Your Views On 'Smacking' children.

Funny, when you are being told to train a pet, you are told to never hit them and to show them love and respect and teach them to behave, yet when it comes to our own kids we think it's ok to hit them and expect them not to hit others.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


My dog cops a light smack on the nose if he is being naughty, what are you talking about? He's the nicest, liveliest dog you've ever known - the whole street loves him . And again, no scars or temperament that suggests mistreatment.

I also used to work at a dog breeders. Let me tell you, without light smacking discipline those 60 dogs would get out of control, psyching each other up from the various dog yards and creating a massive noise nuisance for the rest of the neighbourhood - that's if a dog fight didn't break out.

And what is it with people likening completely unrelated topics to disciplining children?

reply to post by ALOSTSOUL


Have to agree. While no one wants to condone abuse, a spanking is NOT abuse. Not even with a belt, etc. If there are not marks left (as in a couple of hours later, not talking just a redness here), then it isn't abuse. YES, kids, most of them, need that from time to time. We don't teach them to lie, rebel, etc, but they do, and sometimes, they can place themselves in danger, or destroy things, if not taught. Sometimes, firm physical discipline is needed. From long experience, I can state that the kids I have seen who were the most misbehaved were also the least punished. Example, when I was a kid, my siblings and I KNEW we didn't dare act up in a store. Once was all it took. Kids that aren't spanked are the ones we see out of control in public, with parents that think it's "self expression" or some other nonsense! Known people personally that did and didn't smack/spank, and their kids were terrors. The best behaved? The kids of parents that were willing to pop their little rears as needed. Didn't happen often, in most cases, either. I think the fellow over there is onto the truth regarding this issue.

Most places here, it is NOT illegal, and you can spank the kids as needed. Some people trying to outlaw it, though. I suspect the real reason is that they want the state to control OUR children. Example - a father was jailed here recently for duct-taping his kid, reasons never revealed. Yet, a cop can hand cuff a small child in school. Id the parent can't restrain in such a fashion to protect the child and others, why can the cop? We have to let them know they are OUR CHILDREN, not theirs, and to get out of our lives.

Originally posted by InfoKartel
*snip*

I hope it was worth it, because your children will NEVER look upon you as they did at one point before you started hitting them. They will never forget it.

And I'm going to stop there because some things you will find out on your own. But it's all fine and dandy as long as other people think you are raising your children properly, right?

I can tell you, from experience, that you are wrong. MY parents spanked, and when we got it, we deserved it. Didn't happen all the time, and wasn't abusive. WAS enough to remember that we didn't want that happening again. Enough to teach that we didn't break the rules, because there were consequences. Lack of such discipline lands kids in JAIL, then parents that refused to spank them come in and complain that the system is victimizing their "poor child". Not what I learned, and I didn't get into any serious trouble. not what MY kids learn, either, and they don't get into trouble like that, either. it isn't a matter of "pleasing irrelevant strangers", but of teaching kids to be well-behaved members of civilized society. You know, as opposed to running in flash mobs, rioting and calling it protesting, etc. As for how I feel about my parents? Loved them both, and miss them now that they aren't here. NEVER resented them for caring enough to see that I understood that breaking the rules has consequences. in my opinion, parents that refuse to discipline as necessary (not abuse, discipline) don't really care about their kids as much as being politically correct.

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes


Totally agree, if verbal correction isn't doing it, and a time out isn't doing it, the child needs to understand the gravity of the mistake...and sometimes a pop on the ass is the only thing to drive that point home.

I can name a few kids that were never punished in this fashion, and as a result they are holy terrors to their parents. Respect is everything whether some want to believe it or not. When they get older.....they will have to fend for themselves....and when your an adult sometimes an ass beatin is the only way to prove that point.

Respect given is respect earned......when all ealse fails...a swat here and there should not be seen as abuse....but as a corrective measure that will ensure the kid as well as a adult gets the picture.

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes

Lack of such discipline lands kids in JAIL, then parents that refused to spank them come in and complain that the system is victimizing their "poor child".

You don't seem to understand that you are the small minority that grows up so sheltered on this planet.

For every one example that you bring of people turning out fine after they were whooped as kids I can bring you a thousand others that are into less than legal things.

But it is only a parameter, there are so many other things it counts on, I though getreadyalready summed it up neatly in one of his posts.

