9/11: A Boeing 757 Struck the Pentagon

the first page of this post is all ANY person with even below average smarts would need to prove that a plane DID in fact crash into the pentagon . this is the best thread in respect to research ive seen here on ats . thank god and the poster !

Cat herder has not being here since AGES.....and yes after 210 pages the jury is still out... so does many unexplained things, but hey everyone is free to believe, even if evidence points to the contrary...

Originally posted by gen.disaray the first page of this post is all ANY person with even below average smarts would need to prove that a plane DID in fact crash into the pentagon . this is the best thread in respect to research ive seen here on ats . thank god and the poster !

You should read this.... Evidence That a Frozen Fish Didn’t Impact the Pentagon on 9/11

And then this! Joe Quinn: Booby Trap or Just a Boob? frustratingfraud.blogspot.com... rike-back.html

Originally posted by kix Cat herder has not being here since AGES.....and yes after 210 pages the jury is still out... so does many unexplained things, but hey everyone is free to believe, even if evidence points to the contrary...

CH's no longer being active here is exactly how relevant to what? The jury is still out only becuase there is NO jusry selection process whatsoever. YOU are on the jury for God' sake. And Me. Such a "jury" could never get anything done, which is where your metaphor breaks down. Yes, everyone's free to believe whatever, no matter where the evidence points. And since I promised no more posts on "Realtruth's" thread, here is more of your gray paint: Maybe you're right after all, but that's some pretty shiny ass paint I'd say... [edit on 19-3-2007 by Caustic Logic]

The gray appearance could not have been possibly caused by reflection It MUST be paint!![/sarcasm] Face it Caustic, telling most of these guys that a plane hit the pentagon is like telling water to not be wet. it's just not gonna work. [edit on 3/19/2007 by ShAuNmAn-X]

Yeah they've all had their chances. This is just for anyone else reading, in case anything they say is mistaken for credible. That thread I've abandoned to the mystery funsters. This one I'll defend. Grrrrr.

Originally posted by Caustic Logic Yeah they've all had their chances. This is just for anyone else reading, in case anything they say is mistaken for credible. That thread I've abandoned to the mystery funsters. This one I'll defend. Grrrrr.

I'm right here with ya man. I still love that "gray" paint in the photos. Priceless, truly priceless. I want to find gray paint with that much reflectivity. Imagine how many fake pieces of jewelery or fake knives and such I could sell. I'd make a killing [edit on 3/19/2007 by ShAuNmAn-X]

Caustic, I am shocked that you would resort to posting pictures of obviously planted aircraft parts.

I am still waiting for the FBI and NTSB reports that match the parts found at the Pentagon to flight 77.

And I am still waiting for you to get over it! Nah, just kidding. Keep waiting, man. Someone on high seems to love the mystery.

Originally posted by darkbluesky Caustic, I am shocked that you would resort to posting pictures of obviously planted aircraft parts.

It's advance advertising for me and Shaunman's new jewelry line - as seen at the Pentagon on 9/11! [edit on 20-3-2007 by Caustic Logic]

Originally posted by ULTIMA1 I am still waiting for the FBI and NTSB reports that match the parts found at the Pentagon to flight 77.

Ultima, Don't you think if someone planted parts at the site and the FBI and NTSB investigated the site, the FBI and NTSB could damn well produce reports that proved or disproved the authenticity of the parts? If the FBI was complicit, they could have easily provided correlating proof. If the FBI was not complicit, someone within the FBI would have leaked by now, I think.

Can you post the original site of the said hotos and dates of publishing? Just a thought...for cross reference....If you posts the date and hgh resolution and exif data that can corroborate the date Ill admit I was wrong... Why? because its a pattern we haven seen here, debunkers hit a dead end and then appears "new" evidence.... please put the sites, source and date of publishing...thanks

Originally posted by kixWhy? because its a pattern we haven seen here, debunkers hit a dead end and then appears "new" evidence.... please put the sites, source and date of publishing...thanks

Kix I'd say the debunkers are the only ones posting ANY "evidence". CT'ers spawn wild theories based on, and using the very evidence the " debunkers" bring to the debate. Your claim that the fuselage fragment is grey and incorrectly riveted is the first example that comes to mind. Where is YOUR evidence... beyond that consisting of your personal opinions, and claims of disbelief? DBS

Originally posted by darkbluesky Kix I'd say the debunkers are the only ones posting ANY "evidence". CT'ers spawn wild theories based on, and using the very evidence the " debunkers" bring to the debate.

Oh i have been posting plenty of evidence. I have not seen very much evidence from the people who believe the official story that supports it. Here is some evience about how the crime scene at the Pentagon was handled. www.defenselink.mil...

WASHINGTON, Sept. 24, 2001 -- The FBI assumed crime-scene jurisdiction at the Pentagon terrorist attack site Sept. 21 from the Arlington County (Va.) Fire Department, officials said. FBI officials estimate the crime scene investigation would last about a month, Arlington Fire Chief Edward P. Plaugher said. He said he expects "additional remains will be discovered during the course of the FBI investigation" and mortuary specialists will remain on site to process them. WASHINGTON, Sept. 26, 2001 -- The FBI handed over Pentagon crash site management to the Army Military District of Washington at 7 a.m. today. The transfer of responsibility marks the end of the FBI's crime scene investigation following the Sept. 11 terrorist attack against the Pentagon. MDW will oversee ongoing security operations around the damaged area of the building. FBI investigators will move their operations to the Pentagon's north parking lot and continue to sift through debris for more evidence.

