Why can't Americans be as great as Europeans????

Originally posted by THEDUDE86
First let me say I am an American,

As I am watching the Chicago Bears vs.Tampa Bay Buccaneers in Westminister, London UK....and I was also listening to the radio at the same time, the Radio announcer said something I can't get out of my mind....He basically said that the crowds were really into the game, but not just going for one team or the other, just passionate to be there. He said that the crowd wave they were doing at the time was the best he had ever seen....
So he is an American Football announcer basically saying the crowds are better over there.

So the usual thoughts came through my mind about why Americans don't cheer for sports or why can't I go to a football game and have that much fun like Europeans do....

But then I really got thinking about how much more awesome their Occupy Wall Streets are then ours forbes europe occupy wallstreet

It says in that article just how big it is over there.....100,000 people strong at times in different cities


So this is really a message to Americans to understand that we need to up our game....In crowd cheering, and more importantly standing up to tyranny......

We are supposed to be the country who protested our way to becoming a country.

Well, I am just adding my personal opinion, as an american, who has been living in Europe for the last 21 years.
I do not think that Europeans are better than Americans in any general way. I do think there are differences between the cultures, and my personal judgements would place some things about each better than the others, in a very specific areas.

One that might not be so controversial or surprising is that I think America has a highly developed sense fo independance and individual freedom, while the Europeans have a more highly developed sense of social cohesion and interdepedence.

As part of the way they vehicle and focus on these values, the Americans call being social "being sheople", being part of a herd mentality (a pejorative for them), and is associated with all the worst instinctive animal drives and appetites being unleashed.

The Europeans, in a similar focus, call being independant being egotistical and selfish, being asocial and mentally disturbed, and is associated with all the worst instinctive animal drives and appetites being unleashed.

Like a self fulfilling prophecy, they see their values confirmed most of the time in their culture- when you believe letting yourself go with the flow of the crowd will cause you to do bad things, you set yourself up to do exactly that if you try it.
If you believe that following only your inner intents and goals will cause you to do bad things, you set yourself up to do exactly that if you try it.
With our thoughts and values we seed our subconscious, and it listens, believes and obeys- and has a stronger say in our behaviors then we'd like to think.

A european in a crowd or group allows themself to simply feel good and enjoy being in a group with others joyfully. My own husband and kids are european, and I am amazed how they can enjoy the most stupid or wasteful activities, simply because they are doing it with a bunch of others. If the activity is actually something like sitting on a bench for hours, I get irritated with the waste of time and focus. They are confused, "we're not 'Just sitting on a bench", we're exchanging! "they'll say to me.

But my deeply conditioned american thinking just keeps asking what are we DOING rather than how are we BEING. They exchange how they are right now- how they are feeling, how they are thinking. I'm all on what we are doing, what we are aiming for, what is our/my project, and am I going that direction?

I've begun to call it the fuzzy, unfocused perception, in which the whole is taken in, instead of focus upon one aspect. The vision of the herd member or social animal is more all encompassing with wider vision of the ensemble of the environment. Whereas the focus of the predator is tightened in on objectives and has it's own "blinders" letting all that is judged irrelevant to the goal leave focus completely.

We Americans tend to use that predator vision. We are goal oriented, ambitious, and driven. Is this good or bad?
I don't believe it is either, but can be good or bad depending upon the context in the moment. One thing I have noticed is that when amongst social peoples of the wider prey vision, their attention is caught by you if you have that predator vision, in the same way that a lion on the other side of the pond will attract the attention of all the water buffalo. It puts them on alert, and in humans it can excite them, causing that sense of danger/sexual excitement.

Despite my still operative american focus of ambition and will, I can percieve and comprehend the social mentality as valuable. Ultimately being "civilized" is being able to do this.

Why even make a compare between Europe and America?
Europe consists of several countries all with their own nationality, culture and people. When the US is 1 country - this does not make sense.

And all this boasting is childish.

This thread just shows how easy we make it for the elite. Stir up a bit of 'my flag is better than your flag' and look how easy people devolve into tribal groups. God it sickens me. Bring on the NWO if this is the state of people at the moment,it can't be any worse than this sort of primal chest beating phallus waving drivel.

Oh and I'm sure I read somewhere that the Bank of England/City of London/Queen own many of the big American banks through the Rothschilds and therefore by extension still own America.

This thread just shows how easy we make it for the elite. Stir up a bit of 'my flag is better than your flag' and look how easy people devolve into tribal groups. God it sickens me. Bring on the NWO if this is the state of people at the moment,it can't be any worse than this sort of primal chest beating phallus waving drivel.

Oh and I'm sure I read somewhere that the Bank of England/City of London/Queen own many of the big American banks through the Rothschilds and therefore by extension still own America.

I imagine the Wave was because the crowd were a bit bored, that's what usually happens. If a game is exciting there is no need for fans to start a mexican wave.