Originally posted by InfoKartel
*snip*

It has to do with fear.
*snip*

Not even close! I spank mine as necessary, and those kids don't come CLOSE to fearing me! You won't ever find a more loving, caring, trusting batch of kids. They know to behave, and they know they are loved and protected. They know, too, that when they do something wrong, they get into trouble. not always a swap, but sometimes. Depends on the situation, how many times they did it, the specific infraction, etc. No one here is talking about knocking a child across the room or some such thing. We are talking about a pop on the rear end.

My wish is for all parents that don't think spanking is ever needed to get a child like my first. That will cure that misconception fast, believe me!

Originally posted by InfoKartel

For every one example that you bring of people turning out fine after they were whooped as kids I can bring you a thousand others that are into less than legal things.

I am one! I was smacked as a child and I turned out just fine!

Now - pay up. Name your thousand....I'll be counting.....

Originally posted by InfoKartel
reply to post by Hellas

 

Get real!!

You're telling me to get real?

Before you agree with what just anyone puts on the internet, read about Stockholm syndrome and feel stupid.

So........you are telling us that children in families are the same as hostages.....and you tell us to "get real"? Wow.....just......wow......

There is a difference between force and violence. I am more than happy to use force to enforce my boundaries, after the other person has shown they refuse to deal reasonably. The same with children who are out of control and refusing to control their own behavior. I work on a psyche unit, and it needs to be a controlled environment, as does a home, and when patients are refusing to control themselves we are authorized per medical protocol, to use reasonable force to bring control to the situation.

Many of the adolescents on the unit are behavioral because they never learned discipline from their parents. They do respond to the boundaries we enforce. It is safe, effective, and approved by the psychiatric protocols of the us.

Originally posted by GAOTU789
*snip*

Beating them is the lazy way of parenting. It takes creativity and patience to correct bad behaviour without resorting to physical beatings.

Great, that you have a child that doesn't need spanking. I have seen a few like that. Not many, but a few. however, what about the kids for which those methods do NOT work? You can't say the same method that works for you and doesn't work for all is a good method, but the other parents are flawed or something. My oldest was a TERROR for awhile. Throw a fit in the store, and be taken outside, without getting what she was going to get. Throw another, even bigger fit in the parking lot. Mind you, this was NOT the first time we did this. Did it before, and clearly it didn't have lasting effect. This time, she literally dragged herself behind my mother, screaming, pulling, throwing a huge fit. Didn't stop for anything. At the car, my mother, who didn't EVER want her only grandchild (at that time) spanked, busted her rear end. At that point, the kid stopped making ANY noise, sat in the seat as though in shock, and NEVER acted that way again out shopping. My mom, who spanked us and DIDN'T want her grandchild spanked, admitted it was needed then. Truth was, her attitude on not disciplining properly caused a lot of the issues. Sometimes, taking away what they wanted works, and for some kids, that is all that is needed. NOT the case for all kids. I have five, and they are all different. One is so good she almost never warrants a swat. A couple of others have gotten frequent ones. Depends on the temperament of the child. Same parents, same methods, equal treatment, different kids.

The point is, it isn't fair or correct to state that parents who spank are not intelligent, or lack creativity, or weren't raised properly, etc. There isn't any "catch all" discipline for children. Some kids are very stubborn (know where mine get it!), and need firmer discipline. A spanking isn't a beating, either. BIG difference in the two. No parent enjoys swatting a child, but we know it's sometimes needed. If they don't learn as children that some actions have painful consequences, what happens when they become adults?

i had horrid asthma as a child...horrid! i found out when i was like 5 that if i faked an asthma attack during my spanking, i would get out of it. while it was smart as SNIP for my litle 5 year old self to think to manipulate sooo deeply...in retrospect...it wasn't very good for me and my overall development...

i think i ended up fine but if i had been properly disciplined as a child, i might not have gotten into some trouble later in life.

i think parents should spank their child from time to time...and you know what...the little devil might need his/her mouth popped a good time or two, too! this is not to advocate child (or any human) abuse but kids need to be taught boundaries. unfortunately, most kids can't learn from words...they need to be taught not to touch that electric fence...they can't read the sign. know what i mean?

every parent i know of who doesn't spank their kid...their kid is a bratty little youknowwhat. kinda seems to go hand and hand. this is not to say that you cannot properly parent a child without spanking them...just saying i've yet to see a well behaved kid who didn't get their little hind-end tore up from time to time...lord knows it would have benefited me in some ways...

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
*snip*

So it is ok then for a cop to do it to another adult?

