I've really been trying to be a good member lately, and encourage good conversation and debate, i just wish others would adopt this philosophy.

Let me know when you wanna talk about climate change, we can have a nice long conversation about it all night if you'd like!

Thanks for posting this

edit on 6-3-2012 by dannotz because: spelling

My personal favorite is when they cite "statistics" and pie charts from which "PROVE" there is no global warming...data courtesy of the National Association For Burning as Much Coal & Oil As We Can.

Just because it's "data" doesn't mean it's credible. Critical thinking means asking yourself if the parties who compiled the "study" might have had a vested interest in a given result or inherent bias, and if so...to what degree?

i wasn't able to come back after i posted.... i have to get my kids to school in a second and haven't had the chance to read through all the replies just yet. i'll be back in little while.

what i meant was that in this forum the topic of man induced climate change.... the kind that's not just because the earth exists... the kind where humans have accelerated the change to a point we may not be able to evolve fast enough... that topic used to be okay to discuss. by discuss i mean in a manner NOT FILLED with "HUMANS didn't have anything to do with climate change!!!!!" and then the whole thing is derailed.

i believe in climate change,i just dont think it is totally caused by humans. but i'm sure we're not helping!
yesterday here in ontario,it was -16 c.(-22 with wind chill) this was by far the coldest day this winter here,which is crazy because that is normal temps for the winter here. we have no snow,when we should have an average of 2-3 feet on any given day.
tomorrow is supposed to be +13 c.! thats a 26 degree difference!!!
the weather people are just blowing it off like nothing is wrong!
'well it was +15 on this date in 1953'! ya well its been + something all winter! THIS IS CANADA!
climate change indeed! i feel i have to cut my lawn soon!

reply to post by reficul


when you discuss it like that it's not ruining the conversation. it's when someone comes to a thread and says "climate change has nothing to do with humans therefore your post is dumb". it's just become so RUDE. the subtitle of this forum is " Discussion of climate change, pollution, and environment issues".

reply to post by ChaoticOrder


your logic and your data is sound. i totally concour. the photos you posted are shocking in the least,and just over all disturbing! may the gods take mercy on our souls!
peace

reply to post by pasiphae


i think the only thing to do is lead by example,and educate people about the nasty habits that humans do to the earth! being aware is the first step,taking action is the next!

reply to post by pasiphae


sorry,just an add on!
usually by march/april when the snow starts melting here,you can see how much garbage motorists have tossed their junk out of the window on the side of the road. me and my kids take a day and clean up our street.
but this year we have no snow,and strangely,there is far less trash on the road!

I absolutely dont care about the is it global warming and caused by humans yay vs nay debate. I'm glad that people here are realizing there is an abornal change in weather.

For me global warming especially caused by humans is rather too exaggerated. I think it is part of the Earth's natural process the weather to change, that DOES NOT make it normal, at least for our standards and idea of winter, this is not normal. Maybe because there isn't a getting colder, obviously, it is warming,.

So I think it is reasonable to claim there is warming, as for caused by humans? - it hardly has much effect what humans do, The Earth is active, see the earthquakes, volcanoes, climate, it is all part of it.

Some complain smth doesnt freeze? This was the best winter for years, we had more snow than any other of the last maybe 15 years but while it snowed a lot, it was not that typical years ago to suddenly become spring-to-almost-summer in February and March, The weather didn't just become warmer than winter, it became almost like as if it is May not March. I am for having some more snow.

reply to post by pasiphae

is this no longer a forum we can discuss climate change without the battle?

I guess that depends on what your definition of a discussion is. ATS is a conspiracy oriented site, so any topic being discussed is going to be approached from various angles. You don't expect everyone to just agree with everything you say do you?

That said, when it comes to the ACTUAL trolls, those who post comments like you mentioned, and don't actually add to or take part in the discussion, need to be ignored. But if you intend to find answers, you have to take the criticism and questions and run with them.

Climate change is one of those polarizing topics here. you are NOT going to get a consensus. So if all you want is like minded chit chat, probably not your best choice to do it here. If you want a real DISCUSSION, just learn to weed out and ignore the trolls, and you will see how fun this place can be.

And really, it should only take about a week of paying attention to be able to spot the users you can pretty much ignore.

Our ignorance of the environment we live in is real. We have bigger machinery to dig the earth and till it than anywhere in recorded history. We have created fast chainsaws and huge machines to secure our lumber and pulp at amazing rates. We buy more things to make our life easier than anywhere in history. We want all the benefits of living without doing any physical work. To offset our lack of exercise which makes us sickly we buy machines or tools who's creation also destroys the environment. We build big houses that take much to heat and cool, central heating was not used much 70 years ago. Most people then used 1/4 of the fuel we use for heating. Look at the cars on the road. We moved our work far from our homes and now spend much time traveling to get there. What kinds of fools have men become. I remember when a man could work alone and still feed his family. Now both people work to make ends meet with this new wasteful lifestyle. Why can't people see the truth? Do they fear it will interfere with their wasteful lifestyle. Do we really need the best cable package or the fastest internet connection? Do we need to have someone else prepare our food? Have we become the new elite that walk around blind of all those sucking our money away? I understand how Economics work, especially capitalism. Now I invite you to pick apart this post and tell me it's all wrong.

reply to post by pasiphae


Climate change is not in dispute among real scientists. Peer reviewed science states its very real. Plastic science and misinformation can say what is likes and it is a shame that on a sight like ats that people seem to prefer the plastic science..

