Men (Masculinity) Dangerous to Society?

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


You are right we changed things so fast that even common law did not follow the changes.

Common law prohibit and punish violence, murder, rape, swindling with money etc etc. all mostly male crimes.

What is the punishment for freezing out someone from their entire social circle ( a female speciality) .... ohh there is none ...

What is the punishment for keeping a man a hairs width away ... luring him to pay for whatever the girl wants and say # off, when she finds the dreamguy ... oh none again ....

Just like natural selection have selected out the most devious of men, it has done the same to woman ... but the only ones punished by law is the men ...

To be a bit more precise :

When a man feel angry on someone he punches them on their face, wich is clearly illegal.

When a woman feel angry on someone she uses social means to get even, wich is fully legal.

If we want equal rights we should punish both things equally ... yet we don't ... why ?

There is a lot of inequalty these days ... and it is not against woman.

reply to post by pilot70


I agree.

I felt this thread to be very condemning of men and masculinity based on premises that hardly support the call for exorcising the world of masculinity.

I thought someone in this thread might want to point out that masculinity isn't the problem that leads to the intrinsic aggression and tendency towards violence in boys but rather that these tendencies are a physiological birthright. It is male nature to be powerful and to lead. And it is for this physiologically natural fact that I feel the root of this argument seeks to rid us of our metaphysical masculinity for reasons other than mere equality or riding mankind of damaging effects of feeling like a man and deserving respect as stronger vessels.

The research presented that is supposedly supporting evidence for the argument against masculinity seems to be a feminist attempt at gaining more control in society. In order to gain power, all the feminist agenda needs to do is convince males that they aren't biologically fit to be the stewards they are born to be. The women's rights movement has brought some good change (arguably) but is by in large causing severe emotional confusion among our young men and boys who are in the event of forming their identities.

Power and authority is the real agenda here, not that males and masculinity are the cause of this worlds violence.

Originally posted by Starchild23

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by pilot70

 

I like how we divide Human qualities and traits into the masculine kind, and the feminine kind. This is exactly the point of the post to show how we divide these HUMAN qualities up, and is why most men seem to be lacking becuase they don't want to be feminine, when in reality they're human.

Alright. So tell me...why is masculinity at fault here? And this is the very core issue that gets my dander up.

MASCULINITY IS NOT THE SOLE FAULT!

As long as we're playing the "point the finger" game, I'm sure there's something both men AND women are doing wrong. So let's drag all of these issues out into the open...for both the man and the woman.

You've misunderstood. Humans are the problem, not males or females.

Originally posted by Evansr
reply to post by andersensrm

 

No, but thinking of feminine as weak and masculine as strong IS the real problem.
Both are equal, and it doesn't depend on your sex.

That is why I also mentioned the rise on androgynous people and a balance in everyone that must be achieved.

Thats what I was trying to say.

reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff


I saw one of my friends getting teased along by a girl for 10 years of his life. This woman knew she did not want him, but since he was a convniance buying her gift etc. for 10 years she didn't tell him that he was not wanted. So the poor guy spent like 10 years of his life chasing this bitch. I told him several times, but he was blinded. The girl knew and used it ... why is that not a serious crime ?

She knew but CHOSE to waste tens years of his life even if she knew ...... how is that NOT a SERIOUS punishable crime ?

If a man had cheated an other man in a similar way there a laws to put him behind bars .... equality is a misunderstanding until the penal code is also equal.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff

 

The men alive today are descendants of the strongest, fiercest and most driven of their species. For about 3 millions years, man has been the one that needed to be all of that, to provide for his pack, his group, his family. All of the genes necessary for survival in a hostile environment are still with him.

Over the past few thousand years (a blip on the timeline), these traits have become less necessary, as our society changed from hunter-gatherers to corporate office workers. It could be said that these traits are not just unnecessary, but they are almost a disadvantage.

The unnatural way in which we live (which we have fully engineered) has contributed to making our men behave in (as the British wound say) very "anti-social" ways. Because the man has the urge to fight, to hunt, to devour, to control and modern man hasn't yet figured out how to channel those urges...

It all happened so fast.

That's my husband's theory, anyway... And he's pretty smart.