Originally posted by kix Can you post the original site of the said hotos and dates of publishing? Just a thought...for cross reference....If you posts the date and hgh resolution and exif data that can corroborate the date Ill admit I was wrong... Why? because its a pattern we haven seen here, debunkers hit a dead end and then appears "new" evidence.... please put the sites, source and date of publishing...thanks

Which photos? The ones above with plane scraps? Tey're all as valid as any others. Not "new," been there forever. It's not my fault you've never seen them before. So they might be fake? Well, you're the one who saw gray paint and now can't stomach the silver, and you're the one with questions, so Why don't you do a Google image search and see what you find. If you see good reason to doubt any let me know. Russell Pickering has at least the one with the big scrap and fireman, and his are all properly surced and very high res... okay lemme check: His site's down, no time for me to hunt it down. You can do so or continue doubting. You call. If you find more with that gray paint let me know. That might be a fake photo then...

Originally posted by ULTIMA1 Oh i have been posting plenty of evidence. I have not seen very much evidence from the people who believe the official story that supports it. Here is some evience about how the crime scene at the Pentagon was handled. www.defenselink.mil...

WASHINGTON, Sept. 24, 2001 -- The FBI assumed crime-scene jurisdiction at the Pentagon terrorist attack site Sept. 21 from the Arlington County (Va.) Fire Department, officials said. FBI officials estimate the crime scene investigation would last about a month, Arlington Fire Chief Edward P. Plaugher said. He said he expects "additional remains will be discovered during the course of the FBI investigation" and mortuary specialists will remain on site to process them. WASHINGTON, Sept. 26, 2001 -- The FBI handed over Pentagon crash site management to the Army Military District of Washington at 7 a.m. today. The transfer of responsibility marks the end of the FBI's crime scene investigation following the Sept. 11 terrorist attack against the Pentagon. MDW will oversee ongoing security operations around the damaged area of the building. FBI investigators will move their operations to the Pentagon's north parking lot and continue to sift through debris for more evidence.

Ultima, Good article, but what is it evidence of? What I get out of it is that the FBI had carte blanche at the site until 9/26 when they turned over day to day clean-up, and security to the Army. I guess one could argue that this leaves the impression that the FBI could have manipulated the investigation, but IMO, this is not evidence of anything, it's opinion, or conjecture. See...What I'm saying is there are actual photos of 757 parts at the site. Alot folks want to say they are global hawk parts, or A7 parts, or depleted uranium warhead parts, or whatever, but they can offer no proof or evidence. They say things like....There's no way a 757 made that hole....Where's the tail?....That's not enough wreckage...That's too small to be a Rolls Royce RB211 compressor rotor disc.....etc. Photos = evidence. Pieces of an airplane = evidence. FAA/ATC transcripts = evidence. FAA/ATCF radar tracking data = evidence. Opinions (professional or otherwise) = opinions. Theories (no matter how compelling and thought provoking) are still theories without proof/evidence.

I haven't been on for a while, I've been in training for Air Traffic Control for quite some time. I havent read all of the recent posts in this thread, so I am not up to date, but I do want to bring some different light on this subject. The reports indicate that the terrorists turned off the transponders on all the planes, which most people believe means that ATC could not be able to track them. This is incorrect. Radar consists of 2 components: primary, and secondary. The systems ATC uses to track targets, ie, tag them with callsigns and verify altitudes, is connected to the secondary radar. The transponder sends signals that are interpreted by the interpretor (originao name) which then is decoded and the infromation is updated every sweep. when the transponder is turned off, secondary radar fails to work. Now, Primary radar is different. It is like a ping system that is able to produce a blip on the scope, with no information on it. There are very extensive procedures that are undertaken when a track is dropped and only primary radar is used. There are also many different ATC facilities that would have to have handled all the flights from the point that they lost comms, to the point of their crashings. You honestly think that all of these facilities, all the controllers, all the supervisors, would not speak up if they knew the official story was false? And, by official, I mean the general notion that flight 77 hit the pentagon. Sorry, there is just too many people that would need to be involved for a conspiracy to happen, especially with so many random people involved.

Originally posted by darkbluesky Ultima, Good article, but what is it evidence of? What I get out of it is that the FBI had carte blanche at the site until 9/26 when they turned over day to day clean-up, and security to the Army. Photos = evidence. Pieces of an airplane = evidence. FAA/ATC transcripts = evidence. FAA/ATCF radar tracking data = evidence.

Well 2 main things come up with the crime scene. 1. The FBI did not officially take over the scene as a crime scene for 10 days, lots of evidence was moved or contaminated. 2. After the FBI stated it would take 30 days to complete the crime scene they handed it back over to the military in only 5 days. As for the photos of parts we have no name of who took them, no date and time taken or where they were taken. As far as the pieces of plane we have no report of them matching a 757 or flight 77. As far as radar tracking flight 77 was off radar for several minutes and air traffic controllers lost track of it for several more minutes.

Originally posted by Mouth I haven't been on for a while, I've been in training for Air Traffic Control for quite some time. I havent read all of the recent posts in this thread, so I am not up to date, but I do want to bring some different light on this subject.

And the rest... Welcome back! I just started just the thread for you just before I saw this, can ya believe it? Radar tracking questions... www.abovetopsecret.com... =#pid3051934 If ya didn't see it already. Yes, I agree the official story - physically at least - as anyone here will tell you. The most recent craze in The PentaCon's flyover maneuver, Dick Eastman rcycled without the fighter jet, all bldg damage with on-site bombs or whatever, they don't know. I agree, that for the plane to fly over, its radar signal would continue too. Eyewitnesses might well see it, def. hear it, and radar controllers would see it all. Flyover supporters respond that they have been silenced, and beyond our reach. If you asked they'd sy the off story cause the whole scam depends on their silence, etc. Cooouuuld be...