9/11: A Boeing 757 Struck the Pentagon

Originally posted by Caustic Logic ...that wad of electrical tape could represent a tailfin... ...I've asked you for evidence of that and have yet to see it. You showed me one column on the second floor...

That's funny you asking me for evidence. Where's your evidence a 757 hit the pentagoon. Where's your evidence that the parts found (or planted) where from flight 77? Not sure what you mean by 'wad of electrical tape'? But if you watch the video you can see the 'part' going up and over the pentagoon. And it looks suspiciously like the tail assembly and engine mount of a Global Hawk. I'm not saying it was a Global Hawk, but it looks nothing like a 757 stab assembly.... As far as the wall, imo whatever made the hole exploded inside pushing the walls outward. Yes like a missile, or other small craft carrying explosives. What's this about the second floor? I have never made that comment. I see columns on the ground floor pushed out, where the wings and engines supposedly hit, which as you know would have put the engine shrouds on the ground. Yet we have no lawn damage at all. There is one pic of what looks like an engine with a tarp on it. If that is an engine, and as a jet engine mech for 6 yrs it sure looks like one to me, it sure ain't no turbo-fan from a 757.

I believe this is the photo of the engine you are talking about. I have been trying to match it with other engines but its hard because you do not see that much of it. i22.photobucket.com... [edit on 18-5-2007 by ULTIMA1]

Originally posted by ANOK That's funny you asking me for evidence. Where's your evidence a 757 hit the pentagoon.

Umm, from 213 pages back up to the last post. And everywhere else. PROOF? Apparently not for you. But evidence abounds as you know

Where's your evidence that the parts found (or planted) where from flight 77?

I can't prove that without precise ID paperwork, which could also be forged. Flight 77 is not so much the question as 757, or at least something of the same scale, similar-looking model type (Airbus 320 some thought) with similar landing gear and painted w/AA standards.

Not sure what you mean by 'wad of electrical tape'?

Your enlarged tail section sillhouette - I thot I was being funny nevermind.

But if you watch the video you can see the 'part' going up and over the pentagoon. And it looks suspiciously like the tail assembly and engine mount of a Global Hawk. I'm not saying it was a Global Hawk, but it looks nothing like a 757 stab assembly....

Honestly it don't look like much of anything identifiable to me. And Global Hawk is about the dumbest theory that fits about no evidence, so props on not necessarily buying it.

As far as the wall, imo whatever made the hole exploded inside pushing the walls outward. Yes like a missile, or other small craft carrying explosives.

Well that makes more sense than bomb only and no plane. Can't rule that out, some say it was a plane bomb that exploded just before impact, maybe it blew up again - the explosion of jet fuel seems not focused enough to blow columns outward. But did they blow outward?

What's this about the second floor? I have never made that comment. I see columns on the ground floor pushed out, where the wings and engines supposedly hit

Yes that's what you said, and I asked for a picture and you posted this (actually in response to Dark Blue Sky):

This picture is from a de-bunking site (yes I do read those too). I do not buy there comments. You can clearly see columns knocked to the left and out wards.

and this picture of the second floor after collapse. That's still the closest I've seen to substantiation of outward columns. ref: www.abovetopsecret.com... The columns you might mean are 15-17a - seem to be pushed to the left according to the ASCE (which would just about bar a 757 IMO), and completely destroyed according to me and replaced with falling horizontal elements no longer held up. Again with this picture: Are these them? Is this out? Or straight down at a lateral angle? And why these just damaged and tilted while those to the left were obliterated? (this is a Q for both you and the ASCE). The plane's low altitude, you say,

would have put the engine shrouds on the ground. Yet we have no lawn damage at all.

So I guess that would make them just above ground level, wouldn't it?

There is one pic of what looks like an engine with a tarp on it. If that is an engine, and as a jet engine mech for 6 yrs it sure looks like one to me, it sure ain't no turbo-fan from a 757.

It's a ring type thing maybe from an engine on an orange thing or something. Me trying to be funny again: [edit on 19-5-2007 by Caustic Logic] [edit on 19-5-2007 by Caustic Logic]

I got this pic from Blackvault showing "something hit the Pentagon and looks like it is not a plane..I do not have image editing and hope this pic shows but it seemed to me as if it looks like a missle.

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Sorry Nico, not just you, but... I AM SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING THIS LOOKS LIKE A MISSLE! Please, anyone, outline features on this and give me an ID of missile type. Please account for angle of flight, true size of a 757, the compression and frame rate of the video, the fisheye effect of the lens, and the possibility that the Pentagon messed with it to make us think it's a missile. You know what it looks like to me? A blob of white pixels. I've looke closer and can see either a 757 or a giant ghost albatross. Or a missile or a potato. Please, ignore the video, or back up your missile observations with some OTHER evidence that a missile hit the building. Surely there must be some other sign, in the eyewitness pool, the physical damage, the projectile parts, etc... (ps I've pretty much seen them all and remain unconvinced)

Originally posted by Caustic Logic I AM SICK OF PEOPLE SAYING THIS LOOKS LIKE A MISSLE! Please, anyone, outline features on this and give me an ID of missile type. Please account for angle of flight, true size of a 757, the compression and frame rate of the video, the fisheye effect of the lens, and the possibility that the Pentagon messed with it to make us think it's a missile.

