An Iranian's view on the whole situation

I agree US has done some bad things but its nice to know that in the USA you can write your post and give your opinions without being drug out of your house the next day and shot. True we don't have the best government and there is always room for improvement but at least we can make the changes and for the most part our vote counts. Even though I don't always agree with my government I love my country plus all my stuff is here. So let sum it up for anyone talking crap about the USA get used to it, we bringing the new world order Beastie Boy Style.

Ali Baba and the forty thieves

Torching and crakin' and rhymin' and stealin'
Robbin' and raping - busting two in the ceiling
I'm wheeling' - I'm dealin' - I'm drinking, not thinking
Never cower, never shower - and I'm always stinking
Ho ho ho and a pint of Brass Monkey
And when my girlie shakes her hips - she sure gets funky
Skirt chasing, free basing - killing every village
We drink and rob and rhyme and pillage

Rhymin' and stealin' in a drunken state
And I'll be rockin' my rhymes all the way to Hell's gate

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Your reading comprehension and contradictory self-aggrandizing behavior are abhorrent. Your logic is twisted and wrong, and your signature indicates Americans like you give Americans like me a bad name.

I love my country. I'm also willing to accept the err of my government's ways You probably think that because I recognize the mistakes my government has made in its dealings of foreign policy, or that I'd even question its veracity, that I'm not a real patriot.

Keep on drinking the kool-aid, pal.

Originally posted by Tachyeon
I agree US has done some bad things but its nice to know that in the USA you can write your post and give your opinions without being drug out of your house the next day and shot. True we don't have the best government and there is always room for improvement but at least we can make the changes and for the most part our vote counts. Even though I don't always agree with my government I love my country plus all my stuff is here. So let sum it up for anyone talking crap about the USA get used to it, we bringing the new world order Beastie Boy Style.

And you can't work out why they don't like you!

It is getting harder and harder every day to see the USA in a favorable light.

as for
"but its nice to know that in the USA you can write your post and give your opinions without being drug out of your house the next day and shot"
enjoy free speech in the FEMA camps.

To be honest everyone comes to USA from another country likes it here. They like the freedom of speech, religion, own property, etc. We lets tons of people in each year running away from there country. So instead of bringing them all here Why don't we just take over there country install Democracy and they don't have to leave simple as that. Makes things lot easier if we have 300 states plus no customs to deal with after landing sweet.

Excellent thread, my friend!

Unfortunately, logic and reason is lacking in a lot of people and many won't grasp the message behind your post. But I did, and I thank you for presenting such a thorough piece.

Star for you! I would flag too if I could, but I'm still new.....

Bravo ATS for putting up the fake Blocked logo in this thread. ATS is using this post to make a great point.

reply to post by seenavv


Chetori Seenav,
Best current post on ATS.
Thats all I have to say about that.
Good Luck.

PEACE,
RK

reply to post by seenavv


Have to disagree 100%! The Iranian leader is a lunatic who fuels the extremists and treats many of his own people like dirt as covered on many different ATS threads. Has not changed my mind any. I do have sympathy for the average Iranian but they have no one else to blame but their leaders. Sounds like typical ATS "Pro-Iranian" propaganda.

reply to post by seenavv


Good for you brother!

Originally posted by Rocky Black
reply to post by seenavv

 

If Iran has all the oil and gas reserves and so much money and pipeline and export money.

Why do they need nuklear power.

How about some wind technologies.

I would have to guess, that they need something to rely upon, whilst developing more efficient means of achieving clean energy. I wouldn't say they won't develop something other than nuclear power, but it might just not yet be in their cards - as it is, we have gone through fossil fuels, nuclear energy, and now ever sooooo sloooowly developing our own tech for clean energy, but you don't see us slowing down with our nuke plants, or refineries.

I would also think that if the Iranians had the choice of getting off the oil/gas bandwagon, and then selling off all or most of their reserves, would probably be a pretty cool thought to Iran if they could pull it off, wouldn't you?

Iran has the right to Nuclear power.

On the topic of Nuclear Weapons -

Several countries have Nuclear weapons, as you are no doubt aware, including some of Iran's most vocal opponents, the U.S.A., not to mention various other NATO countries. That's not all though, there are even some countries in their own neighborhood, Israel, India, Pakistan. Some during or after the signing of the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear weapons treaty (namely the latter three). Israel does not out right admit they have them, but it is a pretty widely suspected that they do, one believer in this in non other than the American government.

Why can Iran not have them, when so many other countries, including their neighbors, and their enemies have them? OH RIGHT, that's what we like to call "DOUBLE STANDARDS."

You want ISREAL wiped off the map

I think you missed the part of history/the thread, where it was deduced that this was nothing more than the West twisting words said by others, into a meaning of their own very biased interpretation.

well we shall all be wiped off the map someday as we are the poison that is inhabiting and destroying this earth buy our drilling deep into the earth crust and sucking all the oil out.

Well how about all the water that is contaminated and all the poision we spew on the earth.

Doesn't matter as when it happens it happens.

