Christians the End of days for us is Around the Corner

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

. . . not even the Son knows when the timing of the Harpazo is.

Of course there is no verse in the Bible that says that, using that particular word.

A little confused here. Are you saying there isn't a verse in the NT with the word "harpazo" in it? Because that's inaccurate, there are several places that the term appears. Or are you claiming Jesus said even He doesn't know the date of His return for His bride?

Generally it is used in the New Testament to describe a bad thing, like the wolves snatching away the sheep.

No its not. " Harpazo" means to snatch someone out of the way of danger. Basically grabbing someone by their hair and taking them out of the way of danger. Wolves would not be trying to save the sheep from danger, the Sheppard does that.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

A little confused here. Are you saying there isn't a verse in the NT with the word "harpazo" in it? Because that's inaccurate, there are several places that the term appears. Or are you claiming Jesus said even He doesn't know the date of His return for His bride?

Here is what I said:

Of course there is no verse in the Bible that says that, using that particular word.

There are two clauses, a main clause and then a second, dependent clause.
The main clause is saying there is no verse saying that, where the word, that, means your entire sentence:

. . . not even the Son knows when the timing of the Harpazo is.

The second, dependent clause serves to clarify the main clause by focusing in on the main thing that excludes your sentence from being a match to any Bible verses, which is the use of that particular word, harpazo.
If you had replaced that word with one that would match up to the rest of the sentence, you could create a reasonable match with something found in the Bible.
What you are doing is presupposing that other people share your minority view about what a future appearance of Jesus might involve, or if Jesus is even planning such an appearance. To someone who shares your view perfectly of all the details of a theoretical appearance, then they would imagine something like a harpazo being included in that.
But if you were a person more interested in what the Bible says, over harebrained schemes, then your earlier statement is on its face a false statement if you are trying to use it as a quote from the Bible.

reply to post by jmdewey60

But if you were a person more interested in what the Bible says, over harebrained schemes, then your earlier statement is on its face a false statement if you are trying to use it as a quote from the Bible.

If I were quoting Bible I'd use quotation marks. Dur

Okay, that's a bunch of fluff when you could have said "both".

Okay, yes the term "harpazo" is used throughout the NT. It means "catch up" or "snatch up". The example I remember reading was if a Greek boy was playing near the edge of a cliff and his father sees him he will run over and grab the boys hair and "harpazo" him to safety away from the edge of the cliff. It's a violent, abrupt, snatching away of something out of danger's way. Now as far as Jesus goes, we know from Daniel and John that Christ's appearance will be exactly 1,260 days from the abomination that causes desolation Jesus and Daniel warned of. If we can pinpoint the exact date of His return to set foot on Earth from Daniel and John's prophecies then that would make this statement by Jesus in Matthew 24:36 irrelevant:

“But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only".

So the only "coming" of Christ where no one would know the day nor the hour of would have to be the harpazo, His 2nd coming to rule is shared in both Daniel and Revelation, 1,260 days after the abomination of desolation.

I'm not planning on having a rapture in December. I'm going to take it easy this year just in case. I had two hernia surgeries already and don't need another

reply to post by NOTurTypical

So the only "coming" of Christ where no one would know the day nor the hour of would have to be the harpazo, His 2nd coming to rule is shared in both Daniel and Revelation, 1,260 days after the abomination of desolation.

Which would make sense to someone who had a very narrowly matched view of what is supposed to happen that we know not the hour of.
My point being that it does not specify exactly what is supposed to happen and it is very doubtful that it extends off so far to where it becomes a concern of ours, meaning something that could happen involving us.
Most likely it is talking about the thing that is the point of the Gospel you would find a quote like that in, which is the impending doom of Jerusalem, which did happen, a long time ago.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

So the only "coming" of Christ where no one would know the day nor the hour of would have to be the harpazo, His 2nd coming to rule is shared in both Daniel and Revelation, 1,260 days after the abomination of desolation.

Which would make sense to someone who had a very narrowly matched view of what is supposed to happen that we know not the hour of.

First of all, numbers don't make truth, and it said we don't know the day or hour of the harpazo. His 2nd coming was foretold to the day, exactly 1,260 days from the abomination of desolation, in both the OT and the NT.

My point being that it does not specify exactly what is supposed to happen and it is very doubtful that it extends off so far to where it becomes a concern of ours, meaning something that could happen involving us.