Awesome. I will remember that if I ever become a cop or if I see all the threads on how horrible "pigs" are for hitting a civilian. Not to hurt them but to shock them and make them associate the hit with their crime.

Actually, I suspect the people complaining of "police brutality" all the time are the same kids that never got swatted. I am not talking REAL brutality, but people complaining that they resist arrest, and get knocked down, or tasered. people that riot then complain of the pepper spray, or tear gas, etc. This is the kids that didn't get spanked, and now don't understand that breaking the law comes with penalties.

YES< it is alright to cause a child a small, temporary pain, to teach the child that something is dangerous, or deadly, or harmful to others. A swat on the rear, to teach a child not to run into the street, vs. the child being hit by a car. Kids do NOT always understand, or listen to, explanations. A little temporary pain, the understand. Needed at times.

I posted a long post about this in another thread. I will see if I can find it.
It explained how to spank a child IMO and why.

I think it is ok to spank a kid, only on the bet, and only by a calm adult (put some time between what they did and the punishment) I am not so sure about girls really. This is from a family of boys. This is how I will likely punish my boys if/when i have any.

The Guide to Safely Punishing Kids

Guide to Punishing Kids (based on my punishments - I don't have kids, but this is how I would do it - that's my disclaimer )
Adjust ages as you please (within reason, all spankings should be on the butt only of course):

Baby to toddler - Take away possessions temporarily.

Toddler to around 5 - Very, very mild spanking, just the anger and fact you are spanking a child is enough to make the punishment work.

5 to around 10 - A decent spanking (but restrain yourself, you are an adult, but it can sting, it's ONLY on the butt so they can take a little pain).

10 to 14/15 - Grounding/banning from possessions/appliances OR as I was given standing in the corner (for a reasonable amount of time 30 min to an hour is enough. 2 if they did something really out of line) with threat of a spanking, should I not comply (This # WORKS). At this age they are becoming adults so a spanking is more humiliating than it is painful and no one should humiliate their kid EVER that causes real damage. What worked for my dad was making me stand, nose in the corner, while he watched T.V. or worked. He could keep an eye on me. If I tried to move, or leave he would threaten a good spanking. I was aware of how painful and humiliating that would be, so I stood. At this age, you need to let the kid feel like they have a little freedom to take responsibility and make their own choice, even if it is their own punishment. If they get to choose, they are more likely to comply, and wont hate you. So pick something, no: computer/t.v./phone/seeing girlfriend or friends (girlfriend/friend banning is a little harsh and they will hate you, well today they would actually probably freak out more for the video games, but maybe not if you have followed this guide ) and back it up with a spanking.

15/16 and 19 - They are teens. Most of their getting in trouble will likely be them testing their freedoms, or just regular old mistakes. You can't spank them, it would be humiliating and they would probably try to fight you and no matter how big they are or how much you want, you CAN'T fight a 19 year old. Take the car, phone, video games, anything YOU pay for really and back it up with the freedom to not let them be punished, but show sincere disappointment (If you have followed my outline up until that point I would almost guarantee that, unless you have a sociopath child, they will have enough respect to be punished or at least sincerely apologetic which is better.

20 and up - It's their mistake, show disappointment and let them make it. If it's something really big, and they want to fight you I would just stand down with the disappointment. If they hit you however, and depending on the situation (if it's emotional, death/end of relationship/etc, you can't fight them they need support over a lesson) hit them back, ha ha, they are adults and haven't learned a thing.

Originally posted by ALOSTSOUL
MP's have said in the media this week that the UK riots where caused by the lack of physical discipline, not the lack of jobs, education and a decent family lifestyle.

The Tottenham MP David Lammy claimed that Labour's 2004 decision to tighten up the smacking law was partly to blame for last summer's riots, which erupted in his north London constituency.

Hahaha i know, i laughed when i heard this to! Smacking someone about is apparently the best way to stop them doing crime? You reckon that would stop our MP's from fiddling the system? Hell, all those murderers, rapists, thieves and druggies in our prison system? Lets just beat em all half to death and then we wont have to lock em up!!


No i dont really believe in smacking children. Yes, some of em do need a good clip behind back of legs - i sure got taught a lesson or two. However, ive seen people at work smack there kids and... its just wrong Its awful to see.
I dont believe for one second the teens that where raiding london wouldnt have done it if they had strict parents. I bet alot of em grow up in places where violence is the norm. If they're not engaging in physical fights with there family, then surely on the streets? Im not sure, its london and im stereotyping. But no, i hands down do not agree with this ridiculous notion that smacking these young adults would have stopped them from doing what they did.