I agree, your husband sounds to be the kind of man who choose to value understanding over unregulated emotional response. I would say you are lucky to have such an intelligently minded counterpart. Now, I don't necessarily disagree with his assessment but the corporate office workers use their earned resources to purchase the sweat of those who slave in the oilfields, logging yards, farms, and on the front lines of war. The traits you speak of may not be necessary or advantageous in the UK anymore but in the US we are fed and warmed and housed because of those traits that compel men to brave dangerous things in order to provide. However. men are increasingly losing their sense of authority since many years now and are struggling with respect and self-identity because of the feminist and homosexual movements. Our educational system doesn't teach us to be philosopher kings but to be servants of our emotions and feelings. We are taught to submit our autonomy to those with money and what they call truth. It's sad in my eyes how instead of turning back to the natural, society/gov't/culture would seek to make us unnatural in order to fit their deviant prescriptions of philosophy, life, and rule.


Rome is returning. Nevertheless, I know wherein my hope lies and from whence my freedom and salvation comes. I'm not all that tore up about it really.

Kuddos to your husband. Sounds like a smart guy easy to befriend and trust.

blessings

Originally posted by pilot70
reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff

 

I saw one of my friends getting teased along by a girl for 10 years of his life. This woman knew she did not want him, but since he was a convniance buying her gift etc. for 10 years she didn't tell him that he was not wanted. So the poor guy spent like 10 years of his life chasing this bitch. I told him several times, but he was blinded. The girl knew and used it ... why is that not a serious crime ?

She knew but CHOSE to waste tens years of his life even if she knew ...... how is that NOT a SERIOUS punishable crime ?

If a man had cheated an other man in a similar way there a laws to put him behind bars .... equality is a misunderstanding until the penal code is also equal.

edit on 24-2-2012 by pilot70 because: (no reason given)

I can't subscribe to laws that would punish you for my stupidity, neither do I want to be punished for yours.

And I'm not aware of the laws of which you speak.

Originally posted by HeFrippedMeOff

Originally posted by pilot70
reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff

 

I saw one of my friends getting teased along by a girl for 10 years of his life. This woman knew she did not want him, but since he was a convniance buying her gift etc. for 10 years she didn't tell him that he was not wanted. So the poor guy spent like 10 years of his life chasing this bitch. I told him several times, but he was blinded. The girl knew and used it ... why is that not a serious crime ?

She knew but CHOSE to waste tens years of his life even if she knew ...... how is that NOT a SERIOUS punishable crime ?

If a man had cheated an other man in a similar way there a laws to put him behind bars .... equality is a misunderstanding until the penal code is also equal.

edit on 24-2-2012 by pilot70 because: (no reason given)

I can't subscribe to laws that would punish you for my stupidity, neither do I want to be punished for yours.

And I'm not aware of the laws of which you speak.

That's not down to masculinity or inequality that's human nature. Both men and woman do that to each other, who among us doesn't know at least one male or female friend that has had that done to them or is doing it to someone else? That's nothing to do with masculinity, that's human nature. 'Love is blind' part of the human condition. There are a lot of people male and female who are happy to exploit the opposite sex.

I'm male and am quite proud to say I've never (knowingly) done that to someone else but I have had it done to me and I have male and female mates who are currently doing it to other people. I'm sure that in some people it's just a way for them to 'get back' at the opposite sex because it's been done to them in the past.

Originally posted by femalepharoe

Most of violent crimes and sexual assualts on children and adults are overwhelmingly commited by males. (PLEASE NOTE: this is not to say that women have not, will not, or do not have the capacity to do so)

Yet , society refuses to acknowledge these statistics in order to examine the dangers of their "masculinity" cultivation into society.

HUMANS assault other humans. If you believe that men are the downfall of Humanity,what can be done about it?

Heres an article that talks about what you are bringing to the table.

The culture of masculinity costs all too much to ignore

In the article are comments.

Heres a few to ponder on......

When women are seen as less capable or less likely to be aggressive in business or sport its seen as terrible sexism. Yet when women are treated exactly the same by the law as in not aggressive the calls for equality seems to be absent. Women receive shorter sentences for the same crimes on average compared to men. Yet i see no mention of that in the article? For all your righteous indignation society seems to have a giant blind spot when it comes to violent women. All your stats could simply be evidence of that. And finally replace male with black and female with white and read the article....

