OWS: ATS has your opinion changed?

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
I know. I altered the question. Did you want an answer or were you hoping for survey results of "Yes / no / don't know"?

At this point does it matter? I prefer your rantings as they are. All jumbled and incoherent I also prefer my eggs sunny side up as well

You know alcohol kills brain cells way faster than smashing your own head against a wall, right?

I'm sure you're speaking from experience there. I'll take your word on it.

I'm strongly against it as it's a movement controlled by the Globalist Bankers. They engineered the crisis, now they are engineering this movement, the best thing everyone can do is to just to ignore OWS, as people have said before, it's a trap.

They are drawing our pawns out from around the king; they want a quick end game.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
At this point does it matter? I prefer your rantings as they are. All jumbled and incoherent I also prefer my eggs sunny side up as well

Maybe I SHOULD cut back on the Lee Camp stuff tonight...

Anyway. As presented the only answer was "no." Not very interesting or informative about anything, is it?

I'm sure you're speaking from experience there. I'll take your word on it.

No, I've never smashed my own head into a wall. You're on your own there.

reply to post by jameshawkings


Do elaborate, please. I'd like to know what... strategy you're seeing at work here. It sounds complex! So please feel free to gimme lots of text on it.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox



Thank you for answering.

reply to post by ILikeStars




Great rebuttal.
Now, what do you propose and how shall we proceed?

As a European I have a different view, I guess.
But for the question: Yes, reading ATS has changed my view of OWS.

At first I thought: Wow! The American people DO have a political consciousness and they ARE ready and able to go out and voice their opinions. It really looked as if the US was more than a two-party system and if there was a political thinking beyond black and white.

But then all those threads and posts popped up, full of fear and hate, people talking about communism and fascism in the same line, criminalizing and slandering their countrymen, talking about "trouble" they don't want to have...

Now I am convinced that the people in the street are rather the 1%, who is ready to stand up for the 99%, but 98% prefer to sit at home, complaining about this evil world and damning everyone, who disturbs their little peace between tv and pc.

"Don't tread on me" can be interpreted in two ways.

These silly systems we use in our civilization collapse quite frequently. I really got to see that when spending hours going back through family lineages and studying each person's history.

I don't see why everyone is worried. We can have a better society after this crappy one goes down the drain.

reply to post by SLAYER69


I'm split on OWS. I like the idea, I like the protests but when I look at a list of demands, it's empty. I know it's not, but that's what a lot of people see. I feel that their "word" has been spread, they're not doing much good now and are in fact hurting their image.

But that's my opinion. But when it boils down to "OWS VS Them", I'm with OWS.

Originally posted by Siddharta


But then all those threads and posts popped up, full of fear and hate, people talking about communism and fascism in the same line, criminalizing and slandering their countrymen, talking about "trouble" they don't want to have...

Hmmm,

Are you talking about the Threads where Pro-OWS supporters were calling for revolution,sometimes violently?

Because thats change most Americans dont want,hence the 98% that sit at home,and wait for some clarity of a movement,that will actually have ONE message that they can rally behind. Its not hard to talk about communists,socialists,fascists,when there ARE those elements at OWS,but clearly,you forgot to point that out,unless you didnt happen to see it,or actually go to a protest rally.

I assume Europe knows all to well what change is though,because they are soon to embark on the wonderful journey of it,and hopefully wont be doomed to the countless changes that have occurred there throughout the ages.Violently at times.

Many in Europe also forget the melting pot of America was once a haven from the oppression there.

Yup, my opinion has changed.

In the beginning, I was convinced that a majority of the OWS protestors were sincere, well-meaning people who had their hearts in the right places, but couldn't quite figure out where their asses ought to be to get the job done.

In one of my very first posts on the subject, I even stated that I'd go to war if they were fired upon.

Now, after two months of their antics, I think differently. I believe the whole thing is rotten to the core, every man-jack among them. I wouldn't piss on their heads if their hair was on fire.

It doesn't matter what you say to them, what suggestions you offer for a peaceful resolution of their grievances, some of which are valid. They're just not having any of that "resolution" business. They act as if they are obtuse, and just can't understand what you are saying, no matter how simplistically you say it. The fact is, they DO understand, but resolution is not their objective, nor is peace or liberty.

If any of those were the objectives, they would be pursuing them.

They look at you with doe eyes and wring their hands and say "butbutbut we can't DO that!" for any solution offered. Fine. Don't. "Can't" never did a damn thing. Keep doing what you're doing, keep hanging with the associates you choose, and don't expect any help from this quarter when it goes ablaze.

Once, not so long ago, I would have went to war if OWS had been fired upon. Now, I could care less if they get nuked. I wouldn't even look up from making my sandwich.

I'm about done with these OWS threads, and I'll bet there are several here who will be glad to hear that. Instead, I'll just sit back and get my stuff ready to defend the real People when OWS goes on the march against them. I'm done talking.

Yes my opinion has somewhat changed:
- From moderately opposing these people, to radically objecting to these sheeple!