You do know their was a police report in the 911 commission report of a missile being fired at the towers from the Woolworth buidling and thier are phtos of damage to the roof of the Woolworth building ? So why couldn't their have been a missile fired at the Pentagon. In fact if i wanted to hit the Pentagon and knew the walls were reinforced concrete and Kevlar i would use a missile to make sure to get through the wall and then maybe fly a plane in after the hole was made.

To try to insist that a 757 hit the Pentagon and created that little hole with no patrs of the huge Aircraft visible on the front lawn is a stretch. But, when We look at the absolute disturbing behavior of the Whitehouse on this Day and the Stare that Bush is ensconsed in the Class Room that His Historic Fate was sealed that Day when He let a sick and insignificant band of Men decide the Fate of Thousand's working the in Twin Tower's that were dropped. Hell will receive them all with open Arm's' Bush, Cheney, Wolfowitz, Pearle, Feith, Bolton, Abrahms, Rice and the Ill rest of PNAC. History will sort out the facts but the People know this Iraq War was for Money and Oil control. The dispensing of a few thousand in the Twin Towers was in the Manifesto of the PNAC group that insisted a event like a new Pearl Harbor would galvinize the People to rally for a War oof vengance for striking America. Saddly, this is in writing from the fingers of Paul Wolfowitz and the Project for a New American Century. Treasonous Criminals everyone of them. Wake up America.

I give up. I'd tell people to please read or scan the OP, but they do and first thing they see is a tiny 16-foot hole with no marks. I cannot defend this thread any more. No matter what Cat Herder said or showed, a 757 knocked a 90ft wide, 30ft high hole in the Pentagon. Please see here and couble-check before repeating this "fact." frustratingfraud.blogspot.com... I've been wide awake for entirely too long.

Originally posted by Caustic Logic I give up. I'd tell people to please read or scan the OP, but they do and first thing they see is a tiny 16-foot hole with no marks.

But where are the holes caused by the engines, (1 engine found outside)and where is the debris that should be there. A lot of parts from the plane would have survived the crash and fire but we do not see any photos of them. Also we do not have a FBI and NTSB crime scene report that matches the parts found to flight 77.

Nice job on the thread,you have convinced me that a plane did hit.. But how could such in experienced pilots pull this off..they didnt just suck but they couldnt even handle a single engine cessna....their flight instructors even made nots on there progress reports about how bad they were.

Originally posted by iwilldefend To try to insist that a 757 hit the Pentagon and created that little hole with no patrs of the huge Aircraft visible on the front lawn is a stretch. But, when We look at the absolute disturbing behavior of the Whitehouse on this Day and the Stare that Bush is ensconsed in the Class Room that His Historic Fate was sealed that Day when He let a sick and insignificant band of Men decide the Fate of Thousand's working the in Twin Tower's that were dropped. Hell will receive them all with open Arm's' Bush, Cheney, Wolfowitz, Pearle, Feith, Bolton, Abrahms, Rice and the Ill rest of PNAC. History will sort out the facts but the People know this Iraq War was for Money and Oil control. The dispensing of a few thousand in the Twin Towers was in the Manifesto of the PNAC group that insisted a event like a new Pearl Harbor would galvinize the People to rally for a War oof vengance for striking America. Saddly, this is in writing from the fingers of Paul Wolfowitz and the Project for a New American Century. Treasonous Criminals everyone of them. Wake up America.

amen brother..amen

*wrong* cordite smell. *wrong* damaged taxi, and driver story. *wrong* eyewitness testimony given in the brave and diligent research that went into "the pentacon". *wrong* exit hole in c-ring. *wrong* TONS of photoshopped images of the aftermath. *wrong* to not show clear video of event, STIIIILLLLLLL, despite nearly a hundred cameras watching!!! pretty much a whole lot of *wrong*. A + B = B + A, not A + B = WHATEVER I TELL YOU! add in "the rest of the official lie stink to high heaven of a massive cover-up" for flavour.

Originally posted by billybob *wrong* cordite smell. *wrong* damaged taxi, and driver story. *wrong* eyewitness testimony given in the brave and diligent research that went into "the pentacon". *wrong* exit hole in c-ring. *wrong* TONS of photoshopped images of the aftermath. *wrong* to not show clear video of event, STIIIILLLLLLL, despite nearly a hundred cameras watching!!! pretty much a whole lot of *wrong*. A + B = B + A, not A + B = WHATEVER I TELL YOU! add in "the rest of the official lie stink to high heaven of a massive cover-up" for flavour.

nice man,If nothing odd happend then why the secrecy,why keep these 911 "myths" going instead of just giving us a real video?why why why why

Originally posted by project_pisces Hate to tell you but a 757 fusealage, you know that tube where you sit that keeps ya safe at 38k feet? No way it could punch a perfect hole that deep into the Pentagon. I dont care if it was traveling at Mach3 Look at that cookie cutter perfect hole

I concur wholeheartedly. The hole is just too clean. I've always been bothered that there was never any good video of this and that to me is a red flag.

