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Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
ORLY? Dare I ask what lodges in your vast experience "possess it"? Certainly these lodges bear no resemblance to any lodge I've visited.
Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
However, it does have to present a reasonable accommodation to the normal everyday day-to-day requirements of its membership or else it withers and dies. Which is why your assertion of absolute attendance is an absolute fallacy.
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Most people join masonry, because they want more light now.
Really? Is that so? And you 'know' this because you're.....what exactly? A Mason? A Lodge officer? A Grand Lodge Officer maybe? What jurisdiction?
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
ORLY? Dare I ask what lodges in your vast experience "possess it"? Certainly these lodges bear no resemblance to any lodge I've visited.
[snip]
Can anyone see the riddle?
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
However, it does have to present a reasonable accommodation to the normal everyday day-to-day requirements of its membership or else it withers and dies. Which is why your assertion of absolute attendance is an absolute fallacy.
I have used the word "obligation", and have marveled how't turn out to be in the mind of each. Of one it means the same as "optional", and no different from what he had already said. Yet another sees "absolute" in the very word. And even though I gave reference, and drew links to official masonic webpages that use the term in place, yet those here calling themselves masons would still deny that any mason would be obligated to attend anywhere.
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Most people join masonry, because they want more light now.
Really? Is that so? And you 'know' this because you're.....what exactly? A Mason? A Lodge officer? A Grand Lodge Officer maybe? What jurisdiction?
Would it add any, to the words I have already said? To know a title, what effect would it have upon the meaning of the word?
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Seeing as how little is understood of the words herein I have presented. Dare I now reveal myself to the deaf, the blind, and the dumb?
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Would it add any, to the words I have already said?
Seriously, though. Freemasons get too carried away by the jewels and the rank. If you must display an outward sign, that you have some inner light, isn't it better that the sign be by deed done in the moment, than a badge worn upon the breast? What merit is there in a shining jewel, which sits outside the soul?
I've pointed to official masonic references "accepted by many masons", that should be enough.
Originally posted by King Seesar
So and again i don't say i believe this but here's where i'm going with this (deep breath) what if the teaching of Masonry lead Anders Breivik to kill all those people what if he took the symbols and the symbology to mean to do this act?
should Masonry be held accountable in anyway if it was the way Anders Breivik interpreted the symbology that lead to this act?
Originally posted by King Seesar
So and again i don't say i believe this but here's where i'm going with this (deep breath) what if the teaching of Masonry lead Anders Breivik to kill all those people what if he took the symbols and the symbology to mean to do this act?
Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
Would it add any, to the words I have already said? To know a title, what effect would it have upon the meaning of the word?
You made a blanket assertion. Do you really find it that surprising that someone would challenge your bona fides to make such an assertion?
Originally posted by OnTheLevel213
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Would it add any, to the words I have already said?
Given that you're telling multiple Freemasons about a major element of Freemasonry that none of them have ever heard about, it'd certainly add credibility to the words you've already said.
Originally posted by OnTheLevel213
He was as active and enthusiastic a Freemason as he was a Christian. You cannot absolve either group eithout the other (I am both and find the tenets of neither should be on trial here).
Originally posted by DRAZIW
These are all birds of the same flock. Who obviously never heard of other types of birds in other domains. So even when they are shown the things of other birds, they still see and interpret what is there in their own feather colors.
Originally posted by DRAZIW
An active and enthusiastic Freemason? Common fellas. With supposedly 4 attendances?
Maybe he was "visiting" other lodges, and just neglected his home lodge.
You know, that handshake can open doors.
He took the title of "Christian" only to enter the Freemason Lodge in Norway. He, himself, said he did not believe in Jesus Christ. But, he was probably baptized a christian at birth. And by birthright, he was entitled to call himself a christian.
The only thing that might get the Freemasons off the hook
He was probably seeking more light, the kind of light he was looking for, was such as would support his already partly formed views. In the "symbolism" and rituals, he obviously found some verification of his ideas, for he went on to the master mason degree, obviously satisfied from the inkling in the EA and FC that this is where he wanted to explore his ideas.
Since Freemasons have no beliefs
he took that symbolism blank slate, and turned it into his own design, erecting his own building, of which he was master and commander, and took action accordingly, as his imagination was directed.
I see demonic influences there. But, the Tibetan Buddhists believe that the only demons that exist are in each man's own mind.
Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
Originally posted by DRAZIW
Originally posted by Fitzgibbon
ORLY? Dare I ask what lodges in your vast experience "possess it"? Certainly these lodges bear no resemblance to any lodge I've visited.
[snip]
Can anyone see the riddle?
Can you answer the question asked?
It's a straightforward one really.
Originally posted by OnTheLevel213
[
So, in other words...nothing actually present in Masonic ritual was behind the Utoya massacre.
I see demonic influences there. But, the Tibetan Buddhists believe that the only demons that exist are in each man's own mind.
I certainly believe that spiritual malevolence gets far too much credit for the evil in the world.
Originally posted by OnTheLevel213
Breivik revealed in his manifesto an erroneous belief that the Knights Templar created Freemasonry, and expected of them the same militant anti-Islam he saw in the historical Knights Templar, and criticized them for not being a political or militant organization. That mainstream Freemasonry had anything to do with this is clearly contradicted by his own words.
Originally posted by OnTheLevel213
Breivik didn't actually like or even understand Freemasonry to any great degree. Breivik revealed in his manifesto an erroneous belief that the Knights Templar created Freemasonry, and expected of them the same militant anti-Islam he saw in the historical Knights Templar, and criticized them for not being a political or militant organization. That mainstream Freemasonry had anything to do with this is clearly contradicted by his own words.
Originally posted by DRAZIW
I don't know that. What goes on inside a particular lodge is the business of the lodge, and is secret.
His entire action could be part of a ritual, to become a Dark Knight of the Order, walking on the black squares.
Human sacrifice has long been claimed to be part of some cult rituals. It is necessary for the candidate to prove he is capable, and not just theorizing.
One does not become a Knight by merely reading books, and answering questions in a test.
He needed a battlefield, an enemy target, a weapon of choice for the battle, a cause, and to actually take action in the role playing ritual before he could earn the right to wear that badge of Knight's Templar.
Most importantly, he needed to sacrifice the lives of others in reality, to show "will". He did all this to impress somebody else. The question is "who".
Who gave him the knighthood?
Who told him he would get a "reward" for this action?
We do not Knight ourselves. That would be meaningless.
I cannot find any other way to explain the many genocides that occurr from time to time in places around the earth, but that there is a larger deamon out there, to whome these deaths are important sacrifices.
The manifesto is misdirection,. the objective was the sacrifice to prove he was worthy of his Knighthood degree.