Mostly I ignore them, but I can understand the rage of the Residents, and Police Forces, that have to deal with this assortment of losers, socialist/communist, Obamanoid garbage gone wild.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by jameshawkings

 

Do elaborate, please. I'd like to know what... strategy you're seeing at work here. It sounds complex! So please feel free to gimme lots of text on it.

Thanks for asking, here you are:-

This is Norman Dodd (RIP), he spent his life investigating the Tax Exempt Foundations, eventually he found that it is them that deliberately cause war. They cause war to change the way we live, they want to eventually lead us into communism as this will give the people behind the foundations a monopoly. They are doing all of this for their own benefit.


The tax exempt Lucis Trust were caught registering one of the OWS websites, they obviously didn't know that someone could easily look up the owner lalternativaitalia.blogspot.com...

Fluoride makes people docile, that's why it's been added to the US water supply for many years. However, on this occasion they want a (controlled) revolution, so they need the people to take action. Hence earlier this year U.S. lowers limits for fluoride in water

Some of the major tax exempt foundations are behind these two bizarre MTV (Martial Law) adverts; they are preparing the the young people of today for what they have planned. In particular, they are teaching them to comply, by demonstrating what they have to do in specific situations.


Rockefeller's UN will take over. There are thousands of UN vehicles in the US, prepared for when the time comes i.e. mass evacuations/relocation


Here is a map showing where Americans will and won't be allowed to live. If you are currently in a red or yellow area you will be evacuated. They'll use an excuse e.g. it's for your own safety



You can find out more about Agenda 21 and how it's being used to change the planet below


The concept is, that in order to create major change in the US, they have to first create protests/unrest or maybe even civil war. Once they done this, people will be so keen to see a resolution to it that they'll accept major changes to the current system. If we're in our houses being well behaved, it's very difficult for them to bring about the changes they want. At the moment our glasses are less than half full, but if we do what the Bankers want and protest, allowing them to unleash their grand plan, we'll be left with a lot less; it will benefit them and not us.

Most members of Al Qaeda don't know that it was formed and is controlled by the West (Globalist Bankers). OWS is the new Al Qaeda, it's America's own Al Qaeda. It's a group of people who all believe they have a good cause, but they don't know that they are being used, misled and manipulated. In reality, the financial crisis was engineered by the Bankers, we all heard the leaks from Bilderberg a few years back, stating that they wanted to bring about a financial crisis so as it could be used to usher in a new order. In times of crisis people will accept whatever solution that you offer them. The crisis was no accident, it's there by design, and OWS is a controlled group, like Al Qaeda. If TPTB want they can place bombs around the USA, and pretend that OWS has taked credit for them. Really it would be nothing to do with OWS, it would be the secret services, just like what happens in Iraq and Afghan e.g. "a bomb went off in a mosque and killed 50 people". That again is the secret services. They do it to justify having the military on the streets, which then makes it easier to control the people.

I thought OWS was the first real wake up to American Consciousness in many years, and I had hope. I think it is hopeless, but noble, yes NOBLE. Standing up for the rights of others is a good thing. After seeing how many of the "conspiracy" people were so violently against OWS, I looked into their claims.

Here's how it's changed for me.

OWS is hope in a nearly hopeless world. You could have all joined in, made your voice known, maybe changed the world finally. Instead you cower in your soon to be over hollow "lives" condemning anyone trying to actually make anything better. You deserve what's coming to you. I feel no pity for those without any themselves. Of course there's plenty of shills who came out for this, and you more than deserve what's coming to you.

OWS proves just how paralyzed basic morality is in America. Basic values gone for "I, Me, Mine". You people are the spoiled Romans before the fall. You sicken me. Welcome...

To the Machine.

The "official" ows website that has banned alex jones is the biggest corruption of the OWS movement I have seen so far. This banning of individuals and suppression of free speech proves beyond doubt that there are darker forces at work here. All Alex Jone and his infowar partners are doing is telling the truth, and they are being attacked for telling the truth. The truth may scare some people but unless we face that truth we are lost and the next step will be total obedience to tptb and then we will be ready to be marched to the gas ovens.

And for those that think this isnt going to happen and i am being alarmist, well then I guess you have the same attitude as the jews in the 1930s 1940s when they said " dont worry it wont get any worse".

Thats my opinion and I am sticking to it, aint nobody marching me to a damn oven.

Originally posted by thejlxc
I thought OWS was the first real wake up to American Consciousness in many years, and I had hope. I think it is hopeless, but noble, yes NOBLE. Standing up for the rights of others is a good thing. After seeing how many of the "conspiracy" people were so violently against OWS, I looked into their claims.

Here's how it's changed for me.

OWS is hope in a nearly hopeless world. You could have all joined in, made your voice known, maybe changed the world finally. Instead you cower in your soon to be over hollow "lives" condemning anyone trying to actually make anything better. You deserve what's coming to you. I feel no pity for those without any themselves. Of course there's plenty of shills who came out for this, and you more than deserve what's coming to you.

OWS proves just how paralyzed basic morality is in America. Basic values gone for "I, Me, Mine". You people are the spoiled Romans before the fall. You sicken me. Welcome...

To the Machine.