Caustic Logic, the photo you posted does not show a jet engine.. no plane crashed at the Pentagon. 911review.org... An article on rense detailing how Karl.S has jumped to conclusions based upon inaccurate visual analysis.. such as the "blue tarp" hiding a plane wing, which is nothing more than a tent for recovery operations. There is no visual evidence to suggest anything crashed at the Pentagon. Take a hint from the Shanksville event.. The Pentagon incident is smoke and mirrors. The truth is more simple than you realise.

Originally posted by Caustic Logic frustratingfraud.blogspot.com... I've been wide awake for entirely too long.

That site is a little miss-leading. Can you really see the hole they are claiming? All I see is a 18' (or so) hole and a lot of facade around it pushed outwards, not inwards. Looks like an explosion on the inside pushed it out. Sry but you can get as frustrated as you like its not going to make that a real hole that a 757 went through, and conveniently cleaned up its own mess...

Originally posted by ANOK Sry but you can get as frustrated as you like its not going to make that a real hole that a 757 went through, and conveniently cleaned up its own mess...

Sorry but buying into the Pentacon rubbish does NOT dismiss this: Steve Anderson: Location: his office on the 19th floor of the USA TODAY building in Arlington, with a view of Arlington Cemetery, Crystal City, the Pentagon, National Airport and the Potomac River. Testimony:

Shortly after watching the second tragedy, I heard jet engines pass our building, which, being so close to the airport is very common. But I thought the airport was closed. I figured it was a plane coming in for landing. A few moments later, as I was looking down at my desk, the plane caught my eye. It didn't register at first. I thought to myself that I couldn't believe the pilot was flying so low. Then it dawned on me what was about to happen. I watched in horror as the plane flew at treetop level, banked slightly to the left, drug it's wing along the ground and slammed into the west wall of the Pentagon exploding into a giant orange fireball. Then black smoke. Then white smoke.

www.jmu.edu... Deb Anlauf Location:14th-floor room in the Sheraton National Hotel in Arlington Testimony:

Anlauf was watching TV coverage of the Trade Center burning shortly before 9:30 a.m. when she decided to return to her 14th-floor room from another part of the hotel. Once in her room, she heard a "loud roar" and looked out the window to see what was going on. "Suddenly I saw this plane right outside my window," Anlauf said during a telephone interview from her hotel room this morning. "You felt like you could touch it; it was that close. It was just incredible. "Then it shot straight across from where we are and flew right into the Pentagon. It was just this huge fireball that crashed into the wall (of the Pentagon). When it hit, the whole hotel shook."

www.leadertelegram.com... also see: Also see AP wire 9/12 & 9/13 Gary Bauer Location: driving into Washington DC Testimony:

“I was in a massive traffic jam, hadn’t moved more than a hundred yards in twenty minutes. My office called to tell me about the first plane in New York, the reaction was ‘horrible accident.’ And then they called about the second plane, and clearly that meant something much worse was going on. It was only then that I really noticed where I was in that traffic jam. I was going past the Pentagon, really inching a yard or so every couple of minutes. I had just passed the closest place the Pentagon is to the exit on 395 . . . when all of a sudden I heard the roar of a jet engine. I looked at the woman sitting in the car next to me. She had this startled look on her face. We were all thinking the same thing. We looked out the front of our windows to try to see the plane, and it wasn’t until a few seconds later that we realized the jet was coming up behind us on that major highway. And it veered to the right into the Pentagon. The blast literally rocked all of our cars. It was an incredible moment.

www.massnews.com... or his interview here: www.thecharlotteworld.com... Susan Carroll Location:platform high above Reagan waiting for a Metro Testimony:

"I was standing on the platform high above the [Washington Reagan] airport awaiting a Metro subway train to my office in the heart of the district, on Constitution Avenue, admiring the lovely blue skies when I saw the plane hit and the fireball and explosion at the Pentagon".

www.jacksonville.com... I have MANY MANY MANY more if anyone is interested some that saw the plane and heard the crash...some that heard and SAW the plane go in. Please let me know if you would like more!

So do you have the witness account that saw the wings folding? And do you believe that those wings Folded? Its a simple yes or no answer. Did they fold? Yes or no?

Glad to see you guys still hashing away at this. Keep digging and you'll find more "discrepancies," "questions," etc. Doesn't even matter if they line up, offer a rational alternative, or anything. Just keep doubt on the 757 no matter what, no matter how much you have to ignore. 90-foot hole. Plenty of plane parts, if not every scrap. All the eyewitnesses with two main themes -there was a big AA 757 - it flew INTO the building and then stopped... Can we at least admit it's a possibility?

Originally posted by piacenza So do you have the witness account that saw the wings folding? And do you believe that those wings Folded? Its a simple yes or no answer. Did they fold? Yes or no?

Dude... witnesses said they heard and then SAW a plane...THEN saw it CRASH INTO the Pentagon. End of conspiracy... spin it any way you want. Not ONE witness claimed a "flyover" and not one witness said it was definatley a missel. (one guy a mile away said it looked like one) So the missel theory and the pentacon mess are BOTH non stories!!