Remember its not all happy mexican waves, in Europe at football/soccer games in Europe there is still racism and violence on a regular basis.

reply to post by newcovenant

Before I read your post I was going to say that Europeans are just Americans without ambition. The very first Americans were after all Europeans with the gumption to move.

Or it could be said that those that fled to The New World were those that lacked the gumption to be a success in Europe.

I suspect that there is a bit of truth in both statements.

reply to post by steveknows

But cold beer still wins

Of course it does.
It's only them southern sissies who like their beer flat and warm.
Us oop North and in Scotland etc all know that bitter must be served cold.

In continental Europe all beer is served cold.

reply to post by NadaCambia

I'm not talking about the soldier but US soldiers. They're brainwashed in the extreme and anyone who has had the dis fortune of living near a base, or worse still working a long side these people, know it.

Sorry, but going to have to disagree with that sweeping generalisation.
Of course lots of US soldiers come across as arrogant ignoramuses etc but I have had the pleasure of meeting one or two, both in real life and here on ATS, who are quite the opposite of the stereotype.

Originally posted by Deezey
Why even make a compare between Europe and America?
Europe consists of several countries all with their own nationality, culture and people. When the US is 1 country - this does not make sense.

And all this boasting is childish.

I could not agree more. Even the term "better" in relation to people is juvenile at best. Professional American NFL football is only played once a year in Europe as a novelty. These people could care less who wins, they are just having a good time witnessing something live that they can only see one time a year. In a similar vein, if the world cup came to the USA we would go bat # crazy. Get some perspective OP.

,rh

reply to post by tHEpROGRESSIVE


Undoubtedly America did come to aid in WWII, lend lease gave the UK valuable ships and money at a time when the UK needed it, but this wasn't the act of a friend helping out another.

There's considerable evidence that many in the US were aiding the Nazi regime and the cost of the US helping Britain was expensive. America stayed out of WWII until Pearl Harbour because they feared that the many American citizens of German and Italian descent wouldn't support the war effort and would actively oppose it and more to the point.

Roosevelt taking advice from his ambassador to Britain, Joe Kennedy, thought that Britain was finished. They saw no point in helping an ally that was about to get steamrollered.

Originally posted by Mcupobob
reply to post by steveknows

 

It might be the Central Californian talking in me, but I honestly don't like beer. I prefer my wine, French ain't got nothing on that

I'm just kidding the French make alright wine.

What? I lived in SoCal for two years and we all drank beer you've let them down!. Though I missed Aussie beer Na the truth is when we didn't drink beer it was bourbon and both were always cold just like in Aus.

That's true about the french and thier wine.

Originally posted by discharged77
My family is Russian but we live in the US, we have many things living here that we would not have living in Russia. But i do miss living with culture, American has no real culture except TV and fast food, they do not care for their elderly and show respect to them. People here weigh a lot and keep eating, their kids weigh almost as much as they do. What i like here where i live is they have a good hockey team with a strong Russian player, football to me is rap guys talking on the TV and i cant understand what they are saying.

Well the Americans I know look after their elderly.

What they don't have and should have is national healthcare. I've never understood why a wealthy country doesn't have national healthcare. Well I've understood but I've never understood. To me the health of a population is more importent than a super carrier.

Also everybody in the western world has many things the Russians don't because we never suffered under a bound to fail communist system.

Originally posted by Misterlondon

Originally posted by tHEpROGRESSIVE
reply to post by Trolloks

 

I am not being sarcastic. What did I say that was not true? America is the greatest country to ever exist on the face of the Earth. Europeans hate us because they envy us and they know they can never be as great as us. The good Europeans just admit it to themselves and do whatever they can to move here.

you are the perfect example of a brainwashed.. believe me mate... you couldnt be further from the truth in your assumptions..

I agree, I don't want this to become a flamewar, however I have been to America, the carribean, all of mainland Europe etc. If your unaware it's a big place.

I give the above info as I think the op here doesn't understand that although lots of the people are lovely, the country has places of beauty and the American dream is a truley wonderful concept America is viewed by most of the world in a much much different way than America is viewed! First people don't view it as some super entertainment filled mega super power,

It's viewed as a bloated, over brainwashed area of needless excess that has lost all grip on reality,
Not even my personal view, remember your tv is filled with adverts, shows about morons like jersey shore or get a chance at marrying (insert z list celebrity) etc. This is the image people are force fed of America, orange tan idiots with no chance of anything other than minor celebrity, then you have the needless desire for minor celebrity, so few people chase that dream in Europe because it just seem silly! Invasive and a sad way to live!
You then have adverts for drugs and garbage like that on tv, to people in Europe it's simply again something that seems invasive! Although main American sports can be entertaining they are viewed as requiring less skill as each player on the park in most cases is only expected to be good at there role, kicker for kicking blocker for blocking, it's more a huge amount of individuals performing for the same goal instead of a team working covering all angles etc. Then gun ownership just seems silly, if you give everyone the chance to have a gun, someone will get shot! Like it seems like the laws of averages. Finally in schooling America is viewed as having more focus on social standing and sport than teaching people and giving them a proper education, because of this the general view is America is less intelligent,



I cannot stress, these are not particularly my views, I like America, I work for Americans but this is the image the states broadcasts to the rest of the world, posters on here don't seem to understand, the view of the US by almost all other countries is dramatically different than the view they have of themselves, media does the US no favors!