Originally posted by Imtor
I absolutely dont care about the is it global warming and caused by humans yay vs nay debate. I'm glad that people here are realizing there is an abornal change in weather.

For me global warming especially caused by humans is rather too exaggerated. I think it is part of the Earth's natural process the weather to change, that DOES NOT make it normal, at least for our standards and idea of winter, this is not normal. Maybe because there isn't a getting colder, obviously, it is warming,.

So I think it is reasonable to claim there is warming, as for caused by humans? - it hardly has much effect what humans do, The Earth is active, see the earthquakes, volcanoes, climate, it is all part of it.

Some complain smth doesnt freeze? This was the best winter for years, we had more snow than any other of the last maybe 15 years but while it snowed a lot, it was not that typical years ago to suddenly become spring-to-almost-summer in February and March, The weather didn't just become warmer than winter, it became almost like as if it is May not March. I am for having some more snow.

i haven't started any posts that have created an argument. i think my point is lost. i'm not seeing the same kinds of discussions i used to see here and it bums me out. i'm fine with the discussion and we are all welcome to have our own opinions but it has felt like any time a post that leans to the anthropogenic climate change side it just goes down hill. it wasn't always like that.

reply to post by pasiphae

The reason for that is because it is nothing more than a scam which will actually ruin both envirionment and have already led to death of people in third world.
If you actually do some research you will discover that earth has been warmer many times even over the last thousands of years, without any bump in co2.
If you look at long term climate and co2 data based on ice cores you will even discover that 90% of the time it is TEMPERATURES that drive the co2. The little effect you get from co2 is completely dwarfed from natural climate swings and even during the times with co2 being in THOUSANDS of ppm range the earth was very much liveable and sometimes even ICE AGES hit during periods where co2 was many times higher than now.

The current co2 levels is one of the lowest in entire earths history which is mainly because we are currently stuck in a short interglacial period in middle of a ice age and the ice age conditions might return at any time.

What we should prepare for is the coming ice age, which we are already overdue for.

reply to post by usmc0311


here here!!! star for you! im just north of lake ontario and the same is happening here! no snow,worst storm was 5 inches!!!! yhe only reason i bothered to shovel it was cause it seemed i ought too!
the rest melted the next day.
tomorrow gonna be +13 c.( around 55-58 f.)
i know spring is in 2 weeks but man! this is nuts. all our rivers and canals are seriously low because of lack of snow.
i live near an agricultural part of ontario ,called the holland marsh which produces a whole wack off carrots,onions and the like.
these farmers are getting really scared! they draw a lot of their irrigation from a man made canal that was dug in the 40's,oddly enough,to drain the marsh. now its crazy low. never seen it this low before.
this is all going to add up to poor crops,meaning higher prices.
i have my own garden,but i foresee water bans!

The NAS confirmed IPCC findings four years ago. And with other problems affecting the world, it is irrelevant to still be skeptical or live in denial.

Originally posted by usmc0311
reply to post by pasiphae

 

Anyone who doesn't believe the climate is changing. Come to Michigan and talk to the people and you will find your answer. This is the first year that anyone can remember that the lakes have not frozen over. (in southern MI)
We also have not had a snowstorm produce more than 3-5 inches of snow at a time. We have had record highs and sustained periods of warmth. Enough to cause trees to bud in January and my garlic to sprout as well. I laugh at people who don't believe our climate is changing. The reasons can be debated till everyone is blue in the face, but the simple fact is that it is changing. Also look what is happening in europe this winter.

This isn't the first time the lakes did not freeze over, nor is it the first time there was little snow. Meanwhile Europe has had the coldest, snowiest winter on record. Does that count for anything?

Also noted that the same people who scream "global warming by humans" are the same ones who think the planet can take care of 50 billion people.

reply to post by usmc0311


You are not being honest.
I live in Michigan. We have had ice (although not as much as normal) on every lake in Michigan.
We have held pond hockey tournaments on several spread from southeastern to southwestern.

It has been VERY cold for a few weeks, then it warms up, melting the snow, but then freezes again.
We have had our snowmobiles out on the lakes too.

Our snowfall is at a very very low period.... BUT, we also had a few winters in the early 70's where there was virtually no snow at all.

Don't be dramatic, simply for the sake of being dramatic.

Huron and Erie have both been frozen enough to support ATV's and ice fishermen...

reply to post by pasiphae


In the past, there would be a whole lot more adamant debaters on this subject. That seems to have changed. Some who firmly believe in the man caused version still voice their thoughts, but I think since the news has moved on to new celebrities to probe and prod, most folks who feed off of the MSM moved with it. Don't miss the new season of American Idol!

And for the record, I believe man is not capable of even minor affect on Global climate, but does have a very large affect on pollution, both air and land. We need to change lots of things, fuel type being the first in my opinion. But when the Al Gore version hit the news, it was agenda driven from the word go. I am naturally suspicious of agendas.

I agree, Its I see alot of posts smashed these days. I think some members forget that this is a conspiracy forum. I enjoy reading topics, even if they are more fiction than truth.