People demanded proof about how OWS is controlled by the Bankers, so here it is www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by thejlxc
I thought OWS was the first real wake up to American Consciousness in many years, and I had hope. I think it is hopeless, but noble, yes NOBLE. Standing up for the rights of others is a good thing. After seeing how many of the "conspiracy" people were so violently against OWS, I looked into their claims.

Here's how it's changed for me.

OWS is hope in a nearly hopeless world. You could have all joined in, made your voice known, maybe changed the world finally. Instead you cower in your soon to be over hollow "lives" condemning anyone trying to actually make anything better. You deserve what's coming to you. I feel no pity for those without any themselves. Of course there's plenty of shills who came out for this, and you more than deserve what's coming to you.

OWS proves just how paralyzed basic morality is in America. Basic values gone for "I, Me, Mine". You people are the spoiled Romans before the fall. You sicken me. Welcome...

To the Machine.

Basically, then, if "we aren't with you, we're against you?"

Where were you during the Tea Party rallys?

This is what I mean about the narrow-minded attitude that is pervasive within this "movement".

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Ok I've seen this claim posted several times before. I'm sorry but, I've been reading plenty of sources about many of these incidents and very few of those protests and riots taking place elsewhere in the world have little or nothing to do with OWS.

Yet, many supporters will have you believe otherwise and that they are all one in the same or over the same cause.

Isn't that a bit of a stretch?

Well I'm not saying that OWS started the Arab Spring or anything ridiculous like that.. (one happened a while before the other) my point is that many in Europe and elsewhere were already protesting cuts, austerity measures and all manner of social injustice and upheaval.

Once the OWS protest happened and then a month later the Global protests took place, on the 15th, 900 cities were involved and took part... by the 29th, it had spread to 2000 cities.
The point is.. there were many cities and people protesting different issues anyway.... this was just another part of it and spread to ALL of those cities that had already been protesting.

When have you seen such a thing?

When have you seen a cause, a movement spread like this?

There are people now protesting and talking about greed and injustice who have never protested and never been concerned with such issues....we have such a broad mix of people, party political differences have been set aside (Apart from by those who try and attack this movement), race, religion... all manner of pointless crap is irrelevant right now as ALL kinds of people have joined forces for a common cause.

As I've said before, whether you agree with "Some of the actions of the protesters" or not... whether you agree with the methods or not, do people not look at this and think "Wow this is great" "people all working together, trying to achieve and affect change, taking on TPTB and bankers and corruption"

But no... people always look for the negative, people are scared that things may actually change.... people are scared because... Oooooo Socialism is going to get them... :shk:

Grow up.


All those people asking what have the occupy movements achieved??


If you can't see what they have achieved then I can't help you see.... you don't see because you don't want to see.

I'm not sure whether i am a full on supporter or not. But i like what they are doing regardless of the lack of one clear message and leadership.

The reason i like what they are doing, is because they are actually doing something. It may be a little misguided right now and there may be a minority that are being absolute Aholes in the movement (or those Aholes may be nothing to do with the movemnet at all, but are just being named as such). But when has something like this ever been so clear cut when it first started?
This is something all together new. They are all finding their feet and their voices right now, kind of like a toddler learning to walk and experiencing things for the first time, and i think ultimately further down the line things will become a lot more clear.

I would also like to remind some of you, that OWS isn't the only Occupy going on in America or across the Globe.

It may have been the first, but it's not the last and it's growing steadilly.

I have been following Occupy London since it first started and they are doing pretty well. They are very organised. On remembrance Sunday i watched a lovely scene on the livestream, of an old guy coming up to a few of the protestors quite angry about them being at St Pauls. They then explained to him what they were doing there. There was a good debate, his questions were answered. In the end the guy walked away with a better understanding and was pretty much in agreement with all their points.

When i watched the assembly in Portland as 5000 odd people gathered as they told they were being evicted from the parks. It stayed calm and peaceful and it actually made my heart swell.

The trouble at the moment is there is so much wrong with our world, where do you start? Do you just start with one single message? If you just start with one single message, what about all the other important issues? Do they just get put aside for a later date. Or do you make a good list of wrongs you want righted and see where it gets you? That's what i think they are doing. The reason why their message is so unclear, is because there are so many things going on in the world that need righting or putting a stop to.

To be really honest, i don't beleive that this movement will manage to achieve much in regards to all their demands. But what they are doing is spreading awareness and planting the seeds in other peoples minds that they should be standing up and airing their grievances. Not only is that a big achievement in itself, it's also what's desperately needed.
This movement may or may not end up fizziling out eventually, but i think if it did fizzle out, there will be other movements taking their place, learning from Occupy's mistakes. Remember, this is just the start and i hope it stays peaceful.

I do support the OWS but how many people are doing it? 5000? it's hardly a lot is it.
Before the Iraq war 1 million of us marched into London to protest it, did it change anything nah it didn't
I hate to say this but to really change everything I think it may have to be armed revolution because the power's that be just don't listen to us anymore, they just listen to the fat cat's.
I think the question should be Will the OWS movement change anything and unfortunatly the answer is no
Heck I hope I don't get an armed response unit charging in my house because of what I have just said