Well, here you and I can agree. However, I think anybody in their own sane mind, realizes that Iran has nothing specifically to do with that problem, it's more so the blame of.. Religious extremists/bigots both foreign and domestic.

Originally posted by Acetradamus
how can some of you be so narrow minded...

(yes im pointing AGAIN at the americans)

..
imagine just having finished school..
you are on your way home with your best friend..
suddenly he gets torn apart by some predator drone...what would happen to you?
my guess is becoming radical.....driven by hate and revenge..and why wouldnt you..its perfectly normal..i would do it...

so it is basically like this for every citizen killed you create at least ONE more radical..

..viscious cycle

Because the US Military just targets random people in attacks..? Think again, that's the suicide bombers and car bombs that we deal with every day in Afghanistan. Random killings are from the other side, we do everything in our power to make our kills precision.

Originally posted by Rocky Black
reply to post by n00bUK

 

There we go screaming about stealing resources.

Like IRaq and KOSOVO and the like.

Doubt it pal.

We steal nothing.

We liberate.

Make free.

Someday you may be free from oppression..

If you lucky.

Yea... well... you know... that's just like... your opinion man...

I never felt I was liberating anything or freeing anyone of someone else's oppression - we did traded their oppression for our kind of oppression... does that count for you as "liberating"?

Originally posted by Drunkenparrot

Originally posted by seenavv

2. But, but Ahmadinejad is a bad bad man! I don't want that fool in control of a nuclear weapon especially after he said he wants to wipe Israel off the map!

Ahmadinejad is no saint, far from it, but he never made such a statement. Most Iranians despise him greatly and think he is a puppet mouthpiece. But to deliberately misconstrue statements made by him and use it for war propaganda doesn't make him any more evil then you think he is


To quote his exact words in Farsi:

Imam ghoft een rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad.

I will tell you from my personal understanding of Farsi the word "map" does DOES NOT EVEN EXIST in this famous, misinterpreted statement

Direct, literal, Non-Zionist translation:

The Imam said this regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time

You are arguing semantics.

Wiped off the map, vanish from the page of time.

Same meaning, same implication.

No, it is not mere semantics.
The OP points out a lying mistranslation which is used for base propaganda. And he made it clear he does NOT support Ahmadinedjad's government or the Theocracy.

To "wipe Israel off the map" would mean to me that the CIVILIAN population of Israel should be annihilated. It would furthermore imply that whoever says this would want to take an active role in that.

The hope that the "regime occupying Jerusalem" would "vanish from the page of time," quoted clearly from the former religious leader (and NOT being a statement made by Ahmadinedjad himself) means only that he hopes that the extremist, far-right leaders of Israel would sooner or later go away - which any sane Jewish person also hopes for.

It is unworthy of a nation founded in the Enlightenment era to found warmongering propaganda on deliberate distortions and lies. How are we supposed to handle reality if all we face is lies?

To make an imaginary comparison, suppose the leader of Poland in 1939 had quoted the Pope as saying that "the regime occupying Berlin would vanish from the page of time." Controversial, but clearly not a casus belli. If the same leader of Poland would have said "We want to wipe Germany off the map," that would have been a statement of aggression against the entire civilization of Germany, a bloodthristy call for war.

Originally posted by phatpackage
reply to post by seenavv

 

Have to disagree 100%! The Iranian leader is a lunatic who fuels the extremists and treats many of his own people like dirt as covered on many different ATS threads. Has not changed my mind any. I do have sympathy for the average Iranian but they have no one else to blame but their leaders. Sounds like typical ATS "Pro-Iranian" propaganda.

That's an interesting position to take Phatpackage.

You are saying that you disagree with what seenaw has clearly shown to be the truth. You are proclaiming, in essence, that you prefer to be seen as a knee jerk mindless jingoistic muppet. Correct me if I misunderstand your post.

DEFINITION: Jingoism: Extreme nationalism characterized especially by a belligerent foreign policy; chauvinistic patriotism.

Question:

Lately I began wondering if Ahmadinedjad's government actually could already have purchased some nuclear weapons on the black market. Clearly they could have gotten some from Pakistan (Khan is rather secretive and Pakistan even moves its own warheads around constantly), or Russia. Although it is not known in history that either of those countries knowingly supplied nuclear weapons to any others, as far as I know, some nuclear materials HAVE disappeared from Russia when chaos was bigger after the system change. As opposed as these powers are to the coming Western aggression, they might actually intervene. China said so and many Russians are also angry.

At this point basic science and serious intelligence maintains Iran is still incapable to develop its own nuclear devices for years and years to come. (This kind of uranium cannot be used for bombs at all.) The IAEA report last fall merely questioned if only peaceful developments are targeted in the far future, not in the present. I remember reading an Israeli analyst that outlined a possible timeframe of a decade or more (a few years ago). Leon Panetta said recently there is no evidence of warlike nuclear development - as I am sure you all heard.

So this question is only speculative, but it may be important. (Intelligence agencies also speculate a lot.)