I don't share that view. By the statements Christ Himself makes also in Matthew 24 it could not have been at a time before the nuclear age. (unless those days be shortened no flesh would be saved)

Most likely it is talking about the thing that is the point of the Gospel you would find a quote like that in, which is the impending doom of Jerusalem, which did happen, a long time ago.

No, Revelation was written in 95 AD. He was a prisoner of Domitian on Patmos. John was released from Patmos in 96 Ad when Domitian died. John's direct disciple Polycarp said John was imprisoned under Domitian.

You should read what more church historians have to say than textual critics. Perfect example, you can go into hours and hours of study in books trying to see if the last 12 verses of Mark are scripture or not. Yes, they are missing from the 4th century complete manuscripts we have, but Irenaeus quotes from them in his commentary in 177 AD. Common sense, either Irenaeus was clairvoyant, or the verses were removed from the text in Alexandria.

Which makes sense, the Gnostics didn't believe in resurrection.

Originally posted by rickymouse
I'm not planning on having a rapture in December. I'm going to take it easy this year just in case. I had two hernia surgeries already and don't need another

I think it's be on the Feast of Trumpets, whichever year it happens on.

P.S. Don't call it "rapture", call it either "the harpazo" (the Greek) or "gathering together" or the "catching up". rapture will fighters will rush in and say that the word "rapture" isn't in the Bible so it's bogus.

(Even though it's in the Latin Bible.)

reply to post by NOTurTypical

You should read what more church historians have to say than textual critics.

That would be pretty boring reading textual critics more than in tiny doses, when you need to.
There is something supposedly said by Papias about someone named John being in some sort of incarceration, or something, in the time of Domitian but I don't know of any more details than that. If you have the text, feel free to share it.
There is a book out, Redating the New Testament where the author, A.T. Robinson, says that there is information we know through Tertullian and Jerome, that John was exiled in the time of Nero.

well it might just happen at midnight whatever time that really is now day's


11:4 And Moses said, Thus saith the LORD, About
midnight will I go out into the midst of Egypt:

12:29 And it came to pass, that at midnight the LORD
smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the
firstborn of Pharaoh that sat on his throne unto the firstborn
of the captive that was in the dungeon; and all the firstborn
of cattle.

12:30 And Pharaoh rose up in the night, he, and all his
servants, and all the Egyptians; and there was a great cry in
Egypt; for there was not a house where there was not one
dead.

12:31 And he called for Moses and Aaron by night, and
said, Rise up, and get you forth from among my people,
both ye and the children of Israel; and go, serve the LORD,
as ye have said.

16:1 Then went Samson to Gaza, and saw there an harlot,
and went in unto her.

16:2 And it was told the Gazites, saying, Samson is come
hither. And they compassed him in, and laid wait for him
all night in the gate of the city, and were quiet all the night,
saying, In the morning, when it is day, we shall kill him.

16:3 And Samson lay till midnight, and arose at midnight,
and took the doors of the gate of the city, and the two posts,
and went away with them, bar and all, and put them upon
his shoulders, and carried them up to the top of an hill that
is before Hebron.

3:8 And it came to pass at midnight, that the man was
afraid, and turned himself: and, behold, a woman lay at his
feet.

3:9 And he said, Who art thou? And she answered, I am
Ruth thine handmaid: spread therefore thy skirt over thine
handmaid; for thou art a near kinsman.

3:10 And he said, Blessed be thou of the LORD, my
daughter: for thou hast shewed more kindness in the latter
end than at the beginning, inasmuch as thou followedst not
young men, whether poor or rich.

3:20 And she arose at midnight, and took my son from
beside me, while thine handmaid slept, and laid it in her
bosom, and laid her dead child in my bosom.

3:21 And when I rose in the morning to give my child suck,
behold, it was dead: but when I had considered it in the
morning, behold, it was not my son, which I did bear.

34:18 Is it fit to say to a king, Thou art wicked? and to
princes, Ye are ungodly?

34:19 How much less to him that accepteth not the persons
of princes, nor regardeth the rich more than the poor? for
they all are the work of his hands.

34:20 In a moment shall they die, and the people shall be
troubled at midnight, and pass away: and the mighty shall
be taken away without hand.

34:21 For his eyes are upon the ways of man, and he seeth
all his goings.

34:22 There is no darkness, nor shadow of death, where the
workers of iniquity may hide themselves.

34:23 For he will not lay upon man more than right; that he
should enter into judgment with God.

34:24 He shall break in pieces mighty men without
number, and set others in their stead.

34:25 Therefore he knoweth their works, and he
overturneth them in the night, so that they are destroyed.