Also can I include that see saying the us is the best country ever, it is an objective view, Surely you have to consider the roman empire, the Persian empire, Egypt as greatest countries EVER, like I have no doubt it is currently one of if not the greatest country in modern times, but I can't guarantee ever.


Please don't shoot the messenger, this is just what people on the other side of the Atlantic see/are shown.

Originally posted by DonaldD
reply to post by tHEpROGRESSIVE

 

Undoubtedly America did come to aid in WWII, lend lease gave the UK valuable ships and money at a time when the UK needed it, but this wasn't the act of a friend helping out another.

There's considerable evidence that many in the US were aiding the Nazi regime and the cost of the US helping Britain was expensive. America stayed out of WWII until Pearl Harbour because they feared that the many American citizens of German and Italian descent wouldn't support the war effort and would actively oppose it and more to the point.

Roosevelt taking advice from his ambassador to Britain, Joe Kennedy, thought that Britain was finished. They saw no point in helping an ally that was about to get steamrollered.

We had a policy of isolationism during the early stages of the 20th century. We stay true to Washington's work that entangling alliances would get us in trouble and WW1 was proof of it. We did it again. However even though ewe did stay out, we did gave Aid to United Kingdom that made Japan and Nazis angry. Our policy did work until we were bombed.

After WW2, we decided that we have to get involved in International affairs and slam the lid before worst things get happen especially when Western Europe asked us to stay due to the height of the Cold War. The nuclear warfare was serious at that time and we decided had to adopt a foreign policy that we could slam the lid before it blow up into WW3. That's why we don't want another people who called the U.S. cowards to staying out(WW2).

As for U.S. aiding the Naxis it was only companies in the USA that had ties to the Nazis aided them.

reply to post by Misterlondon


USA is huge. Most states being bigger than most European countries. Someone in California is probably not going to have an extra 1000$+ for a plane ticket to NYC in order to protest. We also have a horrible public transportation system unless you live in the inner-city and are trying to get to one block to the next.

Someone traveling to Munich to Berlin is going to have a much easier time and smaller financial burden.

Originally posted by mnmcandiez
reply to post by Misterlondon

 

USA is huge. Most states being bigger than most European countries. Someone in California is probably not going to have an extra 1000$+ for a plane ticket to NYC in order to protest. We also have a horrible public transportation system unless you live in the inner-city and are trying to get to one block to the next.

Someone traveling to Munich to Berlin is going to have a much easier time and smaller financial burden.

edit on 10/24/2011 by mnmcandiez because: (no reason given)

Talking about big states, Australia is roughly the size of the U.S not including alaska but we have only six states and two territories. That's how big our states are.

reply to post by steveknows


The whole point was stating how it would be more expensive to travel within the USA than within European countries. Not boast about size.

Originally posted by mnmcandiez
reply to post by steveknows

 

The whole point was stating how it would be more expensive to travel within the USA than within European countries. Not boast about size.

edit on 10/24/2011 by mnmcandiez because: (no reason given)

But you said that the U.S was huge with states bigger than some European countries. Is that playing down the size of the U.S but pointing out how much a plane ticket would cost? Hmmm,

Yes I know and mine wasn't a boast as we have to pay to fly just like you.

Originally posted by CherubBaby
reply to post by THEDUDE86

 

I give you a S/F out of respect for the time taken to post your thread. I don't agree with you view for one simple reason. I get sick and tired of people telling me what America is and what America feels, Based On Outside Opinions.!! I don't give a damn what UK or China Or Korea etc has to say and sure don't take stock in the opinions of Sports casters anymore than I care about MSM Newscasters..Furthermore what does cheering a sports event have to do with greatness?? Come on..

edit on 23-10-2011 by CherubBaby because: (no reason given)

edit on 23-10-2011 by CherubBaby because: (no reason given)

what does invading countries and killing kids with bombs have to do with greatness

Australian Football is better than rugby, soccer and NFL.. want to b!tch about sports etc, come and have a crack at our code. Even the rugby players are converting. Any of our punters still playing NFL?

Originally posted by Redevilfan09
reply to post by tHEpROGRESSIVE

 

Australian Football is better than rugby, soccer and NFL.. want to b!tch about sports etc, come and have a crack at our code. Even the rugby players are converting. Any of our punters still playing NFL?

Most of them wouldn't understand what it's about having a 6 feet tall bloke run up your back with studded boots in an effort to catch a football.

Up there Casaly in there and fight .. fly like an angel show em your might ...