Let me also add, that while spanked rarely as a child, as an adult I have several times criticized my mother for not having spanked me enough as a child. I feel that due to this I had large problems with self discipline as a young adult, and would never want to inflict this upon my own children. As a child my parents allowed me lots of freedom and free will, so of course I spent most of my time playing video games and reading comic books. As a result much of my formative years were wasted. I know now that childhood is the time to force kids into experiences they may not do if given the choice, but that will make them into better people, and that they may come to love, such as meditation, learning, martial arts, art, and music.

What a lot of it comes down to is that parents have specific roles, and one of those roles is maintaining authority and control, which are necessary for certain stages of mentoring, and by not making these boundaries very clear you are doing a disservice.

Originally posted by InfoKartel
Simple:

You do not lay your hands on a child. Do so and go to jail.

Simple enough yeh?

I am so glad that my dad took his hand across my back side when I needed it. especially when I pulled a shot gun out on him for not letting me go to my friends house. I am a much better person today because I understand REAL LIFE CONSEQUENCE.

You don't do what the police tell you and rest assured that a VERY HARD nite stick is coming across your head.

A spank to the tush is what parents HAD been doing since the beginning of time. Kids were so respectful in the days of the switch and grew up to be respectful, dedicated workers..... That is ALL OVER NOW.

The world is over run by lazy, selfish, brats whom have no respect for anything.

If I tell my daughter no, does she listen? LOL OF COURSE NOT but when she receives that smack on the tush she marches to do what she is told. And no my daughter will not grow up to hate me because when she does listen she gets hugs, smiles and treats.

Listen, you love your children and give them all the affection they deserve but when they are bad they HAVE TO know that YOU (the parent) are the boss, the authority. Or they will run all over you and maybe some day hit you.

I said this yesterday and now I have to say this today. PLEASE STOP TRYING TO DESTROY PEOPLES LIVES OVER YOUR THOUGHTS, IDEAS, AND FEELINGS! PLEASE!

reply to post by Flavian


It does seem that many of the 'Anti-spanking' crowd are childless. To be honest this issue never even crossed my mind until I had my daughter.

ALS

Kids have a knack of pissing you off so much so that if you've never smacked em, you'll eventually consider it....

Originally posted by BooKrackers

Totally agree, if verbal correction isn't doing it, and a time out isn't doing it, the child needs to understand the gravity of the mistake...and sometimes a pop on the ass is the only thing to drive that point home.
*snip*

Originally posted by InfoKartel
*snip*
You don't seem to understand that you are the small minority that grows up so sheltered on this planet.

For every one example that you bring of people turning out fine after they were whooped as kids I can bring you a thousand others that are into less than legal things.

But it is only a parameter, there are so many other things it counts on, I though getreadyalready summed it up neatly in one of his posts.

BooKrackers, totally agree! Some kids will force it, too. had one like that. All things lost, no phone, no tv, no computer, no going anywhere but school and church; still didn't behave. A good swat was all that was left.

InfoKartel, what exactly is this "small minority that grows up so sheltered on this planet"?? Sheltered? That's a JOKE! Minority? Nope, average normal person, average family. Most people understand that kids need a spanking from time to time. Most kids that get them turn out to be decent, honest citizens. By the way, one sibling of mine, younger, did NOT get the same discipline, and got into trouble, where the other two of us, that were disciplined, didn't. Every case I know of kids that weren't spanked, they got into trouble. People posting here say the same thing. Plus, look at the data. More limits on parental control, more problems with children and youths. ALWAYS. Just like gun control. The more they tell us what we can't do, the worse things get. Getready already seems to have the right idea here. Spanking can be needed, depending on the child and the circumstances.

The problem here is really simple. People that don' t agree with spanking seem to consider it abuse, and also to think that parents that do this ONLY do this, as a first resort, and not a last. This simply isn't the case. The last thing I want to do is swat one of mine. However, they will get a swat if needed. Isn't abuse, either. Not even a red mark, typically. THEY know this. No, not some hostage syndrome, either. Loving kids, secure kids, that understand how to behave, and why we have sensible rules. I can guarantee you, I will be the first one ticked off at an abusive parent. Had the cops called on some, in fact, in a store. Man was literally punching his toddler's arm, repeatedly. NO REASON, the kid wasn't acting up or anything. I won't tolerate abuse, but a spanking isn't abuse. Dr. Spock (and I wish he had a different name...) did the world a lot of harm with his stupid book.