34:26 He striketh them as wicked men in the open sight of
others;

34:27 Because they turned back from him, and would not
consider any of his ways:

34:28 So that they cause the cry of the poor to come unto
him, and he heareth the cry of the afflicted.

34:29 When he giveth quietness, who then can make
trouble? and when he hideth his face, who then can behold
him? whether it be done against a nation, or against a man
only:

34:30 That the hypocrite reign not, lest the people be
ensnared.

34:31 Surely it is meet to be said unto God, I have borne
chastisement, I will not offend any more:

34:32 That which I see not teach thou me: if I have done
iniquity, I will do no more.

34:33 Should it be according to thy mind? he will
recompense it, whether thou refuse, or whether thou
choose; and not I: therefore speak what thou knowest.

34:34 Let men of understanding tell me, and let a wise man
hearken unto me.

34:35 Job hath spoken without knowledge, and his words
were without wisdom.

34:36 My desire is that Job may be tried unto the end
because of his answers for wicked men.

119:62 At midnight I will rise to give thanks unto thee
because of thy righteous judgments.

119:63 I am a companion of all them that fear thee, and of
them that keep thy precepts.

13:34 For the Son of Man is as a man taking a far journey,
who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and
to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.

13:35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master
of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the
cockcrowing, or in the morning:

13:36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.

13:37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.

14:1 After two days was the feast of the passover, and of
unleavened bread: and the chief priests and the scribes
sought how they might take him by craft, and put him to
death.

14:2 But they said, Not on the feast day, lest there be an
uproar of the people.

11:1 And it came to pass, that, as he was praying in a
certain place, when he ceased, one of his disciples said
unto him, Lord, teach us to pray, as John also taught his
disciples.

11:2 And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father
which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom
come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth.

11:3 Give us day by day our daily bread.

11:4 And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one
that is indebted to us. And lead us not into temptation; but
deliver us from evil.

11:5 And he said unto them, Which of you shall have a
friend, and shall go unto him at midnight, and say unto
him, Friend, lend me three loaves;

11:6 For a friend of mine in his journey is come to me, and
I have nothing to set before him?

11:7 And he from within shall answer and say, Trouble me
not: the door is now shut, and my children are with me in
bed; I cannot rise and give thee.

11:8 I say unto you, Though he will not rise and give him,
because he is his friend, yet because of his importunity he
will rise and give him as many as he needeth.

11:9 And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you;
seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto
you.

11:10 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that
seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

11:11 If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father,
will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a
fish give him a serpent?

11:12 Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a
scorpion?

11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts
unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly
Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

16:25 And at midnight Paul and Silas prayed, and sang
praises unto God: and the prisoners heard them.

16:26 And suddenly there was a great earthquake, so that
the foundations of the prison were shaken: and
immediately all the doors were opened, and every one's
bands were loosed.

16:27 And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his
sleep, and seeing the prison doors open, he drew out his
sword, and would have killed himself, supposing that the
prisoners had been fled.

16:28 But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying, Do thyself
no harm: for we are all here.

16:29 Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came
trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,

16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do
to be saved?

16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and
thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples
came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them,
ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech
until midnight.

20:8 And there were many lights in the upper chamber,
where they were gathered together.

20:9 And there sat in a window a certain young man named
Eutychus, being fallen into a deep sleep: and as Paul was
long preaching, he sunk down with sleep, and fell down
from the third loft, and was taken up dead.

20:10 And Paul went down, and fell on him, and
embracing him said, Trouble not yourselves; for his life is
in him.

20:11 When he therefore was come up again, and had
broken bread, and eaten, and talked a long while, even till
break of day, so he departed.

20:12 And they brought the young man alive, and were not
a little comforted.