It's interesting we talk about violence against women being endemic. Violence against men seems so accepted that it is rarely challenged. Soaps always take a strong line against male on female violence, but male on male violence is accepted as routine. Female on male violence is still treated as a joke in many cases. It would perhaps reduce violence by men if we stopped seeing violence against men as normal.

I think this has come hand in hand with the feminisation of education, which alienates boys, the collapse of discipline in society generally, and the message to young women that their sexual availability is a valid lifestyle choice. I dont think feminism is correcting any fundamental wrong, its an invalid philiosophy. The traditional roles that men and women fulfilled up until very recently were a function of survival and the production of the next generation in subsistence societies, not some vast conspiracy bu the 'patriarchy'.

A good video to think about also........

reply to post by femalepharoe

Examples of New York Times, etc. support this. In addition if a male teacher molests children they state it was "a teacher/teachers aide" yet if a WOMAN does it they make sure to distinguish the sex.

says FEMALEpharoe

I think you mean Pharaoh

So you know you could have gone with 'Cleopatra'.. but nooo.. Seems you really need this prefix

reply to post by pilot70


You know, I'd like to respond to you, but I don't understand half of what you say.

reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff

Originally posted by HeFrippedMeOff
I would say you are lucky to have such an intelligently minded counterpart.

I would agree wholeheartedly.

Now, I don't necessarily disagree with his assessment but the corporate office workers use their earned resources to purchase the sweat of those who slave in the oilfields, logging yards, farms, and on the front lines of war. The traits you speak of may not be necessary or advantageous in the UK anymore but in the US we are fed and warmed and housed because of those traits that compel men to brave dangerous things in order to provide.

I think you misunderstood something there. The men working behind the desks do make money and provide, but they're not meeting the physical and emotional urges that would be met if they were running, hunting, killing, for their family.

That's why sports, hunting, war, etc. are so popular with men. These manufactured activities serve to meet some of the needs of primitive man. Still, they don't compare to the work primitive man did or the adrenaline he pumped when he brought down and killed a deer with a spear.

However. men are increasingly losing their sense of authority since many years now and are struggling with respect and self-identity because of the feminist and homosexual movements.

Because of the feminists and gays, huh? Again, how does it make sense that when men rule the world, their behavior is women's fault?

Men (Masculinity) Dangerous to Society?

I am comfortable with my masculinity and my view of the rest of the world, including my feminine counterparts and those of both genders who don't dock well into established doctrine.

Sex is actually secondary to survival. But once you lose the 'Y' chromosome from the chain of human reproduction, our species dies. Science may be very assured right now of their ability to sustain a sexless society... but I think we are headed for a mass die-off.

No... it won't be because some rednecks hate gays... but rather, because mother nature said 'Too Many People' and we need to harness the most prolific sex drive of that species.

That homosexuality was ever even thought of as being by choice alone, is really silly. We just don't have that much freedom from our programming.

reply to post by sonnny1


Wow. That's just sad. I don't know why the reactions surprise me, but they do. Realistically, I didn't see that much "intervention", one way or the other, except the one woman who told him he looked like a psycho. Also, the woman who thought the female-on-male abuse was a good thing, didn't appear to have an American accent.
Don't know how that figures into the equation, but I thought it was noteworthy.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

I think you misunderstood something there. The men working behind the desks do make money and provide, but they're not meeting the physical and emotional urges that would be met if they were running, hunting, killing, for their family.

That's why sports, hunting, war, etc. are so popular with men. These manufactured activities serve to meet some of the needs of primitive man. Still, they don't compare to the work primitive man did or the adrenaline he pumped when he brought down and killed a deer with a spear.

Star for you BH!


The primal outlet,has been transformed,and the basic human need,has been corrupted to an extent,with the advancement of Society. Its strange that Humans,with all their failings still need to have the outlets,that might be predestined in their genes.

Anger, is primal trait,in my eyes....... MHO

Originally posted by BellaSabre
reply to post by sonnny1

 

Wow. That's just sad. I don't know why the reactions surprise me, but they do. Realistically, I didn't see that much "intervention", one way or the other, except the one woman who told him he looked like a psycho. Also, the woman who thought the female-on-male abuse was a good thing, didn't appear to have an American accent.
Don't know how that figures into the equation, but I thought it was noteworthy.

Well,I think it brings a certain understanding of gender bias, human have. I dont know. I feel its primal,to want to protect woman.