Originally posted by AnimositisominA
Yes, you are right on many points.
There is just something that I cannot overlook.
The west negatively effected your family and your homeland.
What do you and your family do? You move to the west. Then, living off the fruits of corruption and blood of your own family and homeland, you condemn the west. Does this bother you?

I actually enjoyed your post. You clarified a few things that I was wondering about. Somewhere between your version of events and the reasons tensions are so high, I believe is the truth.

I personally had no say in where we decided to go.. the main thing for the family was to go somewhere that was safe for the family environment, that is all they desired. After the last regime overthrow my family just couldn't take it anymore. Their assets and wealth were stolen/ looted from them in the midst of the transition and with what they had left, they fled to Canada and we've been here ever since. I have been in and out of the states for a few years to live with family friends but grew up in Canada. Now I understand it may seem a little hypocritical to condemn the actions of the west. It does sadden me very much, but my family were just ordinary, honest citizens looking for somewhere safe to live and I think it is fair to exercise our rights here to speak on behalf of what we believe is right in attempt to make a better world for everyone

Originally posted by Magnificient
reply to post by seenavv

 

Nothing you said made any sense. You made a big thing over the map translation, but map was actually correct. How can Israel be removed from the pages of time without being removed from the map? In any non-Muslim mind, pages of time = map, at least in the sense that it was used in your post.

I favor a war with Iran even if it leads to Armageddon and I don't even like Jews.

The correct translation states the imam wants the regime occupying Jerusalem to vanish from the pages of time

that is completely different then calling for the wiping of Israel off the map

I have explained this in further detail in my previous posts: www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

The Imam didn't say "I would like to see"... he said "the regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the pages of time"...
That statement is another way of saying "we must wipe Israel off the map"...

IT IS THE SAME THING...

No it's not. I'm pretty sure during the Cold War the west wanted to wipe communism from the pages of time. It did not mean they wanted to wipe Russia off the map.

But you keep coming to your own conclusions. I take it you wont be fighting over there in Iran. Just cheerleading for others to risk their lives on your behalf. Very noble.

reply to post by dubiousone

You are proclaiming, in essence, that you prefer to be seen as a knee jerk mindless jingoistic muppet.

Well I accept "Jingoistic" as a valid term (I do not believe I am that is your opinion. And it is only an opinion not proof) but to use terms like "Mindless", "Muppet" and being "Knee Jerk" reactive is proof you have no tolerance to others opinions just because they differ from yours or the OP. It is decidedly rude. You obviously have no defense as you resort to insults as a first measure. I am sure your parents are so proud of your lack of tolerance for people to express opinion different to your own.

The truth be told Iran has dug themselves into this hole for a few years now. The Western and Israeli governments concerned have actually been extremely patient and restrained when it comes to Iran. If they were taking a "Knee Jerk" stance with Iran they would have declared war a few years ago. They have been patient in the extreme. This is shown by taking the sanctions route first instead of war.

ATS is full of Iranian sympathisers who if they ever went to the country they so blindly defend would be eaten alive by the extremists they promote. No doubt about it. They do it to their own "Average Joe" citizens.

Originally posted by WhiteHatYou are a real Iranian...
Then why not give us some first hand impression about those people's life, what they think about their ruling regime, about their nuclear program, about the western reaction, what are their hopes and wishes for the future. How they live and what they fear most. Honestly.
But you wouldn't know that, because you live comfortably in a western country, have no idea what oppression means and your only source of "truth" is the same as ours, western mass media. And ATS propaganda.

If that's what you expected to hear in this thread I'm sorry. My intention in terms of the "whole situation" was to discuss the recent political and economical tension that has been building in the past few years (peaking in the past few months), providing some history, and addressing the root causes of certain issues in the region


I do have insight as to the current life of people in Iran at the moment. It is very difficult ever since the sanctions (which are an act of war in my opinion) began to be imposed

Since the enactment of the sanctions:
-The price of fuel at the pump has increased by over 10 fold
-All foods are more expensive then they are here in Canada
-Inflation, corruption, theft, and murder rates are at the highest they have ever been in decades
-People are very unhappy with the regime. However they do not desire a regime overthrow at this time because they understand it is not the right time, and acknowledge the risk of a transition being hijacked by western special interests
-In the midst of these shortcomings, people are still generally happy in their daily lives and the large majority are still able to meet their basic needs

I gather the above information from the past few years from talking to family and family-friends in Iran

Western powers are after the regime of Iran to achieve total and indefinite domination of the middle east to further their plans of establishing their New World Order, which is the real enemy of humanity, not the ordinary citizens of the nations of this world!


This is so fake that made me laugh. But I imagine it brought you some flags right on the spot.

The New World Order conspiracy is no laughable matter. It is obvious you have not done any research into the conspiracy.... there is an abundance of information on it on this website that I highly suggest you look into

Yet the part that I found hilarious is this:


"My family has directly suffered many decades because of the harrasment the west has brought upon Iran. Their lives were shaken.. "


But then you so conveniently found refuge in America....

I have followed up on a similar response here please read: www.abovetopsecret.com...