Hello All

8/26/2011 My first vision
Hello
I first of all don't want anyone to call me a prophet. I am just a man passing on his visions. I have always had some psychic talent. I would know what is going to happen just before it happens, like a few minutes before. I have always been protected by what I believe is an angel. I was put on this earth for a reason. When my wife was 5 months pregnant a voice spoke to me one night and said that she will have a boy and that I have to protect him. He is 7 months now. With all the craziness going on, I decided to give my life to GOD and let him guide my way last week. That's when I started to get a vision or a knowing that something was going to happen within months. The vision I got one day was of a secret room that was built into the mountain at my friends property that I visited a week a go. I asked the lord that if I was supposed to protect my son where was I to go? In the night when I said this to the most beautiful yellowish light enveloped my mind with the picture of the room. My son that was sleeping on the other side of my wife must of felt HIM there and made such a happy long sigh.
Last night before going to bed I ask the lord to please guide me and show me what is coming. I have like a tingling feeling that starts when I know that he is near. He gave me flashes of what is to come. I saw something hitting the earth and a huge mushroom cloud formed. The location was given to me as a picture and I can't remember this morning. But the timing for this to occur is within 2-3 weeks.
I have been preparing my family. We have bought different supplies etc. I try to let my family and others know but mostly they think I am crazy. My immediate family belied and that is what matters to me. These visions could only be for me to protect my son only. I told the wife that that eS my main concern. My GOD wants me to protect my son. There is a purpose for him. I took a picture in a direction where my son was smiling one day and in it was a picture of the face of a golden lady smiling.
But back to this. I am only putting this out there because it is the right thing to do. You may believe or not its up to you. I truly hope and pray that this will not happen. I will update this thread if anything else is shared with me.
We are in the last days but the struggle will be for your souls. Seek GOD out before its too late. GOD BLESS THE WORLD.

My response on that thread:
I dont mind any of the criticisms anymore. I will try to ask GOD again for more info for anyone who cares. One thing is for certain. If you dont prepare now and get some supplies you may not be able to afford it later. Case in point: Best buy charging 40 dollars for a case of bottled water in NY I believe. Again people have critics in anything one does. I found that Christians are the same. Yes we believe in GOD but there are many who don't believe in the devil.

Some believe that they must give their underage daughters to spiritual leaders in repayment for favors. My visions not dreams can be wrong but I believe this is not so because of how I received them. I can tell when I am asleep when a presence is near. I train myself to wake up quickly and then to assess if what I felt is positive or negative. If Pos then I am awake and comcentrate on the incoming message. If its neg I break off contact and open my eyes and get up if i need to.

I dont dream in this fashion. My dreams are the normal blurry dreams of sex, violence and rock n roll, lol
my visions I can induce an occurence whether neg or pos in a dark room. Its sort of opening a doorway a little. I can open a crack and peer at whoever is on the other side. I have seen dark phantoms that exude absolute evil and this was the first times I ever experience the bliss of what I believe is GOD or an angel of GOD.

To continue, many people were ridiculed for their belief especially when it involves such a disastrous premonition. Noah must have been one strong in the faith individual in order to build a boat on dry land in front of his peers.

Remember GOD works in mysterious ways. HE may wants us to get ready for other major disasters before Man price gouges you from surviving.

Either way I will be better off even though I still get weird looks when I buy my nine cases of water for 36 bucks. It beats 1 case for $40.

8/29/2011
Hello
Last night I asked Jesus to show me something about what was going to happen in the near future so that the info can save some of his believers. Later I was going to have a mega vision. I felt it coming on and then before me was like the card game solitaire. There were cards lined up in several rows and columns each depicting some type of scene. Then when I was presented with a card my baby screamed and broke me out of the trance. The only thing I got out of the picture was the word Syria. I will try again tonight to get more details.

Hmmm. Syria and now look what is happening.

Hello All

I had a disturbing vision this morning, 2/20/12. There was some person dressed or wrapped in garb like in Jesus days and in all white. I was looking down from above at this figure. She looked up and I saw her face. Her face had the symbol of the crossed burned into her flesh.

Then she looked away and instead of just following her I became her. I was in her body. Nations was against this person. I remember quoting things from the Bible and with a wave of my arm I would destroy those who were going against me. I would sweep enemy upon enemy away while walking towards some goal. These armies became fearful at some point. I would walk between some and they would not try to harm me. I was going through mountainous terrain. That was it. I have no clue what it means.

Response:
What did she look like? You might have possibly had a vision of this person and since we are all connected, sometimes we can see through another persons eyes and what they are experiencing. Very interesting either way!

Hello

She had a gray ashen face. The scar was on the left side of her face and was pretty big. It looked like it didn't heal properly.You can see that the edges of her wound was curled in exposing an angry looking burned flesh underneath. there were various armies against this person. I could tell that by the different dress the armies wore. I was so upset by this that I asked people in my office was there some commercial on some movie that had this type of figure? I was scared of her. She seemed possessed by the Power of God. I fear God and seeing what this person did was and is overwhelming.

God Bless

reply to post by odinson


Sounds like the antichrist. In Biblical figurative language, false religions or leaders are seen as "immoral women", or sometimes people who have kept themselves from "idolatry" are symbolic of virgins. The cross would mean it's a false Christian religion.