I consider myself to be a fairly ordinary man. I want to be victorius in the face of insurmountable odds or die in glorious battle. There is no place in society for me. I've no innocent to protect. No damsell to champion. I am as useful to society as a solidier at a tea party. My masculinity has become a liability. I must fight it every day. In the absence of an external expression I am at war with myself. For your sake, not for mine. The only fight I have left is to master myself for the protection of those around me. I am spiritually dying. There is no place for MEN in this society. No excitement. No adventure. No purpose for masculinity.

reply to post by femalepharoe
AHAAAHAHAHAHAHAAAA Thanks so much for my weekend humor fix. Let's just get rid of men, that way we can all listen to our Melissa Etheridge CD's in peace, without being reminded of how much she sucks. After all, when men stop producing things that create wealth, then all the teachers, social services, single mom benefits will just keep arriving based on.... whose wealth? Your gig of having everything handed to you as a woman is completely dependent on men paying for it. Men are now in revolt. They won't marry you, they won't work their ass off so you can steal it in a divorce after two years, and they definitely no longer work harder because you decided to have a kid against his wishes, they usually end up going to jail instead (part of your 95% convenient). So now, since men would rather play video games than put up with feminist nightmares like you, and your free ride for being a woman with kids is coming to an end since nobody is paying for it, now you come here and spoooooge all over us. CLASSIC.

With the greatest respect femalepharoe what exactly do you propose? Completely ignoring that men and women are different both mentally and complete the emasculation of everyone in society who posses a penis? Boys act and behave differently overall from girls pretty much from the moment they're born and this is something that cannot be ignored. Boys and men need to be able to identify with positive role models that of their gender, and it is the very fact that there is a severe lack of these that men without direction in life will fall back to there animalistic tendencies to guide them when it comes to gaining pleasure and feeling good.

It is no secret that most crimes are committed by men, but what you seem to overlook is the fact that it is still a minority of men who commit these crimes. Therefore I cannot see how focusing on one group of people simply because they have a few extra bits dangling between their legs will really achieve anything. Yes it is mostly males that commit crimes, but it is mostly men from certain minority groups that are the perpetrators. This is why those groups are focused on.

I also see the opposite problem affecting women, which in turn leads to many of them feeling unsatisfied in life, and in the long term can affect the behavior of their offspring. And this is the fact that traditional female roles are no longer seen as desirable or are viewed as being somehow beneath them. That it is not okay just to want to be a mother or a housewife, but to be something worthwhile in life your achievements must be in the form of some high flying career. Don't get me wrong, I believe that both sexes should be given equal opportunities to be who they want to be. And I think the reason for this is the fact that society is entirely to 'material need' focused. The same also goes for men who wish to be stay at home dads. I think society as a whole is far to career focused instead of worrying about what really matters such as personal contentment.

As for the boys, the fact is that they are overall stronger, cannot fall pregnant yet have higher (on average) sexual desires, and in general think differently. What is needed is not to ignore the fact that they are men, but to channel these energies into a masculine identity that can benefit themselves and society as a whole.

reply to post by Starchild23


You came on very strong yourself. And this world needs both energies, freedom/creativity, and equality/unconditional love, to go home. As above, so below, and fathers seed gives the freedom but it is much abused, and pyramid systems don't progress anyone, that is when mothers wisdom is learnt, and equality, forgiveness, not giving up on people but seeking healing for all, and unconditional love, is the birthing from the matrix.

I understand what she's saying as its the world we're in, but its the rug being pulled over everyone eyes equally, and just alot of manipulated people.

reluctant-messenger.com...

"Reverence Woman, mother of the universe,' in her lies the truth of creation. She is the foundation of all that is good and beautiful. She is the source of life and death. Upon her depends the existence of man, because she is the sustenance of his labors. She gives birth to you in travail, she watches over your growth. Bless her. Honor her. Defend her. Love your wives and honor them, because tomorrow they shall be mothers, and later-progenitors of a whole race. Their love ennobles man, soothes the embittered heart and tames the beast. Wife and mother-they are the adornments of the universe."

This is being said, not to promote inequality, but the burka's and war machine have to end on this planet, and those who have some semblance of freedom, including women, don't stop supporting the corporations and everyone is bent out of shape.

Its takes the two into one in every person, though not physical adrogyny.