I have no idea really, that was my first thought about your vision, I could be totally wrong though.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You should read what more church historians have to say than textual critics.

That would be pretty boring reading textual critics more than in tiny doses, when you need to.
There is something supposedly said by Papias about someone named John being in some sort of incarceration, or something, in the time of Domitian but I don't know of any more details than that. If you have the text, feel free to share it.
There is a book out, Redating the New Testament where the author, A.T. Robinson, says that there is information we know through Tertullian and Jerome, that John was exiled in the time of Nero.

Do you even know why John was banished to Patmos? Domitian had a lust for people calling him: "Dominus et Deus" which meant "Lord and God." He had John arrested and imprisoned at Patmos for refusing to stop saying that Jesus was the only Lord and God when John was leading and teaching the church at Ephesus.

He was arrested from there, wrote 5 NT books from Patmos, then when Domitian died John was released and he came back to Ephesus where he died of old age in 96 AD.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Apparently something you got from a YouTube video since you cite no sources in even the vaguest way.
If you can ever nail down a citation, I would be happy to look into it.

Ephesus where he died of old age in 96 AD.

There is information which indicates that is wrong.
An early Christian writer visited Ephesus not too long after that and they extolled their greatness for having had great Christians who had lived in their city, without ever mentioning John.
My source is: The Theology of the Gospel of John (New Testament Theology), Dwight Moody Smith

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by odinson

 

Sounds like the antichrist. In Biblical figurative language, false religions or leaders are seen as "immoral women", or sometimes people who have kept themselves from "idolatry" are symbolic of virgins. The cross would mean it's a false Christian religion.

I have no idea really, that was my first thought about your vision, I could be totally wrong though.

Hello

That is an interesting take on it. However, when I was looking through that person's eyes, I felt full of the Holy Spirit and was quoting Bible verses fully and laying low those who we coming against her/me. I wish that I knew where she was going. It could mean that Christ is so close to coming and to arm yourself in His armor and maybe to head into the wilderness.

God Bless

reply to post by jmdewey60

Apparently something you got from a YouTube video since you cite no sources in even the vaguest way.

No, the guys I like to watch on YouTube source everything quite liberally. What do you want a source for? I assume since you quoted my statement about John dying in Ephesus if it was about that then:

You can visit his tomb today in Ephesus, Turkey.

Photo:

Originally posted by odinson

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by odinson

 

Sounds like the antichrist. In Biblical figurative language, false religions or leaders are seen as "immoral women", or sometimes people who have kept themselves from "idolatry" are symbolic of virgins. The cross would mean it's a false Christian religion.

I have no idea really, that was my first thought about your vision, I could be totally wrong though.

Hello

That is an interesting take on it. However, when I was looking through that person's eyes, I felt full of the Holy Spirit and was quoting Bible verses fully and laying low those who we coming against her/me. I wish that I knew where she was going. It could mean that Christ is so close to coming and to arm yourself in His armor and maybe to head into the wilderness.

God Bless

Then the woman must be the church, the bride. Christ would appear as Himself, any woman is usually a religious system in Biblical visions. ("The woman who rides the beast")

reply to post by jmdewey60

Apparently something you got from a YouTube video since you cite no sources in even the vaguest way.

Here is the source for the dates of the vision of Revelation, and John's imprisonment on Patmos at the end of Domitian's reign, it's from Irenaeus, (Not YouTube):

"We will not, however, incur the risk of pronouncing positively as to the name of Antichrist; for if it were necessary that his name should be distinctly revealed in this present time, it would have been announced by him who beheld the apocalyptic vision (John). For that (the 'apocalyptic vision') was seen no very long time since, but almost in our day, towards the end of Domitian's reign."

*parenthesis are my additions for clarity*


Irenaeus lived from 130 - 202 AD. He was the disciple of Polycarp, who in turn was the direct disciple of the apostle John himself.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

You can visit his tomb today in Ephesus, Turkey.

That would be comparable to going to Bethlehem and visiting the cave Jesus was born in, or tourists going to Jerusalem in the middle ages and buying a piece of the cross.
There was no such a place in Ephesus until recent times, I would say, and definitely not in the fourth century.

reply to post by jmdewey60


John died at the end of the 1st century, are you saying the church was absolutely clueless to where he was laid to rest only 200 years prior?

What about Irenaeus telling us when John had the vision of Revelation? At the 'end of Domitian's reign'?